Sino-Japanese War still stings China 120 years later

[Europa]

While the Opium Wars did play their part I would say the efforts to overthrow the Shogunate and Perry's ships had more of an impact.

yes and that how i think we should read the developments of that era, objectively

 

[Grand Historian]

yes and that how i think we should read the developments of that era, objectively

The Japanese have no excuse to invade other lands and subjugate its populace.

 

[ComradeNam]

The hypocrisy Chinese screaming to the world that Japan committed crime on them and asking the world bring justice to them. What about the Chinese committed crimes on others? It is not China became huge at its birth. It conquered, enslaved, and subjugated, other ethnics to be Chinese. Looking at Tibetan and Ughi, they became minority on their own soil. Who would bring justice to them?

 

[Zero_wing]

Simply put: salvation of Asians from Western colonizers through conquering Asia, mass murdering Asians, putting Western colonizers in labor camp all in the name of freeing Asia from Westerners.

Wow and you said your different from Japan you sound like Japanese general from world war two what your stealing their Asian Co prosperity sphere too

 

[terranMarine]

The hypocrisy Chinese screaming to the world that Japan committed crime on them and asking the world bring justice to them. What about the Chinese committed crimes on others? It is not China became huge at its birth. It conquered, enslaved, and subjugated, other ethnics to be Chinese. Looking at Tibetan and Ughi, they became minority on their own soil. Who would bring justice to them?

Chinese asking the world to bring justice ? EH is this another made up lie of yours again?

 

[Aepsilons]

What does this have to do with Japanese atrocities?

It has every thing to do. Atrocity knows no bounds, knows no ethnic or racial prejudice. An atrocity on one group of people is a collective insult to all mankind.

The Japanese atrocity towards Chinese civilians, and military personnel were vindictive, and evil. Downright wrong. The Kwangtung Army that was stationed in China was morally and ethically wrong , and violated all professional mandates and agreements in modern warfare. They violated the Geneva Convention, and those who were guilty of perpetuating such crimes against innocent civilians were wrong.

Now, here is where I must infer distinction. The actions of the Kwangtung Army, especially some overzealous soldiers within their ranks, do not speak for nor do they represent the entire continuity of the Imperial Army. There were instances of beneficent acts by soldiers in the Imperial Army.

Let me also infer another point, the actions and atrocities committed by some Japanese soldiers on civilians in China does not excuse or mitigate the brutality of some of the atrocities committed by Chinese soldiers in the past on their own people, or even on minorities within its territory, and outside. What about the atrocities committed by the Qing Army in their 4 attempts to invade Burma through the auspices of the Qianlong Emperor (the Great) ? The attrocities committed on the Taiwanese aboriginese people when Qing forces attempted to colonize Taiwan proper?

I understand your righteous indignation, but , please, do not try to lecture me on atrocity while you dare turn a blind eye on many of the past, recent past, and current issues pertaining to atrocity and abuse within China.

Funny that the aggressor is demanding the victim to let bygones be bygones.

Of course. In the spirit of Kong Zi, let me reiterate his wisdom:

• "To be able to practice five things everywhere under heaven constitutes perfect virtue...[They are] gravity, generosity of soul, sincerity, earnestness, and kindness."
• "Forget injuries, never forget kindnesses"
• "Recompense injury with justice, and recompense kindness with kindness."
• "To go beyond is as wrong as to fall short."

心から,
@Nihonjin1051

 

[ComradeNam]

Chinese asking the world to bring justice ? EH is this another made up lie of yours again?

If you Chinese do not need the world, then you do not need to demand an apology from Japan thus asked other country to boycott Abe when he visit WWII shrine.

What lie, the Viet made? About SCS that Chinese claim is not valid?

 

[Europa]

The Japanese have no excuse to invade other lands and subjugate its populace.

they have made themselves hostage to their own past, question is when the releasing point will come, nothing permanent

 

[INDIC]

What does this have to do with Japanese atrocities?
Two wrongs don't make a right and refusing to acknowledge Japanese ones is ridiculous.
The difference between the Zunghars/Miao and the Japanese is that the Zunghars and Miao often killed Qing subjects even before Qing demands thus causing retaliation while the Japanese waged a war of naked aggression.
.

Although China consider itself as the successor of Qing Empire, I can see you want to neglect the crimes of Imperial Chinese Army on others but want to forever hate the Japanese.

 

[Aepsilons]

Whatever respect that the Japanese had for the Qing evaporated once they saw how they could colonize China.

I thought that you were schooled in history, as your namesake suggest.

The Qing Dynasty had collapsed in 1912. In the 1st Sino Japanese War, the issue was regarding Korea, a political entity that is not Chinese. Our victory over Qing Forces forced the Chinese to recognize Japanese suzerainty over Korea, and forced them to relinquish control of Taiwan to Japan. Japan had not , during that time, invaded China proper or had any designs. That was much later on in the 1920s, 1930s. And during that time, my dear Grand Historian, China was ruled by Sun Yat Sen's successor, Jiang Jieshi (Chiang Kai Shek).

The Qing Dynasty, by then, had already collapsed.

 

[terranMarine]

If you Chinese do not need the world, then you do not need to demand an apology from Japan thus asked other country to boycott Abe when he visit WWII shrine.

What lie, the Viet made? About SCS that Chinese claim is not valid?

I see you like to play dumb games by twisting sentences and cutting off words just to go off topic or switch to another path when you failed to come up with a reply to questions you don't want to answer.

 

[Grand Historian]

It has every thing to do. Atrocity knows no bounds, knows no ethnic or racial prejudice. An atrocity on one group of people is a collective insult to all mankind.

The Japanese atrocity towards Chinese civilians, and military personnel were vindictive, and evil. Downright wrong. The Kwangtung Army that was stationed in China was morally and ethically wrong , and violated all professional mandates and agreements in modern warfare. They violated the Geneva Convention, and those who were guilty of perpetuating such crimes against innocent civilians were wrong.

Now, here is where I must infer distinction. The actions of the Kwangtung Army, especially some overzealous soldiers within their ranks, do not speak for nor do they represent the entire continuity of the Imperial Army. There were instances of beneficent acts by soldiers in the Imperial Army.

Let me also infer another point, the actions and atrocities committed by some Japanese soldiers on civilians in China does not excuse or mitigate the brutality of some of the atrocities committed by Chinese soldiers in the past on their own people, or even on minorities within its territory, and outside. What about the atrocities committed by the Qing Army in their 4 attempts to invade Burma through the auspices of the Qianlong Emperor (the Great) ? The attrocities committed by the Taiwanese aboriginese people when Qing forces attempted to colonize Taiwan proper?

I understand your righteous indignation, but , please, do not try to lecture me on atrocity while you dare turn a blind eye on many of the past, recent past, and current issues pertaining to atrocity and abuse within China.

Did I say only the Japanese were capable of atrocities?

Stop playing coy,Nanking Massacre,Bataan Death March etc are not isolated incidents.

I believe the Imperial soldiers you worship so much even made written confessions,I would advise to read them instead of praising them as saints.

Why would I know it would come down to this,in an effort to whitewash Japanese crimes,Japanese always bring up Qing conflicts for no reason.

The Qing invasion of Burma was unjustified,the Shan states were not traditionally part of Qing and Qianlong's greed was appalling.

There was no systematic Qing attempts at colonizing Taiwan at best there were warring Zhangzhou,Quanzhou,Hakka Han and Plains/Mountains natives.

The natives were justified in killing the migrant Han as my ancestors stole their lands and cheated them.

The Qing and the ROC never attempted to invade Japan so what is your excuse now?

Of course. In the spirit of Kong Zi, let me reiterate his wisdom:

• "To be able to practice five things everywhere under heaven constitutes perfect virtue...[They are] gravity, generosity of soul, sincerity, earnestness, and kindness."
• "Forget injuries, never forget kindnesses"
• "Recompense injury with justice, and recompense kindness with kindness."
• "To go beyond is as wrong as to fall short."

心から,
@Nihonjin1051

Again the aggressor wants the victim to forgive and forget.

Nothing you say will change the truth that Japanese was an expansionist power and committed terrible deeds that are not recognized by some of the populace today.

Although China consider itself as the successor of Qing Empire, I can see you want to neglect the crimes of Imperial Chinese Army on others but want to forever hate the Japanese.

Read my latest posts,not all Qing invasions are justified and many are the result of an emperor's ego getting out of hand

 

[Aepsilons]

Nothing you say will change the truth that Japanese was an expansionist power and committed terrible deeds that are not recognized by some of the populace today.

Then I believe we both have come at an impasse. And it is useless for us to share further words with each other.

 

[INDIC]

Read my latest posts,not all Qing invasions are justified and many are the result of an emperor's ego getting out of hand

Yes, but Chinese consider all those territories conquered by Imperial Qing Army as the historical Chinese land and wanted to reconquer the breakaway regions after the Qing Dynasty was ousted. You don't bother to know how they conquered it or what they did with the natives.

 

[Grand Historian]

I thought that you were schooled in history, as your namesake suggest.

The Qing Dynasty had collapsed in 1912. In the 1st Sino Japanese War, the issue was regarding Korea, a political entity that is not Chinese. Our victory over Qing Forces forced the Chinese to recognize Japanese suzerainty over Korea, and forced them to relinquish control of Taiwan to Japan. Japan had not , during that time, invaded China proper or had any designs. That was much later on in the 1920s, 1930s. And during that time, my dear Grand Historian, China was ruled by Sun Yat Sen's successor, Jiang Jieshi (Chiang Kai Shek).

Qing didn't annex Korea while Japan did,furthermore Qing suzerainty of Joseon was rather peaceful a tribute here and there and military intervention to save the dynasty when it comes under attack.

Taiwan is still part of China,don't play semantics with me.

21 demands ring a bell?

Yes, but Chinese consider all those territories conquered by Imperial Qing Army as the historical Chinese land and wanted to reconquer the breakaway regions after the Qing Dynasty was ousted. You don't bother to know how they conquered it or what they did with the natives.

Show me these atrocities that are equivalent to what the Japanese did.

If I was neglecting Chinese expansion I wouldn't have bothered criticizing the Qing.

Considering how some of minorities started claiming lands they never historically owned and attacked Chinese citizens they deserved to be conquered.

Then I believe we both have come at an impasse. And it is useless for us to share further words with each other.

You refuse to acknowledge Imperial Japanese crimes,judging by your posts you're just another revisionist.