Saudi Arabia expresses interest in JF-17 co-production with Pakistan.

[Zarvan]

NG will not look upto Russians for their inventory especially in loitering crafts. Do you know the geopolitics?Jo aya zehan main ol diya.

Saudi Arabia is going for Chinese stuff and with their problems with USA growing they will go for Russia soon

 

[Informant]

Saudi Arabia is going for Chinese stuff and with their problems with USA growing they will go for Russia soon

NOPES, they are very tight with USA their main supplier. A disagreement over Syria is nothing to fret over. USA would never anger KSA as it is their main ally on Muslim side. From tanks, to aircrafts, to surface ships, to artillery to air defence systems. USA and KSA are as tight as before. Plus Russia screwed over the business they could score after the Syria debacle.

 

[Salahuddin_ayyubi]

NOPES, they are very tight with USA their main supplier. A disagreement over Syria is nothing to fret over. USA would never anger KSA as it is their main ally on Muslim side. From tanks, to aircrafts, to surface ships, to artillery to air defence systems. USA and KSA are as tight as before. Plus Russia screwed over the business they could score after the Syria debacle.

KSA is also not happy from USA on recent US-IRAN agreement on IRAN's Nuclear dispute.

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

Stop acting hard, negotiations are underway.

@Yzd Khalifa i just heard engine change is desired by KSA.

Yeah, I kinda thought about it that way. I don't think the Saudis will accept anything Russians equipments including engines.

 

[RAMPAGE]

Yeah, I kinda thought about it that way. I don't think the Saudis will accept anything Russians equipments including engines.

So what's the alternative ???

 

[BCCItheGreat]

Yeah, I kinda thought about it that way. I don't think the Saudis will accept anything Russians equipments including engines.

You should show your country flags...before you get banned for violating forum rules

 

[SQ8]

Try to fit a 1000 CC engine into 500 CC bike!! It won't fit.
For that to accomplish you need lot of time, money and structural changes.
1. Rafale around M-88 series whose dimension are similar to GE-404, that is why during development phase when M-88 was not ready they used GE-404.
2. JF-17 around WS-13 which is similar to RD-93.
3. Tejas around Kaveri, which is similar to GE-404..

Umm.. no..

There are many aircraft that have had engine retrofits with compartibly little expense. Examples are..

Mirage F-1.. was outfitted with a RD-93.
The F-4 Phantom was outfitted with the F-100
The F-16 has had two engines

The JF-17 was designed around the prospect of taking in two engines..hence it was given an engine bay that could accomodate either the RD-93 or the F-100 with certain changes. The WS-13 was tested into the aircraft at a later stage. So what you talk about is not impossible nor such massively impractical.

 

[Dazzler]

Try to fit a 1000 CC engine into 500 CC bike!! It won't fit.
For that to accomplish you need lot of time, money and structural changes.

This is purely misconception that you can fit any engine to any fighter or can upgrade it with other engines available in open market.

Please understand that the aircraft is designed around a particular engine, like
1. Rafale around M-88 series whose dimension are similar to GE-404, that is why during development phase when M-88 was not ready they used GE-404.
2. JF-17 around WS-13 which is similar to RD-93.
3. Tejas around Kaveri, which is similar to GE-404.

Note: I said similar, it means comparable weight, dimensions, thrust and various other important attachments.

If you want to upgrade the engine in any fighter then you have basically 2 options:
1. Easy way: Ask the original manufacturer of the engine( engine which is currently fitted) to improve the engine in terms of thrust or whatever parameters you want, so as not to change the overall shape, size and attachments. Still you will need years for testing and some modifications, mind it those modifications are small but not easy.
2. Hard way: Change the engine available from open source. Go for many complex and time consuming structural modifications including various other auxiliary units. This will take more than 4-5 years and also much more expensive.

see the difference of fuselage and engine diameter? get a hint

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

You should show your country flags...before you get banned for violating forum rules

Not when you happen to be among PDF's elites

So what's the alternative ???

Maybe something the EF-2000 or something.

 

[BCCItheGreat]

see the difference of fuselage and engine diameter? get a hint

If thats the real reason, then Pakistan did a great job...

 

[Dazzler]

If thats the real reason, then Pakistan did a great job...

the whole aircraft was designed around "plug and play" concept.

 

[BCCItheGreat]

the whole aircraft was designed around "plug and play" concept.

Lets see how it turns out...
Thunder seem to be in a better situation than what i used to imagine...
I am more curious about how tejas will match thunder in future both combat, export customer wise...

 

[RAMPAGE]

Maybe something the EF-2000 or something.

EJ-200 ???

Hmmm the unit cost of RD-93 is $2.5 million and that of EJ-200 is between $6 to $7 million.

The total cost of the program will increase dramatically if you guys choose EJ-200.

 

[BCCItheGreat]

What is the cost of Thunder?

 

[MehrotraPrince]

Umm.. no..

There are many aircraft that have had engine retrofits with compartibly little expense. Examples are..

Mirage F-1.. was outfitted with a RD-93.
The F-4 Phantom was outfitted with the F-100
The F-16 has had two engines

The JF-17 was designed around the prospect of taking in two engines..hence it was given an engine bay that could accomodate either the RD-93 or the F-100 with certain changes. The WS-13 was tested into the aircraft at a later stage. So what you talk about is not impossible nor such massively impractical.

Yes but only if they are compatible + decade of experience (France and USA, both in terms of engine and airframe). They did it just for experimental and study purpose. As far as F-16 and F-15 is concerned then it is very wise to remember that from the start of project itself 2 engines were chosen (insurance purpose, and this is acknowledged by US itself Document: Development of F100-PW220 and F110-GE100 Engines) that means all the possible contingencies were taken care during airframe design only.

This is only because of compatibility that Rafale used GE-404 during developmental phase, similarly India used GE-404 when we failed to develop Kaveri on time and for that much required thrust.

May be I forget to add but my views were specific to people claiming that they can very easily integrate EJ-200 (only feasible option as why will US give engine like F-100 for integration with Chinese platform).

India chose GE-414 not for love of US products (instead of EJ-200), but because it has much more common elements to GE-404 than alien EJ-200. It was chosen to save time, cost and much larger technical complexity.

I never said that its impossible to integrate any other engine, but yes its time consuming and difficult (WS-13 is modelled around RD-93 so less question about its compatibility), for any other engine you need to adjust the airflow or redesign it for that particular engine + redesign other auxiliary units (due to different power outputs) and even require some structural change in the aircraft (depending upon dimensions and weight) + many more other things.