Scorpene sub delayed by one more year

[thestringshredder]

It is official. Gloomy days aren’t over for the Scorpene submarine project. Plagued by years of delays and subsequent cost overruns, the project being executed by defence shipyard Mazagon Dock in Mumbai has missed the deadline once again, dealing a body blow to the Navy’s desperate effort to pull its impuissant submarine arm out of the trough.

The French-origin submarines, being built under a transfer of technology (ToT) contract, will not be available for induction into the submarine-starved Navy in 2015, as promised by the yard. The revised target for delivery of the first of the six Scorpenes is September 2016, with the remaining hopefully entering service at the rate of one submarine every 12 months thereon.

“We have set a new target of September 2016 for delivery of the first Scorpene,” confirmed Rear Admiral (retd.) Rahul Kumar Shrawat, Chairman and Managing Director of Mazagon Dock Limited (MDL) during an interaction with The Hindu in Kozhikode recently. Rear Admiral Shrawat says orders for the third and final batch of 178 high-value items — outfitting equipment that gained an unsavoury reputation as MDL-Procured Material (MPM) after the yard’s cumbersome and hazy procurement procedures held up the project for over two years — was placed on DCNS, the original manufacturer of the Scorpenes, in November last year.

The orders were placed on a single contractor to save the yard from the burden of having to deal with a large number of foreign vendors. The process inter alia ensured transparency and ease of procurement, Rear Admiral Shrawat said explaining the delay.

The Navy, however, is livid over the yard’s persistent disregard for deadlines. Top Navy officials rue that by the time the Scorpenes are commissioned, they would be obsolete. The first three Scorpenes will not even have air independent propulsion (AIP), a technology that enhances underwater endurance of submarines several times over, they point out. Without AIP, submarines are forced to surface once in a few days to recharge their batteries, a process when they are most susceptible to detection.

The contract for construction of the Scorpenes was inked in 2005, with the first originally slated for delivery in 2012. MDL’s long-drawn procurement processes and sluggishness in technology absorption gave the projects hiccups at the start itself. Meanwhile, the project cost grew exponentially from the original Rs.18,798 crore to Rs. 23,562 crore in 2010 with a renewed timeline.

ANOTHER ROADBLOCK

DCNS’ takeover of Armaris, the company with which the contract was signed, contributed to the complexities in sourcing of stipulated equipment. The project faced another roadblock with the yard failing to renew its technology assistance contract with the Spanish Navantia, co-developer of the Scorpenes, early this year.

While the country head of DCNS, in an interview with The Hindu in April, gave an assurance of “technical assistance [to the project] beyond contractual obligations,” it is believed that any further hold-up would result in the company making a plea for extra fee.

Link - Scorpene sub delayed by one more year - The Hindu

 

[SR-91]

For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

Instead of getting upset,maybe Navy can use this as an opportunity.May be we can lease more Akulas, build more Arihants quicker, order more scorpene, but this time have the French make em, i think there was an option for three more scorpenes.

I believe in Indian Navy,they have the ability to make quick decisions, at times like these, for a better future.

 

[Black Eagle 90]

wait and see who wins.... Local N-Subs...

 

[dbc]

The Navy, however, is livid over the yard’s persistent disregard for deadlines. Top Navy officials rue that by the time the Scorpenes are commissioned, they would be obsolete.

Typical tactics employed by weapons makers when customers insist on full ToT. But what is the point of unrestricted ToT on obsolete technology?

 

[Sergi]

This project is dam walking the lines of LCA.

Typical tactics employed by weapons makers when customers insist on full ToT. But what is the point of unrestricted ToT on obsolete technology?

They wont be obsolete unless we are targeting them to some country who has better platform.

And even if every adversary is having better platform these Subs can patrol coast line. That will be a limited use but surely wont be obsolete.

 

[dbc]

This project is dam walking the lines of LCA.



They wont be obsolete unless we are targeting them to some country who has better platform.

And even if every adversary is having better platform these Subs can patrol coast line. That will be a limited use but surely wont be obsolete.

Time does funny things to the value of things I'm told, so when the technology is eventually delivered to the customer at some date in the far far future(10 to 20 years) it is almost worthless. This is a neat trick and one that is often used with great success by firms that don't easily give up technology that has significant commercial value.

 

[sancho]

For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

Instead of getting upset,maybe Navy can use this as an opportunity.May be we can lease more Akulas, build more Arihants quicker, order more scorpene, but this time have the French make em, i think there was an option for three more scorpenes.

I believe in Indian Navy,they have the ability to make quick decisions, at times like these, for a better future.

They are upset about their own silly decisions! "They" opted for the less capable sub (without AIP), that would be new for Indian industry and even more expensive, so they can't really complain about it now.
Nuclear subs are no alternative for SSKs in coastal defence roles, especially at the costs and the P75I competition actually shows how slow IN is with it's decisions. The whole submarine issue is self made and that's what's the biggest problem for us, which they however won't admit I guess.

Typical tactics employed by weapons makers when customers insist on full ToT. But what is the point of unrestricted ToT on obsolete technology?

The obsolescence meant here is, the lack of AIP, which IN not even has procured so far for the last Scorpene subs, which was a major failure in their assessment. Besides that, you have to look at which technology is obsolete for whom? AIP technology, or even the basic techs of the naval systems of the Scorpene won't be obsolete for Indian naval industry, only because it might be obsolete for Europe, Japan or China, which already operates AIP subs for years.
That's not even special for countries like India with limited industrial capabilities, but even for countries like Israel, Turkey, or Japan, that procure arms and techs which were developed from other countries, produce or customize them in house via ToT and benefit from these JVs or licence productions.

 

[janon]

Time does funny things to the value of things I'm told, so when the technology is eventually delivered to the customer at some date in the far far future(10 to 20 years) it is almost worthless. This is a neat trick and one that is often used with great success by firms that don't easily give up technology that has significant commercial value.

As much as I hate to say it, this time we can't blame the OEM. The project is not being delayed because the OEM is withholding technology. It is being delayed because of MDL's incompetence and inability to absorb the technology. That is typical for a government run enterprise, that they will not capitalize on an opportunity even it is offered to them in a golden spoon. Americans have an aphorism for this - "Governments have no business doing business." You as an American may not understand the depths to which government run organizations can sink - AFAIK, and correct me if I'm wrong, the only "business" that the US govt runs is the USPS.

 

[Iggy]

Why cant we just ask France to built some of the subs so that MDL can take their own time to produce the sub with out our Naval submarine force shrinking.. There will be follow on orders anyway!!

 

[Nexus]

The first of the six Scorpene submarines ordered by the Indian Navy from French firm DCNS in 2005, as part of the technology transfer between the two countries, will be rolled out by 2014, France’s top diplomat in India said on Saturday.”The first submarine would be ready by 2014, heralding an important and strategic tie-up between both the nations on the defence front”, said Francois Richier, Ambassador of France in India, adding the rest of five submarines would be delivered every subsequent year.
“Such kind of submarines are important for Indian Navy considering the long coast it has to guard”, he said.

Richier is in Goa to visit French Destroyer ‘FNS Montcalm’ which is here as the part of training exercises with the Indian Navy.

The six Scorpenes are being constructed at the Mazagon Dockyards Limited (MDL) in Mumbai under Project-75 under technology transfer from French firm DCNS.

The government approval for construction of the six submarines was accorded in September 2005 at a total cost of Rs 18,798 crore and the contract was signed in October that year.

The project cost was revised to Rs 23,562 crore in February 2010, along with revision in delivery schedule.

“The induction of Scorpene submarines would enhance Indian Navy’s capabilities to conduct exercises in the open sea. These are the last generation of conventional submarines”, a senior French naval officer said.

Designed for coastal defence against under-water threats, the 1,750-tonne submarine-submarine-killer (SSK) Scorpene is 67 meters in length and can dive to a depth of 300 meters. Ccording to French naval officials, the submarine can stay at sea for 45 days with a crew of 31.

The standard version has six torpedo tubes and anti-shipping missile launchers

-PTI

 

[SirHatesALot]

So whats new

 

[Echo_419]

Can we just contact France for building some subs
& what happened to AIP they had an option to chose it on last 2 Socrpean subs

 

[Anony]

For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

Instead of getting upset,maybe Navy can use this as an opportunity.May be we can lease more Akulas, build more Arihants quicker, order more scorpene, but this time have the French make em, i think there was an option for three more scorpenes.

I believe in Indian Navy,they have the ability to make quick decisions, at times like these, for a better future.

There can be one good reaction. It can be considered as blessing in disguise. India's indigenously developed AIP which will be much more advanced than others generating onboard Hydrogen underwater, which got delayed by one year and will not be available before end 2015 can now be fitted in the last two of the Scorpene subs . Though it has certain limitation at this point and the first batch of this technology will have endurance only for 15 days before subs need to come to surface as against 4 weeks of the one produced by DCNS.

 

[faithfulguy]

Can we just contact France for building some subs
& what happened to AIP they had an option to chose it on last 2 Socrpean subs

If France build it, than it would not be TOT build in India sub. Less money for corruption. And less bragging opportunities for Indians in this forum. It would be ridiculous to think of someone higher up in Indian establishment would brag in here or in Bh arat Rak shak. But I won't be surprise if someone in the Indian establishment use their privy knowledge and brag on here. After all, India is the worlds largest free country.

 

[Echo_419]

If France build it, than it would not be TOT build in India sub. Less money for corruption. And less bragging opportunities for Indians in this forum. It would be ridiculous to think of someone higher up in Indian establishment would brag in here or in Bh arat Rak shak. But I won't be surprise if someone in the Indian establishment use their privy knowledge and brag on here. After all, India is the worlds largest free country.

The method by which you bash india is very similar to our Western Neighbours
I mean Bharat Rakshak
Free country

You sure you are not related to a Pakistani