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So your conclusion is based on the idea that the cash strapped ukranian military which cannot maintain its otherwise excellent fleet somehow reflects on the overall quality of their tanks?
That is like suggesting that somehow the hundreds of ferraris, lambos, mercs and bmws that were abandoned in Dubai after the crash of their real estate market and ended up as junk somehow reflects on Ferrari, BMW and Mercedes as makers of poor quality cars.
Please refrain from commenting before you actually read on the subject.
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The oplot M has been considerd over the MBT 3000. It is official that Pakistan will not pursue the MB-3000
Certain change will be made.Allow me to further explain. The Ukrainians have offered the tank a standard version.
Our demand
Or
Plus Demand of local manufacturing of spare parts.
When I say local yes I say with confidance that we have demanded that 60% of the components be made in Pakistan.
PA has chance to sell AK1s to BDs and even the AK2 prototype which is another Chinese version to BDs.You expect a link this early. Please the reason I uploaded the above picss are because they have overcome the trials In Bhawalpur. The MBT-3000 failed. Plus order from above not to encourage chinese at all.
Why we should buy an expensive Turk tank and not 2 Ukrainians ones?
Here's what I understand
The T-80/84 series has been generally superior to the T-90 series in armor and performance. T-90 (T-72 and T80 cross) was developed because T-80 was too expensive to induct and the T-80 manufacturing was in Ukraine. Russia incorporated some T-80 features on the T-72 and rebranded it T-90 as a marketing gimmick instead of using the T-72 upgrade designation. After parting with Soviet Union, Ukrains 100% locally made tanks were designated T-80UD/T-84.
why are you under the impression that we will get Armata.
Second no one on this thread have given a solid reason or understood what we are trying to do.
GET A REASONABLE PRICE. Hence the large number of trials.
Altay will never come we can't afford it. Setting up the entire logistical support will take us years.
We require something which is affordable and resilient. And cost effective
This Tank doesn't even come close Mr. T-84 Oplot M is more advanced Tank. I can see Tank only as replacement for AL ZARRAR and Type 69 and T-85Point taken, I rather Pakistan should choose Russian tanks than Ukraine. Why is that? Basically Pakistan should work closer with Russia in defence cooperation. I know we have imported some of tanks technology from Ukraine in the past but I would be thrilled Russia would sell T-90MS to Pakistan.
Russia has tried their best selling, T-90MS has everything Pakistan is looking more than T-84 Oplot features. Otherwise India would be fortunate to grab this tank that will likely to chase T-84 Oplot all nights and morning. Game over!
Look like Pakistan decide not to choose MBT-3000 from China, it also means, MBT-2000 via Al-Khalid is totally failures, obviously 450 of 13 years. That's my opinion no worry.
1. Pakistan has a border to defend starting from semi mountain area of Jammu-Sialkot to plains and fields of Lahore-Kasur, River deltas of Sutluj-Bias to the deserts of Bahwalpur-Thar and arid lands of Sindh border. That explains why we can't rely on single model tank.
2. Germans are World leaders in engine technology, but their engine failed in temperatures of Bahawalpur desert. Hence Ukrainian engine was selected for AKs.
3. M1 failed in trails during Zia times. These tanks were top-notch but were design to counter Soviet invasion of Europe. It was suitable for cold, lush green fields of Europe but failed in desert condition. American learned that too while fielding it in Gulf war. Tiny sand particles damaged the expensive blades of its jet turbine engine. There is a reason, why Pakistan opts for diesel engine for its tanks.
4. Some prefer protection over mobility and other choose mobility to compromise little protection. Who knows what PA doctrine is?
5. If you are facing an enemy, who always has enjoyed superior numbers. The numbers which have saved the day for her many times in the past. Whenever she has find herself in trouble, she diluted the threat by opening up new fronts. Surely, someone in hire ups have learned from history that numbers are more important (JF17s are another example). Why we should buy an expensive Turk tank and not 2 Ukrainians ones?
I doubt that very much.. China doesn't hold any preference or authority .. We buy from them due to several factors .. Soft loans,TOT etc.
Russia not really we are getting Mi-35s from them and they have already offered us SAMs and according to recent news Su-35s...
Ukraine has been an old partner -- Il-78s,Help with AK program,Kombat ATGMs,UDs etc etc.
Sir why do u think turks have better chance now as perhaps Pak has already preferred T84 OPLOT M for present?I agree. In this case I don't see much room for Ukraine. I think Turkey has the most viable option and is arguably the best machine.
Engine manufacturing is given to Pakistan in the 60% ?As we are no longer going to take chinses tanks. Because of certain kickback issues.
1500 hp
dear news are their about Pak purchase of T64 upgraded serb tanks for mountainous regions about 282.Bro, Being Heavier is the choice of brain team since they believe on benefits of heavier tanks compared with 45-50 tonnes equivalents. Israeli Merkava are also following similar ways on developments, since Each blocks of Merkava revealed with additional weight and Finally, They reached around 65 tonnes on MK-4 series(3-5 tonnes additional weight). It is more or less same weight of Altay. I think Heavier tanks will be better for Pakistan as long as They are not used on soft and highly mountainous grounds. IFV's equipped with heavier calbre guns/having less pressure effect under the pallets are more suitable for such mountainous regions.