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South Korea: Dependence in the Age of OPCON

The main land Chinese PRC has completely different from SE Asian Chinese on Muslim issues. The SE Asian Chinese think PDF PRC too naive and you guys especially WholeX even give me hell lot of negative ratings. PDF even ban me many times.

The SE Asian Chinese can easily align among ourselves with view of Islam.

Recently in Singapore a Malay Muslim girl was fired by a department store by refusing to take down hijab. The Muslims community cry Chinese racism and curse us.

Sales assistant allegedly asked to leave Isetan for wearing 'TUDUNG'

It is like Muslims go to Champ-Elysees working in LV/Prada with hijab and rant racist when their manager firing her for hijabing. Not a single Muslim cry racism when middle eastern airlines like Emirates, Ethihad, Qatarairways or even Malaysia airline impose a ban on hijab.

Many times, Muslims are street smart. They rant racist on gentile. They will not sabotage their own kind like Middle Eastern airlines.

When their self-victimization reach a critical mass, they will start to kill gentiles, and justify their killings with the wet dream that "Muslim is victim".
We don't view people as muslims and non-muslims,for example,the Malays to us are not so different from Thais,both are Southeast Asians,it seems one's blood is more important in China,for example,no such thing as muslim brotherhood sxist between Kazakhs(and Kirghiz) ans Uygurs.And when the Huis live in other countries,their love for China will increase,because in middle east,Burma,Thailand and any other countries,the local people will view them as simply Chinese.

After 1949,many muslims from Qinghai and Hezhou,Gansu fled to Saudi Arabia with the warlord General Ma Bufang,after they settled there,they didn't intermarry with locals and other muslims,and their miss to their homeland is strong,you can believe in any religion,but you can't change your roots
 
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Just a question, this thread seems to be about the defense issue of South Korea... so why all of the sudden, the comments here in the thread end up about concerns of ASEAN security?

I mean, sure a question earlier was raised about ASEAN but why did it end up being centered on ASEAN security instead of South Korean defense issue?
 
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China doesn't need client states, the US model failed so obviously we should take it? Other countries have navies, they should use it, if one can't guarantee the passage there, maybe you don't need business.

If South Korea wants to work together, they need to decide their own destiny, because we are not going to do it.

North Korea is China's client, so it's important to stay focused and acknowledge the reality of the situation.
 
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North Korea is China's client, so it's important to stay focused and acknowledge the reality of the situation.
really, according to wiki, a client state is A client state is a state that is economically, politically or militarily subordinate to another more powerful state in international affairs.

Economically, the South koreans either provides more or similar. While UN, US and other nations also contribute.

Politically, they do crazy crap including kill the one person the Chinese leadership likes in the form of Kim's uncle.Also trying for relations now and again with US, Japan, and other NATO members.

Militarily, really, you really think the Chinese leadership has any effect on them?

NK is about as much a client state as China was to the Soviets.

We also don't station troops, do joint exercises and any of the other crap US does with its client states. In terms of control who has more US on Japan or China on NK.

I mean since China has no control on NK, it's hard to say really.
 
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@Nihonjin1051 here is a Singaporean, the product of one of the best and most developed education system in Asia, how do you explain the case of Lux de Veritas, our resident Wirathu follower, an outlier perhaps?

His views are non-traditional, at best, from the radical position he tends to take. Statistically, I would deign that his view is an outlier. This kind of position definitely well beyond the 3rd quartile or first quartile. An example of either an upper outlier or lower outlier. But, statistically, these usually tend to represent an insignificant part of the sample pool.
 
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really, according to wiki, a client state is A client state is a state that is economically, politically or militarily subordinate to another more powerful state in international affairs.

Economically, the South koreans either provides more or similar. While UN, US and other nations also contribute.

Politically, they do crazy crap including kill the one person the Chinese leadership likes in the form of Kim's uncle.Also trying for relations now and again with US, Japan, and other NATO members.

Militarily, really, you really think the Chinese leadership has any effect on them?

NK is about as much a client state as China was to the Soviets.

We also don't station troops, do joint exercises and any of the other crap US does with its client states. In terms of control who has more US on Japan or China on NK.

I mean since China has no control on NK, it's hard to say really.

Its really is a matter of semantics. The dependence is obviously there, without China and Chinese help in Korean War, North Korea would cease to exist and would not survive till today. I would call it more of a buffer state than a client state.
Buffer state - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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Its really is a matter of semantics. The dependence is obviously there, without China and Chinese help in Korean War, North Korea would cease to exist and would not survive till today. I would call it more of a buffer state than a client state.
Buffer state - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Do you think that the South Koreans would be able to hold against North Korea , say, if the United States pulls out of South Korea ?
 
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Sri Lanka civil war has ended with decisive victory of the government. Tamil separatists all lost.

The reason I listed Sri Lanka is because of this.
2014 anti-Muslim riots in Sri Lanka - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Yes. This is my "unbias comment" from my experience. In other words, it is a biased comment given my experience.

You definitely have a bias view because you are listing a minor case in Sri Lanka, wherein which the number of peoples affected (4 deaths, and 80 injuries).

That number is statistically insignificant as compared to the number of Hindu Tamils and Buddhist Sinhalese that died in the civil war (as much as 80,000 to 100,000 were killed in the civil war). This number does not include the some 360,000 Sri Lankans that have been internally displaced.

If we use quantitative statistics to make comparative analysis we see that: (Let us research the number of deaths)

Muslim riot in Sri Lanka:
Deaths: 4
Total Population: 20, 200,000 (this was the population of Sri Lanka during the riots, in 2014)

Sri Lankan Civil War vis-a-vis Tamil Eelam
Deaths: 100,000
Total Population: 16,000,000 (this was the population of Sri Lanka during the time of the civil war)

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4 ÷ 20,200,000 = 1.98 x10 ^-7 x 100% = 0.0000198 % , in quantitative statistics this is a numerically insignificant number.
[This refers to the muslim riots in Sri Lanka]


100,000 ÷ 16,000,000 = 0.006 x 100% = 0.63% , in quantitative statistics this is a statistically significant number.
[This refers to the Sri Lankan Civil War]

Nihonjin1051's Conclusion

In lieu with the data that I have presented, and by utilizing comparative analyses of the total number of deaths in the Muslim riots in Sri Lanka and the Sri Lankan Civil War (which involved the Buddhist Sinhalese and the Hindu Tamils), and by juxtaposing their statistical praxis, we , thus, see the statistically insignificance of the damage by the Sri Lankan Muslim riots, as compared to the Sri Lankan Buddhist-Hindu Civil War, which does not take into consideration some over 360,000 internally displaced Sri Lankans, the laying of waste of infrastructure and humanitarian toll. Thus , it is without a doubt that there is no comparison. It is therefore important for us to stress that the level of damage in the Civil War supersedes that seen in the recent riots.

Yet @somsak places significance on the muslim riots, yet failing to identify and acknowledge the greater social catastrophe that had laid waste to Sri Lanka since its historical foundation. And that was the Hindu - Buddhist ethno-religious conflict.

It is through objective analyses we come to this conclusion.

Please refer to:

Sri Lankan Civil War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sri Lanka's Civil War: Casualty Figures | TIME.com

2014 anti-Muslim riots in Sri Lanka - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




Sincerely I Remain,
@Nihonjin1051
 
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Do you think that the South Koreans would be able to hold against North Korea , say, if the United States pulls out of South Korea ?

The question made me think. I think South Korea has been working towards that scenario for the longest time. It has fairly good relations with China today, both economic and diplomatic, while North Korea is increasingly more isolated. Removal of US bases will make China much more open to the idea of Korean unification, as they will not have to worry about keeping a buffer to maintain distance from US forces.

South Korea Armed forces:
Republic of Korea Armed Forces - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Manpower
Military age Mandatory 18 to 35 years of age for male, wartime conscription 18–45 years of age
Conscription 21–24 months depending on the branch
Available for
military service 12,483,677 (2005 est.), age 15–49
Reaching military
age annually 344,943 (2005 est.)
Active personnel 639,000 (2012)[1] (ranked 6th)
Reserve personnel 2,900,000 (2012)[1] (ranked 3rd)
Deployed personnel
12 nations, 1,156 troops total
List of major deployment[2]
  • 23px-Flag_of_Afghanistan.svg.png
    Afghanistan - 63
  • 23px-Flag_of_Lebanon.svg.png
    Lebanon - 321
  • 23px-Flag_of_Somalia.svg.png
    Somalia - 310
  • 23px-Flag_of_South_Sudan.svg.png
    South Sudan - 290
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_United_Arab_Emirates.svg.png
    United Arab Emirates - 150
Expenditures
Budget 33.0 trillion (2012)($30 Billion USD) excluding
₩1.68 trillion($1 Billion USD) given by Korea to United States Forces Korea[3]
Percent of GDP2.52%

The South Korean armed forces were largely constabulary forces until the outbreak of the Korean War. It was heavily damaged by North Korean and Chinese attacks and in the beginning relied almost entirely on American support for weapons, ammunition and technology. During South Korea's period of rapid growth, the military expanded accordingly, benefiting from several government-sponsored technology transfer projects and indigenous defense capability initiatives. Modernization efforts for the ROK military have been in place since the 1980s. The GlobalSecurity.org website states that "in 1990 South Korean industries provided about 70 percent of the weapons, ammunition, communications and other types of equipment, vehicles, clothing, and other supplies needed by the military."

Today, the South Korean armed forces enjoy a good mix of avant-garde as well as older conventional weapons. South Korea has one of the highest defense budgets in the world, ranking 12th globally in 2011, with a budget of more than $30 billion U.S. dollars. Its capabilities include many sophisticated American and European weapon systems, complemented by a growing and increasingly more advanced indigenous defense manufacturing sector. For example, by taking advantage of the strong local shipbuilding industry, the ROK Navy has embarked on a rigorous modernization plan with ambitions to become a blue-water navy by 2020.[4] South Korea has a joint military partnership with the United States, termed the ROK-U.S. Alliance,[5] as outlined by the Mutual Defense Treaty signed after the Korean War. During the outbreak of theVietnam War, ROK Army and the ROK Marines were among those fighting alongside South Vietnam and the United States. More recently, South Korea also takes part in regional as well as pan-Pacific national military wargames and exercises such as RIMPAC and RSOI. Among other components of the armed forces is the Defence Security Command, originally the Army Counter-Intelligence Corps, which had a major role in monitoring the military's loyalty during the period of military rule in South Korea."

Korean People's Army:
Korean People's Army - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Manpower
Conscription17 years of age
Available for
military service6,515,279 males, age 17-49 (2010),
6,418,693 females, age 17-49 (2010)
Fit for
military service4,836,567 males, age 17-49 (2010),
5,230,137 females, age 17-49 (2010)
Reaching military
age annually207,737 males (2010),
204,553 females (2010)
Active personnel1,106,000 (2010) (ranked 5th)[1]
Reserve personnel8,200,000 (2010) (ranked 1st)
Expenditures
Budget~$10 billion[2][3][4]
Percent of GDP~25.0%"

We can also compare their GDP figures:
South v North Korea: how do the two countries compare? Visualised | World news | theguardian.com
Life In North Korea Vs. South Korea - Business Insider

My opinion, the US should keep the Mutual Defense Treaty and US-ROK alliance status, but should make an orderly and phased withdrawal of bases from the Korean peninsula, to facilitate the unification on a realistic pace.

The bigger question is even after Korean unification, if that were to happen, what would be Unified Korea's threat perception from immediate neighbor, China, who by that time (lets say 20-30 years from now) will probably become militarily the most powerful nation on earth and technologically at par with the US/West. To address this concern, Unified Korea should keep the option open for return of US bases and to reduce dependence on the US, pursue a policy of building alliance with other nations who would be open to such ideas and who are uniquely complimentary for mutual needs. These nations I believe will include:

Japan, ASEAN, Muslim world (Sunni)

(I kept out India, because I believe large nations like India and China do not have need for equal partner or allies, but are more interested in client or tributary states relationship)

Note here that today some Chinese South East Asians are trying to divide ASEAN unity (perhaps with a goal to make parts of ASEAN into China's tributary states), and its possible that they have their hand on an effective and explosive issue that is the biggest obstacle to ASEAN integration, but I will address that OT issue in another thread. One cannot sweep these kind of issues under the rug, so they should be explored and analyzed in detail for future geopolitical consequences.
 
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The question made me think. I think South Korea has been working towards that scenario for the longest time. It has fairly good relations with China today, both economic and diplomatic, while North Korea is increasingly more isolated. Removal of US bases will make China much more open to the idea of Korean unification, as they will not have to worry about keeping a buffer to maintain distance from US forces.

South Korea Armed forces:
Republic of Korea Armed Forces - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Manpower
Military age Mandatory 18 to 35 years of age for male, wartime conscription 18–45 years of age
Conscription 21–24 months depending on the branch
Available for
military service 12,483,677 (2005 est.), age 15–49
Reaching military
age annually 344,943 (2005 est.)
Active personnel 639,000 (2012)[1] (ranked 6th)
Reserve personnel 2,900,000 (2012)[1] (ranked 3rd)
Deployed personnel
12 nations, 1,156 troops total
List of major deployment[2]
Expenditures
Budget 33.0 trillion (2012)($30 Billion USD) excluding
₩1.68 trillion($1 Billion USD) given by Korea to United States Forces Korea[3]
Percent of GDP2.52%

The South Korean armed forces were largely constabulary forces until the outbreak of the Korean War. It was heavily damaged by North Korean and Chinese attacks and in the beginning relied almost entirely on American support for weapons, ammunition and technology. During South Korea's period of rapid growth, the military expanded accordingly, benefiting from several government-sponsored technology transfer projects and indigenous defense capability initiatives. Modernization efforts for the ROK military have been in place since the 1980s. The GlobalSecurity.org website states that "in 1990 South Korean industries provided about 70 percent of the weapons, ammunition, communications and other types of equipment, vehicles, clothing, and other supplies needed by the military."

Today, the South Korean armed forces enjoy a good mix of avant-garde as well as older conventional weapons. South Korea has one of the highest defense budgets in the world, ranking 12th globally in 2011, with a budget of more than $30 billion U.S. dollars. Its capabilities include many sophisticated American and European weapon systems, complemented by a growing and increasingly more advanced indigenous defense manufacturing sector. For example, by taking advantage of the strong local shipbuilding industry, the ROK Navy has embarked on a rigorous modernization plan with ambitions to become a blue-water navy by 2020.[4] South Korea has a joint military partnership with the United States, termed the ROK-U.S. Alliance,[5] as outlined by the Mutual Defense Treaty signed after the Korean War. During the outbreak of theVietnam War, ROK Army and the ROK Marines were among those fighting alongside South Vietnam and the United States. More recently, South Korea also takes part in regional as well as pan-Pacific national military wargames and exercises such as RIMPAC and RSOI. Among other components of the armed forces is the Defence Security Command, originally the Army Counter-Intelligence Corps, which had a major role in monitoring the military's loyalty during the period of military rule in South Korea."

Korean People's Army:
Korean People's Army - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Manpower
Conscription17 years of age
Available for
military service6,515,279 males, age 17-49 (2010),
6,418,693 females, age 17-49 (2010)
Fit for
military service4,836,567 males, age 17-49 (2010),
5,230,137 females, age 17-49 (2010)
Reaching military
age annually207,737 males (2010),
204,553 females (2010)
Active personnel1,106,000 (2010) (ranked 5th)[1]
Reserve personnel8,200,000 (2010) (ranked 1st)
Expenditures
Budget~$10 billion[2][3][4]
Percent of GDP~25.0%"

We can also compare their GDP figures:
South v North Korea: how do the two countries compare? Visualised | World news | theguardian.com
Life In North Korea Vs. South Korea - Business Insider

My opinion, the US should keep the Mutual Defense Treaty and US-ROK alliance status, but should make an orderly and phased withdrawal of bases from the Korean peninsula, to facilitate the unification on a realistic pace.

The bigger question is even after Korean unification, if that were to happen, what would be Unified Korea's threat perception from immediate neighbor, China, who by that time (lets say 20-30 years from now) will probably become militarily the most powerful nation on earth and technologically at par with the US/West. To address this concern, Unified Korea should keep the option open for return of US bases and to reduce dependence on the US, pursue a policy of building alliance with other nations who would be open to such ideas and who are uniquely complimentary for mutual needs. These nations I believe will include:

Japan, ASEAN, Muslim world (Sunni)

(I kept out India, because I believe large nations like India and China do not have need for equal partner or allies, but are more interested in client or tributary states relationship)

Note here that today some Chinese South East Asians are trying to divide ASEAN unity (perhaps with a goal to make parts of ASEAN into China's tributary states), and its possible that they have their hand on an effective and explosive issue that is the biggest obstacle to ASEAN integration, but I will address that OT issue in another thread. One cannot sweep these kind of issues under the rug, so they should be explored and analyzed in detail for future geopolitical consequences.

Thank you for that in-depth analyses and for your your future projection estimates, very interesting indeed.

The United States walks in a very precarious situation because it must balance its military-political alliance with South Korea, and at the same time endorse the economic dependency it has with China. With the flowering of Chinese and South Korean relationships, the former is a large market for South Korea, and the former is also an investment source for South Korea). People , thus, assume that due to the economic vibrancy and inter-dependencies between China and South Korea, it is presumed that China would not encourage North Korea to invade South Korea. We can only hope.

The South Korean Government, through its history, has been never short to express its disagreements with the United States , with large scale protests against United States military bases. It is thus understandable why the South Korean Government would express feelings of objection to American military presence. They (Government) have the mandate of the people and are thus supposed to execute the will of those whom they represent.

South Korea , like the United States, has to walk a fine line. By removing the United States from the Peninsula, the Government of ROK exercises national solidarity and a sense of 'independence' from American clout. However, there is the threat of North Korea's nuclear missiles. Being removed from the American nuclear umbrella, South Korea, particularly Seoul, is in a threat. And without the military alliance that once protected / reassured her.

But I am sure , I hope that is, the South Koreans make the right choice. For their interest(s).
 
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really, according to wiki, a client state is A client state is a state that is economically, politically or militarily subordinate to another more powerful state in international affairs.

Economically, the South koreans either provides more or similar. While UN, US and other nations also contribute.

Politically, they do crazy crap including kill the one person the Chinese leadership likes in the form of Kim's uncle.Also trying for relations now and again with US, Japan, and other NATO members.

Militarily, really, you really think the Chinese leadership has any effect on them?

NK is about as much a client state as China was to the Soviets.

We also don't station troops, do joint exercises and any of the other crap US does with its client states. In terms of control who has more US on Japan or China on NK.

I mean since China has no control on NK, it's hard to say really.

Do you believe that the North Korean regime would survive if China withdrew its food aid, energy aid, and diplomatic support? If not, then North Korea is a client of China. I believe that if China withdrew such support, North Korea would collapse (and since such an outcome is anathema to China, China will not withdraw such support).

Chinese control over NK is far stronger than US "control" over Japan, which would be able to fairly easily replace our military presence, and even our nuclear umbrella in short order.

Its really is a matter of semantics. The dependence is obviously there, without China and Chinese help in Korean War, North Korea would cease to exist and would not survive till today. I would call it more of a buffer state than a client state.
Buffer state - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Buffer states and client states are not mutually exclusive.
 
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@Nihonjin1051 @kalu_miah

This is my final post on this issue. I already states all the reason, bias or not, why we,I myself and many other Bhuddist Thai Keyboard warrior view on situation at Burma, are afraid of conflict that come with Islam. Despite my statistics on terrorist name-country which @Nihonjin1051 fail to make argument against, @Nihonjin1051 you still believe that ASEAN should receive BD as member. I therefore, have no more ability to convince you anymore. I hope in the future BD will not be ASEAN member until most of them convert to other religious. I'm not the policy maker therefore I'm powerless to stop BD from entering. I can make a sentiment on Thai forum, and convince those policy maker, not to allow should the BD application request come in. I think that is still very far because BD will have to start with convincing Myanmar to agree her application, should there be an application to join ASEAN. The following are for your info.

To get a membership of ASEAN, there must be 100% agreement from ASEAN's member to accept.

In other words, every country in ASEAN has Veto power not to allow an applicant.
From Thai website: "100 good reasons from 9 ASEAN countries to accept a new membership will lose to 1 single bad reason from 1 country who deny a new membership".

If BD wanna join ASEAN? good luck with Myanmar. Myanmar must be very nightmare to dream having ethnic muslim Bangali freely roaming on her land exporting Islam using (if acquired) ASEAN agreement.
 
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@Nihonjin1051 @kalu_miah

This is my final post on this issue. I already states all the reason, bias or not, why we,I myself and many other Bhuddist Thai Keyboard warrior view on situation at Burma, are afraid of conflict that come with Islam. Despite my statistics on terrorist name-country which @Nihonjin1051 fail to make argument against, @Nihonjin1051 you still believe that ASEAN should receive BD as member. I therefore, have no more ability to convince you anymore. I hope in the future BD will not be ASEAN member until most of them convert to other religious. I'm not the policy maker therefore I'm powerless to stop BD from entering. I can make a sentiment on Thai forum, and convince those policy maker, not to allow should the BD application request come in. I think that is still very far because BD will have to start with convincing Myanmar to agree her application, should there be an application to join ASEAN. The following are for your info.

To get a membership of ASEAN, there must be 100% agreement from ASEAN's member to accept.

In other words, every country in ASEAN has Veto power not to allow an applicant.
From Thai website: "100 good reasons from 9 ASEAN countries to accept a new membership will lose to 1 single bad reason from 1 country who deny a new membership".

If BD wanna join ASEAN? good luck with Myanmar. Myanmar must be very nightmare to dream having ethnic muslim Bangali freely roaming on her land exporting Islam using (if acquired) ASEAN agreement.

This Nihonjin guy is aligned with the Japanese official strategy. That is to shape ASEAN as a counter weight against China.

I am a Chinese and spent 6 years in Buddhist school though I am now a Christian. I am a cultural very much Buddhist at heart. I am sick of seeing Buddhist get killed by Jihadhist and sick of Jihad killing teachers to prevent people getting educated.

Thailand: Separatists Targeting Teachers in South | Human Rights Watch

I am sick of anti dhimmitude against my tribe.
BBC News - Is Malaysia university entry a level playing field?

I am sick of apostasy law, and of people accusing us as racist and we must accomodate to real fanatics.

Malaysia's Lina Joy loses Islam conversion case| Reuters

I am sick of someone monopolizing Allah.

Malaysia’s Highest Court Upholds Ban on the Christian Use of ‘Allah’ - TIME

I am sick of some tribe plundering their rich brothers into poverty.

EPU re-affirms chronic poverty in Sabah | Free Malaysia Today

I am sick of Sunni shiiting on Shia.

Over 100 people arrested in latest crackdown on Shia Muslims - The Malaysian Insider
 
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Currently if you add #Muslim in ASEAN and non-Muslim, the later are still majority, or may be on par. Indonesia is not 97% Muslim, but 80% according to Wiki. Malaysia has 37-40% non-muslim Malaysian Chinese. If you add BD population into the inequality, then Muslim will outnumber non-muslim. Then,... Fire of conflict will occurs. You see Chinese persecuation in Indonesia, Malay Chinese 2nd citizenship, and so on. I would not go to quote Quran for you. There are even teaching about how to do with non-muslim.

You read Viet Comment around #3 - #5 on this thread. Why even a Vietnamese also oppose Islam? You see the ongoing conflict with Bhuddist in Burma and Sri Lanka, why is that happening? How many combination of all number of religious are their? Suppose the world has Christ, Hindu, Buddhist, Kong zhi, Islam, Juda, a total of 6 religious. How many pairs of conflict of these 6 religious there can be? Mathematical answer gives you 6(choose)2=15 pairs.

Now you open the news and count. How many conflict Christ vs Hindu? Christ vs Bhuddist? Christ vs Kongzhi, Christ Vs Islam? Christ vs Juda? Hindu vs Bhuddist? Hindu vs Khong zhi? and so on. Keep doing this until all 15 pairs are counted.

You will find overwhelming conflict with Islam. Why is that? Ph.D student? gives the proper explanation.

Now lets list some country where there are ongoing conflict with Muslim.
Thailand, Srilangka, Myanmar, China, Russia, U.S., Israel, .... and the list keep going, why is that?

Lets look at our friend kalu_miah why is he so pro islam that one day muslim will conquer the world? Why is that? Why are they so much about conquer other's religious&land? Why is that?

My previous occupation was telecom engineer, I went to live in Brunei 3-4 months, Pakistan 1-2 months, and I can't live in these 2 countries. I really don't like. Its about culture, especially about culture w.r.t women. There was a project to go to Saudi-arabia. I was so... happy that the project didn't happened. I was so happy with my 6 months in Singapore. It was so good.

If you want us to live with Islamic culture for your latent political desire to contain China, you are so not care about us. Many of Thai and me cannot live in islamic country.


Read this: Christian Pakistani takes refugee to Thailand because of religious
Packing their bags: Christians moving to Thailand to escape violence, insecurity – The Express Tribune

Yeah, Thailand is a paradise for the last two years compare to Indonesia, no bombing, no riots, no political cahoots, no coup d'etat, no travel warning from European countries, it must be happened in Indonesia and must be the Moslem faults here.
 
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@Nihonjin1051 @kalu_miah

This is my final post on this issue. I already states all the reason, bias or not, why we,I myself and many other Bhuddist Thai Keyboard warrior view on situation at Burma, are afraid of conflict that come with Islam. Despite my statistics on terrorist name-country which @Nihonjin1051 fail to make argument against, @Nihonjin1051 you still believe that ASEAN should receive BD as member. I therefore, have no more ability to convince you anymore. I hope in the future BD will not be ASEAN member until most of them convert to other religious. I'm not the policy maker therefore I'm powerless to stop BD from entering. I can make a sentiment on Thai forum, and convince those policy maker, not to allow should the BD application request come in. I think that is still very far because BD will have to start with convincing Myanmar to agree her application, should there be an application to join ASEAN. The following are for your info.

To get a membership of ASEAN, there must be 100% agreement from ASEAN's member to accept.

In other words, every country in ASEAN has Veto power not to allow an applicant.
From Thai website: "100 good reasons from 9 ASEAN countries to accept a new membership will lose to 1 single bad reason from 1 country who deny a new membership".

If BD wanna join ASEAN? good luck with Myanmar. Myanmar must be very nightmare to dream having ethnic muslim Bangali freely roaming on her land exporting Islam using (if acquired) ASEAN agreement.

Good point. Myanmar will not agree to Bangladesh joining ASEAN and many other states may disagree. So considering this fact, Bangladesh has no reason to beg to get in where it is not welcome.

But if you followed our earlier discussions, we never discussed ASEAN as the most appropriate vehicle for creating a security structure in this region. We discussed that it will start with interested nations who will join Japan in a military alliance. It may start with Japan, Vietnam and Philippines and then add other interested nations later. So this military alliance may include some ASEAN nations, but it will also include many non-ASEAN nations, starting with Japan. And relevant to this thread, South Korea may eventually join this alliance as well, which is another non-ASEAN nation.
 
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