The enemy and Pakistan Army

[somebozo]

Actually we are our biggest enemies

 

[RazPaK]

All I see are bharti wet dreams splashing the thread.


Disarming our nukes, deploying forces against out country, .

What is this garbage?

 

[Edevelop]

India will be Pakistan's enemy for as long as life exists on earth. No matter how hard we try to go for peace, it wont work. From 1947 to present, India continues to see Pakistan's existence as an issue.

 

[TheRafael00000]

India will be Pakistan's enemy for as long as life exists on earth. No matter how hard we try to go for peace, it wont work. From post 1947 to present, India continues to see Pakistan's existence as an issue.

India tried everything in past and failed.Really pathetic for them.

But almost all the Indians do believe they can be a superpower and then,they want to make a World full of Hindu Community! Their possible target is neighboring Countries which are smaller in size. If Pakistan fail to accomplish it's Economic development in a significant manner, Pakistan may struggle. Pakistan do have lots of allies and in war Pakistan is much for favorable than India as Indian treachery foreign policies against neighboring Countries made it clear that they can never be accepted as friend. Economic Development will make India to have alliance with us. We need not to do anything, they will fall but the criteria is we have to win our Economic barriers. You got 12+ yrs time only to do that.

 

[Contrarian]

And who is going to make Pakistan stand down, disband and disarm it. One thing is certain it certainly ain't going to be India, she simply lacks the military and diplomatic muscle to force Pakistan to stand down and disarm. Your General Staff is quite aware of this fact, and that is why it has ensured that things don't heat up with Pakistan. You need to get off this high horse of pretending to be scary, because believe me you are not and most importantly you don't scare Pakistan.



Well India will have to adjust to this fact my friend, the chapter has closed and your military has accepted this fact. This is why i believe both IA and PA need to engage in 1 on 1 talks to discuss the nuclear issue.



I will say it again, India lacks the military or diplomatic muscle required to remove Pakistan from the equation. If she did, believe me she would have removed Pakistan from the equation long ago.

Pakistan has already started standing down.

There is not just a single way to achieve objectives. Over the last decade, Pakistan has continuously reduced its demand/rhetoric against India.

Regardless of whether you believe it was done as a goodwill gesture, policy makers know that Pakistan has been forced to do this.

The reasons are also crystal clear - Terrorism becoming global enemy number one and Economic disparity is the root of all this. Economic disparity leads to differentiation in global treatment and global heft.

Economic disparity has led Pakistan to be left far behind when it comes to getting things done in the global order. An example can be Musharraf publicly asking to be treated on the same level as India in the global fora!

This coupled with economic disparity also makes for military budgets against which even minimum deterrence will be hard to achieve.

The results are there to see. Pakistan has been backing down. Unable to conjure up the resources needed to keep matching India in the level of minimum deterrence which initself has been constantly reducing for Pakistan! What PA deemed minimum deterrence 2 decades back was much more than what it considers minimum deterrence today!

It is not an unreasonable expectation that PA will stand down with increasing gap! To the point that the Pakistani public will question whether in the face of insurmountable odds in military capability and diplomatic heft, is Pakistan's continued enemity with India justified? Or are we wasting money with the military buying these tanks!

This is now borne by experience! Whether disarming Pakistan is possible or not, is beyond the capability of India for atleast 2-3 decades.

Now how to ensure that this economic disparity keeps increasing at an increasing rate - that is the key question!

 

[Contrarian]

Because the cost of these useless and money-sucking parleys, conferences, talks and so on are cheap ways to keep them peaceful and pre-occupied.

The second reason is the Ronald Reagan defence. As long as the two countries are at peace, some kind of peace, the Indian economy gains - every single day - an additional edge over the Pakistani economy. Our competition is not with the Chinese, not even with the Pakistani, it is with ourselves. It is we who are holding ourselves back, by not completing reforms and the dismantling of the administration of minute controls. It is we who can release ourselves to grow to the position that we held till as late as the advent of the British, when the wealth of India was a significant proportion of the wealth of the world. And for that we need peace.


That is why I believe that you would do a great service to the nation - both nations - by calming the waters on the surface, and allow the invisible hand to work its miracles. If only the Pakistanis realized that we would do nothing about Baluchistan for the simple reason that all that a hostile Indian administration might wish for is being achieved for them with ridiculous ease by the other side. So, too, with all other problems afflicting them. They are the Sorcerer's Apprentice; they have nursed and let loose forces beyond their control, and our task should only be to let them sort things out internally, in their on-going but unannounced civil war, and only to stir into action to go to their rescue if things get too bad, or to stop foolhardy aggression as we have had to do so many times before.

By these talks you keep the Pakistani political class pre-occupied and that counts for something less than zero. The great hand in the sky as far as Pakistan is concerned is the Army which is not bound or limited by what the political class does. One article like this, one talk show on prime time by some retd Brig, retg Lt.Gen that Pakistani politicians have sold out to India on Kashmir will take the most bravest of the Pakistani politician to go back on his words an shout, hum Kashmir ka azaadhi chahte the aur UNSC resolution implement karna padega . If by now, Indians have failed to realize that, then God help them.

The reason we see a relative peace in Kashmir and a lull in insurgency is because of Pakistani pre-occupation with its wild west. That is the only pre-occupation we should be concerned about and which we should try to make sure, remains.

Anyway I think your suggestion I think is different from mine only in the way its implemented. While I suggest a more hands-on approach you want the inertia of the past 64 years to guide the way of the Pak Army.

There is one crucial fact you are missing.

By not having these peace overtures or by turning up war rhetoric and actions against Pakistan, we risk the biggest thing of all !
The continued credibility of Pakistani Army as the saviour or essence of Pakistan!

The credibility of Pakistani Army as the be all/end all/holy cow status in Pakistan will last only as long as they can keep feeding the population the mirage of a serious threat from India.

Even a little time of peace - genuine peace - as perceived by the Pakistani populace will make the public raise uncomfortable questions of the Pakistani military which the military is successful in hiding using the threat of India! The Pakistani population is very highly and consistently fed lies about how PA is the only saviour of Pakistan against an evil India and about the history of wars! PA doesnt fight India, it uses India as a tool to continue its numero uno status in Pakistan.

Something that has started now! Raising rhetoric and actions that undermine the feeling/perception of a friendly India will undermine years of work in one stroke!

 

[RazPaK]

There is one crucial fact you are missing.

By not having these peace overtures or by turning up war rhetoric and actions against Pakistan, we risk the biggest thing of all !
The continued credibility of Pakistani Army as the saviour or essence of Pakistan!

The credibility of Pakistani Army as the be all/end all/holy cow status in Pakistan will last only as long as they can keep feeding the population the mirage of a serious threat from India.

Even a little time of peace - genuine peace - as perceived by the Pakistani populace will make the public raise uncomfortable questions of the Pakistani military which the military is successful in hiding using the threat of India! The Pakistani population is very highly and consistently fed lies about how PA is the only saviour of Pakistan against an evil India and about the history of wars!

Something that has started now! Raising rhetoric and actions that undermine the feeling/perception of a friendly India will undermine years of work in one stroke!

Lolz. You are misinformed friend.


Most of the Pakistani population hates Indians and believe them to be the enemy. Most of them are very pro Army.

You think a couple of talk show hosts and NGO's are the majority of Pakistan?

 

[kaykay]

Lolz. You are misinformed friend.


Most of the Pakistani population hates Indians and believe them to be the enemy. Most of them are very pro Army.

You think a couple of talk show hosts and NGO's are the majority of Pakistan?

That seems a bit wrong there.....I mean be them Indians or Pakistanis majority are struggling for their daily lives and expences....still I have never been to pakistan so can't say about pakistanis but surely know Indians for that and majority don't give a damn about Pakistan....but those who care have mixed view about neighbour....anyway breeding hatred will eventually lead to the self-distruction....mark my words..!!

 

[jackyy]

it will be better if pakistan considers india as enemy.you will see its affect after 10 yrs .

 

[Contrarian]

Lolz. You are misinformed friend.


Most of the Pakistani population hates Indians and believe them to be the enemy. Most of them are very pro Army.

You think a couple of talk show hosts and NGO's are the majority of Pakistan?

When did i say that majority of Pakistani's are not pro Army?

I said that today there are a lot more people than say a decade back who question the army on its actions and perspectives. There is a reason for this.

And there is a trend.

 

[Wickerman]

Lolz. You are misinformed friend.


Most of the Pakistani population hates Indians and believe them to be the enemy. Most of them are very pro Army.

You think a couple of talk show hosts and NGO's are the majority of Pakistan?

Sure, I believe that. That is the Pakistani psyche we are talking about here. And that is one of the things that will erode Pakistan from within, since this hate will translate into Islamic extremism which in turn bites you back.

 

[Windjammer]

For those who think Pakistan is standing down...perhaps should follow more of their media.
Either Pakistan doesn't give two monkeys or the Indian media is lying.

Pakistan violates ceasefire again; firing at several Indian posts | NDTV.com

 

[ajtr]

For those who think Pakistan is standing down...perhaps should follow more of their media.
Either Pakistan doesn't give two monkeys or the Indian media is lying.

Pakistan violates ceasefire again; firing at several Indian posts | NDTV.com

Aur bachche Eid ki khushi maain kuch patakhe chor rahe the.(some kids were happily bursting crackers in celebration of eid)..............

 

[illusion8]

When did i say that majority of Pakistani's are not pro Army?

I said that today there are a lot more people than say a decade back who question the army on its actions and perspectives. There is a reason for this.

And there is a trend.

LOL, indoctrination is too deeply set for it to change any time soon.

The people who question the army are branded as traitors and are thrashed, Zaid Hamid filed a supreme court case against 250 media people who were questioning the army, ISI routinely sends notices to the questioning scribes and sometimes picks them up for questioning or whatever...

The army keeps milking the Kashmir and India enemy card and since their independence has been taking away the lions share of their budget and the naive keep falling for it.

 

[Joe Shearer]

India will be Pakistan's enemy for as long as life exists on earth. No matter how hard we try to go for peace, it wont work. From 1947 to present, India continues to see Pakistan's existence as an issue.

You've got it back to front.

India didn't attack Pakistan in 1948, thinking that Pakistan's existence was an issue. Pakistan attacked a third state, independent on that date, thinking that its existence was a threat to Pakistan's existence. What ensued is known to all.

India didn't attack Pakistan in 1965, thinking that Pakistan's existence was an issue. Pakistan's stupid leaders, misled by her knavish leaders, attacked India, thinking that its own existence would never become an issue, and got the fright of her life when it did become an issue.

India didn't attack Pakistan in 1971, thinking that Pakistan's existence was an issue. An increasingly insane leadership of Pakistan attacked another part of Pakistan, thinking that its own existence would never become an issue. I don't want to write the rest.

India didn't attack Pakistan in 1999, thinking that Pakistan's existence was an issue. Pakistan's then leadership of clowns misled by ******** attacked India, thinking that its own existence would never become an issue. Thereafter, it found reason to go and beg its then ally and current pet hate America to save its chestnuts from the fire.

Does something stir in the dim recesses of the attic? A pattern, perhaps? A theme of insanity and foolhardiness, maybe?

Would it explain why people tend to reach for their weapons when Pakistan looks in their direction? Would it help to consider that perhaps the weapons were because other people see the patterns that Pakistanis don't, and know what's coming next? And therefore, in an amazing feat of prediction of the future, prepare for trouble from trouble-makers?