Russian S-300 PMU-2 vs Chinese HQ-9 Which one is better ?

[Audio]

@Audio

You are more unreliable than all of the others put together. Believe what you have to, its not going to change the reality.

According to a representative from the South African Denel Group, the PL-ASR is almost a replica of its A-Darter AAM.
The company strongly suspects that China reverse-engineered its A-Darter AAM after acquiring its technological materials.

China starts buying South African arms - UPI.com

 

[AKINCI]

What is the current program? Learn from China the metrics of this missile and than transfer the technology to the US. Then Turkey will cancel the purchase to protest the treatment of uighurs in China. China will end up with no money and its technology stolen.

Like we did in the past WS-1 and B-611 projects.

 

[UKBengali]

China starts buying South African arms - UPI.com

That is an article from 2009!

It talks about China somehow obtaining the technology of the missiles in the 2000s when it was true that the Chinese weapons industry was lacking. There is actually no proof that it happened though!

What is butt-hurting a lot of people is that China has now beat the rest of the world in the Turkish SAM competition and the future of the Chinese weapons industry is bright.

The end of the Western dominance has just got a little bit closer

 

[Gryphon]

US-sanctioned Chinese firm wins Turkey missile defence system tender

September 28, 2013

ISTANBUL: NATO member Turkey has chosen a Chinese defence firm that has been sanctioned by Washington to co-produce a $4 billion long-range air and missile defence system, rejecting rival bids from Russian, US and European firms.

The Turkish defence minister announced the decision to award the contract to China Precision Machinery Import and Export Corp (CPMIEC) in a statement on Thursday.

In February, the United States announced sanctions on CPMIEC for violations of the Iran, North Korea and Syria Nonproliferation Act.

It did not say precisely what CPMIEC had done, but Washington has penalised the company before. In 2003, Washington said it was extending sanctions on the firm for arms sales to Iran. It was unclear when those measures were first imposed.

Officials at state-run CPMIEC, the marketing arm of China’s missile manufacturing industry, could not immediately be reached for comment.

Turkey, which has the second-largest deployable military force in the NATO alliance, has no long-range missile defence system of its own, but NATO has deployed the US-built Patriot air and missile defence system there since 2012.

The winning Chinese FD-2000 system beat the Patriot, the Russian S-400 and the French-Italian Eurosam Samp-T.

Raytheon Co, which builds the Patriot missile system, said it had been informed about the Turkish decision and hoped to get a briefing soon. It said there were 200 Patriot units deployed in 12 countries, including Turkey.

“NATO has long supported the system, deploying Patriots in five aligned countries and, in 2012, providing a requested Patriot deployment to Turkey. Given this strong performance, we hope to have an opportunity to debrief and learn more about this decision,” Raytheon spokesman Mike Doble said.

CPMIEC does not make missiles itself. The two main manufacturers are China Aerospace Science and Technology Corp (CASC) and China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp (CASIC). CASC makes intercontinental ballistic missiles, while CASIC focuses on short- and intermediate-range rockets.

After decades of steep military spending increases and cash injections into local contractors, experts say some Chinese-made equipment is now comparable to Russian or Western weaponry.

China last year became the world’s fifth-biggest arms supplier with 5 percent of the market, according to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute. Pakistan was its biggest buyer.

Turkish Defence Minister Ismet Yilmaz’s statement also said a contract to produce six corvette ships by Koc Holding , Turkey’s biggest conglomerate, had been cancelled. A contract to build two ships would be awarded to the Turkish naval shipyard. The construction of four remaining ships will be put out to tender later, Yilmaz said. Koc Holding was recently accused of backing the 1997 military overthrow of Turkey’s first Islamist-led government, sending the firm’s shares tumbling on fears of a deepening vendetta against the country’s secular business elite.

The Turkish government launched a probe into the taxes of Koc energy firms in July, weeks after criticising one of the family’s hotels for sheltering protesters during anti-government unrest that rocked several cities over the summer.

US-sanctioned Chinese firm wins Turkey missile defence system tender - Daily Times

 

[faithfulguy]

Like we did in the past WS-1 and B-611 projects.

So did you cancel WS-1 and B-611 project?

 

[-SINAN-]

So did you cancel WS-1 and B-611 project?

So did you cancel WS-1 and B-611 project?

WS-1 evolved as KASIRGA

B-611 evolved as YILDIRIM

They are both in inventory right now.

 

[hacksquat]

So did you cancel WS-1 and B-611 project?

He was being sarcastic ... This is not the first ToT between Turkey and China (as Sinan mentioned above) and it is highly unlikely it will be the last as long as west keeps dragging its feet. Your arguement that Turkey will pull a "switcheroo" and scam Chinese is incredibly baseless and quite insulting. How can you expect a country to give up its reputation just like that?

 

[Audio]

That is an article from 2009!

It talks about China somehow obtaining the technology of the missiles in the 2000s when it was true that the Chinese weapons industry was lacking. There is actually no proof that it happened though!

What is butt-hurting a lot of people is that China has now beat the rest of the world in the Turkish SAM competition and the future of the Chinese weapons industry is bright.

The end of the Western dominance has just got a little bit closer

I know you're not the brightest one, read again to what nonsense i was replying. And for a clue: it had nothing to do with what you wrote.
No need to reply to me if you're insufficiently intelligent to grasp the meaning of fairly simple sentences.

 

[Neptune]

Thread moved to Air Warfare.

 

[UKBengali]

I know you're not the brightest one, read again to what nonsense i was replying. And for a clue: it had nothing to do with what you wrote.
No need to reply to me if you're insufficiently intelligent to grasp the meaning of fairly simple sentences.

Again, you show your inferiority complex by resorting to calling others stupid

You come from a two-bit insignificant european country and was hoping to latch onto the coat-tails of the bigger boys and can now see them being beaten by the Chinese now.

More wins for the Chinese arms industry will surely follow.

I wonder when the European counter to the J-20/J-31 will finally show up

Keep carrying on, your frustration is so entertaining. Remember "game-over" for the EU just got that little bit closer thanks to the Chinese SAM win

 

[Audio]

Again, you show your inferiority complex by resorting to calling others stupid

You come from a two-bit insignificant european country and was hoping to latch onto the coat-tails of the bigger boys and can now see them being beaten by the Chinese now.

More wins for the Chinese arms industry will surely follow.

I wonder when the European counter to the J-20/J-31 will finally show up

Keep carrying on, your frustration is so entertaining. Remember "game-over" for the EU just got that little bit closer thanks to the Chinese SAM win

I didn't call you stupid, i called you insufficiently intelligent. Was replying to fantasies about how Israel sold technology to China. Aeronauts ramblings. I disproved his argument with two links and then you came in. Get a clue and post on topic.

I won't refrain to calling your country any names, since i respect one or two of your countrymen but the fact you live in Europe speaks enough about insignificance of your country.

Who cares what you think about Europe or my home countries. You're a no factor, a symbol of insignificance.
Bengal government begged EU to not lift it's prefered garment maker status after that factory collapsed. And you're acting all tough here. LOL! Your fellow countrymen at least have jobs provided by the EU, while you only have your welfare.

 

[HAIDER]

A State Department spokeswoman made the following statement on 28 September :

"We have conveyed our serious concerns about the Turkish governments contract discussions with a U.S.-sanctioned company for a missile defense system that will not be inter-operable with NATO systems or collective defense capabilities."

Mr. Abdullah Gul made the following statement on 29 Septembers:

"That purchase is not definite. There is a shortlist, and China is at the top of it. We should look at the conditions, but there is no doubt that Turkey is primarily in NATO. These are multi-dimensional issues, there are technical and economic dimensions and on the other hand there is an alliance dimension. These are being evaluated. Turkey needs a defense system."

BUSINESS - Turkey

So HQ9 is off list now.

 

[That Guy]

BUSINESS - Turkey

So HQ9 is off list now.

I wouldn't go that far. The Turks are probably trying to play diplomacy for now; they had to have known that a Chinese defence system in a NATO nation was going to be a nightmare for the US.

Let's wait and see what happens, China still has a chance.

Topic: I'm pretty sure that the S-300 is a better system, but we can't say for sure because neither system has been battle tested.

 

[UKBengali]

I didn't call you stupid, i called you insufficiently intelligent. Was replying to fantasies about how Israel sold technology to China. Aeronauts ramblings. I disproved his argument with two links and then you came in. Get a clue and post on topic.

I won't refrain to calling your country any names, since i respect one or two of your countrymen but the fact you live in Europe speaks enough about insignificance of your country.

Who cares what you think about Europe or my home countries. You're a no factor, a symbol of insignificance.
Bengal government begged EU to not lift it's prefered garment maker status after that factory collapsed. And you're acting all tough here. LOL! Your fellow countrymen at least have jobs provided by the EU, while you only have your welfare.

You were calling me "stupid" two weeks ago, now you are calling me "insufficiently intelligent" now. Please make your mind up


As for BD exporting 60% of it's garment exports to the EU, please do not worry as exports to Chine have increased by 300% in the last 3 years since the Chinese decided to allow duty-free access to BD garments from 2010. This will naturally rise to many billions of Yuan(lol) trade by the end of the decade as the Chinese move away from garment manufacturing due to their rapidly rising labour costs. You will even lose your leverage over BD in the next decade, so enjoy what little power you have while it lasts

 

[cabatli_53]

A State Department spokeswoman made the following statement on 28 September :




Mr. Abdullah Gul made the following statement on 29 Septembers:



BUSINESS - Turkey

So HQ9 is off list now.

An strong answer of our defence minister: The middle finger to USA! We want co-development of Long range missile system and technology transfer. Do other countries supply this? If not we buy from those who do. Rest is out of our concern.

With this tender, Roketsan will be a strategic missile center of Europe and Middile-East which is able to provide almost all type of missile systems as a competitive of What two or three European biggest players can hardly do regarding both financilly and technologically. Our European friends are so worried of our latest achievements that Some of them is even mentioning to issue an arm embargo in order to block Turkey's 2500km missile and satellite launch vehicle programs but As that desicion underlined that No power in world can't change our routes. We have so many friends from East to carry out what we aimed for future.