Should Pakistan act against the Taliban and Kashmiri groups simultaneously?

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

I would rather preffer that we should go for Talibans and BLA simultaneously .Engage them , Shoot them at sight .

 

[roadrunner]

Cannot believe what I am reading, Thanks!! make them your freedom fighters, and we will just keep shouting them when they cross over.

According to international law, the Kashmiris are to be given plebiscite to determine their future. India has incorporated Kashmir into its Consitution. It's Constitutional terrorism, and the Indian troops on the ground constitute terrorists (I suppose the rebel fighters are, actually, but the Indian Constitutional terrorism is their reason to be).

Which part do you disagree with?

 

[DarkStar]

I did not say we should simply accept IOK as Indian Territory but we should close all training camps, and stop sending in Pakistani Citizens who think it's their moral right to liberate Kashmir by fighting with Indian Army and even if people try to infiltrate and PA should stop them from entering into Kashmir.Let the Kashmiris deal with indians themselves.We have far bigger problems going on within Pakistan.

You're obviously not following the developments of the past couple of years. Infiltration has fallen to an all time low, and the Kashmiri struggle has verifiably demilitarised.

Pakistan has a lot to do with this, as it has taken huge efforts to stop the flow of militants, while the Bhartis have made it more difficult by fencing the LOC.

 

[BaburCM]

I did not say we should simply accept IOK as Indian Territory but we should close all training camps, and stop sending in Trainers and even if people try to infiltrate and PA should stop them from entering into Kashmir.Let the Kashmiris deal with indians themselves.We have far bigger problems going on within Pakistan.

What do you mean that we should close training camps? What do you exactly mean that we should stop training people to infiltrate? Pakistan only provides moral support to the Kashmir cause. Let's face it, it's their right to choose their own destiny if they so gladly want. Let's give them their rights so that resistance can be halted for once and all. By denying these people their rights you won't solve a single problem.

 

[wtf]

I did not say we should simply accept IOK as Indian Territory but we should close all training camps, and stop sending in Trainers and even if people try to infiltrate and PA should stop them from entering into Kashmir.Let the Kashmiris deal with indians themselves.We have far bigger problems going on within Pakistan.

Actually India would love it if you did that. You could take it a step further and say that "we are not with terrorists,we have closed all camps. But we will provide diplomatic support to Kashmiri politicians" and it still India would still live with it.

The suspicion between the countries is because there are camps in Pak-Kashmir and Pakistan has not been able to close all of them . Musharraf did close many of them and declared most organizations terrorists, but the ones left behind cause issues for both nations.

It is right now a distraction for Pakistani security just as it has been a distraction for Indian economy for years.

 

[Patriot]

What do you mean that we should close training camps? What do you exactly mean with we should stop training people to infiltrate? Pakistan only provides moral support for the Kashmir cause. Let's face it, it's their right to chose their own destiny if they so gladly want. Let's give them their rights so that resistance can be halted for once and all.

Well clearly we had training camps and we trained insurgents and then sent them to Kashmir after Afghan War.I believe Musharraf closed most of the camps but if there are still some camps they should be closed down.

 

[BaburCM]

I would rather preffer that we should go for Talibans and BLA simultaneously .Engage them , Shoot them at sight .

Well, you hit the nail on the head. However, don't expect any sympathy from the same American quarter that's willing to equate Kashmir and Talibanisation in a single breath. They are providing full support in fuelling the insurgency in Baluchistan. In fact, the Americans are also providing shelter to the BLA terrorists in their own land as well in neighbouring Afghanistan. Talking about applying double standards...

 

[BaburCM]

Well clearly we had training camps and we trained insurgents and then sent them to Kashmir after Afghan War.I believe Musharraf closed most of the camps but if there are still some camps they should be closed down.

Let's for one minute suppose that we did, I still believe there is nothing wrong in doing so. We are supporting a legitimate struggle against oppression and occupation in Kashmir. The Indians are blatantly violating Kashmiri rights and we simply cannot have that. Period. Having training camps and training anti-occupation forces should be the tip of the iceberg as far as I'm concerned. The operations need to be sustained and even broadened. Negotiations with India serve no purpose and we should know better by now. The Kashmir problem has been exacerbated, stalled and politically misused by India in the past decades. There is simply no will and intention in solving any Kashmir related issue.

 

[DarkStar]

Well clearly we had training camps and we trained insurgents and then sent them to Kashmir after Afghan War.I believe Musharraf closed most of the camps but if there are still some camps they should be closed down.

We had no such camps. The camps were in Azad Kashmir, which is a disputed territory, and has not been annexxed by the staet of Pakistan, as is the case with IOK.

It is true that Pakistan tollerated them, due to strategic concerns about Kashmir, and the moral support that Pakistanis have always given for the aspirations of the Kashmiri people.

 

[wtf]

We had no such camps. The camps were in Azad Kashmir, which is a disputed territory, and has not been annexxed by the staet of Pakistan, as is the case with IOK.

It is true that Pakistan tollerated them, due to strategic concerns about Kashmir, and the moral support that Pakistanis have always given for the aspirations of the Kashmiri people.

Hmm... no.

"On Jan. 12, 2002, Musharraf delivered a much-anticipated speech in which he banned extremist groups, pledged to end support for militant attacks in Indian-controlled Kashmir and promised to crack down on madrassas"

USATODAY.com - Is Pakistan doing its part in the war on terrorism?
Note the statement - "promised to end support for militant attacks".Pakistan did support the terrorists who were called freedom fighters until then. After 2002 Pakistan dropped official support and said that they will be from then on called terrorists.

 

[BaburCM]

Hmm... no.

"On Jan. 12, 2002, Musharraf delivered a much-anticipated speech in which he banned extremist groups, pledged to end support for militant attacks in Indian-controlled Kashmir and promised to crack down on madrassas"

USATODAY.com - Is Pakistan doing its part in the war on terrorism?
Note the statement - "promised to end support for militant attacks".Pakistan did support the terrorists who were called freedom fighters until then. After 2002 Pakistan dropped official support and said that they will be from then on called terrorists.

You mean the terrorists that were armed and aided by the brainchild known as the American CIA? Don't even begin to point with fingers because we all know where the trail leads to. Pakistan is only a scapegoat that's being maligned by larger powers. Certainly mistakes were made by the previous leadership. However, it would be totally incorrect and a blatant denial of the actual facts to blame Pakistan for every misery in the world today. We still haven't forgotten how they created anti-USSR camps and left everyone high and dry after the Cold War. Today the root of the problem has the audacity to point fingers. It's the pot calling the kettle black. They should know better. Still, their maligning won't solve a thing. They need us at the end of the day and they realize that. No matter how supposedly evil and criminal we are.

 

[sergente rehan]

Taliban and Kashmiri groups are 2 diffrent things. First are acting against Pakistan and are also supported by anti_Pakistan forces, the second one are fighting for freedom from past 60 years....so there is nothing wrong in Kashmiri groups.

what about India then? what is India doing in Kashmire? where is their so called (fake) democratic state? and are you people sure that there aren't any terrorist camp in India run by Raw or RSS fanatic hindus??

 

[wtf]

You mean the terrorists that were armed and aided by the brainchild known as the American CIA? Don't even begin to point with fingers because we all know where the trail leads to. Pakistan is only a scapegoat that's being maligned by larger powers. Certainly mistakes were made by the previous leadership. However, it would be totally incorrect and denial of the actual facts to blame Pakistan for every misery in this world. We still haven't forgotten how they created anti-USSR camps and left everyone high and dry after the Cold War. Today the root of the problem has the audacity to point fingers. It's the pot calling the kettle black. They should know better. Still, their maligning won't solve a thing. They need us at the end of the day and they realize that. No matter how supposedly evil and criminal we are.

I am not unaware of the history.

My single point was to contradict Darkstar with evidence against his statement. He said Pakistan never supported Kashmir "militants" - I showed a post that quoted Musharraf as saying they did.
It has no bearing on anything else.
I accept your explanation of "certain mistakes" or even if you said "that was good for us then". The question is whether you should continue supporting groups which have guns and can change ideology/ whose ideology is not clear.

 

[DarkStar]

Hmm... no.

"On Jan. 12, 2002, Musharraf delivered a much-anticipated speech in which he banned extremist groups, pledged to end support for militant attacks in Indian-controlled Kashmir and promised to crack down on madrassas"

USATODAY.com - Is Pakistan doing its part in the war on terrorism?
Note the statement - "promised to end support for militant attacks".Pakistan did support the terrorists who were called freedom fighters until then. After 2002 Pakistan dropped official support and said that they will be from then on called terrorists.

That proves nothing. You first have to show that Musharraf actually admitted material, financial, logistical support of the militants. The statement you have given is of a third person, not Musharraf's himself.

Support so, then in this case, support could mean moral support for the militants, which Pakistan and Pakistanis did do.

 

[wtf]

Taliban and Kashmiri groups are 2 diffrent things. First are acting against Pakistan and are also supported by anti_Pakistan forces, the second one are fighting for freedom from past 60 years....so there is nothing wrong in Kashmiri groups.

what about India then? what is India doing in Kashmire? where is their so called (fake) democratic state? and are you people sure that there aren't any terrorist camp in India run by Raw or RSS fanatic hindus??

Depends on which Kashmiri group you are talking about. JKLF has been fighting for about 30 years now (now unarmed). Which group is it that you are talking about that is still armed and has been fighting for 60 years ?

LeT/JeM are newer groups (90s) which are still armed and are categorized by Pakistan as terrorists.Pakistan themselves have said that they may have links to killers of Benazir and to Taleban.