Russia to refurbish Il-78 refuelling tanker aircraft for Pakistan Air Force

[cloud4000]

Can a MRTT version of China's Y-20 work? I believe they have plans beyond pure transport for the aircraft.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Can a MRTT version of China's Y-20 work? I believe they have plans beyond pure transport for the aircraft.

Only for hose-and-drogue. Not sure if it is possible to attach a boom refueling probe aft of the aircraft considering that's the location of the cargo ramp. One would basically need to sacrifice cargo lift in order to refuel, or perhaps try fitting a boom probe to the wings (I've never seen that done before).

 

[razgriz19]

Ukraine inherited 21 Midas tankers from the Soviet Union, the entire Soviet tanker fleet was based in Ukraine

Ukraine never operated these tankers and they were kept in storage

They are in a bad shape because Ukraine only did minor work prior to delivery

Anyone seen the cock pit and avionics ?? They are still using gauges from 1970s very poor condition

The PAF tankers are so loud they aren't even allowed to land at many European airports, those engines need to go

So this refurb is well over due

I guess since we couldn't do it earlier because we didn't have good friendship with Russia

Even the electrics were ripped out and analog gauges were being used it was almost dangerous to fly the PAF Midas tanker fleet

This is actually great news

Just because the gauges are "analogue" doesn't mean its unsafe. Age of the parts and equipment doesn't mean anything in aviation unless the part has an expiry date or life limit, in that case it would be swapped out.
Have you seen the B-52 cockpit? It is full of those 60s analogue gauges.

Engines on the other hand should be replaced. They're not efficient and pose many restrictions like you said. However i don't think they will be replaced. This "overhaul" is basically like a D-check. Aircraft would be stripped to bare metal, inspected and things that needs to be replaced will be replaced, but in the end it will have it's original engines.

 

[The Diplomat]

4 are not enough, they are not just tankers they are also cargo transport planes (MRTT), all 4 can not be available all the time, it is also important what is their availability ratio.

My friend, we also have C130's for cargo. Yes the C130's can't hold as much as a IL78 but I think the C130's alone do meet the PAF requirements?
I'm not too sure my self.

 

[khanasifm]

I think main purpose of il78 was to help avoid ferrying JF 17 and other such program such as spade 2000, mi 17, ly80 etc acquisitions related cost which initially were payed to
Antonov refueling was a plus point
How many mirages were upgraded less then 10 to just introduce ata refueling

JF will benefit though

Finally from 1 transport Sqn you went to 3 for small af that is what can be afforded

 

[DesiWarrior]

I'd try buying 2-3 used Airbus A330s and finding companies with experience sourcing and integrating boom and hose-and-drogue refueling technology. It will be a custom solution, but probably much cheaper than an off-the-shelf Airbus A330 MRTT.

Loved this idea

This is a expensive solution using A330

Also adding tanker for F16 will add significant strain on maintenance and overhaul, keeping a F16 in the air for long periods of time in the long term is probably not what PAF wants to excercise it a point we miss

Ukraine still have surplus Midas tankers PLAAF is getting 3 units, they also have IL-76 for cargo use which can be converted to tankers

KC-135 and A330 as well as A310 which is operated by PIA have long been explored and came to no fruitful conclusion my guess is again the cost

I don't think keeping an aircraft flying for long time puts much strain on the aircraft structurally, it's the actual number of take offs and landings as well as the payload that's carried in a mission that has real effect on aircraft.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Are there any newer platforms that can serve as a Mid Air refueler ? Even slighly smaller size but newer platform from China / Russia / Germany etc

 

[Basel]

My friend, we also have C130's for cargo. Yes the C130's can't hold as much as a IL78 but I think the C130's alone do meet the PAF requirements?
I'm not too sure my self.

Google how excessively IL-78 are used for cargo. There is a reason for that.

 

[khanasifm]

https://www.defensenews.com/global/...re-wants-to-dump-its-four-old-boeing-tankers/

 

[aziqbal]

Ever heard one of these take off?

Definitely need new engines

European airports don’t even accept this

 

[MIRauf]

If US approves it, those KC-135 would be great for PAF to fly within Pakistan or up to M.E. / Turkey.

Use to Live close to Topeka KS, home of the 190th Air Refueling Wing, noise is tolerable.

 

[xyxmt]

Now soon Russia will call India and tell them there will be no refurbishment for Pakistan.

 

[TsAr]

When did we say that ??? And its too furnishing an old plane.. While a Russian minister is coming to India for deal about stealth jets

You mean SU-57, the same stealth jets which a year back according to IAF were not stealth enough and not upto the IAF standards.

 

[araz]

I think main purpose of il78 was to help avoid ferrying JF 17 and other such program such as spade 2000, mi 17, ly80 etc acquisitions related cost which initially were payed to
Antonov refueling was a plus point
How many mirages were upgraded less then 10 to just introduce ata refueling

JF will benefit though

Finally from 1 transport Sqn you went to 3 for small af that is what can be afforded

I thought more than 30 M3/5s were updated with A2AR. Please clarify.
Regards
A

Ukraine inherited 21 Midas tankers from the Soviet Union, the entire Soviet tanker fleet was based in Ukraine

Ukraine never operated these tankers and they were kept in storage

They are in a bad shape because Ukraine only did minor work prior to delivery

Anyone seen the cock pit and avionics ?? They are still using gauges from 1970s very poor condition

The PAF tankers are so loud they aren't even allowed to land at many European airports, those engines need to go

So this refurb is well over due

I guess since we couldn't do it earlier because we didn't have good friendship with Russia

Even the electrics were ripped out and analog gauges were being used it was almost dangerous to fly the PAF Midas tanker fleet

This is actually great news

It is a silly question but I have always wondered whether we can mate the AL56?engines of the C130s with the Iliyushins. The advantages would be tremendous. The answer is probably NO but I just had to ask.
A

 

[araz]

https://www.defensenews.com/global/...re-wants-to-dump-its-four-old-boeing-tankers/

Two key points here.
A Needs approval from US prior to disposal. Why do you think US will give approval when it has previously refused our request.
B. Not used since last June??Problems with spares? What does this entail with regards to revamping them?
A

I'd try buying 2-3 used Airbus A330s and finding companies with experience sourcing and integrating boom and hose-and-drogue refueling technology. It will be a custom solution, but probably much cheaper than an off-the-shelf Airbus A330 MRTT.

An attempt for such has been made. The price quoted was exhorbitant. Source @Bilalkhan777. Secondly do we really need these for 45 of our 3osomething year old fighters which will never be used for aggressive encroachment into Indian territory. 27/2 has taught us that 16s can only be used for inland defence. So how much do we want to spend on these fighters and what is the cost to benefit ratio? I agree that the idea is good but what utility will it have.?
A