Second Italian marine Girone can go back home: Supreme Court

[Abingdonboy]

Hmm I thought the same but, a timing is a bit fishy. Especially when Modi also added Mexico and Switzerland stops on his US trip. Who also just happened to be keen non-proliferator advocates and NSG members who want India to join NPT first. There's nothing in wrong in this btw.

India made the diplomatic point it wanted to make by detaining them in the first place and if freeing the second marine allows Indian inclusion in NSG then it's too cheap a price to pay in my opinion.

Maybe the GoI had advanced warning what the SC's ruling would be and thus structured Modi's visits accordingly but I just don't see the SC playing "ball" with the GoI in this respect. They have religiously protected their autonomy, sometimes to a fault and it could be argued they are getting more and more "activist". The GoI may have even softened their postion which facilitated the ruling but that still doesn't mean the SC made their decsion based on anything other than their interpretation of the law.

 

[MarkusS]

@Vauban @MarkusS @Abingdonboy

Is this India paying for Italy's vote at Nuclear Suppliers' Group in a few weeks?

Because, I remember Italy blocked India's membership at MTCR last year because of a row over marines.

Thats one point. This case went toxic between India and Italy. Italy basicly blocked evry single agreement with India. Be it this NSG issue or the freetrade agreement with europe.

Modi is a nationalist...as a nationalist he understodd that there is no easy solution for this case since italy in no way would accept anything than the realease of our soldiers. He judged the pro and contra and came to the conlusion that its best for india to release them. A decission we are very thankful for in italy and i must admitt he acted wiseand jumped over his own shadow.

 

[aakash_2410]

Thats one point. This case went toxic between India and Italy. Italy basicly blocked evry single agreement with India. Be it this NSG issue or the freetrade agreement with europe.

Modi is a nationalist...as a nationalist he understodd that there is no easy solution for this case since italy in no way would accept anything than the realease of our soldiers. He judged the pro and contra and came to the conlusion that its best for india to release them. A decission we are very thankful for in italy and i must admitt he acted wiseand jumped over his own shadow.

Yes exactly. Also, I think relations will only get better between both the countries once this is over.

It only makes sense that functional secular democracies maintain good ties in ever more dangerous climate. By the way what are the chances of Berlusconi to come back to power in 2018? Surprisingly Italy is the only major European country to choose left wing party recently. From UK, to Germany, to France to Spain all have chose conservatives or centre-right parties.

 

[Immortan.Joe]

Two Indian fishermen sacrificed once again on the alter of political expediency.

Undertaking by the Italian embassy is not worth the paper it is written on.

SC has one again shamed itself and showed why it is such a incompetent institution and deserves no public trust.

The only winners here is the Italians. First shameful act from the Modi government. I hope the CONgress rips the modi govt. on this act, but that too is doubtful.



Wrong. It was the Modi govt. which did not oppose the plea for the marine to be sent back home. The SC could have taken sue motto cognisance of the fact that the first marine has refused to return back, but instead choose to be blind and deaf.

A black day for India.

Stop being melodramatic.


This is a bribe given by GoI for admission into four arms control club, of which MTCR membership is being held up solely due to Italian vote.

This is realpolitik101. I don't understand why anyone think that this affair would have ended in anything except some variant of this outcome.

Thank you 56-inch

Yes certainly. Thanks for resolving this matter in a way which is face-saver for every party involved.

So the rashtravadi govt actually backed his plea to go home. So much nationalism. Bharat mata ki jai!

Imagine the outrage from rashtravadis including Mr. 56 inch strong man if they were in the opposition, many would have received one way tickets to Pakistan and Italy.

Better a bhakt than a hate filled chootiya

 

[MarkusS]

Yes exactly. Also, I think relations will only get better between both the countries once this is over.

It only makes sense that functional secular democracies maintain good ties in ever more dangerous climate. By the way what are the chances of Berlusconi to come back to power in 2018? Surprisingly Italy is the only major European country to choose left wing party recently. From UK, to Germany, to France to Spain all have chose conservatives or centre-right parties.

Its rther good but M5S is far more powerful now. They are hard right and will propably win next election even more.

Stop being melodramatic.


This is a bribe given by GoI for admission into four arms control club, of which MTCR membership is being held up solely due to Italian vote.

This is realpolitik101. I don't understand why anyone think that this affair would have ended in anything except some variant of this outcome.



Yes certainly. Thanks for resolving this matter in a way which is face-saver for every party involved.




Better a bhakt than a hate filled chootiya

exactly It was clear from the beginning it would end like this. One must have been rather idiotic to believe that italy would accept its soldiers in indian prison. India itself knew this and so did Modi. On the other side Italy knew its a hard situation for india as well.

It was clear from the beginning a deal would be reached. Now its important to work together.

 

[Fattyacids]

We weak Indians can only wish to do what Chinese did.

We Indians are mesmerized and enamored by staunch Chinese response in Hainan Island Incident

How amazingly China punished the 24 Americans responsible for Wang Wei's death with making them rot in Chinese jails to this day. How foolish of Americans to expect American crew of a SIGNIT plane spying on China to be returned back.

How impressively China refused to return aircraft debris to Americans, how silly Americans to expect Chinese to be submissive enough to return debris of plane meant to spy on China.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hainan_Island_incident#Aftermath



Your perverse affinity for Richard Lynn is so disgusting, while that too on a Pakistani forum

With this man claiming Pakistanis on average to have an IQ of 82 i.e close bordering mental retardation.

It is understandable like many Chinese members here you hold racist views towards Pakistanis due to Sino-centric Han-chauvinism.

With treatment from likes of Hiso and Shiro, one would expect you people to humble, but alas some cognitive inertia are impossible to cure.

Indeed, your country love to measure itself against China. But you always come up short, not because of a lack of effort, but that innate habits of delusional bragging and chest-thumping simply hampered logical thinking. Coupled that with poor analytic skill, it's really not hard to see why. An incident of mid-air collision over EEZ in which one party is a non-signatory of UNCLOS is apple to the orange case of man-slaughtering unarmed fisherman under civilian law. (Even then, a settlement could still be worked out. But if persecution is taken, no respectable govt and judiciary would give in to "humanitarian" consideration)

One after another, you people simply had to prove Richard Lynn right with the dumbest of logic. Facts are facts, don't play the race card here. If it's really about race, it must be British colonizer's fault that Hisata cannibalized Indian PoWs. It's also British's fault for ruining Indian education and moral standard. Truth be told, that infamous Lord Macaulay's letter had been ingeniously uncovered by you guys, it's all over the internet. Some human ability are simply inborn.

 

[Maira La]

Indeed, your country love to measure itself against China. But you always come up short, not because of a lack of effort, but that innate habits of delusional bragging and chest-thumping simply hampered logical thinking. Coupled that with poor analytic skill, it's really not hard to see why. An incident of mid-air collision over EEZ in which one party is a non-signatory of UNCLOS is apple to the orange case of man-slaughtering unarmed fisherman under civilian law. (Even then, a settlement could still be worked out. But if persecution is taken, no respectable govt and judiciary would give in to "humanitarian" consideration)

One after another, you people simply had to prove Richard Lynn right with the dumbest of logic. Facts are facts, don't play the race card here. If it's really about race, it must be British colonizer's fault that Hisata cannibalized Indian PoWs. It's also British's fault for ruining Indian education and moral standard. Truth be told, that infamous Lord Macaulay's letter had been ingeniously uncovered by you guys, it's all over the internet. Some human ability are simply inborn.

To really understand why Indian Gov let them go, try understanding the collective Indian psyche.

Individual lives among a billion+ Indic people matter little. (both to fellow Indics and Whites). The GoI knows they will be forgiven - Indians are not so passionate about the welfare of fellow little Indians; 600 million are living (and dying) in abject poverty as we speak - so they can certainly live without 2.

What matters is joining elite international clubs to feed the ego of the rich and well-fed Indians. That's what happened here and it's not all that surprising when you understand how Indians think.; )

 

[Immortan.Joe]

It's purely coincidental, the GoI has zero control over the SC's rulings and thus compulsions to "make nice" with the Italians to ensure a quid pro quo on the NSG/MTCR would not even enter into the SC's decsion making process.

It is not a case of control, but of common sense. A call to judge from a secretary stating that he need to do something else India would not get into NSG is good enough to get a favourable judgement.

Also, SC does not have a legitimacy of its own and derive its legitimacy from executive whose mandate is refreshed every five years. Judges avoid confrontation with a strong and popular executive, but would even order generals on operational matters when government of the day is weak. (A SC Judge in case of Hazratbal siege instructed army to provide minimum of 1200 calories to hold up terrorist completely destroying army's tactic of starving them out). Get a government weak enough ,and a judge with god-complex would even dictate strategies to infantry.

 

[dadeechi]

It is going to be a two step process

The first step is to obtain the membership in MTCR. The resolution of marines issue with Italy clears all the roadblocks and will now allow India to attain this membership.

The second step is the NSG membership. Here the opposition is from China. China is negotiating for India's support for it to get into MTCR in return for its support for India's membership in NSG.