South Korean President Park calls on Beijing to take strong punitive actions against Pyongyang after

[LittleFish]

Funny paradox, the more China supports North Korea, the less it will be able to change economic relations into political relations, but push too hard and a collapse could leave American troops on your border.

It's a delicate balancing act, and North Korea's nuclear test just makes it even more complicated for China.

Frankly you can keep your soft line on north Korea, in private it is geopolitically beneficial for us and a pain in the a$$ for China's foreign policy.

We only support them in a minimum level keeping the regime standing. And the reality is totally contrary to what you said------NK stands there, and SK has to keep a good relationship with us. If they want to play with fire, we may see something like long-range rocket guns appear on NK's parade. Though it gives you the excuse to keep your forces there but it's to some extent acceptable.

人の心が思い描き信じられる事は、すべて実現可能である。

あの二つの朝鮮のことには信心ない

China won't sanction NK alone or try to strangle NK economy by cutting off their oil supply. Either that two Koreas fight a war or that US seals hunt down Kim the 3rd would solve the problem.

Leave Kim in his position and we may be blamed, but if we kick him out our Northeast part will fall in danger.

 

[Aepsilons]

あの二つの朝鮮のことには信心ない

@LittleFish

だんだん上手になってくるよ！だんだん上手になってくるよ！チャンスは自分で作るもの。

 

[nang2]

Not very nice to say, bro. Calm it.

Nice picture What does it mean? Back off?! haha

 

[Aepsilons]

Nice picture What does it mean? Back off?! haha

In that dance, she is telling the lover to stop with the advance, slow down.

 

[nang2]

In that dance, she is telling the lover to stop with the advance, slow down.

I guess the body language is universal. If we encounter ETs, that is how we will communicate.

 

[Aepsilons]

I guess the body language is universal. If we encounter ETs, that is how we will communicate.

Or encounter an angry, jealous xgf who sees us with another hot babe, LOL!

if the xgf is carrying a cleaver, then i won't be doing that , i'll be doing this...

 

[anon45]

Actually, this is their stated intention in the event of a collapse:

North Korea threatens to 'leave no Americans alive' - The Independent

That seems like a much more likely scenario than your fairy tale of an American occupation of North Korea. Unless you think those Hydrogen bombs will just disappear into thin air?

Oh no, i'm so scurred! Do you actually believe they have the capability to follow through?

Why would we care about Nork threats of total destruction? They make them every year.

In any case North Korea is welcome to try,
but that will also leave a huge crisis on China's border, namely refugees, along with US troops and a solidly pro American and possibly anti-Chinese South Korea.

We only support them in a minimum level keeping the regime standing. And the reality is totally contrary to what you said------NK stands there, and SK has to keep a good relationship with us. If they want to play with fire, we may see something like long-range rocket guns appear on NK's parade. Though it gives you the excuse to keep your forces there but it's to some extent acceptable.

It does force the South Koreans into considering you, but I wouldn't say that coercion sets the basis for positive political relations in the future.

As you say, it is acceptable to China for security reasons, that said I say its fundamentally flawed because US troops on China's borders are not a big threat in the first place.

Just consider the size of China, the US has no interest in invading that, what do you think we are Imperial Japan? We already have our continental power, there is absolutely no benefit in invading China.

This was a definite concern in the cold war, but now i'd say it's outdated and China should focus on how it can best unify the Korean peninsula under favorable conditions to facilitate and give reason for a US drawdown and for South Korea to view it favorably.

That would be very interesting.. what would the effect of all those north koreans be on Korean politics... well that's a moot point now.

 

[Jlaw]

Oh no, i'm so scurred! Do you actually believe they have the capability to follow through?

Why would we care about Nork threats of total destruction? They make them every year.

In any case North Korea is welcome to try,
but that will also leave a huge crisis on China's border, namely refugees, along with US troops and a solidly pro American and possibly anti-Chinese South Korea.



It does force the South Koreans into considering you, but I wouldn't say that coercion sets the basis for positive political relations in the future.

As you say, it is acceptable to China for security reasons, that said I say its fundamentally flawed because US troops on China's borders are not a big threat in the first place.

Just consider the size of China, the US has no interest in invading that, what do you think we are Imperial Japan? We already have our continental power, there is absolutely no benefit in invading China.

This was a definite concern in the cold war, but now i'd say it's outdated and China should focus on how it can best unify the Korean peninsula under favorable conditions to facilitate and give reason for a US drawdown and for South Korea to view it favorably.

That would be very interesting.. what would the effect of all those north koreans be on Korean politics... well that's a moot point now.

It won't happen until America decide to start a war in N Korea. We already know US military and your government is not too anxious to do so.

 

[Aepsilons]

but that will also leave a huge crisis on China's border, namely refugees, along with US troops and a solidly pro American and possibly anti-Chinese South Korea.

Not necessarily. Seoul is already playing an omnidirectional game with both Beijing and Washington. I would say that Seoul would try to implement an equidistant position ; afterall they already signed an FTA with Beijing just this year. If , hypothetically speaking, South Korea and North Korea were to be reunified, and the seat of power were in Seoul, then a unified Republic of Korea would balance relations with China and America.

Mind you that a unified Korea would now also be nuclear armed, thus would have the ability to stave off any coaxing by both Russia, America, and also the means to intimidate Japan, even Russia. I would even go as far as to claim that a unified Korea would see both China and America jostling for Seoul's favor.

What's your input, @sEoulman556 @pokdo ?

It won't happen until America decide to start a war in N Korea. We already know US military and your government is not too anxious to do so.

Either way, if South Korea and North Korea unifies, then United States will be ejected. Believe you me. If that happens, then Japan, too, will follow suit.

Strategically, it is against US interest to lose its grip on Seoul and Tokyo. So you will see the US will do everything it can, a la Washington state actors and intelligence agencies, to stoke political instability in the two nations , which will only further necessitate the Washington alliance with TOKYO and SEOUL, respectively.

Remember, it is contrary to American interest to see a unified Korea, or a totally resurgent Japan. It was not China that attacked America in '41, and it was not China that america dropped nukes on, after all.

It won't happen until America decide to start a war in N Korea. We already know US military and your government is not too anxious to do so.

America, honestly speaking her, should be fearful of having a totally resurgent right wing Japan. As the right wing are demanding the total ejection of American "rapists" of the islands, and the total ejection of Gaijin impurities. Right wingers also want a nuclear armed Japan, and the return of the Imperial Agencies. These Uyoko Dantai also talk about revenge for historical attacks. Quite alarming, actually.

 

[anon45]

Not necessarily. Seoul is already playing an omnidirectional game with both Beijing and Washington. I would say that Seoul would try to implement an equidistant position ; afterall they already signed an FTA with Beijing just this year. If , hypothetically speaking, South Korea and North Korea were to be reunified, and the seat of power were in Seoul, then a unified Republic of Korea would balance relations with China and America.

Mind you that a unified Korea would now also be nuclear armed, thus would have the ability to stave off any coaxing by both Russia, America, and also the means to intimidate Japan, even Russia. I would even go as far as to claim that a unified Korea would see both China and America jostling for Seoul's favor.

What's your input, @sEoulman556 @pokdo ?

I'm skeptical of how a FTA will translate into improved political relations. If China is still seen as a security threat, which it should be given its support of North Korea, the primary security threat to South Korea, then i feel political relations will remain unchanged, with South Korea tending to look to the US instead of China.

Oh no I agree, a peaceful reunification between north and South Korea could likely lead to a balanced Korean politic. Especially considering former North Korean voters. honestly I don't particularly see the US endgame after Korea is reunited in such a fashion... possibly port agreements for the navy? Maybe a (joint?) naval base? It will certainly free up capacity for the US to use its military elsewhere in the region. A reunited prosperous Korea would be good for both US and China, but China would possibly gain more benefits.

This makes it all the more baffling given their current position though, not that i'm complaining.

It won't happen until America decide to start a war in N Korea. We already know US military and your government is not too anxious to do so.

Then why should we worry about it? Its an empty threat.

 

[Aepsilons]

Oh no I agree, a peaceful reunification between north and South Korea could likely lead to a balanced Korean politic. Especially considering former North Korean voters. honestly I don't particularly see the US endgame after Korea is reunited in such a fashion... possibly port agreements for the navy? Maybe a (joint?) naval base? It will certainly free up capacity for the US to use its military elsewhere in the region. A reunited prosperous Korea would be good for both US and China, but China would possibly gain more benefits.

In my view, and from studying policies implemented by the ROK government over the years, their bilateral mechanism with China, in context to America, they most likely implement an equidistant policy. Ultimately they will probably implement a non-alignment policy. Remember that after the two Koreas are united, the unified Korea will be nuclear powered. So, there will be no threatening Korea ever again, my friend. As she can assure MAD to any power.

Ultimately a non alignment policy by both the United Korean Republic and Japan would be healthy for the region.

Leave Kim in his position and we may be blamed, but if we kick him out our Northeast part will fall in danger.

No, China should not intervene in Korea, i suppose the best strategy is to allow both to reunify the natural way. Japan, already, has immense interest in uniting both Koreas. Afterall there is a great opportunity in developing North Korea.

Anyways both North and South Korean Governments have already made a joint declaration of North - South unification as the end goal.

The leaders of the South and the North, recognizing that the meeting and the summit talks were of great significance in promoting mutual understanding, developing South–North relations and realizing peaceful reunification, declared as follows:

1. The South and the North have agreed to resolve the question of reunification independently and through the joint efforts of the Korean people, who are the masters of the country.
2. For the achievement of reunification, we have agreed that there is a common element in the South's concept of a confederation and the North's formula for a loose form of federation. The South and the North agreed to promote reunification in that direction.
3. The South and the North have agreed to promptly resolve humanitarian issues such as exchange visits by separated family members and relatives on the occasion of the August 15 National Liberation Day and the question of unswerving Communists serving prison sentences in the South.
4. The South and the North have agreed to consolidate mutual trust by promoting balanced development of the national economy through economic cooperation and by stimulating cooperation and exchanges in civic, cultural, sports, health, environmental and all other fields.
5. The South and the North have agreed to hold a dialogue between relevant authorities in the near future to implement the above agreements expeditiously.

June 15th North–South Joint Declaration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[anon45]

In my view, and from studying policies implemented by the ROK government over the years, their bilateral mechanism with China, in context to America, they most likely implement an equidistant policy. Ultimately they will probably implement a non-alignment policy. Remember that after the two Koreas are united, the unified Korea will be nuclear powered. So, there will be no threatening Korea ever again, my friend. As she can assure MAD to any power.

Ultimately a non alignment policy by both the United Korean Republic and Japan would be healthy for the region.

I am skeptical on whether a reunification would lead to Korea becoming a nuclear power. As it is Kim has not conducted a successful nuclear test. All the tests have been duds that have not achieved full ignition. The attempts are galling enough though for the international community and South Korea.

Japan would need to become a nuclear power for assured independence something like 100 nukes for deterrence purposes, and the same for South Korea. That still isn't MAD though. MAD is thousands. Only Russia and the US have MAD, China and the rest have 'deterrence'. Its a different way of looking at it but comes with its own pros and cons.

, The Chinese and South Koreans would vehemently oppose Japan obtaining nuclear weapons, their experiences with a non-aligned Japan have not been positive.

I think the US serves as a cap on tensions between the 3, especially between Korea and Japan.

If the US left the region the 3 wouldn't suddenly become friendly imo, we would see a massive arms race with possibly Korea and China vs Japan, or perhaps vs Japan separately. Both have disputes with Japan and neither holds great love for it, and this is mainly due to historical issues, not the fact that it is a US ally.

The potential for violent resolution of disputes also increases because China has the conventional advantage over either Korea or Japan alone.

Basically I disagree that a non-alignment policy by Japan would be seen as positive by either Korea or China, unless by non-aligned you actually mean friendly to Chinese or Korean interests.

A united Korea could pull it off though.

 

[Aepsilons]

Basically I disagree that a non-alignment policy by Japan would be seen as positive by either Korea or China, unless by non-aligned you actually mean friendly to Chinese or Korean interests.

More or less around those lines.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Oh no, i'm so scurred! Do you actually believe they have the capability to follow through?

Why would we care about Nork threats of total destruction? They make them every year.

In any case North Korea is welcome to try,
but that will also leave a huge crisis on China's border, namely refugees, along with US troops and a solidly pro American and possibly anti-Chinese South Korea.



It does force the South Koreans into considering you, but I wouldn't say that coercion sets the basis for positive political relations in the future.

As you say, it is acceptable to China for security reasons, that said I say its fundamentally flawed because US troops on China's borders are not a big threat in the first place.

Just consider the size of China, the US has no interest in invading that, what do you think we are Imperial Japan? We already have our continental power, there is absolutely no benefit in invading China.

This was a definite concern in the cold war, but now i'd say it's outdated and China should focus on how it can best unify the Korean peninsula under favorable conditions to facilitate and give reason for a US drawdown and for South Korea to view it favorably.

That would be very interesting.. what would the effect of all those north koreans be on Korean politics... well that's a moot point now.

This is a fairy tale man.

So you think the North Korean regime, in their last dying moments, would allow themselves to be occupied by their most hated enemies (US + SK soldiers) without firing off every hydrogen bomb they have?

Nobody believes that, or else America would have invaded North Korea already, instead of invading Iraq over fake WMD.

North Korea could hit US homeland with nuclear weapon, says top US admiral - The Guardian

And even IF those Hydrogen bombs somehow did disappear into thin air (or they were somehow all used up), and America invaded NK, do you really think China would not intervene again like we did in the last Korean War?

Your scenario is all rainbows and optimism, but nobody believes it or the Norks would have been handled already.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

This is a fairy tale man.

So you think the North Korean regime, in their last dying moments, would allow themselves to be occupied by their most hated enemies (US + SK soldiers) without firing off every hydrogen bomb they have?

Nobody believes that, or else America would have invaded North Korea already, instead of invading Iraq over fake WMD.

North Korea could hit US homeland with nuclear weapon, says top US admiral - The Guardian

And even IF those Hydrogen bombs somehow did disappear into thin air (or they were somehow all used up), and America invaded NK, do you really think China would not intervene again like we did in the last Korean War?

Your scenario is all rainbows and optimism, but nobody believes it or the Norks would have been handled already.

If NK is about to collapse, then the only country that is going to occupy it should be China.

And China will assign a moderate faction to rule over the WPK.