Taliban to US Envoy: We didn't give sacrifices just to form National Government

[IbnAbdullah]

Salaam

Afghan Taliban showing its true colors. These talks are a sham, and I hope Imran Khan wake up.

Not so fast. Depends upon what direction US will take if the Taliban is not willing to cooperate.

What did people expect will happen after two decades of war with NATO - which came right as the Taliban had managed to secure peace after nearly decades of war with the Soviets and the resultant civil war after the Soviets left - a liberal pro LGBT government?

As for what the US may or may not do - well given how the history and context of this whole war and the fact that the US is now talking with the Taliban - shows the US has checked all directions it could reasonably take. All that has led to these talks with the Taliban to get some sort of face saving out of this whole thing.

The US is leaving not because they want peace - rather they have tried all reasonable measures of war and failed to gain anything of substance whilst spending trillions on this whole thing.

These wars have given the Chinese the opportunity to catch up - and they have caught up. Even the EU has started to move away from US led world. The war has been and continues to be exceptionally costly for the US, that is why they want to leave. The Taliban know this and so they are going hard in these negotiations.



....

 

[Respect4Respect01]

i think taliban government is coming. They will behead Ashraf ghani and other Parlimentarians . Taliban is not happy with them.

lol people like Ghani and Karzai are a bigger threat to Pakistan than the talibans, 70000 Pakistanis were killed by these Indian puppets.

 

[Imran Khan]

And is envoy may sh1tting in paint then

 

[LeGenD]

taliban know how to talk with bullies and they have full right to make islamic govt

Bro, you do not understand. Afghanistan, in its present form, is home to a powerful terrorist organization ISIS-K [1] and the original Al-Qaeda Network might rear its ugly head in the region once again under the leadership of Hamza Bin Laden [2] (son of deceased Osama Bin Laden).

Food for thought:-

[1] https://thedefensepost.com/tag/islamic-state-khorasan-province-isis-k/

[2] https://www.timesofisrael.com/born-into-al-qaeda-hamza-bin-ladens-rise-to-prominence/

My point-of-contention is that the Afghan Taliban's priorities are not straight even after decades of bloodshed in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Trump administration is willing to integrate the Afghan Taliban with the existing Afghan government to formulate a wider Afghan national government [3].

[3] https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.06220697a5cf

This is a golden opportunity for the Afghan Taliban to do something right, for the betterment of the region, and defeating the menace of terrorism should be top priority of regional forces (Pakistan cannot do this on its own).

Unfortunately, the Afghan Taliban haven't learned any lesson yet. They are hellbent on continuing on the path of CIVIL WAR which is causing record number of civilian casualties in Afghanistan, and ignoring the very threats that brought US into this region. Did it occur to you that why ISIS-K is proving resilient in the face of extensive COIN operations? Who is joining them? Afghans who suffered at the hands of Afghan Taliban and other forces?

Trump administration will not last for indefinite period, and if the aforementioned terrorist organizations RESURGE in Afghanistan, then American and Pakistan COIN efforts since 2001 were for nothing. What do you think will happen afterwards? What if Pentagon decide to take matters into its hands? What if they decide to use nuclear weapons at some point?

I hope Imran Khan wake the hell up.

Any good suggestions after 2 decades of blood bath?


They are not willing from day one.

See above.

Taliban will wait another 5 years but amricans cant...

See above.

US doesn't give a hoot about Afghan government. As long as there is no terrorist attack from Afghanistan on US soil. US will be happy to make the deal. Pakistan couldn't care less what happens to Asharf Ghani and other Indian puppets either. The real objective is to remove all northern alliance and other Indian puppets from Afghanistan so that there is no terrorist attack on Pakistani soil.
The ultimate objective for Pakistan should be to once again secure our strategic depth.

See above.

The entire situation can blow on our face at some point.

 

[Peaceful Civilian]

lol people like Ghani and Karzai are a bigger threat to Pakistan than the talibans, 70000 Pakistanis were killed by these Indian puppets.

Yes we should talk with taliban. Afghan government is just India puppet..

 

[Murgah]

Bro, you do not understand. Afghanistan, in its present form, is home to a powerful terrorist organization ISIS-K [1] and the original Al-Qaeda Network might rear its ugly head in the region once again under the leadership of Hamza Bin Laden [2] (son of deceased Osama Bin Laden).

Food for thought:-

[1] https://thedefensepost.com/tag/islamic-state-khorasan-province-isis-k/

[2] https://www.timesofisrael.com/born-into-al-qaeda-hamza-bin-ladens-rise-to-prominence/

My point-of-contention is that the Afghan Taliban's priorities are not straight even after decades of bloodshed in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Trump administration is willing to integrate the Afghan Taliban with the existing Afghan government to formulate a wider Afghan national government [3].

[3] https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.06220697a5cf

This is a golden opportunity for the Afghan Taliban to do something right, for the betterment of the region, and defeating the menace of terrorism should be top priority of regional forces (Pakistan cannot do this on its own).

Unfortunately, the Afghan Taliban haven't learned any lesson yet. They are hellbent on continuing on the path of CIVIL WAR which is causing record number of civilian casualties in Afghanistan, and ignoring the very threats that brought US into this region. Did it occur to you that why ISIS-K is proving resilient in the face of extensive COIN operations? Who is joining them? Afghans who suffered at the hands of Afghan Taliban and other forces?

Trump administration will not last for indefinite period, and if the aforementioned terrorist organizations RESURGE in Afghanistan, then American and Pakistan COIN efforts since 2001 were for nothing. What do you think will happen afterwards? What if Pentagon decide to take matters into its hands? What if they decide to use nuclear weapons at some point?

I hope Imran Khan wake the hell up.


See above.


See above.


See above.

The entire situation can blow on our face at some point.

mutual govt is not possible in afghanistan

 

[I S I]

Ye to Lolwa hogaya.

 

[Reddington]

Bro, you do not understand. Afghanistan, in its present form, is home to a powerful terrorist organization ISIS-K [1] and the original Al-Qaeda Network might rear its ugly head in the region once again under the leadership of Hamza Bin Laden [2] (son of deceased Osama Bin Laden).

Food for thought:-

[1] https://thedefensepost.com/tag/islamic-state-khorasan-province-isis-k/

[2] https://www.timesofisrael.com/born-into-al-qaeda-hamza-bin-ladens-rise-to-prominence/

My point-of-contention is that the Afghan Taliban's priorities are not straight even after decades of bloodshed in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Trump administration is willing to integrate the Afghan Taliban with the existing Afghan government to formulate a wider Afghan national government [3].

[3] https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.06220697a5cf

This is a golden opportunity for the Afghan Taliban to do something right, for the betterment of the region, and defeating the menace of terrorism should be top priority of regional forces (Pakistan cannot do this on its own).

Unfortunately, the Afghan Taliban haven't learned any lesson yet. They are hellbent on continuing on the path of CIVIL WAR which is causing record number of civilian casualties in Afghanistan, and ignoring the very threats that brought US into this region. Did it occur to you that why ISIS-K is proving resilient in the face of extensive COIN operations? Who is joining them? Afghans who suffered at the hands of Afghan Taliban and other forces?

Trump administration will not last for indefinite period, and if the aforementioned terrorist organizations RESURGE in Afghanistan, then American and Pakistan COIN efforts since 2001 were for nothing. What do you think will happen afterwards? What if Pentagon decide to take matters into its hands? What if they decide to use nuclear weapons at some point?

I hope Imran Khan wake the hell up.


See above.


See above.


See above.

The entire situation can blow on our face at some point.

You are wrong. ISIS and other terrorists in Afghanistan are being helped by CIA and RAW.
Read this article. Even Karzai an American puppet is saying US is behind ISIS in Afghanistan.

11 Nov 2017


Hamid Karzai: US colluded with ISIL in Afghanistan
Ex-Afghan president says group's presence used as excuse to drop the largest non-nuclear bomb on district in Nangarhar.

Hamid Karzai, the former president of Afghanistan, has accused the US of working with the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) group in his country.

In an exclusive interview with Al Jazeera's UpFrontaired on Friday, Karzai said the US government had allowed ISIL, also known as ISIS, to flourish inside Afghanistan.

"In my view under the full presence, surveillance, military, political, intelligence, Daesh [ISIL] has emerged," he said.

"And for two years the Afghan people came, cried loud about their suffering, of violations. Nothing was done."

Karzai said the US administration of President Donald Trump used ISIL as an excuse to drop a massive bomb on Afghanistan in April 2017.

"And the next day, Daesh takes the next district in Afghanistan," he said referring to the Arabic name of the armed group.

"That proves to us that there is a hand in it and that hand can be no one else but them [the US] in Afghanistan."

GBU-43, the largest non-nuclear bomb, the US used in combat was dropped in the Achin district of Nangarhar province, close to the border with Pakistan, reportedly killing at least 36 ISIL fighters and destroying tunnel complex of the armed group.

The US Central Command (CENTCOM) said the attack was designed to minimise the risk to Afghan and US forces conducting clearing operations in the area.

The explosive, also known as the "mother of all bombs" (MOAB), was equal to 11 tonnes of TNT with a blast radius of 1.6km.

Witnesses said they felt the ground shake after the explosion, while others described towering flames in the aftermath.

At that time, Karzai also condemned the attack as "inhuman and most brutal misuse" of Afghanistan as "testing ground for new and dangerous weapons".

'Potential war crimes'
Karzai also said he welcomed a recent call by the International Criminal Court (ICC) prosecutor to investigate war crimes in Afghanistan, including those committed during his tenure in office.

"She's right to launch such an investigation," Karzai told UpFront host Mehdi Hasan, referring to ICC Chief Prosecutor Fatou Bensouda's request to launch an investigation in Afghanistan.

Karzai also acknowledged that there were human rights violations during his government, and possibly on his watch.

"Definitely, there were violations by the Afghan security forces, by the US, and by others."

Karzai said he would help with any investigation, even into his own potential complicity.

"I have been asking for this so that they come to Afghanistan and investigate as to what has happened in this country."

During the interview, Karzai was also asked to respond to claims by human rights groups that he was warned while in office that human-rights abuses were taking place.

"They are wrong," he said. "They didn't tell me. I told them."

"I told the Western human rights bodies as to what was going on in Afghanistan. They were hiding it. The Western press was hiding it. I told them. I raised it."

SOURCE: AL JAZEERA NEWS

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/11/hamid-karzai-colluded-isil-afghanistan-171110191715544.html

https://timesofislamabad.com/09-Oct-2017/why-cia-is-supporting-isis-in-afghanistan

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-04-21/afghan-ex-president-karzai-isis-tool-united-states

 

[Yaseen1]

u.s end is near defeat is written in their fate whatever they do they cannot win this war

 

[Zhukov]

Seems like Fresh material is Ready about "How Glorious Mujahideen Defeated the Kuffaar"
These same Drums that were beating at the Time of Soviet Withdrawal. Soviet Packed and left this Shithole region seeing this fight have no end as these people don't care about their country. Let them be what they want. The Soviets sought out their Problems, Abandoned the White Elephant of Communism and now Gradually Joining the Developed World. Russia and Eastern Europe even Central Asia is growing fast peacefully. But this Afghanistan remained where it was even more dangerous and unstable and poor.
Now USA is packing up realizing it can pour trillions of dollars into it but cannot put sense in these people. They will go home and continue to Prosper While Al-Jihaad Brigade will continue to Rot and Backward waiting for some prophecy to be fulfilled without any hard work.
The Poorest and most Unsafe Country in the World. Russia and USA are still thriving.
And For some of my Fellow Pakistanis. Its easy to chant glory for Afghan Fighters while sitting comfortably in Security of Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad, Peshawar, Sialkot, Multan or Faisalabad. Ever wonder about the common folk Afghans what they have suffered. And some Pakistani People still want the 1996 Styled Islamic Government. 50% Mandatory Tax on every Business Get Attacked if not Paid, Heroin Poppy Production as the only source of Government Revenue, Smuggling as major source of Income, Ban Women from School, Destroy Ancient Sculptures.
I suggest Vote for Tehreek Taliban or Jamaat ul Ahrar like people in Pakistan Instead of PTI PPP or PMLN before wishing for a similar fate for your neighbor.
I thought Taliban have Changed and are now working toward a proper government with Nationalistic Ambitions fighting against occupying forces. but they are still the same old Cult. Allah Protect Afghanistan and Pakistan from this madness and Bloodshed

 

[Crystal-Clear]

Not so fast. Depends upon what direction US will take if the Taliban is not willing to cooperate.

only if usa us willing to fight by themselves.

 

[ziaulislam]

Salaam





What did people expect will happen after two decades of war with NATO - which came right as the Taliban had managed to secure peace after nearly decades of war with the Soviets and the resultant civil war after the Soviets left - a liberal pro LGBT government?

As for what the US may or may not do - well given how the history and context of this whole war and the fact that the US is now talking with the Taliban - shows the US has checked all directions it could reasonably take. All that has led to these talks with the Taliban to get some sort of face saving out of this whole thing.

The US is leaving not because they want peace - rather they have tried all reasonable measures of war and failed to gain anything of substance whilst spending trillions on this whole thing.

These wars have given the Chinese the opportunity to catch up - and they have caught up. Even the EU has started to move away from US led world. The war has been and continues to be exceptionally costly for the US, that is why they want to leave. The Taliban know this and so they are going hard in these negotiations.



....

War costs USA 60-70b every year and a trillion in total
Even half of that spent in USA would have revolutionized changes in infrastructure

Today yemen, africa and middle east has more presenece of anti state bodies..Afghanistan is just forgotten

In mean while opium has united all the drugvlords

 

[LeGenD]

You are wrong. ISIS and other terrorists in Afghanistan are being helped by CIA and RAW.
Read this article. Even Karzai an American puppet is saying US is behind ISIS in Afghanistan.

11 Nov 2017


Hamid Karzai: US colluded with ISIL in Afghanistan
Ex-Afghan president says group's presence used as excuse to drop the largest non-nuclear bomb on district in Nangarhar.

Hamid Karzai, the former president of Afghanistan, has accused the US of working with the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) group in his country.

In an exclusive interview with Al Jazeera's UpFrontaired on Friday, Karzai said the US government had allowed ISIL, also known as ISIS, to flourish inside Afghanistan.

"In my view under the full presence, surveillance, military, political, intelligence, Daesh [ISIL] has emerged," he said.

"And for two years the Afghan people came, cried loud about their suffering, of violations. Nothing was done."

Karzai said the US administration of President Donald Trump used ISIL as an excuse to drop a massive bomb on Afghanistan in April 2017.

"And the next day, Daesh takes the next district in Afghanistan," he said referring to the Arabic name of the armed group.

"That proves to us that there is a hand in it and that hand can be no one else but them [the US] in Afghanistan."

GBU-43, the largest non-nuclear bomb, the US used in combat was dropped in the Achin district of Nangarhar province, close to the border with Pakistan, reportedly killing at least 36 ISIL fighters and destroying tunnel complex of the armed group.

The US Central Command (CENTCOM) said the attack was designed to minimise the risk to Afghan and US forces conducting clearing operations in the area.

The explosive, also known as the "mother of all bombs" (MOAB), was equal to 11 tonnes of TNT with a blast radius of 1.6km.

Witnesses said they felt the ground shake after the explosion, while others described towering flames in the aftermath.

At that time, Karzai also condemned the attack as "inhuman and most brutal misuse" of Afghanistan as "testing ground for new and dangerous weapons".

'Potential war crimes'
Karzai also said he welcomed a recent call by the International Criminal Court (ICC) prosecutor to investigate war crimes in Afghanistan, including those committed during his tenure in office.

"She's right to launch such an investigation," Karzai told UpFront host Mehdi Hasan, referring to ICC Chief Prosecutor Fatou Bensouda's request to launch an investigation in Afghanistan.

Karzai also acknowledged that there were human rights violations during his government, and possibly on his watch.

"Definitely, there were violations by the Afghan security forces, by the US, and by others."

Karzai said he would help with any investigation, even into his own potential complicity.

"I have been asking for this so that they come to Afghanistan and investigate as to what has happened in this country."

During the interview, Karzai was also asked to respond to claims by human rights groups that he was warned while in office that human-rights abuses were taking place.

"They are wrong," he said. "They didn't tell me. I told them."

"I told the Western human rights bodies as to what was going on in Afghanistan. They were hiding it. The Western press was hiding it. I told them. I raised it."

SOURCE: AL JAZEERA NEWS

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/11/hamid-karzai-colluded-isil-afghanistan-171110191715544.html

https://timesofislamabad.com/09-Oct-2017/why-cia-is-supporting-isis-in-afghanistan

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-04-21/afghan-ex-president-karzai-isis-tool-united-states

Since when is Hamid Karzai a reliable source of information? He ran out of favor with the US due to corruption scandals, and he decided to slander his master afterwards.

[1] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/dec/02/wikileaks-cables-hamid-karzai-erratic

[2] https://www.usip.org/sites/default/...etween-Hamid-Karzai-and-the-United-States.pdf

I am not asserting or believe that American hands are CLEAN in Afghanistan; they will play all kinds of games there as long as they PROFIT from their experiments. But it is foolish to assert that US and ISIS-K are allies in any sense; You can find numerous footage of US-led forces pounding ISIS-K positions to oblivion over the course of years.

Anyways, it is important for regional players to make sure that forces like ISIS-K and Al-Qaeda Network do not RESURGE in the region. But this is not possible as long as Afghanistan find itself in CIVIL WAR situation. Afghan Taliban should understand that their actions are not helpful. Best way to send US home is by addressing its primary concerns for the AfPak region.

 

[Reddington]

Since when is Hamid Karzai a reliable source of information? He ran out of favor with the US due to corruption scandals, and he decided to slander his master afterwards.

Ok.
How about Russian foreign minister's statement.

Unidentified helicopters delivering arms to militants in Afghanistan – Moscow
Published time: 23 Aug, 2018 14:10Edited time: 23 Aug, 2018 14:34

The Russian Foreign Ministry on Thursday drew attention again to the flights of “unidentified helicopters in the north of Afghanistan, delivering weapons and ammunition” to local Islamic State (IS, formerly ISIS) militants and Taliban fighters. “According to the statements by the Afghan media and local residents, such flights have recently been recorded in the province of Sari-Pul,” said the ministry’s spokeswoman Maria Zakharova. She added that neither the Afghan military nor NATO forces had addressed those flights, which were carried out close to the borders of Central Asian countries, Sputnik reported. “Who is behind those flights, who provides weapons for the terrorists and creates their bases close to the southern borders of the CIS countries, and why does this occur in Afghan airspace controlled by NATO forces?”Zakharova said.

https://www.rt.com/newsline/436666-helicopters-arms-militants-afghanistan/

I am not asserting or believe that American hands are CLEAN in Afghanistan; they will play all kinds of games there as long as they PROFIT from their experiments. But it is foolish to assert that US and ISIS-K are allies in any sense; You can find numerous footage of US-led forces pounding ISIS-K positions to oblivion over the course of years.

Anyways, it is important for regional players to make sure that forces like ISIS-K and Al-Qaeda Network do not RESURGE in the region. But this is not possible as long as Afghanistan find itself in CIVIL WAR situation. Afghan Taliban should understand that their actions are not helpful. Best way to send US home is by addressing its primary concerns for the AfPak region.

I understand. In an ideal situation it would be preferable for Pakistan that there shouldn't be a civil war in Afghanistan. But we have to make do with what we have got. We can never let any Indian influence in any Afghan government. By making a national government all these northern alliance aka Indian puppets would still be in power. That means there will still be terrorist attacks on Pakistani soil.

Can we really afford that????
With a hostile India on our east, it would be preferable to once again have our strategic depth secured again.
That should be ultimate goal. Our strategic depth secured.
When that happens, Pakistan's entire focus will be on Kashmir and India.

 

[925boy]

Not so fast. Depends upon what direction US will take if the Taliban is not willing to cooperate.

But how long can US keep at it in Afghanistan? How long can US keep at it in Afghanistan IF conflict erupts somewhere else, like Korean Penninsula? I'm just wondering, because i know the Taliban has been hit hard and continuing is hard, but i'm worried the US is overhyping its stamina for Afghanistan war.

Why do I get the feeling that Taliban are trying to become Sunni Ayatollahs?

what do you mean?