The Danger of Strategic Impatience

[Bussard Ramjet]

The biggest threat to China today, is the threat of playing up its cards.

China, especially under Xi Jinping has started getting restless, and forgetting the basic mantra of Deng Xiaoping that worked so well, "Hide your strength, bide your time."

It is trying to compete with the US in all areas including in currency etc. What it is forgetting is that these things take a lot of time.

The US became the biggest economy on Earth by about 1870.

It got a reserve currency only after the second World War, that is 80 years later.

Also, the US kept its population growing. By inviting immigrants of all stripes.

It is time for China ideally, to rest low, keep developing, and getting ahead, instead of trying to spark any war, or arms race, or challenging American supremacy.

Let the Russians do it. Russians are obsessed by the prospect of doing it, which has led them to reduce their nation from the biggest, and a truly modern and leading nation, to one which is in recession, where the life expectancy is exceeded by dozens of Asian Countries, which relies solely on using the fruits of its past conquests ie the resources which Russia relies on.

 

[21stCentury]

This is assuming China is indeed as aggressively pursuing some grand master plan to start a world war for global dominance. If you watch CNN or FOX news or any American/'western' +"allied" media (Japan, India etc) then this may not be surprising since this lot have been pushing the 'China threat' agenda as part of a global propaganda campaign for many decades now.

Fact of the matter is, China have actually been very patient and moderate in its response to aggression and irrational behavior by some claimants of SCS.

 

[Genesis]

The biggest threat to China today, is the threat of playing up its cards.

China, especially under Xi Jinping has started getting restless, and forgetting the basic mantra of Deng Xiaoping that worked so well, "Hide your strength, bide your time."

It is trying to compete with the US in all areas including in currency etc. What it is forgetting is that these things take a lot of time.

The US became the biggest economy on Earth by about 1870.

It got a reserve currency only after the second World War, that is 80 years later.

Also, the US kept its population growing. By inviting immigrants of all stripes.

It is time for China ideally, to rest low, keep developing, and getting ahead, instead of trying to spark any war, or arms race, or challenging American supremacy.

Let the Russians do it. Russians are obsessed by the prospect of doing it, which has led them to reduce their nation from the biggest, and a truly modern and leading nation, to one which is in recession, where the life expectancy is exceeded by dozens of Asian Countries, which relies solely on using the fruits of its past conquests ie the resources which Russia relies on.

Keep doing what? China is just doing what we are suppose to do to become a large economic nation. Your accusations are the same as the anti China crowd and has no basis in facts.

First trying to spark a war? What's the evidence of this, having a dispute is sparking a war, it takes two to tangle. I realize China is the bigger nation, and in the eyes of the popular opinion that's never good, but give me one indication China is ACTUALLY, looking for war.

Arms race? China is spending 1.4 percent on arms, that's well below India's 2+ or America's 4, and just .4 percent more that Japan, a pacifist nation. If we are doing an arms race, we suck at it.

Challenging America supremacy? That's debatable at best, China's interests are China's interest. If we are doing anything is because everything is American interest. Americans getting close to our islands and mainland is routine and fine, but apparently us sailing within international law, but close to America is provocative.


The old ways have changed because the situation has changed. How can one formula work across the ages and situations. China needs to increase income and to do that, not only quality is needed but also prestige. That's always how things worked.


Just think what you are suggesting, not develop a miliary, since we are not doing anything we won't be doing otherwise. Not go for a special drawing rights status, which would make the Yuan less important. Not go for international organization leadership positions, which would make our prestige low and no where to invest our money how we want to.

Lastly to give up territory. Which one sounds fun to you.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Let the Russians do it. Russians are obsessed by the prospect of doing it, which has led them to reduce their nation from the biggest, and a truly modern and leading nation, to one which is in recession, where the life expectancy is exceeded by dozens of Asian Countries, which relies solely on using the fruits of its past conquests ie the resources which Russia relies on.

LOL, so basically you are saying: "Challenging America is bad".

As for trying to spark a war, no.

America has launched 3 invasions of the Middle East and North Africa region in the past decade alone. Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.

That is the peak of war mongering. And despite China's diplomatic disputes we have not had a war for the past three decades.

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

Keep doing what? China is just doing what we are suppose to do to become a large economic nation. Your accusations are the same as the anti China crowd and has no basis in facts.

First trying to spark a war? What's the evidence of this, having a dispute is sparking a war, it takes two to tangle. I realize China is the bigger nation, and in the eyes of the popular opinion that's never good, but give me one indication China is ACTUALLY, looking for war.

Arms race? China is spending 1.4 percent on arms, that's well below India's 2+ or America's 4, and just .4 percent more that Japan, a pacifist nation. If we are doing an arms race, we suck at it.

Challenging America supremacy? That's debatable at best, China's interests are China's interest. If we are doing anything is because everything is American interest. Americans getting close to our islands and mainland is routine and fine, but apparently us sailing within international law, but close to America is provocative.


The old ways have changed because the situation has changed. How can one formula work across the ages and situations. China needs to increase income and to do that, not only quality is needed but also prestige. That's always how things worked.


Just think what you are suggesting, not develop a miliary, since we are not doing anything we won't be doing otherwise. Not go for a special drawing rights status, which would make the Yuan less important. Not go for international organization leadership positions, which would make our prestige low and no where to invest our money how we want to.

Lastly to give up territory. Which one sounds fun to you.

No, it means to keep the lowest profile possible.

For example, there was no use building up South China sea islands so rapidly. Before China started building them, the status quo was largely well established. Time anyways favored China, but than it started building up, making enemies with Philippines and Vietnam.

Right now is the time to calm nerves, and keep your neighbors happy. You are at a very critical stage of just being able to compete with US in your backyard. Don't fight until you are sure that you will be able to overwhelm them.

LOL, so basically you are saying: "Challenging America is bad".

As for trying to spark a war, no.

America has launched 3 invasions of the Middle East and North Africa region in the past decade alone. Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.

That is the peak of war mongering. And despite China's diplomatic disputes we have not had a war for the past three decades.

There is no right or bad. There is useful or not useful.

Challenging America right now is not good, because you have unnecessarily put fuel into fire.

LOL, so basically you are saying: "Challenging America is bad".

As for trying to spark a war, no.

America has launched 3 invasions of the Middle East and North Africa region in the past decade alone. Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.

That is the peak of war mongering. And despite China's diplomatic disputes we have not had a war for the past three decades.

Also, you didn't had disputes, because you were comparatively very weak, and surrounded. You are not the leader of the International Community, and you should know it.

Bide your time, and the time is not yet. Grow your economy to twice the size of US, and then talk about reserve currency etc.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

You are not the leader of the International Community, and you should know it.

So being the world leader means invading 3 countries in one decade alone?

Then don't worry, we are nowhere close to that. Thankfully.

Challenging America right now is not good, because you have unnecessarily put fuel into fire.

LOL, it is America that is trying to provoke us. Look at the BS rhetoric coming out of Trump/Hillary/Obama and every other American politician.

They want us to be anti-America.

Heck from the garbage that they are spewing, I can't even claim they are targeting China alone. They are basically targeting the whole world.

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

So being the world leader means invading 3 countries in one decade alone?

Then don't worry, we are nowhere close to that. Thankfully.

Being the world leader means the ability to lead and command respect.

US leads a global alliance composed of almost all major economies on earth. If the US led alliance is considered, not only does it control almost everything on earth, they easily create more than three fifths of the economy, with huge defense outlays.

 

[TaiShang]

For example, there was no use building up South China sea islands so rapidly.

There is build-up in SCS since the 1970s.

Before China started building them, the status quo was largely well established.

There is not a single status quo in SCS but a plethora of it as the individual states make of it. China simply brought its own status quo to the table.

Time anyways favored China, but than it started building up, making enemies with Philippines and Vietnam.

Time favors anybody ready for the challenges that it brings. So, it favors everybody one way or another. The enmity of the Phil has been there even before China started build-up. Remember, they murdered an unarmed elderly Chinese fisherman from Taiwan.

Vietnam is no enemy. Less enemy than India is.

Right now is the time to calm nerves, and keep your neighbors happy.

Advise that to India which can start by giving back the occupied South Tibet.

You are at a very critical stage of just being able to compete with US in your backyard. Don't fight until you are sure that you will be able to overwhelm them.

Don't be an alarmist.

China does not take the US head on. Everything is well within our capabilities and managed accordingly. In fact, China and the US are currently transforming their relations into a new level: A new form of major power relationship or the New Normal.

Challenging America right now is not good, because you have unnecessarily put fuel into fire.

No body challenges the US. In fact, relations are more meaningful now than it was ten years ago. I see Russia-US relations are improving, as well.

Also, you didn't had disputes, because you were comparatively very weak, and surrounded. You are not the leader of the International Community, and you should know it.

China is responsible for its citizens within the periphery of the Greater China, first and foremost. Change the world is US business although that change might come in the form of ISIS.

Bide your time, and the time is not yet. Grow your economy to twice the size of US, and then talk about reserve currency etc.

Most of those commentaries are made by the Westerners themselves. I agree on the idea that there is no need to give away information and intention prematurely.

In most cases, the Western press puts the word into your mouth. They rinse and repeat, hence, it becomes a perception.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Being the world leader means the ability to lead and command respect.

US leads a global alliance composed of almost all major economies on earth. If the US led alliance is considered, not only does it control almost everything on earth, they easily create more than three fifths of the economy, with huge defense outlays.

Amazing, all that power and you can only start wars and create destruction wherever you go.

Look at the Middle East and North Africa region after your 3 invasions.

It has gone from a Saddam-era Iraq with ZERO active terrorist groups, to the worst hell hole on Earth. Iraq and Syria don't even exist anymore, vast swathes of their territory are part of a new country, called the Islamic State.

And Europe are forced to take in millions of refugees as a result of your destruction of the Middle East and North Africa region. While Trump screams and points his fingers in every direction like a baboon.

Great work. Well done.

 

[Genesis]

No, it means to keep the lowest profile possible.

For example, there was no use building up South China sea islands so rapidly. Before China started building them, the status quo was largely well established. Time anyways favored China, but than it started building up, making enemies with Philippines and Vietnam.

Right now is the time to calm nerves, and keep your neighbors happy. You are at a very critical stage of just being able to compete with US in your backyard. Don't fight until you are sure that you will be able to overwhelm them.

Yea, it's never going to be calm. China is at the stage where we can dictate the temple. nobody likes it, if it were me I wouldn't like it and we didn't with Japan in the 1900s.

America's power largely comes from its economy, it's going to see us as a threat either way, as we move up the value added ladder.

We be at "war" either way, it should be at our discretion.


You can see slave labor and copy and paste from such nations that are worst than African nations and yet there they are accusing us of mistreating workers. Perhaps it isn't first world, but it's a shit load better than anything they can hope to do.

This perception needs changing and guess how that's done.

We are going to be hated and underestimated at the same time, why not make something of it.


As to the islands, that's the normal speed, it's not like it's something special, it's more everyone else sucks. We are the number one dredging nation bar none, what can you do. This is the sort of thing that's not mentioned, we also got 15,000 km of HSR, why was that speed not mentioned, since one rail takes a billion years in those other nations, it makes sense their islands are smaller.

 

[terranMarine]

Our so called sinology expert is trying to portray China as the aggressor for starting the SCS islands buildups thus provoking our neighbors and the US which will inevitably lead to a military conflict according to him. Yet he fails to see who started with the reclamation activities first. My advice is worry less about China and more about your impoverished homeland. It's not too late to work on the realization of the bollywood production super power 2030 if Indians truly desire the exodus of Caucasians flooding into India to become servants.

 

[TaiShang]

It's not too late to work on the realization of the bollywood production super power 2030 if Indians truly desire the exodus of Caucasians flooding into India to become servants.

On this regard, China won't ever be a superpower.

 

[terranMarine]

On this regard, China won't ever be a superpower.

Lets just say we have different mindsets and criteria for that position so i'm sure we will be a superpower just not the type the Indians have in mind for their own country.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

On this regard, China won't ever be a superpower.

Honestly I think only Indians are so excited by this cold war term "superpower".

India to become superpower by 2012: Kalam - Economic Times

Brazil has a larger GDP than India, they are much more developed, I've never heard them claiming to be a superpower?

As for China, all we need is to be able to protect our own interests and our own sovereignty. Being a superpower is not an aim, it might be an accidental consequence of our economic development at some point in the future, but that's all it will be, just a side effect.

Our so called sinology expert is trying to portray China as the aggressor for starting the SCS islands buildups thus provoking our neighbors and the US which will inevitably lead to a military conflict according to him. Yet he fails to see who started with the reclamation activities first. My advice is worry less about China and more about your impoverished homeland. It's not too late to work on the realization of the bollywood production super power 2030 if Indians truly desire the exodus of Caucasians flooding into India to become servants.

I don't think the OP is an Indian to be honest.

Indians on this forum tend to argue from a very emotional standpoint, and using words like superpower from a very emotional point of view.

The OP sees things in quite a calculated manner, and out of all the countries in the world, he only seems to praise America.

From arguing with him I get the impression that I am talking to an American. Even if he may be ethnic Indian from his grammar, the dominant identity seems to be American.

 

[terranMarine]

I don't think the OP is an Indian to be honest.

Indians on this forum tend to argue from a very emotional standpoint, and using words like superpower from a very emotional point of view.

The OP sees things in quite a calculated manner, and out of all the countries in the world, he only seems to praise America.

From arguing with him I get the impression that I am talking to an American. Even if he may be ethnic Indian from his grammar, the dominant identity seems to be American.

Perhaps, but one thing is for sure and that he's a major fanboy of our HSR expert