State will take action against those calling others infidels: Nisar

[faisal6309]

The only group you will find not believing in God is Atheist. Even then, they are reasonable people and believing in analyzed research, and that alone will take them closer to the search for God sooner or later. Many have converted to Islam attests to that. It is better not to use that word since we don't know the future.

I didn't said "not believing in god", I said "not believing in your god.

 

[Finer]

I didn't said "not believing in god", I said "not believing in your god.

Hence the Atheism?

Interesting point in second portion. Which is the fullest Religion?

Muslims believe Islam is de facto religion. Every born baby is Muslim by default, then he grows up and adopts different ways.

So why not use that as actual and fullest Religion, which is, as a matter of fact. After birth we don't seize to be human how can we seize to be muslim. Bigger approach is call everyone Muslim, at least under your jurisdiction.

This is weird post, no offense.

I am talking about using complete quote to present real picture, not hijacking by using half to fool to suit their agenda. Nowadays, most of the Muslim groups are following the latter. Hence the chaos in the Muslim worlds; the birth of Khawarij.

 

[Salik]

This is weird post, no offense.

I am talking about using complete quote to present real picture, not hijacking by using half to fool to suit their agenda. Nowadays, most of the Muslim groups are following the latter. Hence the chaos in the Muslim worlds; the birth of Khawarij.

I explain.

There're two things:

1. We are human by birth by default.

2. We are muslim by birth by default.

Now if a person commits bestiality, he still remains a human and receives the protocol of a human.

But if a person commits certain acts mentioned in Islamic books, he siezes to be muslim and no more protocol of a muslim.

Talking about their totalitarian approach, why don't they treat everyone as their own. Giving lesser status you already lose one.

 

[Finer]

I explain.

There're two things:

1. We are human by birth by default.

2. We are muslim by birth by default.

Now if a person commits bestiality, he still remains a human and receives the protocol of a human.

But if a person commits certain acts mentioned in Islamic books, he siezes to be muslim and no more protocol of a muslim.

Talking about their totalitarian approach, why don't they treat everyone as their own. Giving lesser status you already lose one.

May i ask what it is you are trying to prove? This is taking to the different level.

Whether it is human beings regardless of whether they are Muslims or not, their actions will be defined in according to the human laws exist in the nations.

Every religions preach equality, not just Islam. Only those who use half instead of complete interpretation have questionable agenda.

I am not sure where you are going with.

Let me give you example in grade one so you can understand:

Use half from the complete Quote:

Kill Muslims

Complete Quote:

Kill those Muslims who promote fina in form of terrorism

If people read the whole quote, no religion promotes violence. But if you take half and discard other, it will be interpreted as "Kill every Muslims" making it assume they must be bad never mid sounding racist to the core.

 

[Salik]

May i ask what it is you are trying to prove? This is taking to the different level.

Whether it is human beings regardless of whether they are Muslims or not, their actions will be defined in according to the human laws exist in the nations.

Every religions preach equality, not just Islam. Only those who use half instead of complete interpretation have questionable agenda.

I am not sure where you are going with.

Let me give you example in grade one so you can understand:

Use half from the complete Quote:

Kill Muslims

Complete Quote:

Kill those Muslims who promote fina in form of terrorism

If people read the whole quote, no religion promotes violence. But if you take half and discard other, it will be interpreted as "Kill every Muslims" making it assume they must be bad never mid sounding racist to the core.

First please correct yourself. Sorry to say but Islam does not talk about equality. Once you commit certain acts you're no more muslim and become second class citizen, in some cases don't remain even human. Already non muslim? You can't enter certain areas of Muslims.

My question is if nature never changes and every human is muslim by birth then why they're called non muslim.

Another angle, Prophet Muhammad P.B.U.H. said a person would be muslim in the morning and kafir in the evening, kafir in the morning and muslim in the evening. Is it not time that we treat everyone equally, leave whether he is muslim or kafir at a particular time.

 

[Finer]

First please correct yourself. Sorry to say but Islam does not talk about equality. Once you commit certain acts you're no more muslim and become second class citizen, in some cases don't remain even human. Already non muslim? You can't enter certain areas of Muslims.

My question is if nature never changes and every human is muslim by birth then why they're called non muslim.

Another angle, Prophet Muhammad P.B.U.H. said a person would be muslim in the morning and kafir in the evening, kafir in the morning and muslim in the evening. Is it not time that we treat everyone equally, leave whether he is muslim or kafir at a particular time.

On color bold:

Can you prove it by using original source of Islam; Holy Quran, which you are adamant to say Islam does not talk about equality? You will be disappointed to learn that Islam preaches equality and peace, and nothing like what you have been told [by your media].

Regarding terrorism, that's why we call them terrorists because they commit terror in the name of God which is biggest insult to God. In fact, in modern word as we call them terrorist, Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) already had word for them, and that was called "Khawarij" - the biggest hypocrite of the highest order. According to the saying of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) on khawarij in Authentic Hadith: "Whenever you find khawarij, kill them all. Verily, they are worst dogs of hell-fire."

They are quite opposite of what Islam preaches, and ironically, USA has understood this, but took little while for Pakistan army and ISI to understand this dilemma, and took long while for Pakistan as whole to understand the complexion of terrorism matter. Earlier, they were against Pakistan army for conducting military operation against terrorist groups, but attacks after attacks forced the nation to reconsider its perspective, and understood the agenda of TTP. Therefore, the nation as whole urged Pakistan army and federal democratic elected government for full-scale military operation against TTP; hence the birth of mission Zarb-e-Azb. As former leader of Pakistan, Pervaiz Musharraf knew this, but back then, Pakistan as whole was not familiar with the concept of terrorism back then unfortunately.

On bold:

Perfect example of using half quote from the hadith concerning the signs of End of Times. I take it you haven't understood the quote by yourself never mind going with the half. I suggest you re read the quote, in fact the complete quote to understand this crucial matter. Besides, that is for the future to determine their best understanding on the matter of the quote. Until then, best for us to stick with the actual events that present to us relatively. On the other hand, Scholars still wrestles on the confusion matter of Muslim in the early morning and Kaafir in the night, and i am not quite sure of that quote myself either, therefore, choose not to talk about that part which will be made perfect sense in the time to come. It is not exactly black and white stuff.


Back to the topic:

My main point was to either use complete Religion to the fullest or don't use Religion at all. Don't use half which doesn't end well as i have mentioned the examples above repeatedly, yet they continue to fall on deaf ears.

 

[faisal6309]

Hence the Atheism?

Christians can be called infidels because they don't follow your god. They call Jesus god whereas you call Allah god (although the word Allah is Arabic word for god). The same can be said for Hindus because they don't follow your god. They have their own gods.

As simple as that. Atheists however don't even believe in god.

 

[Salik]

On color bold:

Can you prove it by using original source of Islam; Holy Quran, which you are adamant to say Islam does not talk about equality? You will be disappointed to learn that Islam preaches equality and peace, and nothing like what you have been told [by your media].

Regarding terrorism, that's why we call them terrorists because they commit terror in the name of God which is biggest insult to God. In fact, in modern word as we call them terrorist, Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) already had word for them, and that was called "Khawarij" - the biggest hypocrite of the highest order. According to the saying of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) on khawarij in Authentic Hadith: "Whenever you find khawarij, kill them all. Verily, they are worst dogs of hell-fire."

They are quite opposite of what Islam preaches, and ironically, USA has understood this, but took little while for Pakistan army and ISI to understand this dilemma, and took long while for Pakistan as whole to understand the complexion of terrorism matter. Earlier, they were against Pakistan army for conducting military operation against terrorist groups, but attacks after attacks forced the nation to reconsider its perspective, and understood the agenda of TTP. Therefore, the nation as whole urged Pakistan army and federal democratic elected government for full-scale military operation against TTP; hence the birth of mission Zarb-e-Azb. As former leader of Pakistan, Pervaiz Musharraf knew this, but back then, Pakistan as whole was not familiar with the concept of terrorism back then unfortunately.

On bold:

Perfect example of using half quote from the hadith concerning the signs of End of Times. I take it you haven't understood the quote by yourself never mind going with the half. I suggest you re read the quote, in fact the complete quote to understand this crucial matter. Besides, that is for the future to determine their best understanding on the matter of the quote. Until then, best for us to stick with the actual events that present to us relatively. On the other hand, Scholars still wrestles on the confusion matter of Muslim in the early morning and Kaafir in the night, and i am not quite sure of that quote myself either, therefore, choose not to talk about that part which will be made perfect sense in the time to come. It is not exactly black and white stuff.


Back to the topic:

My main point was to either use complete Religion to the fullest or don't use Religion at all. Don't use half which doesn't end well as i have mentioned the examples above repeatedly, yet they continue to fall on deaf ears.

I'll take expert's opinion. @syedali73 sir how much Islam talks about equality when a non muslim can't become president or PM of the country, i am not talking about becoming caliph. And he can't enter the Haram even one is aware of civic sense. Which was the main issue. In daily life Islam gives less status to a non muslim as compared to a muslim.

#2. If a person is muslim by birth. Howcome he becomes a non muslim as per human nature. You must've read in above posts. How would sum up this point.

 

[syedali73]

I'll take expert's opinion. @syedali73 sir how much Islam talks about equality when a non muslim can't become president or PM of the country, i am not talking about becoming caliph. And he can't enter the Haram even one is aware of civic sense. Which was the main issue. In daily life Islam gives less status to a non muslim as compared to a muslim.

#2. If a person is muslim by birth. Howcome he becomes a non muslim as per human nature. You must've read in above posts. How would sum up this point.

We have to look for examples and one can be found during the Fatmid empire in Spain. Non-Muslims (zimmis) can hold all sorts of important offices. In Spain, the chief justice of that time was a Jewish. Many important minsters were Jewish and Christians. Nothing wrong with it so long they are loyal to the state.

Secondly, no, Islam does not but Muslims give low status to non-Muslims and it is wrong and against Islamic teachings. Once they pay jizya that is same (2.5%) as Zakat for Muslims, they have similar rights as of Muslims. I have not read anywhere in any book that non-Muslims are any less than Muslims.

 

[war&peace]

Nisar sahab should visit pdf during some free time lol

This does not apply to calling indian hindus infidel

@Zarvan ur in trouble mera bhai

He is a respectable member of pdf constantly posting some positive news related to defence systems and upgrades

 

[Salik]

@syedali73 sir one philosophical point i'm discovering in this thread. Do non muslim really exist? Because a baby is born on the nature of truth i.e. Islam. Then he grows up and does good/bad deeds. On average every human does good and bad deeds. Like a son, how much he disobeys his father, remains his son. So there's no non muslim thing, we are all one and the same.

 

[syedali73]

@syedali73 sir one philosophical point i'm discovering in this thread. Do non muslim really exist? Because a baby is born on the nature of truth i.e. Islam. Then he grows up and does good/bad deeds. On average every human does good and bad deeds. Like a son, how much he disobeys his father, remains his son. So there's no non muslim thing, we are all one and the same.

As per Muslim's belief, a child is born like that and remains a Muslim until he takes control of his life. Once he is in-charge of his life, he must say Kalima Shahdah and accept it by heart, that is to believe in the oneness of Allah and the prophet hood of Mohamed (PBUH). Without that he is not a Muslim.

 

[45'22']

This does not apply to calling indian hindus infidel


He is a respectable member of pdf constantly posting some positive news related to defence systems and upgrades

Its sad then

I wonder what makes me infidel .....not believing in God or not believing in their God

 

[war&peace]

Its sad then

I wonder what makes me infidel .....not believing in God or not believing in their God

It is a joke. Don't take it seriously. Just pulling legs of indians on pdf

 

[Salik]

As per Muslim's belief, a child is born like that and remains a Muslim until he takes control of his life. Once he is in-charge of his life, he must say Kalima Shahdah and accept it by heart, that is to believe in te oneness of Allah and the prophet hood of Mohamed (PBUH). Without that he is not a Muslim.

Many people to whom we've declared as non Muslims believe in oneness of God and prophet hood of Muhammad P.B.U.H. Only that they don't put on Arab culture and traditions. For example Hindus complete these conditions. Sufis have written in their books that Hindus don't commit polytheism, they just worship different attributes of God. Are you ready to accept Hindus as Muslims of different names and same meaning, synonym.