Solving Pakistan Navy's Ship Problem

[Luftwaffe]

we have reasons to believe that agostas are very much better, more silent and potent as compared to chinese subs. but will the french enter into any kind of military contract with pakistan in the face of burgeioning Indo-French defence cooperation? Scorpene subs acquired by IN can be regarded as an advance version of Agaostas.

Throw them french money had Pakistan thrown in $2.5B for 6 submarines ppl would have seen a sealed deal but I believe Pakistan have choice from China on long term payment/soft loans so no point is french submarines I am sure Pakistan needs something very credible reliable that is why it is taking time to find the right product according to Pakistan's requirements. As for German submarines it can still be acquired but Pakistan needs to pay in advance and full cash that is something Pakistan is not ready for nor money is available.

 

[Friei Indien]

Throw them french money had Pakistan thrown in $2.5B for 6 submarines ppl would have seen a sealed deal but I believe Pakistan have choice from China on long term payment/soft loans so no point is french submarines I am sure Pakistan needs something very credible reliable that is why it is taking time to find the right product according to Pakistan's requirements. As for German submarines it can still be acquired but Pakistan needs to pay in advance and full cash that is something Pakistan is not ready for nor money is available.

yeah German U-boats recently acquired by Israel are awesome. i would like to mention that not just $2.5B, we will also be paying the French $20 billion for 126 Rafales. why doesn't Pakistan manufactures naval vessels?

 

[Penguin]

why not locally built Type 51A with VLS?

1. Type 051A (Luda I)?
2. It isn't built locally already.

 

[truthseeker2010]

1. Type 051A (Luda I)?
2. It isn't built locally already.

i think he means to say 054a

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

we have reasons to believe that agostas are very much better, more silent and potent as compared to chinese subs. but will the french enter into any kind of military contract with pakistan in the face of burgeioning Indo-French defence cooperation? Scorpene subs acquired by IN can be regarded as an advance version of Agaostas.

The new chinese sub is being compared to the latest russian subs... as for scorpene.. it only excels over agostas in endurance...the combat system etc are all the same as the ones on the 90B's .. (Which Pak built under ToT (tech n skills will come in handy) and are equipped with MESMA AIP... just as the 6 subs navy wants are going to be equipped)...

China’s Submarine Fleet Evolution

 

[Basel]

1. Type 051A (Luda I)?
2. It isn't built locally already.

i think he means to say 054a

Yeah, I wanted to say Type-54-A, sorry for typo error.

@Penguin When Compared C-28 with Type-54-A which one is better?

 

[Penguin]

Yeah, I wanted to say Type-54-A, sorry for typo error.

@Penguin When Compared C-28 with Type-54-A which one is better?

apples and oranges. rough placement in terms of capabilities, somewhere between 054 and 054A. Smaller, but with Thales radars and CMS. With a VLS in place of the HQ7, a very nice package.

 

[Super Falcon]

Well i think we buy naval weapons from germany and france they are best with dcn and hdw

 

[西门吹水]

Why Pakistan Navy not use Type 056 corvette.This may be cheaper when chinese build more,and chinese will upgrade it continously.Pakistan need type 056 and type 022 missile boat.no matter how big the ship is,It's hard to survive after first attack from India,so i think Pakistan need more small ship

 

[Penguin]

Well i think we buy naval weapons from germany and france they are best with dcn and hdw

Then what is the use of having built 1 F22P 'at home'?

Why Pakistan Navy not use Type 056 corvette.This may be cheaper when chinese build more,and chinese will upgrade it continously.Pakistan need type 056 and type 022 missile boat.no matter how big the ship is,It's hard to survive after first attack from India,so i think Pakistan need more small ship

Please compare the 3rd ship from the left (C28A, a further development on the F22P, for Algeria, with Western CMS and radar) and with the first ship (056), which is HALF the tonnage. This limits its sensor and weapons capability, aviation as well as its sea keeping and endurance.

 

[Super Falcon]

Than u want to relay on just F 22 frigate to save us from indian talwar class destroyers we need bigger ships with more fire power dont relay on one system

 

[asq]

I am flabbergasted to hear this, Give me the opportunity and i will convert out aging ship in to something of future, the reason Pakistan is behinf in every sphere, it is because of nincompoops who rule us, talents are overwhelming in Pakistan, but those who are in power are clueless, selfish, have no common sense, ingenuity, deductive reasoning, negotiation skills, and most of all they only believe in achievement through violence and threats.

Lies and cheating they acquire wealth, through lies and lie about everything. education, wealth, income tax, ride in an entourage of 50 cars wasting poor countries resources, and firing the poor pilot who leads them and than if he or she makes a mistake they fire him for one small mistake. and the list goes on, so talents are abundance but those who control it do not want talented people to become visible as those with brilliance will make them redundant and irreverent..

 

[Basel]

apples and oranges. rough placement in terms of capabilities, somewhere between 054 and 054A. Smaller, but with Thales radars and CMS. With a VLS in place of the HQ7, a very nice package.

What is so different in between them that you say apple and oranges? also is Type-54A is better to fulfill the needs of PN?

 

[Anony]

IMO, PN should call off induction of all surface warships and should go for all submarines. Its because PN has only one adversary and it is IN. In no way can PN even think of matching IN capabilities. In any war, the first target of IN will be to destroy karachi port and enforce blockade. No surface ship of Pakistan can ever challenge this blockade. And fighters like Su 30mki, Mig 29K because of their advance avionics and weapons will wipe out the entire surface fleet of PN in less than 2 days of war. And again Brahmos launched from ship with 290km range will clear the surface fleet of PN even before they could detect the ship that fired them and within next 2 years Brahmos will be available to launch from air as well. So in short capability of IN exceeds PN by many miles. And once all these surface ships gets wiped out, the morale of the PN will take a bad beating and even remaining 3+3 submarines will not be that effective then.

Now just imagine that PN has no surface ships but instead has 10-12 submarines. So in one go; Brahmos factor, Su-30mki factor, Mig 29K factor virtually vanishes for PN. The fight will now be of subsurface capability. Though IN will after inducting Scorpene submarines and fitting towed sonars in their frontline warships and also with their P-8 planes, will be way ahead of PN, but in the this case it will not be a cakewalk for IN and because most of this ships of PN will have AIP, it will not be easy to track their location and IN will have to search entire Arabian Sea and also some parts of Indian Ocean to track these ships, which will be a nut cracking job. And with good strategy, they can effectively deny the blockade as IN will have no clue how many subs they will be facing infront while imposing blockade and how many may surprise their own port back home.

In short, in later case IN will have to keep one part of their resources back home for security of their own ports.

 

[Indischer]

IMO, PN should call off induction of all surface warships and should go for all submarines. Its because PN has only one adversary and it is IN. In no way can PN even think of matching IN capabilities. In any war, the first target of IN will be to destroy karachi port and enforce blockade. No surface ship of Pakistan can ever challenge this blockade. And fighters like Su 30mki, Mig 29K because of their advance avionics and weapons will wipe out the entire surface fleet of PN in less than 2 days of war. And again Brahmos launched from ship with 290km range will clear the surface fleet of PN even before they could detect the ship that fired them and within next 2 years Brahmos will be available to launch from air as well. So in short capability of IN exceeds PN by many miles. And once all these surface ships gets wiped out, the morale of the PN will take a bad beating and even remaining 3+3 submarines will not be that effective then.

Now just imagine that PN has no surface ships but instead has 10-12 submarines. So in one go; Brahmos factor, Su-30mki factor, Mig 29K factor virtually vanishes for PN. The fight will now be of subsurface capability. Though IN will after inducting Scorpene submarines and fitting towed sonars in their frontline warships and also with their P-8 planes, will be way ahead of PN, but in the this case it will not be a cakewalk for IN and because most of this ships of PN will have AIP, it will not be easy to track their location and IN will have to search entire Arabian Sea and also some parts of Indian Ocean to track these ships, which will be a nut cracking job. And with good strategy, they can effectively deny the blockade as IN will have no clue how many subs they will be facing infront while imposing blockade and how many may surprise their own port back home.

In short, in later case IN will have to keep one part of their resources back home for security of their own ports.

Please don't come up with such analysis. You'll inadvertantly end up attracting the Nuke-worshippers and ruin a good thread in the process.