Featured Russia would be developing upgraded engines for Pakistan's JF-17 fighters

[Beast]

Abadeel

Russian hardware is robust sturdy and hardhitting. BUT it requires more maintenance.

Im sure that given PAF love of F16 they would have preferred a LICENSE BUILT COPY of the F16 with western technology.

BUT will settle for a chinease designed fighter powered by RUSSIAN engines IF they do the nearly the same job.

AT HALF THE COST & WITH NO SANCTIONS THREAT

THat is not what PAF pilot who previously flown F-16 transit to JF-17 think. All decide to stay with the JF-17 rather than going back to F-16.

 

[IHK_PK]

SO WHEN WILL WE RECEIVE THIS NEW ENGINE RD-93MA OR ITS STILL IN TESTING PHASE?? ANY GUESSES???

 

[Thorough Pro]

Not sure how accurate that news is, no one even knows if the modified engine even exists or is just a paper plan, though I would love that to be inducted in block II and retro fitted to all present Thunders.

 

[Umair Nawaz]

According to UEC General Designer Alexander Ivakh speaking at the Engines 2012 salon in April, about 70 engines of the RD-33 family were made in Russia last year. Their production is run now by the Chernyshev Mashine-Building Enterprise in Moscow. Previously, the RD-33 Series 2 had been in production with the Baranov OMO enterprise in Omsk (at present, an affiliate of the Salut Gas Turbine Research and Production Centre), but the fact that customers order now RD-33 Series 3 and RD-33MK engines only has left Omsk-based plant with repairing and overhauling Baranov-made engines, while the production of new engines has moved to Moscow.



Chernyshev’s near-term production programme is determined by its current orderbook for the second batch of 29 MiG-29K/KUB carrierborne fighters to India (the first batch of 16 aircraft powered by Chernyshev-built RD-33MKs was delivered during 2009–2011) and the recent Russian Defence Ministry order for 24 fighters of the type. In addition, the plant supplied RD-33MK turbofans to fit the first two MiG-29M/M2 fighter prototypes.

The first MiG-29K/KUB jets are due to the Russian Navy’s air arm as soon as 2013, but the RD-33MK first has to pass its official bench tests for compliance with peculiar requirements of the Russian Armed Forces. Klimov JSC kicked off the tests on 28 January 2012.

An important position in Chernyshev’s production plans is also occupied by the deliveries of RD-33 Series 3 knockdown kits to India under the January 2007 contract on licence production of 120 engines of the type there. The programme is about half-complete.

Finally, the RD-93, a RD-33 derivative with the low-mounted accessory gearbox, is exported to China to fit FC-1 (JF-17) light single-engine fighters. The deal for 100 RD-93s with an option for 400 more was clinched in April 2005. The first 15 engines were assembled by Klimov, and Chernyshev has handled the rest of the deliveries since 2006. The contract is half-complete, and the deliveries shall resume as soon as the customer submits its request.

At the same time with the full-rate production in Moscow, Klimov JSC in St. Petersburg continues to refine the RD-33MK and RD-93. According to Klimov, the company’s jet engine priorities are the development of the modified RD-93MA with the thrust enhanced to 9,300 kgf for a foreign customer and the development of the upgraded RD-33MKM with a thrust of 9,500 kgf for the MiG corporation.

Take-off Magazine : RD-33: output on the rise

From 8,300kgf to 9,300kgf. That's a 1 tonne thrust increase. Would do wonders for JF-17's thrust to weight ratio. Enjoy the extra thrust PAF fans!
9,300kgf is equal to 20502lbf if my calculations are right.

well i'll say lets not jump on the conclusions so early lets first confirm that foreign customer is Pakistan really!!!

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

The new engine would be a great upgrade , the sooner the better

 

[niaz]

Just ask yourself the question?

If the aircraft is so good why China doesn’t’ use it? Who knows “Pros & Cons” of a fighter better than the people who build it?

Unless the main designer that is China inducts JF-17 in large numbers in the PLAAF, few other countries will buy it.

 

[Munir]

Just ask yourself the question?

If the aircraft is so good why China doesn’t’ use it? Who knows “Pros & Cons” of a fighter better than the people who build it?

Unless the main designer that is China inducts JF-17 in large numbers in the PLAAF, few other countries will buy it.

Niaz, the Chinese have a priority list... That is clearly J20, j10, J11... These are high end planes which are most needed and also asap. You want them to go for hundreds of fc1's? Or would they go for it if they have in house engine for the FC1? Do not see it as offensive post but just an honest and humble question...

 

[Pakistanisage]

Just ask yourself the question?

If the aircraft is so good why China doesn’t’ use it? Who knows “Pros & Cons” of a fighter better than the people who build it?

Unless the main designer that is China inducts JF-17 in large numbers in the PLAAF, few other countries will buy it.

China is developing its Air Force to Challenge the US Air Force. They need fifth Generation Fighter Aircrafts to meet this challenge. JF-17 is designed for third World Air Forces who have a need to retire their Mig21 fleets. Their enemies are also other third world countries whose Air Forces will also have 4th Generation fighters. This is the profile of a typical JF-17 customer and JF-17 fills the need of such customer well.

 

[niaz]

Price is not the only consideration when buying military hardware; it has to be good enough to face what the possible adversary possesses. My point here is that JF -17 has to compete against existing proven aircrafts in the world market.

Argument that China is developing Air Force to challenge USAF is an argument against JF-17. Pakistani Thunders would be facing IAF Mk-1’s and Rafael’s. Pakistan is aiming to export Thunder to Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Iran, Venezuela etc. Don’t you think that these countries would like the assurance that aircraft they are buying can stand on its own against other comparable Western fighters because you don’t know what aircraft it comes up against.

Any marketing manager will tell you that best recommendation for any product is if the manufacturer also uses it. PLAAF still has about 300 J-7 (MIG -21) in service. It would go a long way towards increasing JF-17’s export possibilities if China were to induct a few squadrons replacing the aging J-7. China not doing it could be construed to imply that the manufacturer has doubts about its survivability against 4+ generation aircrafts.

I don’t want China to do anything; neither am I implying that JF-17 is no good. I am just trying to be a devil’s advocate.

 

[Luftwaffe]

China is developing its Air Force to Challenge the US Air Force. They need fifth Generation Fighter Aircrafts to meet this challenge. JF-17 is designed for third World Air Forces who have a need to retire their Mig21 fleets. Their enemies are also other third world countries whose Air Forces will also have 4th Generation fighters. This is the profile of a typical JF-17 customer and JF-17 fills the need of such customer well.

China still won't field 2000 5th Gen compared to USAF/USN. They have considerably invested in 4.5Gen J-11/J-15/J-16/JH-7 variants thus at the most they would field 600 5th Gen that is 1/4. The problem with third world is they are out of cash and can't even afford FC-1.

 

[Pakistanisage]

Price is not the only consideration when buying military hardware; it has to be good enough to face what the possible adversary possesses. My point here is that JF -17 has to compete against existing proven aircrafts in the world market.

Argument that China is developing Air Force to challenge USAF is an argument against JF-17. Pakistani Thunders would be facing IAF Mk-1’s and Rafael’s. Pakistan is aiming to export Thunder to Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Iran, Venezuela etc. Don’t you think that these countries would like the assurance that aircraft they are buying can stand on its own against other comparable Western fighters because you don’t know what aircraft it comes up against.

Any marketing manager will tell you that best recommendation for any product is if the manufacturer also uses it. PLAAF still has about 300 J-7 (MIG -21) in service. It would go a long way towards increasing JF-17’s export possibilities if China were to induct a few squadrons replacing the aging J-7. China not doing it could be construed to imply that the manufacturer has doubts about its survivability against 4+ generation aircrafts.

I don’t want China to do anything; neither am I implying that JF-17 is no good. I am just trying to be a devil’s advocate.

The Problem is that you have never really served in an Air Force which explains your shallow knowledge and appreciation of issues. I can certainly understand your dilemma because it is tough to learn Military Strategy from the Video Games in your library.

The Air Forces have many different tasks to perform. Not all of the Air force Aircrafts are for the purposes of fighting enemy fighters. That is the job of Air superiority fighter to rule the airspace. (Pakistan's Thunders -BLK 1 will not be pitched against Rafale's or MKI's. That would be the job of F-16's). Under that umbrella many different types of missions are required for example different CAS missions on Land and Sea.

JF-17 Blk 1 is not designed to be an Air Superiority aircraft. For that role the best we have so far are our F-16's and we need other 4.5 or 5th Generation fighters. To think JF-17 ( BLK 1 ) is all in all for all roles for the PAF is really convoluted. It fits its role as a Multi-role Fighter that can perform many tasks ( excluding the role of Air Superiority aircraft). We plan on using it against enemy ships as well as on land against enemy Armoured Formations in the battlefield.

Eventually, as JF-17 BLK II's are equipped with an AESA RADAR and BVR Missiles , they will be used as a deterrent against Indian 4.5 generation fighters.

JF-17 BLK II's with their AESA RADAR and BVR MISSILES are an awesome bargain at 25 to 30 Million USD for any Air Force. That is one third the cost of any closest competition.

 

[Asian.Century]

100 more upgraded RD-93 turbofans bought:

Airshow China 2014: Russia to supply China with more RD-93 turbofans - IHS Jane's 360

Total JF17 and J-31 engines is now 200.

 

[rockstar08]

still no sign of Jf-17 block 2 ??
when it is coming out ?? are they going to induct like 10-15 birds at same time ?? or it will just one first for display .?

 

[My-Analogous]

100 more upgraded RD-93 turbofans bought:

Airshow China 2014: Russia to supply China with more RD-93 turbofans - IHS Jane's 360

Total JF17 and J-31 engines is now 200.

Ok now i got it, its new engine and will be called RD93"S" and that what they mentioned in J31 spec.

 

[Asian.Century]

Ok now i got it, its new engine and will be called RD93"S" and that what they mentioned in J31 spec.

Can you show me the spec for J-31, that says RD-93 'S' ?