Russian Navy Spots Foreign Submarine near Russia-Japan Border

[ChineseTiger1986]

so you wanna beef with everyone? Korea, china and now russia too?

That's why you simply cannot trust a US colony.

 

[NKVD]

forced out?
like seriously what was they going to do if the sub stood it's ground?? destroy it, lol?

Yeah might be what can Japan might do in such case. Offer sake

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

why would U.S have nukes stationed in Japan or any country in the Pacific?
the SSBN on patrol have plenty of ICBMs and the range launch from any point on the world and hit it's mark if the need called for it.

I think he meant the SSN actually.

By SSN, I think maybe the ones from the strike group of either CVN-73 or CVN-76.

 

[xunzi]

nope

we would also nuke your ships anyways

Japan only talk tough now because they know they have the US to back them up. It is kind of like a kid talking smash on the street because he got a whole gang behind him.

 

[Aepsilons]

UPDATE

Russian top brass denies forcing Japanese submarine out of La Perouse Strait


MOSCOW, August 21. /ITAR-TASS/. A well-informed source at the Russian General Staff has denied forcing a Japanese submarine out of the border area in the Sea of Japan on Wednesday.


"The Japanese submarine detected in the La Perouse Strait on Wednesday did not violate international law and did not cross the Russian state border," the source told ITAR-TASS Thursday. "The submarine moving into the strait was a usual thing, and nobody forced it out of border water area," the source said.


The statement came in the wake of media reports saying that the anti-submarine forces of the Russian Pacific Fleet had cut short reconnaissance operations conducted by the Oyashio submarine in the border area in the Sea of Japan.


"The Japanese submarine was at an equal distance both from the Japanese and the Russian coast," the source said, showing the position of the Japanese submarine on a map of the region. "Tokyo's submarines often visit the La Perouse Strait, but until now such incidents never drew such a close attention of the press," it said.

"Reconnaissance activity in the northern part of the Sea of Japan is a routine job practiced by Tokyo in the north of the Sea of Japan, similar to Moscow, which does the same in the south of the Sea of Okhotsk," the source said. "No one has forced anyone out of the border area. Usually, when a submarine is detected, its hydro-acoustic system signals that it has been detected, and then the submarine moves back to its coast. Our submarine crews do the same," the source said.


It was a second foreign submarine detected by the Russian Navy in the border area over the past two weeks. On August 7, another submarine, presumably a multi-purpose US submarine of "Virginia" class, was spotted in the Barents Sea.


ITAR-TASS: Russia - Russian top brass denies forcing Japanese submarine out of La Perouse Strait

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

nope

we would also nuke your ships anyways

Damn, the Russian Navy is so powerful.

Especially the nuclear submarine fleet. Including the latest Yasen and Borei class.

We really need to put more money into our defence budget.

 

[VelocuR]

Can Japanese submarines go deeply into Sea of Okhotsk (OK-HOT-SK) ?

 

[Aepsilons]

Can Japanese submarines go deeply into Sea of Okhotsk (OK-HOT-SK) ?

Yes, we have, and I'm sure we still do.

Damn, the Russian Navy is so powerful.

Especially the nuclear submarine fleet. Including the latest Yasen and Borei class.

We really need to put more money into our defence budget.

They have impressive fire power, I will give them that. But in regards to their conventional forces, their entire navy is rather small compared to the size of their maritime domain. Their surface capital ships that are worthy of praise would be their cruisers (Kirov , Kara and Slava classes), and their 10 or so destroyers. The rest are minor patrol ships with ASM capability. Their submarine force is worthy of note, but considering Japan's powerful ASW capability and deployed forces at any given time around Japan's Maritime Domain -- they are nill.

The Japan Maritime Self Defense Force's 4th Escort Fleet -- the Esuko Kantai 4-- which has an area of responsibility of Northern Japan and our Northern Territories -- is over twice the size of the Russian Pacific Fleet. This does not include our impressive Naval Aviation and ASW Force that is assigned to the 4th Escort Fleet.

Objectively, I would emphasize that Japan is not threatened by Russia military threat. They are a grade 2 level threat.

 

[Europa]

@ChineseTiger1986
@Nihonjin1051

its a new development, something serious is going on under the surface

US Subs on Routine Patrol Missions Off Russian Shore – Admiral | World | RIA Novosti

MOSCOW, August 21 (RIA Novosti) - The recent sighting of a Japanese submarine off Russia's Pacific coast is a rare one, unlike the presence of the US Navy’s subs, Admiral Viktor Fyodorov, former commander of the Russian Pacific Fleet, told RIA Novosti Thursday.

“There have hardly been any sightings of Japanese submarines near Russia’s maritime border, unlike American ones, which have been on routine patrol missions off the Kamchatka [peninsula] shore and the main base of Russia’s Pacific Fleet in Vilyuchinsk,” Adm. Fyodorov said.

This comment came after a report by Russia’s Kommersant daily, which cited a senior military official from the General Staff as saying earlier in the day that a Japanese submarine had been detected Wednesday in the La Perouse Strait, in between the southern part of the Russian island of Sakhalin and Japan's northern-most home island of Hokkaido.

The Russian admiral suggested the Japanese mission so close to the Russian waters was a sign that Tokyo had been beefing up its fleet to restore the Navy. The Imperial Japanese Navy was dissolved following World War II, with the Maritime Self-Defense Force being formed in its stead.

“A new status would allow Japanese subs to venture outside Japan’s marginal waters and effectively go to anywhere around the world,” Adm. Fyodorov told RIA Novosti.

In a similar incident, on August 7 Russia’s Northern Fleet antisubmarine forces detected and drove away a Virginia-class US submarine in the Barents Sea.

 

[Aepsilons]

We've been patrolling the Japan - Russia Neutral Zone for a long time now. This is no big deal.


Oyashio Class patrolling the Japan Maritime Domain,

Launching of a new Soryu Class submarine, to augment the 4th Fleet's Submarine Force,

 

[nvKyleBrown]

Japan only talk tough now because they know they have the US to back them up. It is kind of like a kid talking smash on the street because he got a whole gang behind him.

Lots of BS on this thread. @senheiser 's graphic shows the ENTIRE Russian Navy, rather than just the Pacific Fleet. The US is hardly a "whole gang", it's one country. As depicted below, most US forces are not in the west pacific regularly.

Anyhow... what I could find:

Russia Pacific Fleet:
1 cruiser
5 destroyers
4 SSBN
5 SSGN
4 SSN
7 SSK

Japan: (total, divide by two if you assume they preserve half the force for possible Southern threats, or make up your own percentages)
4 "helicopter cruisers"
24 destroyers
13 frigates
16 SS (all diesel)

US pacific fleet (again, should be divided to account for multiple zones of coverage, also need to account for the US Navy being pretty damn quiet about where their subs actually are located)
7th Fleet (western pacific, based in Japan)
1 CVN
2 CG
7 DG
1 LHD (the assault ships that are standard sized carriers with helo, harriers, and Marines)
3 SSN (based in Guam)

3rd fleet (eastern pacific, including alaska, west coast of North America, basically east of the international dateline, but you gotta figure there'd be some quick transfers in case of hostilities)
4 Carrier strike groups, variable composition, 1 CVN + typically 4-5 surface combatants and 1 SSN

difficult to say where other US subs are - there are more, but... they don't talk much about where they are assigned.

Another consideration is that realistically, not all these ships (from any country) are available all the time. They are capable of operating maybe 30% of the time on a peacetime footing, maybe 50% on a wartime footing(?). Some countries are not as good at keeping ships out at sea as others, but I couldn't give you numbers on that.

China has apparently put forces into the N. Pacific, but probably not regularly, and it wouldn't make much sense if they were teaming with Russia. You'd want to keep the forces closer to home, under land-based air cover, and draw off US/Japanese/Korean strength from a northern fight. I suspect North Korea is too politically unreliable to be of use to anyone, and South Korea probably not interested in fighting on behalf of Japan while North Korea is un-engaged (if ever).

 

[Aepsilons]

Lots of BS on this thread. @senheiser 's graphic shows the ENTIRE Russian Navy, rather than just the Pacific Fleet. The US is hardly a "whole gang", it's one country. As depicted below, most US forces are not in the west pacific regularly.

Anyhow... what I could find:

Russia Pacific Fleet:
1 cruiser
5 destroyers
4 SSBN
5 SSGN
4 SSN
7 SSK

Japan: (total, divide by two if you assume they preserve half the force for possible Southern threats, or make up your own percentages)
4 "helicopter cruisers"
24 destroyers
13 frigates
16 SS (all diesel)

US pacific fleet (again, should be divided to account for multiple zones of coverage, also need to account for the US Navy being pretty damn quiet about where their subs actually are located)
7th Fleet (western pacific, based in Japan)
1 CVN
2 CG
7 DG
1 LHD (the assault ships that are standard sized carriers with helo, harriers, and Marines)
3 SSN

3rd fleet (eastern pacific, including alaska, west coast of North America, basically east of the international dateline, but you gotta figure there'd be some quick transfers in case of hostilities)
4 Carrier strike groups, variable composition, 1 CVN + typically 4-5 surface combatants and 1 SSN

difficult to say where other US subs are - there are more, but... they don't talk much about where they are assigned.

Another consideration is that realistically, not all these ships (from any country) are available all the time. They are capable of operating maybe 30% of the time on a peacetime footing, maybe 50% on a wartime footing(?). Some countries are not as good at keeping ships out at sea as others, but I couldn't give you numbers on that.

China has apparently put forces into the N. Pacific, but probably not regularly, and it wouldn't make much sense if they were teaming with Russia. You'd want to keep the forces closer to home, under land-based air cover, and draw off US/Japanese/Korean strength from a northern fight. I suspect North Korea is too politically unreliable to be of use to anyone, and South Korea probably not interested in fighting on behalf of Japan while North Korea is un-engaged (if ever).

Thanks for pointing out that misinformation that @senheiser purposely posted. He posted the Russian Navy biometrics, not the Russian Pacific Fleet. And to reiterate my previous posts, Japan does not consider Russia as a naval threat, but as a partner. There are no military provocations on either part that constitutes as a threat.

China has apparently put forces into the N. Pacific, but probably not regularly, and it wouldn't make much sense if they were teaming with Russia. You'd want to keep the forces closer to home, under land-based air cover, and draw off US/Japanese/Korean strength from a northern fight. I suspect North Korea is too politically unreliable to be of use to anyone, and South Korea probably not interested in fighting on behalf of Japan while North Korea is un-engaged (if ever).

A very concise strategic analysis, @nvKyleBrown . I would likely add that the recently deployment of the 4th Escort Fleet to the Northern Territories is to address new threats in the North Pacific.

Just couple of months ago the Japan Western Army had conducted military exercises with the US Army in Alaska , with participation of the JMSDF and the US Navy's 3rd Fleet. To address these new threats in the Arctic.

We should see these Japanese - American military exercises -- deployments as a force of peace and stability for both Our strategic interests.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Lots of BS on this thread. @senheiser 's graphic shows the ENTIRE Russian Navy, rather than just the Pacific Fleet. The US is hardly a "whole gang", it's one country. As depicted below, most US forces are not in the west pacific regularly.

If you saw Senheiser's graphic, it clearly shows a color-coded distinction between the different regional fleets.

The Pacific fleet for example uses the color grey.

 

[Europa]

Thanks for pointing out that misinformation that @senheiser purposely posted. He posted the Russian Navy biometrics, not the Russian Pacific Fleet. And to reiterate my previous posts, Japan does not consider Russia as a naval threat, but as a partner. There are no military provocations on either part that constitutes as a threat.
.

my friend, you talk as if you are a government spokesperson, you see japan says another thing

Provocative Russian military games in northern territories unforgivable - The Japan News

 

[nvKyleBrown]

If you saw Senheiser's graphic, it clearly shows a color-coded distinction between the different regional fleets.

The Pacific fleet for example uses the color grey.

I did not notice that. Thanks for pointing it out. Given that it was a discussion of just the region, it seems better to only show regional forces to avoid confusion.