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Talks for Su-35, Mi-35 sales to Pakistan are underway: Russian Deputy FM

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at 65 Million a piece let see how many can Paksitan afford.. :)
Well look at it this way, at least you're one of the few people who can sleep well at night in Hindusitan. ;)
 
If that means Russia selling us the products you refer to I seriously doubt that. Considering how little we know about what aircraft has been offered(if it has been really) we dont know if its the same fit that is going to the VVS or a downgraded model much like the Mig-31E.

Yes..that's what I meant when I saw someone mention top of the line products will be available to Pakistan from Russia. The real top of the line doesn't move beyond a closed group of buyers is what I think, even Russia adheres to that, It's a closed club and breaking into it depends on all the global factors.

Russians have been pushing for SU 35 sales to China...if anything..this could be a cross marketing offer where China buys it and sells to Pakistan..similar to the RD 93 deal where china ended up buying a 1000 of them.

So, if the offer is real..it would most likely be the same configuration that they are offering to China.

well, this is a very heated thread. i shall say my part and leave it at that. Russia is pushing India to purchase the su-35, by creating the the atmosphere of Pakistan procuring the su-35, which in fact they genuinely want.

quiet a while ago, just after the 126 jet deal was cancelled, sukhoi proposed an more advanced mki variant based on the su-35, this deal was dropped in favour in searching for other western suppliers. quote me if im wrong here, but there were plans to have internal weapons bays. similar to that of the f15-se(as shown in the link).

would i see the su-35 in paf colours? No
does paf need the su-35? yes

If you mean...super sukhoi's..then that was offered as a counter to the chinese variants and that offer was running along with the mmrca.

I doubt Russia is pushing India to buy su 35, they have been pushing China to buy them.
 
So many rumors are floating around. Following is an excerpt from Wiki which was updated in last 72 hours.

Pakistan Air Force is also a potential customer and Vladimir Kozhin, an aide to the Russian President Valdimir Putin, reportedly told reporters that Russia might sell Sukhoi Su-35S Flanker-E to Pakistan. On September 9 2015, it was reported that Islamabad and Moscow are in talks over the delivery of latest Su-35 fighter jets along with additional multi-role MI 35M Attack Helicopter. Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergeil Ryabkov revealed that the two countries are in talks on the supply of Su-35 fighter jets. According to reports, Pakistan may buy up to 48 Sukhoi Su-35S Flanker-E (2 squadrons) for Maritime patrol and long range strike roles.
 
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On the far off chance that it does happen.

Su-35BM-P 8th Squadron "Haiders"

img00003.JPG

img00004.JPG


Russians have been pushing for SU 35 sales to China...if anything..this could be a cross marketing offer where China buys it and sells to Pakistan..similar to the RD 93 deal where china ended up buying a 1000 of them..

China is getting the same configuration as Russia is. Essentially, its the same as the US selling the Block-52 to us. It is the same(if not better configuration in some parameters) to what they operated.

China bought a 100 RD-93s, now the deal may be direct between Pakistan and Russia.
 
Janes has been wrong on multiple occasions. Besides, it mentions TALKS not signing of deals, clear difference that even you should be able to tell.

I know its hard for you, but try thinking.
Sure Jane's will be wrong , Russian FDM will be wrong , & the whole world will be wrong ?
Only you are the one who is always right ?
If there are talks that means bussines in process ?
No ?
No one has said that any deal has been signed yet but , on the basses of the on going talks its be highly predicted that , it will happen ?
So ,just accept the fact because that's the fact is ,instead of being foolishly stubborn & telling whole world is wrong & you the dynamite genius the waiting Jesus is right ?

The thing is, it's not just my perspective, this is pretty much a common consensus between most analysts. There is little reason to believe the Su-35 is actually on the table.
Kindly name few of these so called analysts ,I can bet you most of them are Indians ?
 
@batmannow Without naming names and revealing any identities, I know someone personally who facilitated the on-going talks for Su-35 from the Pakistan side. I came to know about it much earlier before it got into the news. But obviously the deal is not done unless it's done. But let me tell you one more thing that the hopes are very high. Until unless something drastic happens and it's over, let us all keep our fingers crossed and pray for Indian defeat.
 
Su-35s for Pak :: Pie in the sky






Saturday, September 19, 2015

By : Russia India Report




Is Russia planning to win friends in Pakistan and lose influence in India? If Russia sells the advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to Pakistan, it is likely to lead to a major diplomatic rift with India.
1_img118915231646.jpg


  • Is Russia planning to win friends in Pakistan and lose influence in India? If Russia sells the advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to Pakistan, it is likely to lead to a major diplomatic rift with India. So why did Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov make the statement that Russia and Pakistan were “negotiating for the delivery of an unspecified number of Su-35 jets” to Islamabad?

    The best case scenario is that Russia is keen to ensure India’s return to its fold. As India enters into an increasing number of defence partnerships with Russia’s rivals, particularly Israel and the US, but also France and the UK, Moscow believes two can play the game. It is in this backdrop that Russia has entered into a defence cooperation agreement with Pakistan.

    Another reason could be that the judgement of some Kremlin players is clouded by the pressure of economic sanctions and they would like to grab a larger share of the global arms market in which Russia traditionally has been a leader. However, this possibility can be discounted as western sanctions have not had the intended impact. Despite an unfavourable geopolitical climate in 2010-14, Russia accounted for 27 per cent of the global arms market, with approximately $14 billion in exports. In fact, Rosoboronexport, Russia’s weapons export cartel, has orders exceeding $40 billion on its books.

    Russia’s offer to Pakistan could, therefore, be in the same category as the forever-on-hold S-300 sale to Iran. Moscow has attempted to squeeze diplomatic concessions from the US and Israel as payoff for withholding the air-defence system from Tehran.

    Likewise, the Russia-Pakistan talks over the Su-35 could be a ploy to get India fully on board the PAK-FA stealth fighter programme. The Indian Air Force (IAF) was originally committed to buy 200 of these fifth generation fighters but has since cut back the planned buys to 127. Now India wants to buy these jets directly off the production line from Russia rather than jointly develop the aircraft.

    Perhaps the Russians believe that Pakistan’s possession of the Su-35 could scare India to buy larger number of the PAK-FA. India may also be forced to purchase other advanced Russian weapons as sops for blocking the Sukhoi sale.


    What can the Su-35 do?

    With around 60 MiG-29s and a Su-30 fleet projected at 300, India currently enjoys an enormous advantage over Pakistan. While India would like to maintain this edge, the Su-35 will make a dent – albeit a slight one – in the IAF’s advantage. Although the much larger IAF, with its AWACS force multipliers, would easily tackle the Super Flanker, the presence of a brand new fighter – that is more powerful than anything in the IAF – could cause some anxiety among India’s war planners.

    According to Pakistani analyst and former PAF pilot Kaiser Tufail, the Su-35 being a twin-engine aircraft with an extremely long range, would help Pakistan “have a significant and potent presence in the Arabian Sea”.

    He adds: “These fighters would also allow unhindered patrolling by naval (long range maritime patrol aircraft), as well as providing top cover to our fleet at sea....Essentially, I see it as a guarantor of maritime security as far as the airspace is concerned.”

    To be sure, the Su-35 will be a game changer only if wielded in sufficient numbers and in sync with other air defence assets and missiles. But Pakistan is unlikely to order more than two squadrons of the Su-35 because of the expenses of operating a heavy fighter. The Super Flanker burns as much fuel per hour as an entire Karachi neighbourhood. Plus, twin engines would mean double the maintenance time of a single-engine F-16 in the PAF fleet.


    Diplomatic powwow ::

    How serious is the offer? Ryabkov is a junior minister in Russian cabinet. But making an offer to a financially insolvent client – that is also an exporter of terror – is one thing. Making it stick is a different ball game. Approval for the sale will have to go through several rungs of the Russian parliament Duma and the military, plus there are higher powers in Vladimir Putin’s inner circle who can overrule Ryabkov. So there’s every possibility that the Su-35 for Pakistan will end up being the equivalent of the S-300 for Iran.

    However, in the highly unlikely scenario that the Su-35 wears Pakistani colours, Russia can say goodbye to its largest buyer. Although Russia was the second largest arms exporter in the world during the period 2010-14, it was less diversified than the US. According to SIPRI, “Three countries; India, China and Algeria; accounted for almost 60 per cent of total Russian exports.” India alone accounted for 39 per cent.

    In contrast, the US which led with 31 per cent, had Korea as its top buyer at just 9 per cent. The US therefore had a better spread than Russia.

    So without India, Russia’s arms exports will atrophy. And although the likes of Algeria, Indonesia and Malaysia continue to be steady buyers of Russian weapons, the flows to these countries are a trickle rather than a torrent. No country offers Russia such a long-term market as India.

    India was also the first international customer for the MiG 29, and in fact expressed interested in it during its development in the early 1980s. Again, the IAF was among the first air forces in the world to induct the Su-27/30. India’s early investment in the PAK-FA project is enough indication of its seriousness in the project.

    In the backdrop it seems unlikely Russia will go ahead with ramping defence ties with Pakistan beyond a few helicopter gunships.


    Stopping the Kozyrevs ::

    It was under Andrei Kozyrev’s watch that India diversified away from Russia. Kozyrev (Russian foreign minister from 1990 to 1996), who sought close ties with the West, had declared after the Soviet Union was dissolved that the new Russia would no longer give special importance to India and would in fact treat India and Pakistan as equals. So basically, the country that was indirectly responsible for the deaths of 15,000 Soviet lives during the Afghanistan War was preferred by him over friendly India.

    Deepa Ollapally of George Washington University writes in the paper ‘Indo-Russian Strategic Relations: New Choices and Constraints’, “Kozyrev relegated India to a secondary role. During this initial phase, which was to last until 1996, India was forced to take the initiative to try to build new bridges to the Duma and utilise earlier Soviet lobbies. India was able to exploit lobbies against Kozyrev's tilt which had formed in the Russian Federation presidential apparatus. It was aided by such figures such as Vladimir Lukin who called for greater attention to be paid to old allies.”

    “However, then Prime Minister P.V. Narasimha Rao had no choice but to diversify India's security links as its most crucial erstwhile ally continued to labour in confusion and anxiety over its economic and political status, with no clear signal regarding its foreign policy preferences.”

    Kozyrev currently lives in Miami where he has acquired money and a nice tan. He slams Putin to the delight of his American backers. The thing India and Russia must do is sidestep or sideline such actors and keep the phone lines open. For, just as there are a few Indian leaders wanting closer ties with the West at Moscow’s expense, there are some Russian leaders who cannot see the importance of having India on their side.

    According to Ryabkov, increasing military cooperation between Islamabad and Moscow would not negatively impact Russia's ties with India. His statements would vindicate Rao’s decision to wean India away from over-dependence on Russia. Compared with Rao, current Prime Minister Narendra Modi belongs to the right leaning RSS, which is pro-American. He is unlikely to treat such an issue lightly.
Self satisfactory article again by a Indian to Indian public ?
Can't be taken seriously cause its just an excuse to show the Indian public every thing is alright & Russians are in our hands ?
What they will get by using these kind of low level prapoganda media stunts ?
Russia ,China USA & Pakistan are not using the theory described by that media stuntman ?
End of story but it shows how Indian media is desperate to down grade the reality that Russians are not with them ,on every issue .
 
Su-35s for Pak :: Pie in the sky






Saturday, September 19, 2015

By : Russia India Report




Is Russia planning to win friends in Pakistan and lose influence in India? If Russia sells the advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to Pakistan, it is likely to lead to a major diplomatic rift with India.
1_img118915231646.jpg


  • Is Russia planning to win friends in Pakistan and lose influence in India? If Russia sells the advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to Pakistan, it is likely to lead to a major diplomatic rift with India. So why did Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov make the statement that Russia and Pakistan were “negotiating for the delivery of an unspecified number of Su-35 jets” to Islamabad?

    The best case scenario is that Russia is keen to ensure India’s return to its fold. As India enters into an increasing number of defence partnerships with Russia’s rivals, particularly Israel and the US, but also France and the UK, Moscow believes two can play the game. It is in this backdrop that Russia has entered into a defence cooperation agreement with Pakistan.

    Another reason could be that the judgement of some Kremlin players is clouded by the pressure of economic sanctions and they would like to grab a larger share of the global arms market in which Russia traditionally has been a leader. However, this possibility can be discounted as western sanctions have not had the intended impact. Despite an unfavourable geopolitical climate in 2010-14, Russia accounted for 27 per cent of the global arms market, with approximately $14 billion in exports. In fact, Rosoboronexport, Russia’s weapons export cartel, has orders exceeding $40 billion on its books.

    Russia’s offer to Pakistan could, therefore, be in the same category as the forever-on-hold S-300 sale to Iran. Moscow has attempted to squeeze diplomatic concessions from the US and Israel as payoff for withholding the air-defence system from Tehran.

    Likewise, the Russia-Pakistan talks over the Su-35 could be a ploy to get India fully on board the PAK-FA stealth fighter programme. The Indian Air Force (IAF) was originally committed to buy 200 of these fifth generation fighters but has since cut back the planned buys to 127. Now India wants to buy these jets directly off the production line from Russia rather than jointly develop the aircraft.

    Perhaps the Russians believe that Pakistan’s possession of the Su-35 could scare India to buy larger number of the PAK-FA. India may also be forced to purchase other advanced Russian weapons as sops for blocking the Sukhoi sale.


    What can the Su-35 do?

    With around 60 MiG-29s and a Su-30 fleet projected at 300, India currently enjoys an enormous advantage over Pakistan. While India would like to maintain this edge, the Su-35 will make a dent – albeit a slight one – in the IAF’s advantage. Although the much larger IAF, with its AWACS force multipliers, would easily tackle the Super Flanker, the presence of a brand new fighter – that is more powerful than anything in the IAF – could cause some anxiety among India’s war planners.

    According to Pakistani analyst and former PAF pilot Kaiser Tufail, the Su-35 being a twin-engine aircraft with an extremely long range, would help Pakistan “have a significant and potent presence in the Arabian Sea”.

    He adds: “These fighters would also allow unhindered patrolling by naval (long range maritime patrol aircraft), as well as providing top cover to our fleet at sea....Essentially, I see it as a guarantor of maritime security as far as the airspace is concerned.”

    To be sure, the Su-35 will be a game changer only if wielded in sufficient numbers and in sync with other air defence assets and missiles. But Pakistan is unlikely to order more than two squadrons of the Su-35 because of the expenses of operating a heavy fighter. The Super Flanker burns as much fuel per hour as an entire Karachi neighbourhood. Plus, twin engines would mean double the maintenance time of a single-engine F-16 in the PAF fleet.


    Diplomatic powwow ::

    How serious is the offer? Ryabkov is a junior minister in Russian cabinet. But making an offer to a financially insolvent client – that is also an exporter of terror – is one thing. Making it stick is a different ball game. Approval for the sale will have to go through several rungs of the Russian parliament Duma and the military, plus there are higher powers in Vladimir Putin’s inner circle who can overrule Ryabkov. So there’s every possibility that the Su-35 for Pakistan will end up being the equivalent of the S-300 for Iran.

    However, in the highly unlikely scenario that the Su-35 wears Pakistani colours, Russia can say goodbye to its largest buyer. Although Russia was the second largest arms exporter in the world during the period 2010-14, it was less diversified than the US. According to SIPRI, “Three countries; India, China and Algeria; accounted for almost 60 per cent of total Russian exports.” India alone accounted for 39 per cent.

    In contrast, the US which led with 31 per cent, had Korea as its top buyer at just 9 per cent. The US therefore had a better spread than Russia.

    So without India, Russia’s arms exports will atrophy. And although the likes of Algeria, Indonesia and Malaysia continue to be steady buyers of Russian weapons, the flows to these countries are a trickle rather than a torrent. No country offers Russia such a long-term market as India.

    India was also the first international customer for the MiG 29, and in fact expressed interested in it during its development in the early 1980s. Again, the IAF was among the first air forces in the world to induct the Su-27/30. India’s early investment in the PAK-FA project is enough indication of its seriousness in the project.

    In the backdrop it seems unlikely Russia will go ahead with ramping defence ties with Pakistan beyond a few helicopter gunships.


    Stopping the Kozyrevs ::

    It was under Andrei Kozyrev’s watch that India diversified away from Russia. Kozyrev (Russian foreign minister from 1990 to 1996), who sought close ties with the West, had declared after the Soviet Union was dissolved that the new Russia would no longer give special importance to India and would in fact treat India and Pakistan as equals. So basically, the country that was indirectly responsible for the deaths of 15,000 Soviet lives during the Afghanistan War was preferred by him over friendly India.

    Deepa Ollapally of George Washington University writes in the paper ‘Indo-Russian Strategic Relations: New Choices and Constraints’, “Kozyrev relegated India to a secondary role. During this initial phase, which was to last until 1996, India was forced to take the initiative to try to build new bridges to the Duma and utilise earlier Soviet lobbies. India was able to exploit lobbies against Kozyrev's tilt which had formed in the Russian Federation presidential apparatus. It was aided by such figures such as Vladimir Lukin who called for greater attention to be paid to old allies.”

    “However, then Prime Minister P.V. Narasimha Rao had no choice but to diversify India's security links as its most crucial erstwhile ally continued to labour in confusion and anxiety over its economic and political status, with no clear signal regarding its foreign policy preferences.”

    Kozyrev currently lives in Miami where he has acquired money and a nice tan. He slams Putin to the delight of his American backers. The thing India and Russia must do is sidestep or sideline such actors and keep the phone lines open. For, just as there are a few Indian leaders wanting closer ties with the West at Moscow’s expense, there are some Russian leaders who cannot see the importance of having India on their side.

    According to Ryabkov, increasing military cooperation between Islamabad and Moscow would not negatively impact Russia's ties with India. His statements would vindicate Rao’s decision to wean India away from over-dependence on Russia. Compared with Rao, current Prime Minister Narendra Modi belongs to the right leaning RSS, which is pro-American. He is unlikely to treat such an issue lightly.
This deal will be very good for Pakistan, India and the region. Now you will say why good for India?
As long as there is imbalance of conventional weapons between Pakistan and India, India will be tempted to have a limited war. Limited War concept failed almost always if you read military History. So once conventional balance is restored the chances of nuclear war decrease and region can be secure. Now Russia does not need India as much as India needs Russia to continue to supply parts and armament of Russian origin. Russia will follow the US style of supplying arms to both nations and will have leverage on both. Russia was loyal to India and will be, but once you went ahead and bought Rafale from France, Apache, Sikorsky,Posieden and transports from US/Europe and various other armament from US. Who do you think broke the loyalty? This is not a movie that everything works your way.
 
@batmannow Without naming names and revealing any identities, I know someone personally who facilitated the on-going talks for Su-35 from the Pakistan side. I came to know about it much earlier before it got into the news. But obviously the deal is not done unless it's done. But let me tell you one more thing that the hopes are very high. Until unless something drastic happens and it's over, let us all keep our fingers crossed and pray for Indian defeat.
I think , & check the situation in our region most of the times & I think its going to happen very soon but yes best of luck in the end ?
Still Pakistan has many options ?

@batmannow Without naming names and revealing any identities, I know someone personally who facilitated the on-going talks for Su-35 from the Pakistan side. I came to know about it much earlier before it got into the news. But obviously the deal is not done unless it's done. But let me tell you one more thing that the hopes are very high. Until unless something drastic happens and it's over, let us all keep our fingers crossed and pray for Indian defeat.
I think , & check the situation in our region most of the times & I think its going to happen very soon but yes best of luck in the end ?
Still Pakistan has many options ?
 
Su-35s for Pak :: Pie in the sky






Saturday, September 19, 2015

By : Russia India Report




Is Russia planning to win friends in Pakistan and lose influence in India? If Russia sells the advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to Pakistan, it is likely to lead to a major diplomatic rift with India.
1_img118915231646.jpg


  • Is Russia planning to win friends in Pakistan and lose influence in India? If Russia sells the advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to Pakistan, it is likely to lead to a major diplomatic rift with India. So why did Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov make the statement that Russia and Pakistan were “negotiating for the delivery of an unspecified number of Su-35 jets” to Islamabad?

    The best case scenario is that Russia is keen to ensure India’s return to its fold. As India enters into an increasing number of defence partnerships with Russia’s rivals, particularly Israel and the US, but also France and the UK, Moscow believes two can play the game. It is in this backdrop that Russia has entered into a defence cooperation agreement with Pakistan.

    Another reason could be that the judgement of some Kremlin players is clouded by the pressure of economic sanctions and they would like to grab a larger share of the global arms market in which Russia traditionally has been a leader. However, this possibility can be discounted as western sanctions have not had the intended impact. Despite an unfavourable geopolitical climate in 2010-14, Russia accounted for 27 per cent of the global arms market, with approximately $14 billion in exports. In fact, Rosoboronexport, Russia’s weapons export cartel, has orders exceeding $40 billion on its books.

    Russia’s offer to Pakistan could, therefore, be in the same category as the forever-on-hold S-300 sale to Iran. Moscow has attempted to squeeze diplomatic concessions from the US and Israel as payoff for withholding the air-defence system from Tehran.

    Likewise, the Russia-Pakistan talks over the Su-35 could be a ploy to get India fully on board the PAK-FA stealth fighter programme. The Indian Air Force (IAF) was originally committed to buy 200 of these fifth generation fighters but has since cut back the planned buys to 127. Now India wants to buy these jets directly off the production line from Russia rather than jointly develop the aircraft.

    Perhaps the Russians believe that Pakistan’s possession of the Su-35 could scare India to buy larger number of the PAK-FA. India may also be forced to purchase other advanced Russian weapons as sops for blocking the Sukhoi sale.


    What can the Su-35 do?

    With around 60 MiG-29s and a Su-30 fleet projected at 300, India currently enjoys an enormous advantage over Pakistan. While India would like to maintain this edge, the Su-35 will make a dent – albeit a slight one – in the IAF’s advantage. Although the much larger IAF, with its AWACS force multipliers, would easily tackle the Super Flanker, the presence of a brand new fighter – that is more powerful than anything in the IAF – could cause some anxiety among India’s war planners.

    According to Pakistani analyst and former PAF pilot Kaiser Tufail, the Su-35 being a twin-engine aircraft with an extremely long range, would help Pakistan “have a significant and potent presence in the Arabian Sea”.

    He adds: “These fighters would also allow unhindered patrolling by naval (long range maritime patrol aircraft), as well as providing top cover to our fleet at sea....Essentially, I see it as a guarantor of maritime security as far as the airspace is concerned.”

    To be sure, the Su-35 will be a game changer only if wielded in sufficient numbers and in sync with other air defence assets and missiles. But Pakistan is unlikely to order more than two squadrons of the Su-35 because of the expenses of operating a heavy fighter. The Super Flanker burns as much fuel per hour as an entire Karachi neighbourhood. Plus, twin engines would mean double the maintenance time of a single-engine F-16 in the PAF fleet.


    Diplomatic powwow ::

    How serious is the offer? Ryabkov is a junior minister in Russian cabinet. But making an offer to a financially insolvent client – that is also an exporter of terror – is one thing. Making it stick is a different ball game. Approval for the sale will have to go through several rungs of the Russian parliament Duma and the military, plus there are higher powers in Vladimir Putin’s inner circle who can overrule Ryabkov. So there’s every possibility that the Su-35 for Pakistan will end up being the equivalent of the S-300 for Iran.

    However, in the highly unlikely scenario that the Su-35 wears Pakistani colours, Russia can say goodbye to its largest buyer. Although Russia was the second largest arms exporter in the world during the period 2010-14, it was less diversified than the US. According to SIPRI, “Three countries; India, China and Algeria; accounted for almost 60 per cent of total Russian exports.” India alone accounted for 39 per cent.

    In contrast, the US which led with 31 per cent, had Korea as its top buyer at just 9 per cent. The US therefore had a better spread than Russia.

    So without India, Russia’s arms exports will atrophy. And although the likes of Algeria, Indonesia and Malaysia continue to be steady buyers of Russian weapons, the flows to these countries are a trickle rather than a torrent. No country offers Russia such a long-term market as India.

    India was also the first international customer for the MiG 29, and in fact expressed interested in it during its development in the early 1980s. Again, the IAF was among the first air forces in the world to induct the Su-27/30. India’s early investment in the PAK-FA project is enough indication of its seriousness in the project.

    In the backdrop it seems unlikely Russia will go ahead with ramping defence ties with Pakistan beyond a few helicopter gunships.


    Stopping the Kozyrevs ::

    It was under Andrei Kozyrev’s watch that India diversified away from Russia. Kozyrev (Russian foreign minister from 1990 to 1996), who sought close ties with the West, had declared after the Soviet Union was dissolved that the new Russia would no longer give special importance to India and would in fact treat India and Pakistan as equals. So basically, the country that was indirectly responsible for the deaths of 15,000 Soviet lives during the Afghanistan War was preferred by him over friendly India.

    Deepa Ollapally of George Washington University writes in the paper ‘Indo-Russian Strategic Relations: New Choices and Constraints’, “Kozyrev relegated India to a secondary role. During this initial phase, which was to last until 1996, India was forced to take the initiative to try to build new bridges to the Duma and utilise earlier Soviet lobbies. India was able to exploit lobbies against Kozyrev's tilt which had formed in the Russian Federation presidential apparatus. It was aided by such figures such as Vladimir Lukin who called for greater attention to be paid to old allies.”

    “However, then Prime Minister P.V. Narasimha Rao had no choice but to diversify India's security links as its most crucial erstwhile ally continued to labour in confusion and anxiety over its economic and political status, with no clear signal regarding its foreign policy preferences.”

    Kozyrev currently lives in Miami where he has acquired money and a nice tan. He slams Putin to the delight of his American backers. The thing India and Russia must do is sidestep or sideline such actors and keep the phone lines open. For, just as there are a few Indian leaders wanting closer ties with the West at Moscow’s expense, there are some Russian leaders who cannot see the importance of having India on their side.

    According to Ryabkov, increasing military cooperation between Islamabad and Moscow would not negatively impact Russia's ties with India. His statements would vindicate Rao’s decision to wean India away from over-dependence on Russia. Compared with Rao, current Prime Minister Narendra Modi belongs to the right leaning RSS, which is pro-American. He is unlikely to treat such an issue lightly.

Russia should understand there are some lines which India will not like to cross . We expect the same from you . Let's say if Su35 sold to pakistan . This will dent and hurt our nation but we will survive . But what will russia do if India comes up with its own Super sukhoi out of HAL's facility with full western technology and call it Tejas 35 ? Like Chinese did with their J 11 ? And makes agreement with US Aerospace giants to develop AMCA and invest in Japan's 5th gen fighter program ? So we are not out of option but we will undergo hard times at least for two years but we can overcome as US wont waste any time to give india all it wanted and take its relationship to whole new level . As India can tank heavily on chinese power . Only power in asia which can bleed china to the last drop.

If russia sold su35 then India will release some pressure to align with western power wholly and solely and will get advanced war machines from US nuclear submarines to many other futuristic technology . US don't sell its high tech weapon system especially naval vessels as it doubt of confidential infos leaked to russia . India won't stop purchasing western systems whether you like it or not . India will be in better position aligning with west as Our Core enemy is not Pakistan but China .

So its upto russia what they want to do ... We will reciprocate , That too when leader like Modi at helm our reaction will be very intense for sure . Because problem with selling these weapons will start a new war. As Pakistanis leadership have this habit of declaring war once they get new weapons like in 1965 . So be it .

Self satisfactory article again by a Indian to Indian public ?
Can't be taken seriously cause its just an excuse to show the Indian public every thing is alright & Russians are in our hands ?
What they will get by using these kind of low level prapoganda media stunts ?
Russia ,China USA & Pakistan are not using the theory described by that media stuntman ?
End of story but it shows how Indian media is desperate to down grade the reality that Russians are not with them ,on every issue .

its well written article . Whats wrong with that ? If you check my previous comments i made on related thread you will notice i said the same . Its either a stunt or Confusion created by Pakistan . See Pakistan discussed with russia . That's thge truth but what russia said ? Nothing other than diplomatic answer like " Ok we will look in to it" Or "Let the discussion open then we will decide " So far pakistan did not say what russian replied .But just propaganda bits here and there but all on one truth Pakistan Discussed su35 lol .

On the far off chance that it does happen.

Su-35BM-P 8th Squadron "Haiders"

View attachment 258576
View attachment 258577



China is getting the same configuration as Russia is. Essentially, its the same as the US selling the Block-52 to us. It is the same(if not better configuration in some parameters) to what they operated.

China bought a 100 RD-93s, now the deal may be direct between Pakistan and Russia.

Keep dreaming India Russia both are matured states . This deal will make both into core enemies . Not in the interest of both
 
I think , & check the situation in our region most of the times & I think its going to happen very soon but yes best of luck in the end ?
Still Pakistan has many options ?


I think , & check the situation in our region most of the times & I think its going to happen very soon but yes best of luck in the end ?
Still Pakistan has many options ?

I am really not sure about various other options, but it's not like Pakistan's security is totally dependent on Su35s. We can definitely wait for the Chinese platforms and induct them. Also if we are unable to materialize this deal we can look into Rafaels also, since French are quite pissed off with the Indians. They have been behaving quite interestingly lately, I must say. But looking into Rafaels is quite far fetched in this moment. The Russian deal is much much more important for Pakistan in many ways than just buying some fighter jets.
 
Russia should understand there are some lines which India will not like to cross . We expect the same from you . Let's say if Su35 sold to pakistan . This will dent and hurt our nation but we will survive . But what will russia do if India comes up with its own Super sukhoi out of HAL's facility with full western technology and call it Tejas 35 ? Like Chinese did with their J 11 ? And makes agreement with US Aerospace giants to develop AMCA and invest in Japan's 5th gen fighter program ? So we are not out of option but we will undergo hard times at least for two years but we can overcome as US wont waste any time to give india all it wanted and take its relationship to whole new level . As India can tank heavily on chinese power . Only power in asia which can bleed china to the last drop.

If russia sold su35 then India will release some pressure to align with western power wholly and solely and will get advanced war machines from US nuclear submarines to many other futuristic technology . US don't sell its high tech weapon system especially naval vessels as it doubt of confidential infos leaked to russia . India won't stop purchasing western systems whether you like it or not . India will be in better position aligning with west as Our Core enemy is not Pakistan but China .

So its upto russia what they want to do ... We will reciprocate , That too when leader like Modi at helm our reaction will be very intense for sure . Because problem with selling these weapons will start a new war. As Pakistanis leadership have this habit of declaring war once they get new weapons like in 1965 . So be it .



its well written article . Whats wrong with that ? If you check my previous comments i made on related thread you will notice i said the same . Its either a stunt or Confusion created by Pakistan . See Pakistan discussed with russia . That's thge truth but what russia said ? Nothing other than diplomatic answer like " Ok we will look in to it" Or "Let the discussion open then we will decide " So far pakistan did not say what russian replied .But just propaganda bits here and there but all on one truth Pakistan Discussed su35 lol .



Keep dreaming India Russia both are matured states . This deal will make both into core enemies . Not in the interest of both

So What Should we buy which would not make you angry?. I understand Russians are under your influence that is why they sold Su 27 and Su 30 to China. (You Indians must have approved the sale). Would it be okay with you if we could buy J11D?
 
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