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Shipbuilding in India

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angeldemon_007

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It was during the Medieval period that a number of Indian Vessels were constructed, for the first time, purely for war at sea. Facilities for launching catapults and incendiary throwers, however, existed even earlier on board Indian ship.

The ancient shipbuilding in India goes back to the third millennium BC in the Harappan times (Indus Civilisation). The Harappans built the first tide dock of the world for berthing and servicing ships at the port town of Lothal in about 2500 BC. For inland waterways, flat bottomed boats of the type suggested by the terracotta models were used. An engraving on a seal from mohenjodaro represents a sailing ship with a high prow, the stern was made of reeds. In the centre, it had a square cabin. Out of the five miniature clay models of boats, one is complete and represents a ship with sails. The latter has a sharp keel, a pointed prow and a high flat stern.

In the second model, the stern and the prow were both curved high up as in the Egyptian boats of the Garzean period. The three other models found at Lothal have a flat base and a pointed prow. Apparently these flat based craft were used in rivers and creeks without sails, while the other two types with sails and sharp keels plied on high seas and were berthed in deep water of the gulf. Perhaps the Canoe types of flat-based boats were the only ones, which could be sluiced at high tide. Another type of boat was seen with multiple oars. The Harappan ship may have been as big as the modern craft, which bring timber from Malabar to Gogha. On this analogy, it can be assumed that a load of 60 tons could be carried by these ship. The sizes of the anchor stones found in the Lothal Dock also support this view.

The technology of shipbuilding was a hereditary profession passing from father to son and was a monopoly of a particular caste of people. The local builders used the hand, fingers and feet as the units of measurement. In different places different kinds of boats were built for specific purposes. For construction of ship, the teak (Tectona Grandis) wood is generally employed in India.

The Earlier Vedic Period – (The Dark Age for Shipbuilding – 2000 to 600 BC)
All the advancement of the Harappa culture some how got wiped out and its achievements buried deep, until it was unearthed centuries later. Thus there was a dark age in India’s history. During the earlier Vedic period ( 2000 to 600 BC), there was no evidence of their culture until about 600 to 500 BC.

Later Vedic Period and the Mauryan Era – (600 to 200 BC)
During the later Vedic Period ( 600 to 200 BC), there are references to ocean voyages, description of boats and passages. The earliest reference of maritime activities in India occurs in Rig Veda; “ Do thou whose countenance is turned to all side send off our adversaries, as if in a ship to the opposite shore; do thou convey us in a ship across the sea for our welfare. “ — Rig Veda 1, 97, 7 & 8

For the later period we have a remarkable work, Kautilya Arthasastra, which was written during 321 to 300 BC. During the Maurya period, a Superintendent of ships (Navadyaksa) was appointed for building and maintenance of boats. There are accounts in Pali literature on the size of vessels which could accommodate 700 passengers. We have the Buddhist Jatakas of the 5th/6th century BC, which give us the tales of overseas travel. We know that ocean going ships existed then, but unfortunately the material is meager in the description of vessels in details. During Mauryan epoch, however, we have more information. Boats some of them 30 oared, have been built in the Punjab for Alexander’s fleet.

Post Gupta Era
The Sanskrit work, Yukti Kalpataru of post-Gupta era mentions of vessels with single, double, treble and four masts, and presumably as many sails. From this we gather information on the art of shipbuilding in ancient India. In the use of metals, in ship construction, the work recommends gold, silver and copper or an alloy of two or more of these elements. It strongly forbids the use of iron, particularly for joining sides and bottom, for fear of exposing ships to the influence of magnetic rocks in the sea.

Although the technique of joining timbers by nails and rivets was known in the medieval period, the shipbuilders preferred to lash together with ropes. This practice was widely followed in South India, which earned such a boat the nomenclature : “Catamaran”. This preference for tying by rope was due to the fact that such vessels were more resilient to monsoon conditions than the nailed ones. The planks were joined together, tied with ropes and stuffed with oakum and painted over on either side with a concoction of quick lime and oil to make it water proof. To be on the safe side the bottom was double planked.

By about 200 BC, ships were built in larger and larger sizes. Number of bulkheads were increased; some had as many as 13 of these in order to cater for accidents to ships sides. Ships of 200 ton, carrying over 100 persons were reported to have been built. The wood used was mainly of Malabar teak and was found superior in durability than oak used in foreign vessels.

Oars to Sails - (0 to 1100 AD)
In 45 AD , when ‘trade winds’ were discovered, the multi-oared galleys gave place to sail ships. The oars were retained as these were used when wind dropped at sea, and also for maneuvering inside harbours. Eventually, the sail ships completely eclipsed multi-oared galleys, which are now seen only during the annual Kerala boat races! The early sails were lateen or triangular in shape made of coarse cloth, and later with light canvas. Triangular sails were then replaced by square and rectangular sails.

The ships which carried a larger number of sails were normally square rigged, built with more than one deck. It is a recorded fact that Pushyadeva, the ruler of Sindh pushed back the formidable Arab navy attacks in 756 AD which only indicated his marine prowess. The historical text Yukti Kalpataru (11th century AD) deals with shipbuilding and gives details of various types of ships. Boats used for different purposes were called by different names such as Samanya, Madhyawa, Visesha for passenger service, cargo, fishing and ferrying over the river.

The ships so constructed rode the sea well, withstood the high swell during cyclones and could sail almost as fast as the wind blew. The distinctive feature of all these vessels was the high prow and stern. This facilitated carrying the forward anchor well above the waterline, and the helmsman aft could sit at a commanding height, affording better visibility. More importantly, such a construction restricted shipping of sea waters on board due to pitching in high swell. The Monarchs who owned the vessels, had their motifs carved on the sides of the stern, such as peacock, lion, swan etc. Thus entered artistry in shipbuilding too.

The Hindu Period – (1175 AD to 1572 AD)
The Hindu Kingdom since the days of Mauryans, had built ships at Calicut, Cochin, Kaveripattinam, Masulipatnam and Calcutta. There were two types of ships built; the “Monoxylon” and the “Colandiophonta”. The “Monoxylon”, as the name implies was cut out of a single log, and in order to accommodate about 100 to 150 persons, it was raised with planks athwart in tiers. The “Monoxylon’ were used in coastal traffic and these were referred to in the Periplus of the Erithroem Sea as “Sangara.” The ‘Colandiophonta’, however were ocean-going ships and were proportionately large and sturdy being of more than 1000 tons.

The Medieval Period – (1378 to 1797 AD)
Indians of the Medieval period did not particularly build very large ships, like the Chinese Junks, because such ships could not enter small ports and estuaries studded around India, nor could they negotiate the Persian Gulf and the Red Sea.

The size of the Indian Ship was, however, larger than the European vessels of the contemporary period. During the Muslim period ( 1000 to 1700 AD ), the Seafaring Arabs entered the Indian Maritime Scene. They came as merchants in their Dhows from 11th century onwards in substantial numbers and effectively edged out the Hindus from shipping trade by about 16th century.

Through Arab patronage, shipbuilding yards thrived on the Malabar Coast at Broach, Surat and at Maldive islands, and were noted for their high quality vessels. Akbar had an Imperial Navy. The Moghul Navy was based at Dacca. It was by no means a high seas fleet, but was a fleet of large boats. There was a medley of river craft built in the boat building yards at Hoogly, Balasur, Murangu, Chilmam, Jessore and Karibari.

It was during the Medieval period that a number of Indian Vessels were constructed, for the first time, purely for war at sea. Facilities for launching catapults and incendiary throwers, however, existed even earlier on board Indian ship. A Muslim ruler from Honavur launched in 1377 AD, a seaborne attack on Sandpur (Goa) with a war fleet of 52 vessels, including two landing craft which opened their sterns to launch soldiers on horse back, directly galloping from the boat on to the enemy’s shore. This was perhaps the first recorded incident in the Indian Maritime History where landing craft was used for assault.

With the coming of the Portuguese in 1498, building of warships in India underwent a change when guns were mounted on board. The practice was first adopted by the Zamorin of Calicut emulating the Portuguese ships. The malabar vessels started using sails made of cotton and anchors made of marble. The Portuguese started building their ships in Goa and Daman with Indian artisans under their employ, using indigenous materials.

The Marathas too gave impetus to the Indian shipbuilding industry. In the 17th century, the Maratha’s shipbuilding yards were developed at Vijaydurg, Swarndurg and Kolaba, where those famous grabs and gallivats were constructed. These boats were noted for their maneuverability in restricted waters and superb sailing qualities.

One of the oldest designs in ship construction was the Baghalah, which traversed in Gujarat Coast. Since the days of Alexander’s invasion, the Baghalah had retained its main features; overall length of 74 feet by 25 feet at its breadth, of 150 tons weight with holds as deep as 11 feet. The stern was almost perpendicular. The only modernisation that came about was the mounting of two guns at the stern, which was well rounded to give a large arc of fire. As for Baghalah’s durability, the Deria Doulut lasted 87 years from 1750 to 1837, more than what could be said of the life of present day ships !

Thus we see that there had been a long shipbuilding heritage even before the British entered the scene.

Sail to Steam
The industrial revolution, however, brought in its wake a number of changes in ship construction. The advent of the paddle steamers relegated India’s shipbuilding techniques based on sail propulsion. In 1836, screw propeller was invented. The Assaye and the Punjaub were first built as sailing ships in India in 1854/1856. Their sailing qualities were superb. The British converted both ships as paddle wheel steamers and then into screw propelled ships. By this time the Europeans were overtaking the Indians in shipbuilding.

Wood to Iron
In 1840 iron hull was introduced. The next generation was the ‘iron clad’ , clad in iron. The ship was protected by iron plates and rendered safer than purely wooden ones exposed during battle at sea, grounding or collision. Then came the steel hull in 1880.

Shipbuilding at the turn of 20th century

The prime mover was also developed in quick succession : 1895, the diesel engine, in 1900 turbine or rotary engine and in 1903, the electric motor vessel. The fuel used was wood, coal, oil, and finally gas in that sequence. Every advancement required change in machinery and equipment for operation and maintenance.

At the turn of the 20th century, the shipbuilding industry saw the development of design teams which replaced the earlier tradition of the brilliant “Single Designer” taking decisions.

The technical developments continued through the first world war, cyclic depression of the 1920s and 30s and the second world war, with the introduction of the turbine, diesel propulsion, supercharging engine, turbo-electric propulsion and much higher engine speeds, longitudinal framing replacing the transverse frames. Towards the beginning of second world war, electric arc welding began to be introduced.

Second Dark Age in Shipbuilding
The transition from sail to steam and from steam to power also came again at the wrong time for India. Since the British shipbuilders had refused to transfer this technology to the Indians and since the industrialisation in India had lagged way behind the European nations, the shipbuilding industry in India was doomed to virtual extinction. Though the Bombay Dockyard built its first steam ship, Hugh Lindsay, as early as in 1830, it had failed to sustain the effort of updating the technology of building iron clad and therefore got subsequently relegated to the status of just a maintenance and repair yard.

Indian shipbuilding was thus able to hold its own till about 1840. A revolution in the technique of ship construction and ship propulsion took place on account of the use of steam power and the use of iron plates in place of timber. Independent countries introduced the necessary changes and were able to build up their own marine industry. But India had to go to the wall, in the interest of the British shipping and shipbuilding.

The Wadia Era – 1735 to 1884
During the 18th century and first half of the 19th century, the shipbuilding activity in India was dominated by one community, the Parsis. Shipbuilding activity at Surat thrived during the Moghul period. Apparently, it was during the declining years of the Moghul period, that the Parsis had started showing absorbing interests in the art of shipbuilding. In addition to building ships on order, the Parsis also dealt with construction of boats for sale. After Surat, the shipbuilding moved to Daman, Dhabul, Bassein and Bombay. On an average one or two ships per year were being built at Bombay, from 1736 to 1743.; twelve ships of different types were built : Schooners, Grabs, Sloops, Ketches and Brigantines.

Regular shipbuilding programme was drawn up for building ten ships during 1750 to 1760. The wood used in these early ships was quality teak, obtained mainly from the west coast. The ships built of Malabar teak by the Wadias for the East India Company’s Navy, not only cost far less but expected to last for 30 years against an English vessel average life of only 12 years.

These ships were also stronger, as was demonstrated when only one ship, ‘the Wadia frigate’—“Salsette” came through undamaged after a British naval squadron was trapped in ice for nine weeks in the North Baltic Sea. The “Salsette” was the first ship to be built in 1807 on direct order from the Admiralty. During 1810 to 1813, series of six 74-gun ships were built for the Royal Navy.

The story of Wadia’s shipbuilding in India cannot be complete without a mention of the “Foudroyant” launched in October 1817, a 46-gun ship, commissioned as the “Trincomalee” and later renamed as “Foudroyant”. She has the distinction of being the oldest ship still afloat. The longest recorded life of any ship built anywhere in the globe, this is truly one of the wonders of the world! The ship is afloat in British waters even today under their tender care.

Conclusion
The evolution of ships and shipbuilding, is, no doubt, a continuous process as technology advances. A floating vessel of some utility can be built with only the most elementary thought for design, such as a few fallen logs, collected at the edge of the stream and lashed together into a crude raft. In course of time, shaped wooden planks must have replaced irregular floating logs. It is with such crude beginning, that over the many centuries of intuition and trial & error, have grown today with an array of complicated and highly sophisticated ships. This is the result of man’s indomitable spirit of inquiry and adventure.

India had a rich shipbuilding culture as early as 3000 to 2000 BC as is briefly discussed in sections 1 & 2. This was followed by a dark age in shipbuilding in India during early Vedic Period from 2000 to 600 BC. Thereafter from 600 BC to end of 19th century AD, shipbuilding flourished in India and we were the leaders in this profession. The second dark age for shipbuilding in India started towards end of 19th century and continued in 20th century. It is now in the beginning of the 21st century that serious actions are being taken to revive shipbuilding in India and restore her prestigious position in this profession once again.

Shipbuilding in India
 
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Harappa is in Pakistan.... n it didnt spread to india nor did indus civilisation.
 
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I read this on a blog a year ago but its nice...

Modular Shipbuilding in India

BAE+Systems+Warship+Modules.jpg


Fincantieri%27s+Warship+Modules.jpg


Schelde+Shipbuilding+Modules.jpg


Is there any existing shipyard in India that can undertake modular warship-building? For that you ought to look for some visual signs of it, instead of asking any of the existing shipbuilders, be it Goa Shipyard Ltd (GSL), Kolkata-based Garden Reach Shipbuilders & Engineers Ltd (GRSE), the Mumbai-based Mazagon Docks Ltd (MDL), or Cochin Shipyard Ltd (CSL). Because one will only get a warped answer that skirts the entire issue of modular shipbuilding and tries to oversimplify the industrial challenges. Before we go any further, let us examine in simple terms what modular warship-building is all about. Simply put, it was pioneered by Germany’s Blohm + Voss and ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems (now grouped as the German Naval Group, or GNG), with the scope of work to be performed consisting of integrated modular designs (using TRIBON CAD/CAM software) for both onboard and off board systems that are designed specifically for the varied deployment of standardised modules (weapons, electronics and the ship’s technical equipment) which, in addition, are connected with the power supply, the air-conditioning and ventilation system and the data network for example, via standardised interfaces. All the components needed to run a specific system are accommodated in a single module. Depending upon the particular task they are required to perform, a distinction is made between weapons, electronics and the ship’s technical modules. Containers, pallets and mast modules are installed during the construction phase. Such modularity allows a wide range of choice in the selection of the on-board systems, whether it be with regard to the integration of customer-supplied systems or the use of products that the customer already has in service from various manufacturers. By simultaneously building the warship’s platform at a shipyard and the modules at the suppliers’ premises, a significant savings in both time and cost can be achieved. The modular construction principle also reduces the costs of maintaining and modernising the vessels during both periodic refits and service life-extension programmes (SLEP). Following the example and standards set by the GNG, other European shipyards like The Netherlands’ Schelde Naval Shipbuilding, the UK’s BAE Systems and Italy’s Fincantieri have actively embraced such shipbuilding practices and processes.

This now leads us to the question at hand: can shipyards like GSL, CSL, MDL and GRSE presently undertake modular warship-building? The answer is a clear no, as they are not only not equipped with the required industrial infrastructure, but they do not have any standardised roadmap or time-bound infrastructure development implementation plan. A cursory look around any of these shipyards will reveal that none of them even have syncrolifts, which must be accompanied by related shiplift piers, and dry berth. For modular shipbuilding the syncrolift (for transferring the various modules into the final enclosed assembly hall), dry berths and assembly halls must all be connected by a modern, land-level ship-transfer system. The only such syncrolift that exists within India is the one at INS Kadamba (Project Seabird) in Karwar, having been ordered on May 20, 2002 at a cost of US$32 million and delivered by Rolls-Royce Marine Systems in late 2004. Configured as a 10,000-ton shiplifter, it is a large marine elevator used for lifting warships out of, or lowering ships into, the water. To dock a warship, the platform and cradle are lowered into the water, and the vessel is then moved into place over the platform. When in position, the syncrolift raises the platform, removing the vessel from the water. Work on the vessel can then be done in situ, or the vessel transferred offshore, leaving the syncrolift available to dock other vessels. On completion, the process is reversed. The hoists, platform and associated ship-transfer system were all made in India and the project was managed by Syncrolift Inc, the world leader in shiplift systems with 224 installations in 67 countries.

Making matters worse is the disparate state of military-industrial cooperation between the Indian shipyards and their foreign counterparts. For instance, GSL has a longstanding agreement with Schelde Naval Shipbuilding, The Netherlands’ Maritime Research Institute (MARIN) and Haskoning Nederland BV, and Germany’s Raytheon Anschutz GmbH. MDL, on the other hand, openly declares its preference for ARMARIS of France, while CSL is now in bed with Fincantieri, with GRSE preferring to team up with the GNG. These varying and competing industrial tie-ups are now indulging in intense lobbying within the MoD for securing the contract for supplying the Indian Navy with seven Project 17A guided-missile frigates (FFG), seven Project 15B guided-missile destroyers (DDG) and up to three amphibious assault vessels. While the Navy’s Directorate of Naval Design (DND) has clearly indicated its preference for adopting the GNG’s proven and globally popular MEKO concept of modular design/construction, BAE Systems, ARMARIS, Schelde Naval Shipbuilding and Fincantieri haven’t yet lost hope and are exerting intense pressure on the MoD to at least share the cake (comprising the projected FFG, DDG and LPH projects) as a compromise. The latest entrant into the fray is South Korea’s Hanjin Heavy Industries & Construction, which is offering the Dokdo-class LPH and KDX-3 DDG.

As far as selecting the design of the Project 17A FFG goes, ARMARIS’ Fremm FFG, the GNG’s F-125 FFG and Navantia’s F-310 FFG are likely to be shortlisted. The foreign shipyard whose FFG design wins the tender will be required to build two FFGs at its own yard, using craftsmen from the selected lead Indian shipyard. For the Project 17A FFG, the Navy is seeking revolutionary solutions aimed at seamlessly operating under various scenarios under a global deployment spectrum. For instance, the Navy wants the vessel’s dwell-time in the area of operations of up to one year, without having to return to its homeport for scheduled maintenance during this phase. This concept of operations is thus aimed at doubling the warship’s time-on-station between major overhauls by maintaining the warship’s uninterrupted operational availability, and drastically cutting down (by several weeks) on long-transit times. In addition, a high degree of on-board automation will be specified to enable the warship to be manned by a crew complement of less than 100, with the crew complement on deployment being swapped at-sea according to a four-monthly cycle. An identical concept will be specified for the three planned seven Project 15B DDGs.

On the Indian Navy’s plans to acquire up to three LPH-based multi-role support ships (MRSS), a total of eight companies from The Netherlands (Schelde Shipbuilding with its Enforcer LPD), France (Armaris’ Mistral LHD), the UK (BAE Systems Marine’s Ocean-class LHD), Germany (ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems’ MHD-150), Italy (Finantieri’s 20,000-tonne LHD), the US (Raytheon’s San Antonio-class LPD-17), Spain (Navantia’s 21,500-tonne Strategic Projection Ship, two of which were ordered by Australia on October 9, 2007) and South Korea (Hanjin Heavy Industries & Construction’s 14,500-tonne assault landing ship, three of which have been ordered for the ROK Navy) have begun lining up for marketing their respective solutions. It is believed that the Indian Navy originally desired a LPD design capable of undertaking sea logistics and humanitarian relief operations. Now, however, the Navy has projected a requirement for helicopter carriers (LHD) that will also host rear flooding decks to accommodate armoured wheeled/tracked amphibious assault vehicles and LCAC-type assault hovercraft. This means the MRSS will in essence be a LHD that will also be capable of supporting ‘over-the-horizon assaults’ by heliborne and LCAC-borne infantry forces. That being the case, the Navy’s to-be-selected MRSS will have to host on board at least six medium-lift utility helicopters.—Prasun K. Sengupta

TRISHUL: Can They Or Can’t They?
 
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Project 17a

This will be the first project to be build with modular designing. Everybody knows about it. Here's a summary...

The Project 17A is the follow on the Project 17 (Shivalik class) frigates for the Indian Navy. A total of seven ships will be built. The ships will be built at Mazagon Dock Limited and at GRSE. The Indian shipyards would start the construction of the first ship by 2011 after the process of upgradation of the shipyards are completed. The shipyards are being upgraded to incorporate modular construction technique.

The anticipated cost for each vessel is above Rs 4,000 crore (approximately US $900 million) and the total deal is expected to be worth more than Rs 45,000 crore (US $10+ billion). The vessel will incorporate the latest indigenous developed stealth features. The first ship is expected to roll out by 2015.

Lockheed Martin and Hyundai Heavy Industries have jointly responded to the Project 17A combat systems Request for Information (RFI) issued by Indian Navy. They are offering the Aegis Combat System to be included in its Project 17A frigate proposal.
 
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Harappa is in Pakistan.... n it didnt spread to india nor did indus civilisation.

There was no India and pakistan,it was Hindustan or Bharat and Hindus where living there before arab invaders.. Get your facts right for more read this.
Harappan people worshipped
a Mother goddess symbolizing fertility. However, this view has been disputed by S. Clark. [53] Some Indus valley seals show swastikas which are found in later religions and mythologies,
especially in Indian religions such as Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism.


Indus Valley Civilization - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Am sure these are not part of Islam.:coffee:
 
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There was no India and pakistan,it was Hindustan or Bharat and Hindus where living there before arab invaders.. Get your facts right for more read this.
Harappan people worshipped
a Mother goddess symbolizing fertility. However, this view has been disputed by S. Clark. [53] Some Indus valley seals show swastikas which are found in later religions and mythologies,
especially in Indian religions such as Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism.


Indus Valley Civilization - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Am sure these are not part of Islam.:coffee:

Have u found Harappan or indus civilisation sites in india?ok indus civilisation did spread to a few part (mostly punjab n rajhistan) but harappa? thts an over kill!

Simply thing is tht its the people of the harappa region (TODAYS PAKISTAN) whose ancestors had this idea and yes i know tht they worshipped mother godess(u can see in our meuseums) which was not hindu... And indus civilisation was not hindu either..

And ur sanskrit was born in wat is today Pakistan... so u should be basically thankful to our (Pakistanis in general)ancestors for giving u all tht knowledge.
 
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Have u found Harappan or indus civilisation sites in india?ok indus civilisation did spread to a few part (mostly punjab n rajhistan) but harappa? thts an over kill!

Simply thing is tht its the people of the harappa region (TODAYS PAKISTAN) whose ancestors had this idea and yes i know tht they worshipped mother godess(u can see in our meuseums) which was not hindu... And indus civilisation was not hindu either..

And ur sanskrit was born in wat is today Pakistan... so u should be basically thankful to our (Pakistanis in general)ancestors for giving u all tht knowledge.

again delusion and Pakistan school text book theory ,arey they were worship mother goddess and there are Swastika found in IVC,swastika belongs to hinduism not Hitler :lol: ok according to you worshiping Mother goddess and swastika is not hinduism then what were they ??Green martian
 
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Have u found Harappan or indus civilisation sites in india?ok indus civilisation did spread to a few part (mostly punjab n rajhistan) but harappa? thts an over kill!

Simply thing is tht its the people of the harappa region (TODAYS PAKISTAN) whose ancestors had this idea and yes i know tht they worshipped mother godess(u can see in our meuseums) which was not hindu... And indus civilisation was not hindu either..

And ur sanskrit was born in wat is today Pakistan... so u should be basically thankful to our (Pakistanis in general)ancestors for giving u all tht knowledge.

hahahaha nice history the teach you in pakistan
 
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tell me after the decline of IVC where did the people settled,please be specific about location
 
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hahahaha nice history the teach you in pakistan

Hahahaha whose stopping u frm claiming the harappans as ur forefathers... lol... coz According to u guys harappa is near mumbai and IVC is in bhopal ...ROFL.

U can start calling them ur forefathers whenever u wish.
 
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Have u found Harappan or indus civilisation sites in india?ok indus civilisation did spread to a few part (mostly punjab n rajhistan) but harappa? thts an over kill!

Simply thing is tht its the people of the harappa region (TODAYS PAKISTAN) whose ancestors had this idea and yes i know tht they worshipped mother godess(u can see in our meuseums) which was not hindu... And indus civilisation was not hindu either..

And ur sanskrit was born in wat is today Pakistan... so u should be basically thankful to our (Pakistanis in general)ancestors for giving u all tht knowledge.

Which was not Hindu eh?

This sure does look like a early Lingam

Linga.jpg


lingam.jpg


This sure does look like a proto-Shiva in a yogic position.

pashupati_protoshiva.jpg


Sanatan_Shiva.jpg
 
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Hahahaha whose stopping u frm claiming the harappans as ur forefathers... lol... coz According to u guys harappa is near mumbai and IVC is in bhopal ...ROFL.

U can start calling them ur forefathers whenever u wish.

i thought you were descendents of arabs and mughals
please reply to my previous post
 
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Have u found Harappan or indus civilisation sites in india?ok indus civilisation did spread to a few part (mostly punjab n rajhistan) but harappa? thts an over kill!

Simply thing is tht its the people of the harappa region (TODAYS PAKISTAN) whose ancestors had this idea and yes i know tht they worshipped mother godess(u can see in our meuseums) which was not hindu... And indus civilisation was not hindu either..

And ur sanskrit was born in wat is today Pakistan... so u should be basically thankful to our (Pakistanis in general)ancestors for giving u all tht knowledge.

so sanskrit came from pakistan ,arey is there any land called pakistan before Sir jinnah tossed ?? Your ancestor were too the same ,aap bhi us khet ki mulli ho ,jaha ki hum hai... :lol:
 
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