Should ISI collaborate with Mossad to undermine RAW's presence in IRAN?

[TNT]

How do you know I am fasting?

I am well aware of the fact that Ind/Israel are in bed together...and I am also aware of the fact that we are partly to blame for this.

If ur muslim and ur not fasting without a valid reason then its a shame. Why are we to be blamed? Does Israel resemble anything humane?

Israel has a bigger fish to fry :IRAN & Iran's nuclear goal. Yes, they maybe friends with India but given a choice a they would rather concentrate their efforts on Iran on any given day (just like we would on India).

Israel is dealing with that along with US and France and others, if anything, even RAW might be helping mossad.

Now, you talk about critical thought process....so how about we offer to help sabotage Iran's goals in return for Mossad ditching India - don't you think they would consider it? You bet they would! It's business...where both parties benefit.

No and i bet they wont. What mountainous changes our help can provide israel that they are currently unable to do? Have u analyzed the advantages israel get from india, including business and defense deals? Do u know the depth of business relation between israel and india before saying that? Is broke Pakistan going to benefit israel or big market india? What abt history, politics, religion?

In an ideal world, it doesn't have to come to this. We would much rather talk to Iran and get them to kick out Indians...but it would appear that they are not so keen on talking. So, maybe we should change our approach?

In an ideal world why would iran kick india if they r getting more benefits from india? Having relations with india fits into their geopolitical planning, so why would they ditch india? Yeah we need to change our approach but does that mean we go n beg an enemy? Does that mean we make ppl laugh at us n call us coward? Or go to mossad so they double bluff us and weaken us further?

Lastly, let's keep this discussion civil and to the point. Don't dismiss different opinions as fanboys thinking etc. Pakistan is in deep trouble and the loss of our citizens/armed forces lives deeply hurt us. We need to take action and consider changing our attitudes/thinking as/when needed.

We are not in that big a trouble to go n ask for help from an enemy of muslims. That enemy who is teaching india how to destroy demographics of kashmir. Yes we need to change approach but that does not mean bending over to ur enemy. When u make such childish assumptions, it ought to be dismissed as fanboy stuff.
Lastly u think of Pakistan as weak? We took care of soviets, we took care of US and NATO, we take care of indians, we even took good care of mossad in different places, so what makes u think we cant take care of iranian mullahs? What makes u think we even need anyone's help?

 

[Vapnope]

I can be wrong, Quran is not, and time hasn't been wrong either. How many billion times do you want to see Israel with India against you before you would conclude?

Please do not misquote Quran. The specific verse was for the tribes of that time who betrayed Prophet Muhammad.

If we go by your logic, no christian country can be our friend so we should stop buying high tech equipment from them.

 

[Metal 0-1]

Straight No.
If we collaborate with them they gonna pass all the sensitive information to RAW. ISI will find it self in quicksand sooner or later.

 

[Pakistan Ka Beta]

Israel cant be trusted as well , as they are selling almost everything to Indians , Iran should not mess with Pakistan as they already have too many enemies and message should be sent to them that we can't tolerate it further . Iran is against Israel but friend with India and Israel is against Iran but friend with India .

 

[CriticalThinker02]

Give me one good reason why Israel would want to cooperate with us?

 

[Samurai_assassin]

A strong Pakistani nationalist movement is needed. Pakistanis just don't seem to be an aggressive nation. We seem to want to love Indians, Afghans and Iranians. This needs to stop!

 

[SEAD]

If ur muslim and ur not fasting without a valid reason then its a shame. Why are we to be blamed? Does Israel resemble anything humane?

With all due respect, it's not for you to judge. Let's leave Israel's track record for a moment.


Israel is dealing with that along with US and France and others, if anything, even RAW might be helping mossad.

Yes, exactly my point. This is why it's imperative we engage with these countries. What do you think India is doing right? They are in bed with everyone who isn't supportive of Pakistan - does that tell you something?

No and i bet they wont. What mountainous changes our help can provide israel that they are currently unable to do? Have u analyzed the advantages israel get from india, including business and defense deals? Do u know the depth of business relation between israel and india before saying that? Is broke Pakistan going to benefit israel or big market india? What abt history, politics, religion?

Did you know that Pakistan is probably the only country who has helped Iran with their nuclear ambitions? Even if it's little, we have done it in the past. I would hazard a guess that we are likely to know more about Iran's nuclear goals, than Israel. You really think this information isn't important? Really?

And this isn't about business relations. In the world of intelligence, everything works. It's not like Mossad will tell RAW.."Sorry, we sold you to ISI...they won't know what the hell happened. This is all about intelligence...you tip us off, we will tip you off.

In an ideal world why would iran kick india if they r getting more benefits from india? Having relations with india fits into their geopolitical planning, so why would they ditch india? Yeah we need to change our approach but does that mean we go n beg an enemy? Does that mean we make ppl laugh at us n call us coward? Or go to mossad so they double bluff us and weaken us further?

It only fits in their geopolitical planning because Pakistan has, on record, openly threatened Israel...and have publicly stated that we will defend ME, even with Nuclear weapons, no matter what. Is this the right approach? This is what has alienated us...what were you expecting the Israelis to do? Just remember, that Palestinian issue has nothing to do with us...but yet our love for so called Muslim Brotherhood made it our issue.

Iran is benefiting from India because they are united in their goal to destroy/divide Pakistan. We must NOT let this happen. Pakistan must come FIRST. Also, a nuclear Iran is as much as of an issue for Pakistan as it is for ME/Israel. Just remember this.



We are not in that big a trouble to go n ask for help from an enemy of muslims. That enemy who is teaching india how to destroy demographics of kashmir. Yes we need to change approach but that does not mean bending over to ur enemy. When u make such childish assumptions, it ought to be dismissed as fanboy stuff.
Lastly u think of Pakistan as weak? We took care of soviets, we took care of US and NATO, we take care of indians, we even took good care of mossad in different places, so what makes u think we cant take care of iranian mullahs? What makes u think we even need anyone's help?

This isn't about asking for help or begging. We have information that may/may not benefit Israel and they may have information that may/may not benefit us. What's the issue? Ever heard about mutual benefit?

Reply in bold.

 

[Trango Towers]

My fellow Pakistanis,

Following on from the recent event in Balouchistan & death of our brave soldiers, it got me thinking whether we should change our approach towards Iran and finally accept the fact that they do not love us as much as our government & some Pakistanis would have us believe!

RAW's presence in Iran is a well known secret - and Pakistan's ISI did well to bust the gang with the capture of Kulbushan Yadav but I don't think it had much of an impact - or even if it did, it was short-term.

We know that India lost few soldiers in Kashmir recently, and openly threatened us - and if this was India's retaliation then this tell us something:

* This attack happened within days after recent events in Kashmir. What does this say? Their presence in Iran is pretty sophisticated, established & well set up. I mean you would think it would take them time to plan & execute this but no, it was done within days and they were successful. Almost as if all it needed was a green signal from RAW's HQ and bang!

* Is IRAN aware, or even collaborating with RAW, to undermine our homeland security? This can be debated but I would find it hard to believe that they are not part of this...or, as a bare minimum, looking the other way...i.e. aware of the presence but not doing anything about it.

So, in light of the above, I think we need to change our approach and be more aggressive towards Iran...and covertly. The issue is, just like Afghanistan, it happens to be a Muslim nation and our people are often emotional & short sighted...so we can't do much publicly but nothing stops us from lighting a fire here & there to let them know we mean business...

And here comes Mossad in the picture: Israel/Iran relationship can be summed up to what ours is with India - we can't stand each other. Mossad must have a deep, & well established set up in Iran - much better than ISI's.

Despite what many think, I do not think Israel is our real enemy here, they have no land/border issues with us and our love of Arabs is what keeps them suspicious of us. If, hypothetically speaking, Iran/Pak went to war, you can be rest assured that Israel will support us - as we would lesser of two evils in their eyes. And, also remember due to our approach towards Israel, we pushed them towards India (which is also another topic).

For me, being a Pakistani, Pakistan comes first - our security, our nation & our goals FIRST. I think, it's about time we became more pragmatic in our approach and time to teach our enemies a lesson. Mossad/ISI can certainly help each other out...couple of tip offs from them about Indian activities in Iran would do nicely & our boys can clean up the mess. In return, ISI can help Mossad out also...all done discreetly, and this doesn't need to be announced - so long the objectives are achieved!

What do members think?

Nope....sworn enemies of the prophet pbuh and sworn enemies of Pakistan..the arabs can go jump we must find our own path

 

[Asian.Century]

Pakistanis should help Israeli Mossad against Iran. Period.

Invite Americans in Pakistan Balochistan against Terror sponsor Iran immediately.

I want Iranian soldiers and Indian dead as a revenge.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Pakistanis should help Israeli Mossad against Iran. Period.

Invite Americans in Pakistan Balochistan against Terror sponsor Iran immediately.

I want Iranian soldiers and Indian dead as a revenege.

Good passionate post but not quite right to want total collapse of Iran. I do think a stern message is needed and the mullahocracy needs a slap on its face via clandestine channels. Getting Mossad on side is not a bad idea - at arm's length though. The problem with destroying the regime outright - even if it were possible - is that the replacement will be even worse for Pakistan. India would have free reign in Iran if some Western trained technocrats came in.

I'm in favour of some kind of action involving Mossad because this in itself will put the mullahs on notice and if they care for their own skins, they will not keep pissin their neighbours off.

 

[Arulmozhi Varman]

All factual analysis. If Iran knows we are working with Mossad inside Iran, RAW will be booted out. So that's a very very childish assumption to make. Iran has her own domestic spying capability. Moreover RAW doesn't need help from 3rd countries where it had developed their own capabilities. Remember we gave intelligence to US during Taliban bombing and saved Musharraf life.

And it's all a IF. "Balochistan Liberation Front is a independent indigenous movement which has nothing to do with India or Iran". How they get their weapons is the same way how Kashmiri fighters get theirs.

 

[S Hussain]

It is MOSSAD and RAW that are supporting anti Pakistan groups. I don't think Iran has any reason to go against Pakistan. We should collaborate with Iran to fight a common enemy.

 

[Silverblaze]

Collaboration is not something open. There is no black and white. Agencies work quietly and give tacit approvals to each other. Pakistan already works with CIA the mother organization of Mossad.

Determine - what is Pakistans interests and then make a move.

If its in Pakistans interests to "fix" or "show" some countries, it should give a tacit approval to Mossad.

Israel sent many weapons during 80s in Afghan war to Pakistan through Egypt. Why was it ok then?

Turkey worked with israel in Syria, but in Libya they are rivals. Its about interests.

 

[SEAD]

Good passionate post but not quite right to want total collapse of Iran. I do think a stern message is needed and the mullahocracy needs a slap on its face via clandestine channels. Getting Mossad on side is not a bad idea - at arm's length though. The problem with destroying the regime outright - even if it were possible - is that the replacement will be even worse for Pakistan. India would have free reign in Iran if some Western trained technocrats came in.

I'm in favour of some kind of action involving Mossad because this in itself will put the mullahs on notice and if they care for their own skins, they will not keep pissin their neighbours off.

Exactly my point, brother. I am not at all favour of regime change but a covert operation to teach them a lesson will do nicely. I actually think that just the thought of ISI collaborating with Mossad or even ME, will send shivers in Iranian leadership. Right now we are not doing anything...and they know this. They have taken our peaceful approach as our weakness - Indians did the same via the "fake surgical strike" drama but we slapped them on their face in the daylight...same message needs to be delivered to Iran also.

 

[HAIDER]

'Israeli Mossad Agents Posed as CIA Spies to Recruit Terrorists to Fight Against Iran'
Foreign Policy magazine cites CIA memos from 2007-2008 that the Mossad recruited members of Jundallah terror group to fight against Tehran; U.S. was reportedly furious with Israel and moved to limit joint intelligence programs.

Israeli Mossad agents posed as CIA officers in order to recruit members of a Pakistani terror group to carry out assassinations and attacks against the regime in Iran, Foreign Policy revealed on Friday, quoting U.S. intelligence memos.
Perry quotes a number of American intelligence officials and claims that the Mossad agents used American dollars and U.S. passports to pose as CIA spies to try to recruit members of Jundallah, a Pakistan-based Sunni extremist organization that has carried out a series of attacks in Iran and assassinations of government officials.

According to the report, Israel's recruitment attempts took place mostly in London, right under the nose of U.S. intelligence officials.

"It's amazing what the Israelis thought they could get away with," Foreign Policy quoted an intelligence officer as saying. "Their recruitment activities were nearly in the open. They apparently didn't give a damn what we th
According to a currently serving U.S. intelligence officer, Perry reports, when Bush was briefed on the information he "went absolutely ballistic."

"The report sparked White House concerns that Israel's program was putting Americans at risk," the intelligence officer told Perry. "There's no question that the U.S. has cooperated with Israel in intelligence-gathering operations against the Iranians, but this was different. No matter what anyone thinks, we're not in the business of assassinating Iranian officials or killing Iranian civilians."

The intelligence officer said that the Bush administration continued to deal with the affair until the end of his term. He noted that Israel's operation jeopardized the U.S. administration's fragile relationship with Pakistan, which was under immense pressure from Iran to crack down on Jundallah.

According to the intelligence officer, a senior administration official vowed to "take the gloves off" with Israel, but ultimately the U.S. did nothing.

"In the end it was just easier to do nothing than to, you know, rock the boat," the intelligence officer said.

Apparently, the Mossad operation caused a fiery debate among Bush's national security team and it was only resolved when U.S. President Barack Obama drastically scaled back joint U.S.-Israel intelligence programs targeting Iran, Perry quotes several serving and retired officers as saying.

The U.S. State Department has vehemently denied any ties to Jundallah and many U.S. intelligence officials remained angry with Israel over the 2007-2008 operation.

"Israel is supposed to be working with us, not against us," Foreign Policy quoted an intelligence officer as saying. "If they want to shed blood, it would help a lot if it was their blood and not ours. You know, they're supposed to be a strategic asset. Well, guess what? There are a lot of people now, important people, who just don't think that's true."

The CIA, the White House, and the Mossad failed to respond to the Foreign Policy report by the time it went to press.

Read this article in Hebrew
ought."
@graphican @Irfan Baloch @waz @The Eagle and rest ...