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TF-X Turkish Fighter & Trainer Aircraft Projects

They either changed the engine's name to TS1500, or they have two models TS1400 and TS1500. Next in the pipeline for TEI is to make TS3000, a 3000 hp engine for 10t helicopters.
Anyway these engine's are not ready to be mass produced as of yet. The engine's will be delivered to TAI this year for flight tests. The engine project is going according to the roadmap.

Thank you for your information and also your comparatively reasonable reply. However, I usually don't comment on this so-called TS3000 since TS1400 is not proven yet. The engine hasn't even started a field test with a real application nor spent tens of thousand hours in real world to prove its airworthness & reliablity.

And I have to remind you that even GE Aviation which has far more experience in this field has spent 12 years to develop GE T901 with output of 3000 shp for the ITEP, even though the company has practically recycled their T700 turboshaft engine. I don't know whether the Turkish government officially launched this TS3000 program and it does sound a little bit more realistic than a F110-grade turbofan engine within this decade, I believe we should wait & see what would become of TS1400 before we project our fantasy over something that doesn't exist. However, designing & building a reliable 1400 shp turboshaft engine from a scratch would be some achievement regardless.

I agree with you that F110 grade turbofan engine's are much more complex and advanced. That is why Turkey is looking for a techonological partner in this field and negotians are ongoing. SSB president Ismail Demir said that this process for continue for some time to come, especially due to the pandemic.

It is regrettable to say, but I don't trust Ismail Demir as he speaks like a politician. Rolls-Royce backed off from the deal for TF-X because they did not want to share intellectual properties of Eurojet turbofan engines (probably the engine core) with Turkey. You can't negotiate those matters with GE, RR, Safran nor P&W. They may allow Turkey to manufacture their engines under license, some ToT and even award some export contracts for engine parts, but those companies won't transfer critical technologies (especially the engine core) & share intellectual properties for both financial and strategic reasons. Their governments would veto it anyway. Turkey is probably not actually in negotiation, but try to re-open the regotiation with anyone who offers 'technological assistance' that is mostly unacceptable by turbofan engine manufacturers to begin with.

The same goes for Atlay powerpack. Dr. Demir claimed that “ The work done with a country regarding ALTAY's engine has reached a very good point. We can say that the signatures have been made. With the collaboration to be done there, this will take a certain process." as if the powerpack problem would be solved rather sooner than later. After that he even said he also has Plan "B" and "C". If that's not hype, I don't know what is hype then. However, I suspect the man actually doesn't have a practical plan as he kicked the can down the road by starting the limited production with very few remaining spare engines & transmissions, but did not give the exact date when Turkey would start testing a MBT with a new powerpack or when would they start actual mass-production other than meaningless T0+18mths timeline.

And frankly I don't believe any of those Tumosan engines, either. As I asked before, why isn't Turkey attempting to replace American powerpack of their armoured vehicles with indigenous ones already? Why isn't Turkey trying to sell their Tumosan/BMC engines along with FNSS/PT PINDAD Kaplan MT/Harimau when they could make more profit? Only reasonable answers are either Turkey actually doesn't have engines or those engines only exist in CAD & labs, but are actually not roadworthy & are unfit for military operations. I would only believe them when Turkey actually starts to test those engines (and transmissions) with a real appliaction on field and those real applications enter mass-production.

Anyway, thank you for your information again. I can't possibly fool myself and have a faith in ambitious projects such as TF-X with given information, but Turkey may prevail and prove all foreign observers who doubted the country wrong. Good night.
 
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What I understand is that our Turkish friends are trying to do what French did with their Dassault Rafale. The French government flew a technology demonstrator with a pair of F404, because they couldn't develop Safran/Snecma M88 on time. I am sure you wouldn't say that M88 is a copy of F404 just because French replaced F404 with M88 for their Rafale prototype. Of course, I understand that it was one of reasons why Rafale had become a very costly project which was also delayed for at least a decade. Even then, French had years of experience in both gas-turbine engines and designing & manufacturing of fighter jets. Hence, I must assume that Turkey which has relatively less experience in both departments than French of 1980's~2000's would face considerably more challenges for their TF-X project.
Agree for M88/F404.

I read in the article about the TS1500 : " It is using LHTEC-800A generating power of 1350 hp ".
It's not clear ?
 
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Mark my words : Turkey will not have it's own fighter engine ready for serial production in 2030 (not to speak of 2023 or 2025)

For many reasons the proud turkish people here don't want to understand.
 
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Mark my words : Turkey will not have it's own fighter engine ready for serial production in 2030 (not to speak of 2023 or 2025)

For many reasons the proud turkish people here don't want to understand.

Little french hater, nobody claimed that an engine would be ready by mid-2020s.

Your words and opinions are worthless.

Even if the engine is not ready by 2030, it will be in 2031 or the year after that. A few years of delay doesn't matter. Turkey will become independent in this field and will continue to smack your sorry french asses across the world.
 
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Mark my words : Turkey will not have it's own fighter engine ready for serial production in 2030 (not to speak of 2023 or 2025)

For many reasons the proud turkish people here don't want to understand.
I am a logical Turk. Can you explain why?
 
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Agree for M88/F404.

I read in the article about the TS1500 : " It is using LHTEC-800A generating power of 1350 hp ".
It's not clear ?
STupid French, the reason its called TS1500 us because it use 1500 SHP, not 1350... do you even understand that with that 150 SHp difference, Turkey fly its medium range ANka UAV... plus you are going to use 2 engine so its going to be 300 SHP difference... or it will be able to lift 1 more ton of weight than t129
 
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I am a logical Turk. Can you explain why?
Because you don't have yet the technological and R&D cluster to do so.
You enter too soon in the battle. It needs so many times (to built prototyps, to learn from your sucess and mainly from your fails...) and money that it will take far more time.

See the Indian Kaveri exemple.
See the chinese exemple : they struggle for decades to be fully independant. It's near the case (they are purchasing russian engines even this year).

For world top engine manufacturers, it takes 10 years to fine tune an engine (ie ready to be fitted in an operational fighter). And it's not an insult to say that no one of these manufacturers is Turkish.
 
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STupid French, the reason its called TS1500 us because it use 1500 SHP, not 1350... do you even understand that with that 150 SHp difference, Turkey fly its medium range ANka UAV... plus you are going to use 2 engine so its going to be 300 SHP difference... or it will be able to lift 1 more ton of weight than t129
OK.
I'm stupid and you are a genius.
Good night Einstein.
 
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" While Ankara has plans to develop an indigenous fighter, any such program will likely be extremely expensive, face serious delays, and may not deliver enough fighter aircraft to replace its current inventory of F-16s. "


probably written by another stupid french.... or not.
 
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Because you don't have yet the technological and R&D cluster to do so.
You enter too soon in the battle. It needs so many times (to built prototyps, to learn from your sucess and mainly from your fails...) and money that it will take far more time.

See the Indian Kaveri exemple.
See the chinese exemple : they struggle for decades to be fully independant. It's near the case (they are purchasing russian engines even this year).

For world top engine manufacturers, it takes 10 years to fine tune an engine (ie ready to be fitted in an operational fighter). And it's not an insult to say that no one of these manufacturers is Turkish.

You ve got point ok we got it. its not easy but you ve got another pain we cant make head and tail. Folks talking acording to the what the officials say. However every once in a while, you and the likes come here and keep bigmouthing "Turks cant do that, turks cant do this". You troll.

As i always say, we didnt have any UAV technology ten years ago.

Also, we re working on finding possible partnerships in order to reduce the time span. For example Ukrainain delegation has been in Turkey for 3 days. Deputy Minister is visiting every defence related departments including TAI. i am expecting good news. Cus they are trying hard this time. (They started trying hard after experiencing our UAVs)

Turkey will achieve this no matter what. Delays are possible, who cares. Be it a few years later. So take your BS elsewhere
 
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Bottom line what these trolls are telling is, you should stop and com buy it from us. When we feel need to ambargo you we will do it, and you will obey us :-) . Fakin cunts....
 
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Because you don't have yet the technological and R&D cluster to do so.
You enter too soon in the battle. It needs so many times (to built prototyps, to learn from your sucess and mainly from your fails...) and money that it will take far more time.

See the Indian Kaveri exemple.
See the chinese exemple : they struggle for decades to be fully independant. It's near the case (they are purchasing russian engines even this year).

For world top engine manufacturers, it takes 10 years to fine tune an engine (ie ready to be fitted in an operational fighter). And it's not an insult to say that no one of these manufacturers is Turkish.
experience in the aviation sector in Turkey has increased with each passing year, although R & D expenditure is less. Turkey Turkish engineers experienced in this regard from the outside is trying to bring the country team will produce the engines. However, it is obvious that some experienced engineers, especially from Aselsan, left the country in recent years. Turkey inside to make jet engine R & D 'to be intensified, if possible in the sub-system is forced technology transfer from foreign countries to try to do, it will also benefit from the experience in basic science TUBITAK. For example, Tübitak produced the turbine blade. In addition, TEI built the TS1400 turboshaft engine with a team of Turkish engineers brought from other countries. The helicopter engine was a dream but now reel. Although the jet engine is late, I guess it will happen in the early 2030s. Because anyone who has information about jet engines in the country will come together for this project.


In addition, Turkey's TF / X fighter aircraft and tidy an article showing the latest situation regarding the engine and other sub-systems work for it was published. Good reading, here's the link.

 
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