Russia-Ukraine War - News and Developments PART 2

The SC · Jan 9, 2023

thetutle · Jan 9, 2023

jhungary said:
If you ask any Western Ukrainian, they will probably shot you now. If you ask any Ukrainian in the East, they will probably hit you in the face.

No one wants to be associated with their mortal enemy, but that doest change facts, culture language religion or DNA. The most vicious and bitter fights are between those that are the most similar. Ask those ukranians what is the most similar ethnic group to you? It's clearly the Russians.

jhungary said:
I would say culturally there are some similarities, but linguistically and racially most likely not. Ukrainian can't read Russian if they had not learnt Russian, but they can read Serbian even if they had no prior knowledge.

Ukrainians will definitely understand more russian than Serbian if they read it for the first time. Ukrainians will understand maybe 50% of Serbian-Bosnian-Croatian (essentially the same language). But they will understand maybe 80% of russian.
In fact the only words from Serbian that ukranains will understand are those that are the same as russian.

jhungary said:
Racially, Russia is more metro than Ukrainian, Russian have a lot of different ethnicities, from Slavs to Chechen to Cossack to Buryat (Mongolian) to Siberian (Eskimo) to Russian Chinese, and of course, Rus. While most Ukrainian are either Slav or Cossack.

The ethnic minorities are irrelevant. We are comparing ethnic Russians to ethnic ukranians. Chechens or Chinese living in russia have nothing similar to Russians or Ukrainians, they are only there because they were conquered.

BHAN85 · Jan 9, 2023

Stranagor said:
I think bringing up the nukes nullify any political debate as nukes are worthless once they are used in our present world.

If it were only Russia having them, they would be effective.

Under existing conditions, it is extremely irresponsible for Russia to wave the nuclear stick. It just does not work that way.

We need to keep cause-effect relationship in mind. It was Russian invasion that triggered the whole chain of events. Western intervention, brother's language being suppressed, Nazis are running rampant... These sort of arguments by Russia do not convince those with rational thinking because Russia has all the qualities it blames Ukraine/the West for.

It is all about how the Ukrainians themselves feel about their national identity. Besides, nationhood and self-identity are not necessarily the same thing. You can continue to feel like a Slavic ethnicity while strongly identifying with the Ukrainian nationhood.

No one can take away that sense of being Ukrainian if people themselves embrace it. If they are forcefully put under the Moscow yoke, they simply become another North Caucasus.

Kadyrov runs the Caucasus. Some Wagner warlord would run Ukraine.

Do you see a beautiful future coming out of this for you if you were a Ukrainian?

I prefer Ukraine past before 2014 under Moscow rule, than current Ukraine under bombs. Maybe they were not rich, but they got their basic needs supplied, now they live in the fucking hell.

Nationalist identity can be exagerated to unstabilize a country, and that is easy to do when the country has economic problems and the devil that unstabilizes come with fresh money.

There is a lot of common parallelisms between Ukraine/Russia problem and Catalonia/Spain problem (2017).
Both problems were used by the twisted Americans to unstabilize europe using dumbshit european slaves like EU and Germany.

Do you remember Barcelona terrorist attack in Las Ramblas August 17th 2017? It was the biggest terrorist attack in Spain since March 11st 2004 terrorist attack in Madrid, and it happened months after than the biggest terrorist attack in UK (Manchester) since July 7th 2005 terrorist attack in London.

Do you think it's a coincidence? When the Americans start their plans, things starts to blow up.

2004 Madrid train bombings - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

2017 Barcelona attacks - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

7 July 2005 London bombings - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Manchester Arena bombing - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

2017 Catalan independence referendum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

America and Europe can't have common interests in 2023, in a world with each time less energy and raw materials.
But dumbshit European rulers keep acting like if nothing of the previous things had happened in last years.

The SC · Jan 9, 2023

Russian general, member of the State Duma Defense Committee, Andrei Gorolev:

Russia should be prepared for the fact that the United States can send nuclear weapons to Ukraine and train Ukrainian troops how to use them.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612157565768708096

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612124577521442817

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612218450126200832

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612218441343111170

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612106629138481158

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612104752191442949

jhungary · Jan 9, 2023

BHAN85 said:
Well, that is exactly what I said.

A Spanish-speaking person can understand Catalonian-speaking person if he talks slow, in the same way that you can understand some relation between the words Vladimir and Volodomir.

Then Catalonian speaking people thinks they are special and from other universe, ignoring centuries of common history with Spain, ignoring all the Spaniards who live in Catalonia, and ignoring that all their fucking traditions and behavior are pretty the same than Spain.

The same to Ukraine.

Unless my ex-Ukrainian girlfriend lies to me. A person only speak Ukrainian will not understand Russian no matter how slow he or she speak. The word structure and the context are different. While yes, some words are the similar, but with my basic understand of both languages, I would say it is closer to an English Speaker talk to a German Speaker speaking their respective language.

This is not even at the team of a Chinese Speaker and a Japanese Speaker or Spanish and Portuguese.

thetutle said:
No one wants to be associated with their mortal enemy, but that doest change facts, culture language religion or DNA. The most vicious and bitter fights are between those that are the most similar. Ask those ukranians what is the most similar ethnic group to you? It's clearly the Russians.

Ukrainians will definitely understand more russian than Serbian if they read it for the first time. Ukrainians will understand maybe 50% of Serbian-Bosnian-Croatian (essentially the same language). But they will understand maybe 80% of russian.
In fact the only words from Serbian that ukranains will understand are those that are the same as russian.

Refer to the answer above.

I wouldn't say a Ukrainian will understand 50% of what a Russian said. A Chinese may understand 50% of what a Japanese said if they had not learn the language, Russian and Ukrainian is not really that close.

thetutle said:
The ethnic minorities are irrelevant. We are comparing ethnic Russians to ethnic ukranians. Chechens or Chinese living in russia have nothing similar to Russians or Ukrainians, they are only there because they were conquered.

Well, Ukrainian is actually itself an ethnic minority in Russia.

It depends on how you define Russian. If you are talking about Rus (as in ethnic European) then yes, they are similar, but then it will be the same across Baltic, Finland and some Swede. If you are talking about Rossiyane (The Russian Identity) then no. Ukrainian is not in that category.

I don't think there were ever "Ethnic Russian" by the way, I mean it's either you considered yourself European or Russian. Its like people saying Han is Chinese (as most Chinese is Han), most Han will identify themselves as Chinese, they seldom identify themselves as Han or Ethnic Han....So if you are saying Ethnic Russian are the same or similar to Ethnic Ukrainian, well, you are basically coming down to White People are similar to White people....

Stranagor · Jan 9, 2023

Hassan Al-Somal said:
So it is not like Iranian and DPRK's weapons are not making difference; they're significantly shifting the ground to Russia's favor

Indeed, Russia has been increasingly dependent on Iranian and North Korean military support.

Hassan Al-Somal said:
China and India are huge countries, so trading them means Russia beats the Western-imposed sanctions.

Not necessarily because Russian trade is heavily resource -based and it has to make deep discounts because Indians and Chinese have the advantage of being two of the few buyers, hence they utilize this Russian weakness to their own advantage.

India and China are ruthless pragmatic countries.

It is called trade between inequals.

Stranagor · Jan 9, 2023

BHAN85 said:
I prefer Ukraine past before 2014 under Moscow rule, than current Ukraine under bombs. Maybe they were not rich, but they got their basic needs supplied, now they live in the fucking hell.

Looking at the developments on the ground, Ukrainian people overwhelmingly disagree with you.

By the same analogy, any war of independence is like living in hell. Revolutions and wars of independence tend to be not so nice. It's what it is.

BHAN85 said:
Nationalist identity can be exaggerated to unstabilize a country, and that is easy to do when the country has economic problems and the devil that unstabilizes come with fresh money.

You can apply the same analogy to all the independent Central Asian states which were under Soviet rule or current Balkan republics which were under Ottoman rule. Were they bad nationalism?

Without nationalist ideology, one cannot fight a war. Same for Syrian people who stood against all odds. I don't see it as an exaggeration, but people's own decision. If the Syrian people did not have that fighting in themselves, resigned to the idea of a country divided into three to avoid a bloodshed, no amount of Russian help would save them.

Or, if you really find the moniker too repulsive, you don't call it nationalism but patriotism.

Viet · Jan 9, 2023

BHAN85 said:
I prefer Ukraine past before 2014 under Moscow rule, than current Ukraine under bombs. Maybe they were not rich, but they got their basic needs supplied, now they live in the fucking hell.

Nationalist identity can be exagerated to unstabilize a country, and that is easy to do when the country has economic problems and the devil that unstabilizes come with fresh money.

There is a lot of common parallelisms between Ukraine/Russia problem and Catalonia/Spain problem (2017).
Both problems were used by the twisted Americans to unstabilize europe using dumbshit european slaves like EU and Germany.

Do you remember Barcelona terrorist attack in Las Ramblas August 17th 2017? It was the biggest terrorist attack in Spain since March 11st 2004 terrorist attack in Madrid, and it happened months after than the biggest terrorist attack in UK (Manchester) since July 7th 2005 terrorist attack in London.

Do you think it's a coincidence? When the Americans start their plans, things starts to blow up.

2004 Madrid train bombings - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

2017 Barcelona attacks - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

7 July 2005 London bombings - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Manchester Arena bombing - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

2017 Catalan independence referendum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

America and Europe can't have common interests in 2023, in a world with each time less energy and raw materials.
But dumbshit European rulers keep acting like if nothing of the previous things had happened in last years.

That’s worthless in using the judgments of others. Your opinion or Putin’s opinion is worthless. Ukraine is like a women that wants to leave an abusing husband. Every relationship is up and down, at some point enough is enough. why don’t let her go? Why start a war to kill her?

It’s Ukraine that self decides her fate, nobody else. About the conflict with Russia, Ukraine wants to join the EU that led to revolution because the gov refused to sign the treaty that’s in turn the reason why Putin starts the war in 2014.

Putin is like a man that rather wants to kill his former spouse than let her go with another man.

sammuel · Jan 9, 2023

Hassan Al-Somal said:
This is sad. Hopefully, there will be a peaceful end to this conflict. Very sad for the Ukrainians and Russians who are affected by this conflict.

War stinks.

It is no wonder that all the 3 religions tried to comfort people , by promising them that one day there will be no more wars.

People have freedom of choice, there is nothing stopping people from reaching this goal , even without some divine intervention. This is our duty as human beings.

May this be the last war.

~

Viet · Jan 9, 2023

Russia is determined to wage war against Ukraine at all costs. The goal is either extermination of Ukraine or if not possible occupy its territories as much as possible. Or secondary goal the annexed regions. Or as minimum goal the Donbas.

According to EU military staff, Russia suffers enormous casualties: 250,000 men. 60k to 65k death, the rest is wounded. 60 percent of all tanks, 40 percent of all amor vehicles were destroyed.

Ukraine-Perspektive für 2023: Russland wird weiter angreifen - ZDFheute

Russland wird im Donbass weiter angreifen, während es an den anderen Fronten verteidigt; Verluste lassen die russische Armee ausbluten.

amp.zdf.de

ZeGerman · Jan 9, 2023

Why European Democracies Are More Resilient Than Expected

As winter neared, many observers were concerned about the resilience of European democracies during Russia’s war against Ukraine. The triple pressures of economic downturn and inflation, energy crisi…

www.cfr.org

So i see support (financial/sanctions/military) from EU to continue well into 2023.
Gas storage remains high as well.

The latest move to donate Bradley/Marder/AMX-10 is a step up too. Hopefully to artillery in larger numbers and Leopard tanks.
The latter relies fully on the Germans. Who are overly passive on this matter (they have been consistently way to soft towards Putin. Assuming trade and concessions would avoid any confrontation, allowing themselves to be blackmailed due to gas dependency and stripping their military)

public support for weapons was a majority in germany for most of the year (historically considering how much of a tree-hugger germans became in that regard) but has dipped just below 50% again and we know how much of a whore for votes many Politicians can be.

Scholz however doesnt need to donate any tanks himself. Merely needs to “ok” Leopard tank for third party donation. poland, finland, spain are eager to hand over many dozens of tanks.

Vergennes · Jan 9, 2023

Hassan Al-Somal said:
That was a thermobaric attack, you bummer. Ukraine is only showing 2 holes. The attack was carried out with aleast 8 missile attacks. What happened to other missiles? That is the proof that the Ukrainians have something to hide.

The twitter profile was deleted after he found out how it spread throughout social media. Perhaps Ukrainian securities ordered him to take it down and he deleted his whole profile.

Do you even believe what you are writing ? :lol:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612121227971239936

Viet · Jan 9, 2023

ZeGerman said:
Why European Democracies Are More Resilient Than Expected

As winter neared, many observers were concerned about the resilience of European democracies during Russia’s war against Ukraine. The triple pressures of economic downturn and inflation, energy crisi…

www.cfr.org

So i see support (financial/sanctions/military) from EU to continue well into 2023.
Gas storage remains high as well.

The latest move to donate Bradley/Marder/AMX-10 is a step up too. Hopefully to artillery in larger numbers and Leopard tanks.
The latter relies fully on the Germans. Who are overly passive on this matter (they have been consistently way to soft towards Putin. Assuming trade and concessions would avoid any confrontation, allowing themselves to be blackmailed due to gas dependency and stripping their military)

public support for weapons was a majority in germany for most of the year (historically considering how much of a tree-hugger germans became in that regard) but has dipped just below 50% again and we know how much of a whore for votes many Politicians can be.

Scholz however doesnt need to donate any tanks himself. Merely needs to “ok” Leopard tank for third party donation. poland, finland, spain are eager to hand over many dozens of tanks.

Germany fears escalation but that fear is unfounded. It won’t be WW3 or WW4. its Putin. He alone decides to escalate or not. He is on madness trip. He goes all-out no matter Germany sends tanks or fighter jets. He sends parts of Russia’s 400,000 men national guard to the front. Those “Rosgwardija” is already suffering heavy losses. He will send more.

10 countries are ready to send leopards to Ukraine. Olaf Scholz just needs to say ok. Germany does not even need to send a single tank.