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Senior Taliban leader rejects Pakistan's western border

I read somewhere Taliban was sending TTP guys up to North Afghanistan just so they can consolidate control there. Idk if its true.

Its pretty clear they are playing a double game just to have leverage over Pakistan. Same way Iran hosts BLA and BRF guys to have leverage.

If Pakistan doesn't get its act together then I am genuinely afraid that Afghanistan will eclipse Pakistan.
All that does is harm ethnic minorities in the North where their homes and land will be forcefully taken by the Taliban. After that they'll simply continue the war with Pakistan.

Also truly eclipsing Pakistan isn't easy, you'd need an actual army for that, but maintaining and long-term insurgency with great success? Definitely seems like they can go for another 100 years minimum if I'm being honest

United Nations say Durand Line agreement has no expiry date.
United Nations recognizes Durand Line as a legitimate border.

Or unite both Pakistan and Afghanistan into one country.
Uniting the nations won't work as internal stability is already fragile and generally Afghans hate Pakistanis.

You'll have all out race wars constantly.
 
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No power has been able to control Afghans in the last 200 years. Pakistan has made many errors while dealing with Afghan issue. Those are the ones that are affecting Paksiatn badly.

Trying to annihilate it may be the biggest of those mistakes.

Your nation is in a catch 22 situation. A military solution to it may not be the way out.
There is no non-military solution. The only thing Afghans know is war, you can convince a few but the majority warmongers will still reorganise and go to war anyway. These people even go to war over small tribal disputes and kill their own.

This is why I believe a military solution may be the only one, but it can't be half-assed.

Either it has to be a very well thought-out elaborate plan arming two sides to kill each other (or something similar) or perhaps just total nuclear annihilation (very unrealistic). I don't know to be honest.
 
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All that does is harm ethnic minorities in the North where their homes and land will be forcefully taken by the Taliban. After that they'll simply continue the war with Pakistan.

Also truly eclipsing Pakistan isn't easy, you'd need an actual army for that, but maintaining and long-term insurgency with great success? Definitely seems like they can go for another 100 years minimum if I'm being honest


Uniting the nations won't work as internal stability is already fragile and generally Afghans hate Pakistanis.

You'll have all out race wars constantly.
But Afghanistan is a member of United Nations, and has to follow UN protocol. Otherwise Pakistan can legally declare war on Afghanistan over land.
 
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All that does is harm ethnic minorities in the North where their homes and land will be forcefully taken by the Taliban. After that they'll simply continue the war with Pakistan.

Yeah I agree. Like I said before its domestic consolidation and leverage.

I don't even know if they are actually sending people up there, but if they are then it seems they are just following a rudimentary playbook every country plays.

1. Domestic consolidation
2. Economics (Big Question Mark here in case for Afghanistan because it depends if they get recognized or not).
3. Geopolitical aspirations (Durand Line as well as maintaining a leverage against Pakistan via TTP).

Also truly eclipsing Pakistan isn't easy, you'd need an actual army for that, but maintaining and long-term insurgency with great success? Definitely seems like they can go for another 100 years minimum if I'm being honest

I am only saying this because of the magnitude of decline we have seen since April 2022.

United Nations say Durand Line agreement has no expiry date.
United Nations recognizes Durand Line as a legitimate border.

Or unite both Pakistan and Afghanistan into one country.

Afghans view Durand Line just as Pakistanis view LoC. The Barakzai Dynasty made sure to leave their imprint on the Afghan psyche.

I don't think its possible to unite Pakistan and Afghanistan to one country because the amount of economic burden Pakistan will receive will be immense. The moment you do it, Karachi and Lahore will be flooded and this will displace the local labor. Not to mention Peshawar and Quetta will also see a huge population increase that won't be able to be maintained.

Idealistically, free trade should be a thing.
 
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Yeah I agree. Like I said before its domestic consolidation and leverage.

I don't even know if they are actually sending people up there, but if they are then it seems they are just following a rudimentary playbook every country plays.

1. Domestic consolidation
2. Economics (Big Question Mark here in case for Afghanistan because it depends if they get recognized or not).
3. Geopolitical aspirations (Durand Line as well as maintaining a leverage against Pakistan via TTP).



I am only saying this because of the magnitude of decline we have seen since April 2022.
One thing I can't understand is that from everything I've read in books and to what it seems, Pakistan specifically wants a friendly Pashtun government in power in Afghanistan, not Tajik.

But logically Tajik would make far more sense and be easier to handle geopolitically, demographically and in the long-term.

Yet they don't want that, can't put my finger on why, I think it's because a Tajik wouldn't ever be stable or accepted by Pashtuns and a civil war would ensue in Afghanistan
 
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We shouldn't accept either. Pakistan should either take over all of Afghanistan or partially the Pashtun areas and ask Iran, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and Tajikistan to take areas ethnically relevant to them.
 
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One thing I can't understand is that from everything I've read in books and to what it seems, Pakistan specifically wants a friendly Pashtun government in power in Afghanistan, not Tajik.

But logically Tajik would make far more sense and be easier to handle geopolitically, demographically and in the long-term.

Yet they don't want that, can't put my finger on why, I think it's because a Tajik wouldn't ever be stable or accepted by Pashtuns and a civil war would ensue in Afghanistan

Pakistan supported Ahmed Shah Masoud in the 1970s against Daud Khan. However, as usual Pakistan backstabbed and started supporting that nutcase Hekmatyar (this move alone is why Kabuli Tajiks don't trust Pakistan as Hekmatyar caused maximum damage firing RPGs in the middle of Kabul leading to 30K casualties in the first half of the 90s).

Then Mullah Omar arose and we all know what happened after that. Northern Alliance was seen as more pro-India and places in FATA especially Waziristan was the second home to the Haqqanis. Quetta was the makeshift base for the Kandaharis. Remember when I said before Waziristan always came to Afghanistan's rescue and aided it during the Anglo-Afghan war and other internal turmoil previous Kings had.

War on Terror, GHQ probably ran a cost reduction analysis and realized having Taliban in power is more beneficial than having Ashraf Ghani and Karzai in power. Ghani had open bases and training fields for BLA in Kandahar during his time. Not to mention during the early NDS early days it was majority Panjsheri. So at that moment in time they thought it was good.

I think its probably more of a "killing 2 birds with one stone" thing. If you have Pashtuns in power in Afghanistan and are friendly with you, you'll check 2 boxes and don't ever have to worry about the Western border again and focus on Kashmir.

Like usual no long term planning is done and everything is done on the whim since our institutions are weak. In the documentary Waziristan Hard Homecoming by Russia TV (this was shot in Raheel Sharif's era) the army was bragging about high tech cameras and motion sensors along the border. However, when the border fence was finally commenced it had none of that and it was completed via lots of corruption of the materials that were used to make the fences.
 
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Pakistan supported Ahmed Shah Masoud in the 1970s against Daud Khan. However, as usual Pakistan backstabbed and started supporting that nutcase Hekmatyar (this move alone is why Kabuli Tajiks don't trust Pakistan as Hekmatyar caused maximum damage firing RPGs in the middle of Kabul leading to 30K casualties in the first half of the 90s).

Then Mullah Omar arose and we all know what happened after that. Northern Alliance was seen as more pro-India and places in FATA especially Waziristan was the second home to the Haqqanis. Quetta was the makeshift base for the Kandaharis. Remember when I said before Waziristan always came to Afghanistan's rescue and aided it during the Anglo-Afghan war and other internal turmoil previous Kings had.

War on Terror, GHQ probably ran a cost reduction analysis and realized having Taliban in power is more beneficial than having Ashraf Ghani and Karzai in power. Ghani had open bases and training fields for BLA in Kandahar during his time. Not to mention during the early NDS early days it was majority Panjsheri. So at that moment in time they thought it was good.

I think its probably more of a "killing 2 birds with one stone" thing. If you have Pashtuns in power in Afghanistan and are friendly with you, you'll check 2 boxes and don't ever have to worry about the Western border again and focus on Kashmir.

Like usual no long term planning is done and everything is done on the whim since our instituitions are weak. In the documentary Waziristan Hard Homecoming by Russia TV (this was shot in Raheel Sharif's era) the army was bragging about high tech cameras and motion sensors along the border. However, when the border fence was finally commenced it had none of that and it was completed via lots of corruption of the materials that were used to make the fences.
Any good book recommendations of this time frame? The books I've read are post 2001

the army was bragging about high tech cameras and motion sensors along the border. However, when the border fence was finally commenced it had none of that and it was completed via lots of corruption of the materials that were used to make the fences.
Also this is crazy, it's the one area where you don't want to **** everything up because of greed
 
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United Nations say Durand Line agreement has no expiry date.
United Nations recognizes Durand Line as a legitimate border.

Or unite both Pakistan and Afghanistan into one country.
Nothing bunch of namak haram faggots.
Some of them even claim territory of Afghanistan till Delhi bcz according to them they are descendants of former afghan rulers :lol:
 
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There is no non-military solution.
A full blown war against Taliban government would drag down Paksiatn in many ways.

Let’s presume that Paksiatn wins the war in few months. Then what? Who would rule that place? You wouldn’t be able to because no outsider has been able to.

There has to be an entity, powerful enough to unite all the factions and maintain some sanity while governing this faction ridden nightmare and also be friendly to you. A difficult ask. If that is not possible then the present setup is better then the likely unknown one that would come after your victory.

The possibility of not getting a win against them also has to be considered. Because the one thing that they know well is to keep fighting and bleed the opponent out. They have proven to be very good in that. Then what? Then you have an openly hostile western border. Right now they are veiled which would change then to full fledged open hostilities. That can be more painful then the present situation.

A catch 22 situation it is. Can’t think of a solution, but whatever it is, it can’t be a military one. Maybe some experts can put their minds together and think of something.
 
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