Russia Wagner Mutiny | Updates & Discussions

jhungary · Jun 24, 2023

Ali_Baba said:
Yeah - it is difficult to see how this will work out - but I do think ROD is Wagners "oblast" now and will form the base of operations for Wagner going forward. The Russian Army will struggle to take on Wagner in ROD and win - the Russian Army lacks the manpower to take on an beat Wagner right now.

Taking / occupying Moscow will be difficult - which is why i think they have selected ROD as a safe base to ensure they have a logistics supply line from ROD to whatever they want to do next.

There is fighting going on in Voronezh right now... ( BBC News flash .. )

Question - has Russia just blown up the oil depot at Voronezh to try and slow/stop the Wagner advance ???

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www.ft.com

Head of Russia's Voronezh region says Russian army taking action there amid Wagner mutiny

The governor of Russia's Voronezh region said on Saturday that the army was taking "necessary military measures" in the region as part of a counter-terrorist operation declared after an armed mutiny by the Wagner mercenary group.

www.deccanherald.com

Taking Rostov-On-Don also takes the entire Russian military effort in Ukraine hostage, that now is the major supply base for almost all Russian force in Ukraine, if Prigozhin took the Southern Command (no way to verify if he had done it) which mean nothing is going out to Russian troop in Ukraine unless Prigozhin said so.

Depends on what Prigozhin want to do and whether or not Putin will relent. Wagner may hold out in ROD for a long period of time, and either Putin would have to charm Prigozhin or have to retake ROD by force, which with majority of Russian combat power already in Ukraine, I don't know how it would be possible, you can't send the National Guard and FSB unit to fight an offensive on a battle hardened Wagner. So, I would bet this is going to be peaceful way out, but how long does it take and how much damage to Russian force in Ukraine is going to be unknown, I suppose Prigozhin won't release any supply until his demand is met. I mean, he ain't stupid, he wouldn't take ROD and let the supply free float into Russian military hand.

Foinikas · Jun 24, 2023

REhorror said:
Is this the Protocols of the Ancient Elder of Zion?

No,it's from something foretold by a Russian starets

23. Elder Theodosius (Kashin) of Minvody (+1948), shortly after the outbreak of war with Germany in 1941:

"Do you really think that that was the war (1941-45)?! The war is still to come. It will begin from the east. And then from all sides, like locusts, the enemies will spread over Russia... That will be the war!"

The West will assist this creeping conquest of our land and in every way support the military and economic might of China out of hatred for Russia. But then they will see the danger for themselves, and when the Chinese try to conquer the Urals, this time by military might, and go even further, they will by all means hinder this and will even be able to help Russia in deflecting the invasion from the East. Russia must stand her ground in this battle; after sufferings and complete impoverishment she will find in herself the strength to recover. And the coming regeneration will begin in the lands conquered by the enemies, in the midst of Russians left in the former republics of the Union. There Russian people will realise what they have lost, will recognise themselves to be citizens of that Fatherland which is still alive, and will want to help her rise from the ashes. Many Russians living abroad will begin to help the re-establishment of life in Russia. Many of those who are able to flee from persecutions will return to the immemorial Russian lands so as to fill up the abandoned villages, till the neglected fields and use the mineral resources that remain untapped. The Lord will send help, and, in spite of the fact that the country will have lost its main seams of raw materials, they will find the oil and gas without which a contemporary economy cannot work, in Russia.

The elder said that the Lord would permit the loss of huge territories given to Russia because we ourselves were not able to use them worthily, but only spoiled and polluted them. But the Lord will leave in Russia's possession those lands which became the cradle of the Russian people and were the base of the Great Russian state. This is the territory of the Great Muscovite Principality of the 16th century with outlets to the Black, Caspian and North seas. Russia will not be rich, but still she will be able to feed herself and force others to reckon with her.

To the question: What will happen to Ukraine and Belorussia? The elder replied that everything is in the hands of God. Those among those people who are against union with Russia even if they consider themselves to be believers will become servants of the devil. The Slavic peoples have one destiny, and the monastic Fathers of the Kiev Caves [Lavra] will yet utter their weighty word - they together with the choir of the new martyrs of Russia will by their prayers obtain a new Union of the three brother peoples. They posed one more question to him on the possibility of the restoration of a monarchy in Russia. The elder replied that this restoration must be earned. It exists as a possibility, but not as something predetermined. If we are worthy, the Russian people will elect a Tsar, but this will become possible before the very enthronement of the Antichrist or even after it for a very short time."[21]

ReasonableStar75 · Jun 24, 2023

LeGenD said:
Ukrainian forces could not be resupplied in Mariupol. It still took 81 days and heavy use of thermobaric artillery systems to take the city.

Wagner stood out in Bakhmut, a city where Ukrainian forces can be resupplied.

Wagner is a far more capable force than the grossly overrated TikTok chechen clowns operating in convenient conditions.

No way, Wagner are just talkers, always talking about support from the russian army... chechens were there alone and did the job silently against international troops deplyed in the factories and suburbs of the whole Mariupol.

You have a very short memory.Yes time has passed from Mariupol victory by Chechens.

It s funny you say about Tik Tok, this Wagner chief loves to pose to the camera all the time asking for supplies and crazy.

LeGenD · Jun 24, 2023

ReasonableStar75 said:
No way, Wagner are just talkers, always talking about support from the russian army... chechens were there alone and did the job silently against international troops deplyed in the factories and suburbs of the whole Mariupol.

You have a very short memory.Yes time has passed from Mariupol victory by Chechens.

It s funny you say about Tik Tok, this Wagner chief loves to pose to the camera all the time asking for supplies and crazy.

Sorry but I recall the battle of Mariupol differently. Prove it that Chechens took the city. You cannot. You do not know who was involved in what capacity down there.

Even Putin has acknowledged Wagner's performance in Bakhmut, but you.

I mentioned TikTok because Chechens were using it for "poses." Real fighters do not have time for poses.

Viet · Jun 24, 2023

jhungary said:
I personally think this coup (or whatever you call it) would fall apart. Prigozhin have no way to threaten Putin, if he had, he would not choose Rostov-On-Don as his first objective, he would most definitely choose Moscow.

But taking ROD also show you one thing, Prigozhin probably is using the war in Ukraine as leverage to get what he needed from Putin, depends on who is going to brink first, Prigozhin may get his way (which mostly involved replacing Shoigu or senior position on the table) or Putin may get his, which mean Prigozhin either leave or go to jail. But this is going to take a quite lasting effect on Russia military. After this, if I was a normal Russian soldier, I wouldn't know who to trust.

Will be interesting
Putin still has some jokers.
Russia’s national guard is the main joker.
If FSB and Russia’s national guard falling then Putin’s hours have arrived.
Then Putin life will end very quickly.
As ex KGB agent Putin will be treated as like other Kgp agents.

Foinikas · Jun 24, 2023

ReasonableStar75 said:
No way, Wagner are just talkers, always talking about support from the russian army... chechens were there alone and did the job silently against international troops deplyed in the factories and suburbs of the whole Mariupol.

You have a very short memory.Yes time has passed from Mariupol victory by Chechens.

It s funny you say about Tik Tok, this Wagner chief loves to pose to the camera all the time asking for supplies and crazy.

Oh hey,it's the guy who said ancient Greeks stole everything from other civilisations. Now you're saying Wagner is just talkers.
I guess Voronezh didn't get captured by Wagner,it was blue smurfs.

Vergennes · Jun 24, 2023

LeGenD said:
Sorry but I recall the battle of Mariupol differently. Prove it that Chechens took the city. You cannot. You do not know who was involved in what capacity down there.

Even Putin has acknowledged Wagner's performance in Bakhmut, but you.

Russian military and cannon fodders DNR took Mariupol after months of brutal fighting, surely not the Chechens who even according to Russian sources at that time were purely there to shoot tiktoks and take credits of the fightings...

jhungary · Jun 24, 2023

Viet said:
Will be interesting
Putin still has some jokers.
Russia’s national guard is the main joker.
If FSB and Russia’s national guard falling then Putin’s hours have arrived.

Putin still have considerable asset he can use, don't forget, 70% of Russian Air Force is unused,

Putin can hold Moscow with the number of National Guard and FSB couple with the support of RUAF with ease, Wagner will have a hard time cracking Moscow if they were indeed trying to get there.

But there virtually no chance for the Russian to try and crack Rostov on Don if Prigozhin indeed took the city. Putin is going to relent, otherwise he may as well pack up Russian Force in Ukraine because as I said, I doubted Prigozhin would be dumb enough not to use that to hold Russian MOD hostage

But you know what? It may be fun if Prigozhin ask Ukrainian for help............

ReasonableStar75 · Jun 24, 2023

LeGenD said:
Sorry but I recall the battle of Mariupol differently. Prove it that Chechens took the city. You cannot. You do not know who was involved in what capacity down there.

Even Putin has acknowledged Wagner's performance in Bakhmut, but you

How naive you are,... slavic people is not gonna recognize chechen role, never. Russia will always give chechens low profile to their victories for a reason, they are worried of chechen and caucus region.

I don t care what Putin says, he has commited grave errors for Russia.

Lets compare Bakhmut with Mariupol region,...well no it cannot be compared.

Viet · Jun 24, 2023

good progress

Prigozhin’s army is approaching Woronesch. Half way to Moscow.

MeFishToo · Jun 24, 2023

https://twitter.com/x/status/1672557805151088641

StormBreaker · Jun 24, 2023

HerbertPervert said:
This war was just another stupid mistake in a long history of stupidity. Russians kept focusing on expanding instead of consolidating whatever they have. Instead of focusing on economics, education, technology, and industry like the US or China, they focus on territorial expansion while their people get poorer and the youth migrate for a better future. It's the typical mindset of people there, the same thing existed in Soviet times. Just keep expanding until you implode.

Russians could have just bought out Ukranians and each successive government would have been pro-Russian.

LiKe tHe uSa

Yeah, USA focusing on economy and education by killing Afghans, Syrians, Iraqis and stealing their resources.

Yeah yeah, All Hail USA, Angel Gabriel of the World

Ali_Baba · Jun 24, 2023

BBC News Breaking - via Reuters ( unverified )

Russian Airforce/Army aviation attack Wagner convey on Russian M4 Motorway - they have opened fire ..

reflecthofgeismar · Jun 24, 2023

Where is the - "One post, one calorie" Somali?

LeGenD · Jun 24, 2023

ReasonableStar75 said:
How naive you are,... slavic people is not gonna recognize chechen role, never. Russia will always give chechens low profile to their victories for a reason, they are worried of chechen and caucus region.

I don t care what Putin says, is not my God.

Lets compare Bakhmut with Mariupol region,...well no it cannot be compared.