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Taliban Leader Mullah Omar Urges Seven Point Plan for Peace

Qouted by Fundamentalist:
main thing is that democractic system should continue.

Yes, this is the point. If Taliban had given the Northern Alliance their due right, the history of Afghanistan would have been showing a better picture of the scenario at this moment.

But a question comes to my mind, are Taliban such democratic minded that they would allow other political fractions not only to exist, during their assumed future government, but to gain political popularity?
 
The nature of the discussion so far has been quite extraordinary. Looks like everybody is saying that if Taliban had done thing A or thing B, it would have been great. Why the fck Taliban deserves to have ANY sort of power? Why should they be given ANY attention when it is crystal clear that people in Afghanistan & Pakistan detest their regime?

And if you are so eager to have an Afghan government which has a Taliban presence, why don't you first try the experiment in Swat & NWFP? Lay down your conditions, accept a mutually agreeable form of Sharia & have Taliban rule those. If it is OK in Afghanistan, it should be OK in Pakistan too. Or, is it that just Afghanis should be put under some form of Taliban regime?
 
The nature of the discussion so far has been quite extraordinary. Looks like everybody is saying that if Taliban had done thing A or thing B, it would have been great. Why the fck Taliban deserves to have ANY sort of power? Why should they be given ANY attention when it is crystal clear that people in Afghanistan & Pakistan detest their regime?

And if you are so eager to have an Afghan government which has a Taliban presence, why don't you first try the experiment in Swat & NWFP? Lay down your conditions, accept a mutually agreeable form of Sharia & have Taliban rule those. If it is OK in Afghanistan, it should be OK in Pakistan too. Or, is it that just Afghanis should be put under some form of Taliban regime?



Talaban during their governance not involved in terrorism , their crime is support of OBL for which they got too much punishment ,now if US and allies wanted to invlove them in political process , why Pakistan should have any objection?

Talaban named TTP is purely terrorist group so their is no question to involve them in peace deal.They are treathening our writ of state and have links with RAW .So TTP or Sufi should have no more chance to participate in political system of Pakistan.
 
Yes, this is the point. If Taliban had given the Northern Alliance their due right, the history of Afghanistan would have been showing a better picture of the scenario at this moment.

But a question comes to my mind, are Taliban such democratic minded that they would allow other political fractions not only to exist, during their assumed future government, but to gain political popularity?

US Obama regime is seriously considering to involve talaban in political process after peace deal then why should we have objection?

Infact uptill now US had not involved us as real partner in this war as we were during Afghan Russian War.India is actually playing same role.
 
Talaban during their governance not involved in terrorism , their crime is support of OBL for which they got too much punishment ,now if US and allies wanted to invlove them in political process , why Pakistan should have any objection?

Now hold it right there. So whatever Taliban was doing & will do in Afghanistan is OK? Doesn't it matter that they have nurtured the deadliest terrorist ever? And doesn't it matter that they turned Afghanistan into a living hell? And is it OK for them to return to power just because now they say they are 'remorseful' & 'will not repeat the mistakes'? There are lots of other people out there who are not Taliban & are capable of running Afghanistan. Now when you have an opportunity, why would you not like to just annihilate Taliban & make them history? And too much punishment for Taliban? You gotta be kidding me. The very fact that they are still alive signifies that they have not got ANY punishment yet.

Talaban named TTP is purely terrorist group so their is no question to involve them in peace deal.They are treathening our writ of state and have links with RAW .So TTP or Sufi should have no more chance to participate in political system of Pakistan.

I don't know how their activities in Pakistan are different from those in Afghanistan. They planned to implement the same kind of Sharia & similar kind of regime. Or, they are terrorists just because now it is Pakistan & not Afghanistan? Painful when the drug is self-administered?
 
There should be no peace deal! with these bastards they are no one to make deals ! there should be 7 shots in this mullah omar's damn head thats your 7 points lol .
 
There should be no peace deal! with these bastards they are no one to make deals ! there should be 7 shots in this mullah omar's damn head thats your 7 points lol .

Are you ex adviser of Bush?:lol:
 
Lets not make this mistake again. There is no good and bad Taliban, they are all sick. If there are peace deals with them right now, we will surely have to fight a war again in the future because they are not people we can coexist with. The sooner we realize that a 'good taliban is a dead taliban,' the better it will be for us.
 
Lets not make this mistake again. There is no good and bad Taliban, they are all sick. If there are peace deals with them right now, we will surely have to fight a war again in the future because they are not people we can coexist with. The sooner we realize that a 'good taliban is a dead taliban,' the better it will be for us.

How many you are going to kill? You have killed 10s of taliban commanders, 1000s of Taliban soldiers, 1000s of afghan civilians, but what happen? whole pushtoon community is backing Taliban now. because of stupid karzai's policies. and more then half of afghanistan is still under Taliban. & now they have american armors as well, they have the power. American government played a drama of 9/11, just to accomplish Afghanistan, but they have paid there price, if they yet not give up, then it would be pretty hard to run away. Nato agreement is also going to end soon.
 
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As much as i want to simplify matters, there is no simple answer.
Do you mean to say that all Germans should have been killed after WW2 for the Jewish holocaust?
For bombing Japan should all of US citizens be called mass murderers for eternity?
Oversimplification is not something good in the long run...
You guys discuss Afghanistan as if it was land of peace and Taliban attacked it and tortured and butchered everyone...care to read about the atrocities inflicted upon Afghans by the very Mujahidden commanders that fought off the soviets and only then will you have the real perspective of why people supported Taliban for most part in the days of their phenomenal growth in Afghanistan.

Not all Taliban were terrorists who wanted to bomb and kill...as opposed to Al Qaeda and their fatwas Taliban ideology was different...terrorism would have been if Afghanistan was a land of relative peace and Taliban started a civil war to impose their views on the land...that would have been unacceptable from a humanitarian perspective and also from religious perspective...no one has the right to shatter peaceful existence of innocents for power...anyone who does so is a terrorist of some sort...but what happening in Afghanistan after the soviets were kicked out?

The Taliban did at least have a reason for their campaign and this was what they projected to the masses.
They did not land from mars, they were Afghans and they were not agents of ISI...they were students in madrassas who for good or for bad claimed that the civil war in the Afghan land had to end even if it was via an armed struggle...the killings, rapes, torture etc. at the hands of the scores of warring factions was claiming hundreds of thousands of victims and Taliban promised the population to deliver them from this all...
This is the reason for tremendous support they got initially...Afghan War lords quickly bent their knee to Taliban not because of goodwill but because the power of the people was with Taliban at that time or if you find that hard to believe then i shall rephrase it as the hate of the people was so much for the warring factions that they accepted Taliban promise of peace, stability and justice.

Now the real problems started when Taliban got the power...they did provide peace from civil war and unification but at a cost...they imposed certain views on the masses which were against the spirit of Islam and the local sentiments.
Condemning the females to a life without prospects of job etc. was a cruel thing to do and entirely unacceptable to me...in a society where so many men had perished this meant condemning many families to absolute poverty and desperation...not to mention that speaking from Islamic perspective, women have a lot more rights than protect them rather than such restrictions.
Yes this was cruel and entirely unacceptable and something not at all with any justification.

To top it there was the issue of Mr. Osama landing in Afghanistan...again something not right but then Taliban did not view him as a terrorist but as an Afghan was veteran who did play a very major role...the Al Khidmat foundation run by Bin Laden was active in US as well so should we say US was supporting terrorism?
No will be the answer by many and the reason will be because Osama did not show such tendency at that point in time.
Osama sought shelter in Afghanistan and had the finances to assist Taliban...this was a marriage of necessity for Taliban and had terrible results for them....
The Taliban became more and more strict and this was also due to the influence of Osama, his anti Shia views were clearly reflected in the anti Hazara actions of Taliban and this was also entirely cruel and unacceptable thing to do.

The difference between Taliban and Al Qaeda is that Al Qaeda has no nationalistic ambitions whereas the Taliban are Afghans and their movement was started to save Afghanistan, Al Qaeda is a terrorist organization from the start whereas Taliban was a local militant movement which lost track...due to their bad decisions and war crimes one can say that they failed and i agree with this completely...but their use of force and their killing of enemies was not something unprecedented, it was done by most of the warlords who rained hell on their opponents...so they are not the only guilty party in Afghanistan and that is what i want to emphasize upon...
Kabul was literally raped and destroyed by the warlords prior to Taliban so people who assume Taliban were terrorists and all other Afghan forces were angelic are really not seeing the situation clearly.
If many former Mujahidden commanders can be reasoned with then what is wrong with engaging Taliban in a dialogue?

I think many Taliban can still be reasoned with and you know why i say it...because they are not a phantom organization like Al Qaeda which can destroy any country in its proclaimed cause without feeling remorse...Taliban claimed Afghanistan as their cause and by virtue of this and their nationalistic sentiments, i think it is possible to isolate them from Al Qaeda....I am not saying they are likable lot to me...i am just saying that for Afghanistan to be peaceful they should be engaged in dialogue on a national platform and made to see what they can do in benefit of Afghanistan.

I think the Taliban loyal to Osama will be in minority but branding them together has forced all of them to fight side by side.

I do not care what they think of Pakistan, i am 100% sure they do not like us and i am actually quite pissed off at all what they did in the name of Islam but for the sake of Afghanistan i say that Taliban need to be separated from Al Qaeda...treating them as the same will help Al Qaeda and no one else!

Whether this can be done in practice is something else but in theory it is not a bad option if taken in entire perspective.
 
As much as i want to simplify matters, there is no simple answer.
Do you mean to say that all Germans should have been killed after WW2 for the Jewish holocaust?
For bombing Japan should all of US citizens be called mass murderers for eternity?
Oversimplification is not something good in the long run...
You guys discuss Afghanistan as if it was land of peace and Taliban attacked it and tortured and butchered everyone...care to read about the atrocities inflicted upon Afghans by the very Mujahidden commanders that fought off the soviets and only then will you have the real perspective of why people supported Taliban for most part in the days of their phenomenal growth in Afghanistan.

Not all Taliban were terrorists who wanted to bomb and kill...as opposed to Al Qaeda and their fatwas Taliban ideology was different...terrorism would have been if Afghanistan was a land of relative peace and Taliban started a civil war to impose their views on the land...that would have been unacceptable from a humanitarian perspective and also from religious perspective...no one has the right to shatter peaceful existence of innocents for power...anyone who does so is a terrorist of some sort...but what happening in Afghanistan after the soviets were kicked out?

The Taliban did at least have a reason for their campaign and this was what they projected to the masses.
They did not land from mars, they were Afghans and they were not agents of ISI...they were students in madrassas who for good or for bad claimed that the civil war in the Afghan land had to end even if it was via an armed struggle...the killings, rapes, torture etc. at the hands of the scores of warring factions was claiming hundreds of thousands of victims and Taliban promised the population to deliver them from this all...
This is the reason for tremendous support they got initially...Afghan War lords quickly bent their knee to Taliban not because of goodwill but because the power of the people was with Taliban at that time or if you find that hard to believe then i shall rephrase it as the hate of the people was so much for the warring factions that they accepted Taliban promise of peace, stability and justice.

Now the real problems started when Taliban got the power...they did provide peace from civil war and unification but at a cost...they imposed certain views on the masses which were against the spirit of Islam and the local sentiments.
Condemning the females to a life without prospects of job etc. was a cruel thing to do and entirely unacceptable to me...in a society where so many men had perished this meant condemning many families to absolute poverty and desperation...not to mention that speaking from Islamic perspective, women have a lot more rights than protect them rather than such restrictions.
Yes this was cruel and entirely unacceptable and something not at all with any justification.

To top it there was the issue of Mr. Osama landing in Afghanistan...again something not right but then Taliban did not view him as a terrorist but as an Afghan was veteran who did play a very major role...the Al Khidmat foundation run by Bin Laden was active in US as well so should we say US was supporting terrorism?
No will be the answer by many and the reason will be because Osama did not show such tendency at that point in time.
Osama sought shelter in Afghanistan and had the finances to assist Taliban...this was a marriage of necessity for Taliban and had terrible results for them....
The Taliban became more and more strict and this was also due to the influence of Osama, his anti Shia views were clearly reflected in the anti Hazara actions of Taliban and this was also entirely cruel and unacceptable thing to do.

The difference between Taliban and Al Qaeda is that Al Qaeda has no nationalistic ambitions whereas the Taliban are Afghans and their movement was started to save Afghanistan, Al Qaeda is a terrorist organization from the start whereas Taliban was a local militant movement which lost track...due to their bad decisions and war crimes one can say that they failed and i agree with this completely...but their use of force and their killing of enemies was not something unprecedented, it was done by most of the warlords who rained hell on their opponents...so they are not the only guilty party in Afghanistan and that is what i want to emphasize upon...
Kabul was literally raped and destroyed by the warlords prior to Taliban so people who assume Taliban were terrorists and all other Afghan forces were angelic are really not seeing the situation clearly.
If many former Mujahidden commanders can be reasoned with then what is wrong with engaging Taliban in a dialogue?

I think many Taliban can still be reasoned with and you know why i say it...because they are not a phantom organization like Al Qaeda which can destroy any country in its proclaimed cause without feeling remorse...Taliban claimed Afghanistan as their cause and by virtue of this and their nationalistic sentiments, i think it is possible to isolate them from Al Qaeda....I am not saying they are likable lot to me...i am just saying that for Afghanistan to be peaceful they should be engaged in dialogue on a national platform and made to see what they can do in benefit of Afghanistan.

I think the Taliban loyal to Osama will be in minority but branding them together has forced all of them to fight side by side.

I do not care what they think of Pakistan, i am 100% sure they do not like us and i am actually quite pissed off at all what they did in the name of Islam but for the sake of Afghanistan i say that Taliban need to be separated from Al Qaeda...treating them as the same will help Al Qaeda and no one else!

Whether this can be done in practice is something else but in theory it is not a bad option if taken in entire perspective.

US policies during bush regime were based on extremisim , war is not long term solution , all sensible minds have no doubt about it.

US intially refused to accept Hamas now wanted to involve them in Palestine peace process.

US policies are dramatically changing after change of government.

Afghanistan will remain country of war lords ,Talaban is their united force and emerged as unbeatable force.

If we make them our enemy and US hand over Afghan government to them , which is possible in new US afghan strategy , then question is are we ready to fight with long term gurrila war , i dont think we can afford enemies on both eastern and western boarders.

US wanted peace deal with them that is reason now putting pressure on them through PA operations in FATA .

We should also develop our national policies for long term basis .
 
We will keep killing unless the damn virus of these bastards keep growing wake up stop sleeping i cant belive some of you are still asleep! wat we are doing to these bastards is the right thing and only thing left we tried all that peace bull eather give in and let them have Pakistan or defend or nation at all cost throw out the trash if you people are not with the plan then get some help.
 
We will keep killing unless the damn virus of these bastards keep growing wake up stop sleeping i cant belive some of you are still asleep! wat we are doing to these bastards is the right thing and only thing left we tried all that peace bull eather give in and let them have Pakistan or defend or nation at all cost throw out the trash if you people are not with the plan then get some help.

Why dont you understand , this cancer will spread in other parts of region if same strategy will continue,number of attacks on ISAF are increasing with passage of time .

Better isolate source of this cancer( Al Qaeda ) and target it ,same strategy of Iraq could work in Afghanistan also.
 
This "peace" deal has SWAT written all over it. Mullah Omar see the writing on the wall and is talking from a position of growing weakness. Why would someone want to negotiate with the Taliban? The are a cancer of the human race and can only be negotiated with the only way they know how, down the barrel of a gun.

This is not true. The reality of Afghanistan is that its a bloody and dirty stalemate and sending additional western forces will not change anything on the ground. So the Taliban are pretty much at the same point as the ISAF. Whether to push more military operations which have very limited return or get talking? Neither side can military turn the tide to its advantage. On top of that, the Saudis (if there is anyone the Talib will listen to is the Saudis) are also telling them to talk.

Your Cancer analogy is misplaced. This is an issue of cause and effect now. The rallying point for the other side is the occupation of their country. That is all the Taliban talk about and insist as being central to their resistance. You cannot cure the Afghans of this feeling for as long as you stay there. This has to be understood. Like Iraq, Afghanistan also will have to be vacated by the ISAF.

Lastly, the folks that you are trying to deal with at the barrel of a gun have nothing to look forward to aside from the barrel of the gun. It is better to wean them off the gun and get them going on something more productive. You continue to occupy them and hit them, then they will find ways to hurt you elsewhere if not in Afghanistan. Fighting in Pakistan is an escalation point since the takeover of Afghanistan. Continued military operations and presence will stoke militancy in other regions of Asia and even Middle East.
 
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