Tejas(LCA)- Setting the record straight

[Capt.Popeye]

is Drop tank = Fuel tank?.. what is the range of LCA?
What is a Service ceiling?

By the way 3000 Km is not a small distance ... does it include the fuel tanks? or only the internal fuel??

Drop Tank is an auxiliary (not built in to the aircraft) fuel tank carried under the wings. Usually consumed first as it affects the aerodynamics of the aircraft. When emptied, the tank(s) are jettisoned. Hence the name- drop tanks.

Service ceiling:
The service ceiling attempts to capture the maximum usable altitude of an aircraft. Specifically, it is the density altitude at which flying in a clean configuration, at the best rate of climb airspeed for that altitude and with all engines operating and producing maximum continuous power, will produce a given rate of climb (usually 100 feet per minute climb or 30 meters per minute). (courtesy Wikipedia)
In simple terms the maximum altitude above MSL that the aircraft is capable of performing reasonably.

3000 km range seems to be the ferry range for the aircraft in clean condition (without external stores) flying at optimal height and speed. That would be with drop tanks.

 

[wali87]

These reasons and arguements that the indian members give here are simply justifications given to them by their government.. like parents do to kids when they cant buy them something when they want it.

No matter how much the indians wish in their hearts to turn back time, its simply not happening and regardless of the number of explainations u give.. u just cant deny that its been more than the 30 years since the Idea of Tejas came into being so save it guys.

India shud learn from Pakistan infact.. when it comes to indigenous aircraft manufacturing... Putting the usual bs aside Pakistan is manufacturing its own aircraft in less than 10 years

 

[FGFA-PAKFA]

India shud learn from Pakistan infact.. when it comes to indigenous aircraft manufacturing... Putting the usual bs aside Pakistan is manufacturing its own aircraft in less than 10 years

Well'i will keep all ur flaming/troll and BS statements aside and tell me which indeginous Aircraft pakistan is building ?as u mentioned....
that too in less than 10years

 

[foxbat]

These reasons and arguements that the indian members give here are simply justifications given to them by their government.. like parents do to kids when they cant buy them something when they want it.

No matter how much the indians wish in their hearts to turn back time, its simply not happening and regardless of the number of explainations u give.. u just cant deny that its been more than the 30 years since the Idea of Tejas came into being so save it guys.

India shud learn from Pakistan infact.. when it comes to indigenous aircraft manufacturing... Putting the usual bs aside Pakistan is manufacturing its own aircraft in less than 10 years

You get the award for the funniest post in this thread.. You do know that even today, more than 80% of JFT comes from China in a knocked down conditions to be assembled in Pakistan.

If you would have said China, I would have accepted it, but Pakistan.. c'mon dude, we have been assembling Su 30 for years now. As a matter of fact over 85% of Su 30 parts are now manufactured in India as against less than 20% for JFT in Pakistan.

From that pov, JFT is to Pakistan what Su 30 MKI is to India. A bought platform, customized for the respective country and being manufactured indegenously.

 

[kingdurgaking]

Drop Tank is an auxiliary (not built in to the aircraft) fuel tank carried under the wings. Usually consumed first as it affects the aerodynamics of the aircraft. When emptied, the tank(s) are jettisoned. Hence the name- drop tanks.

Service ceiling:
The service ceiling attempts to capture the maximum usable altitude of an aircraft. Specifically, it is the density altitude at which flying in a clean configuration, at the best rate of climb airspeed for that altitude and with all engines operating and producing maximum continuous power, will produce a given rate of climb (usually 100 feet per minute climb or 30 meters per minute). (courtesy Wikipedia)
In simple terms the maximum altitude above MSL that the aircraft is capable of performing reasonably.

3000 km range seems to be the ferry range for the aircraft in clean condition (without external stores) flying at optimal height and speed. That would be with drop tanks.

Great right on spot...
so any clue on what is the actual range of Tejas without this external fuel tanks?.. so when we have Mid air refuelling i guess we can eliminate it... hmmm hopefully in MK2 i hope they are implementing probes for fuelling.. I guess having a fixed probe for refuelling should not be of that big deal.. Secondly on dirty load will it have a tremendous impact on the range? i guess there should be % of impact should not be of that big deviation am i right? because when the kinetic energy kicks in the mass of the total body reduces and if we take the kinetic of Fighter it is a tremendously huge...

One more question on Wiki Source
What is the difference b/w
Loaded weight And Max takeoff weight

 

[kingdurgaking]

India shud learn from Pakistan infact.. when it comes to indigenous aircraft manufacturing... Putting the usual bs aside Pakistan is manufacturing its own aircraft in less than 10 years

Holy crap... do you know what do you mean by indigenous? Pakistan is just a decade behind us in aircraft building.. We have done that what you have done by building MKI..

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Great right on spot...
so any clue on what is the actual range of Tejas without this external fuel tanks?.. so when we have Mid air refuelling i guess we can eliminate it... hmmm hopefully in MK2 i hope they are implementing probes for fuelling.. I guess having a fixed probe for refuelling should not be of that big deal.. Secondly on dirty load will it have a tremendous impact on the range? i guess there should be % of impact should not be of that big deviation am i right? because when the kinetic energy kicks in the mass of the total body reduces and if we take the kinetic of Fighter it is a tremendously huge...

The over-riding consideration for an aircraft is drag. Drag will increase in case of external stores (incl. drop tanks) So it cant be discounted.

One more question on Wiki Source
What is the difference b/w
Loaded weight And Max takeoff weight

Max Take-Off Weight (MTOW) is the max. weight of aircraft and stores that is permissible by airworthiness requirements.
However the Take off weight may be regulated by other factors such as air temperature, altitude above MSL, length of runway and so on.

 

[kish]

India shud learn from Pakistan infact.. when it comes to indigenous aircraft manufacturing... Putting the usual bs aside Pakistan is manufacturing its own aircraft in less than 10 years

name the aircraft Pakistan is manufacturing indigenous .. please dont take JF 17 ... Its a JV between pak and china ,,

how many Pakistani system are integrated JF 17 (which are developed by pak alone ) ...
airframe ?? air intake ?
radar ? antenna ? or its processor ?
RWR ? ECM ?
Engine?
cockpit ? hud ? ejection seat ?
FBW system ??
any missile A2A or A2G

OR just give information on any system on which PAC working alone


its very good aircraft and very much suited for PAF ,,,,

BUT its not indigenous ,, .. not even PAC is heard of working on any major system ,,
please provide source to prove me wrong ,,,
i hope u will give some


and for Tejas, HAL is working on its every system ,,,, you can claim that its fail but dont worry dude,, slowly every system of it will be indigenous .....
i think u didn't heard of the story of spider tried to to reach top of cliff but reach there after many failure ,,

 

[Capt.Popeye]

name the aircraft Pakistan is manufacturing indigenous .. please dont take JF 17 ... Its a JV between pak and china ,,

how many Pakistani system are integrated JF 17 (which are developed by pak alone ) ...
airframe ?? air intake ?
radar ? antenna ? or its processor ?
RWR ? ECM ?
Engine?
cockpit ? hud ? ejection seat ?
FBW system ??
any missile A2A or A2G

OR just give information on any system on which PAC working alone


its very good aircraft and very much suited for PAF ,,,,

BUT its not indigenous ,, .. not even PAC is heard of working on any major system ,,
please provide source to prove me wrong ,,,
i hope u will give some


and for Tejas, HAL is working on its every system ,,,, you can claim that its fail but dont worry dude,, slowly every system of it will be indigenous .....
i think u didn't heard of the story of spider tried to to reach top of cliff but reach there after many failure ,,

Let me add something more basic to the list before we can reach FBW, Hydraulic actuators and so on.
What about Jigs, Dies and Fixtures?
Before the first sheet of metal is bent in to any shape to make a wing or whatever- the above are required.

 

[kingdurgaking]

The over-riding consideration for an aircraft is drag. Drag will increase in case of external stores (incl. drop tanks) So it cant be discounted.

Thanks sirjee... But never knew that weapons cause such huge problem because most of the weapons looks aerodynamic...To say in high speed the goods trains power reduces the weight of the entire bogies by a huge mass.. Thats why goods trains are too long and they have huge horse power engine some time two... which is basically two inject power for the initial kinetic as compared to the express..

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Thanks sirjee... But never knew that weapons cause such huge problem because most of the weapons looks aerodynamic...To say in high speed the goods trains power reduces the weight of the entire bogies by a huge mass.. Thats why goods trains are too long and they have huge horse power engine some time two... which is basically two inject power for the initial kinetic as compared to the express..

Actually everything related to an aircraft can cause drag- the aircraft it self and anything attached to it. The only time there is zero drag on an aircraft, is when it is parked on the ground.

 

[kish]

Let me add something more basic to the list before we can reach FBW, Hydraulic actuators and so on.
What about Jigs, Dies and Fixtures?
Before the first sheet of metal is bent in to any shape to make a wing or whatever- the above are required.

hmm ,, u know i dont think that he even know these names,,

about LCA , i will really happy when i will hear some good news about kaveri,
and yes about radar .. .because these are only main platform we are still running late,, hope mk2 will be a full success ,,,

and i could be a part of LRDE ,,, hehehhehehe

 

[Chanakyaa]

MKI is NOT ASSESEMBLED.
ITS now MADE 100% From Scratch in India !

Also, India has made Licensed Productions of Migs and Jaguar too.

Add to it that Before LCA we had our own fighter Marut way back in 70s..

LCA, is categorised as 4 the Gen Fighter with 70 of Aircraft being Indegenious, and most importantly its Designed by India and India alone.

 

[marcos98]

Holy crap what happened to LSP-5.. is LSP-4 is the final configuration? I heard that they are revamping the cockpit in LSP-5 which will be equal to the IOC standard?? Last i heard it was taxing .... some can shed some light here?

good news is here friend.......

India To Fly Tejas LSP-5 Soon​

India To Fly Tejas LSP-5 Soon | AVIATION WEEK

LSP-5 gearing-up for first flight; lit cockpit for night flying & new com set onboard; will fly on autopilot mode for first time​

India’s fifth limited-series production (LSP-5) Tejas Light Combat Aircraft is ready for its first flight.

Indian sources confirm to AVIATION WEEK that a flight readiness review meeting was held recently and the LSP-5 will fly “soon,” weather permitting. LSP-4 had its first flight in June.

“Two more high-speed taxi trials are remaining and after that we will be ready for the first flight,” says a senior official associated with the program. “It will have internal cockpit lighting for enabling night flying, with all corrections being done. We are also testing a new communication set, similar to that on the Dhruv chopper. This would again ensure commonality of inventory in the country.”

LSP-5 will be the first to test the Tejas’ auto-pilot mode. “The autopilot is indigenously developed by the national control law team of National Aerospace Laboratories,” the official says. “With LSP-5, we are demonstrating all the final configuration of Tejas Mk-1, which will also be a final cockpit version.” The LSP-5 will be the 11th test vehicle to join the Tejas flight line.

The Aeronautical Development Agency is working toward a Dec. 27 deadline for the crucial release-to-service certification. For this, the Center for Military Airworthiness and Certification is working with the agency, the Defence Research & Development Organization, the National Aerospace Laboratories and aircraft provider Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. “Almost 70 percent of equipment has been type approved, while 70 percent of systems also have been type certified,” the official says.

If the delivery schedules are met, then the Indian Air Force will have LSP-7 and LSP-8 for user evaluation trials by March 2011. LSP-6 will be a test vehicle for high angle of attack. The Tejas squadron is expected to be in Bengaluru by mid-2011 and the first two series production aircraft (SP-1, SP-2) also should be ready by then.

 

[kingdurgaking]

^^^^ finally.... auto pilot has created the mess for so much of delay... but i heared that auto pilot is built for NLCA(even for take off and landing)... how the hell it came into Tejas...