Russia snubs India, postpones defence minister's visit to New Delhi

[SpArK]

Russia is not going to reduce its diplomatic interaction or influence in India. Why would it. It may emanate from India as India would increasingly lean towards US and the west. At a certain stage the Russians may be seeking Indian support at international fora, and like Iran, India may not be in a position to out-rightly extend its support to Russia as it used to, due to American and western concerns.

Also, the major economic interaction between India and Russia is arms sales. What about trade. How much is it and how much it may increase.

It indeed would be interesting emerging environment.

Good PoSt.

And regarding the trade, there has been massive transformation in the approach. The usual space & defence cooperation have been periodically taken over by the Indian-Russian partnership in energy, high technology, steel production, production of oil and gas and the aerospace industries.

Even local governments have started to deal directly with Russia.

Trade is expected to double to $15 billion this year from the trade volume of $7.5 billion five years ago.( Almost double).

Also the trade with former soviet or CIS Countries are expected to touch 30 Billion.




Sources:

Gujarat delegation visits Russia to promote trade | Russia & India Report

Russia-India trade to double in 3 years | Russia & India Report

India-CIS Countries trade may touch $30 bn by 2020

Indo-Russian Inter-Governmental Commission to meet in mid-October | Russia & India Report

 

[帅的一匹]

India cant buy all the manufacturing output of Russia, business is business. The delay of visit tell India to shut up. Unless you could build up your own defense industry, you will kept frustrated. Money can't buy dignity.

 

[Gessler]

India cant buy all the manufacturing output of Russia, business is business. The delay of visit tell India to shut up. Unless you could build up your own defense industry, you will kept frustrated. Money can't buy dignity.

Or maybe you should just shut up your wet dreams.

Do you THINK Russians are fools to run after a few millions, FORSAKING billions ?? Im pretty sure
we can get what we want outta them FOR AS LONG AS our own industry isn't capable of feeding
our war machine. And besides, we have FRANCE and USA as well ready to give us what we want.

So stop dreaming and start supplying quality firebricks instead.

 

[arp2041]

I never said that Russians would stop selling weaponry to India.

What I said was that in due course they would also start selling good stuff to Pakistan.

And this has happened due to weakening Indian geopolitical clout.

India may get richer and richer - however, this may not make a big difference in her geopolitical strength.

I am reading this BS argument of yours that India is losing geopolitical strength since yesterday, i want to give u some points that will prove otherwise:

1. India got an NSG waiver in 2008 by the 45 member grouping to conduct civilian nuclear trade without signing NPT. There are around 200 countries in this world & this was the exception only made to India, & the country which was lobbying for India waiver was none other than only superpower of the world - US.

2. There is a grouping formed called G-4 (Germany, Japan, India, Brazil) which demands permanent seat in UNSC, India is the only country that have got 4 of the P-5 countries on it's side (US, UK, France, Russia) & even China will not veto if any vote to include India in UNSC comes. So it's not the question of "If" anymore but "When" will India be in UNSC (bad news for ur Kashmir cause ).

3. There is talk going on for including India in 4 groupings of nuclear non-proliferation (MTCR, NSG, Australia Group and Wassenaar Arrangement) & again the lobbying country is the US, so in some years u will see India in these top non-proliferation groupings, even without signing any conditional aggrements like NPT, etc. (do i have to reiterate that India will again be the only country to get it's way??).

4. How many country can get a top class SSN from an ex-superpower?? AGAIN INDIA IS THE ONLY ONE, just wait before we include another Akula sub in our fleet.

5. India is one of the few country's in this world that have good relations with both traditional competitors/rivals - Iran- Israel, Israel-Palestine, Russia-US, etc.

6. How many country's can buy top class weapons from nearly all top class weapons suppliers like Israel, US, UK, Russia, France, etc (before we were buying only from USSR). Again we don't have to get weapons at any conditions which many of our neighbors get

IS INDIA STILL LOSING GEO-POLITICAL, GEO-ECONOMIC OR ANY OTHER GEO U WANT TO SAY CLOUT???

 

[Ticker]

It's good in theory. Perfect.
Now lets calculate
1. Will Afgan people and the Pak tribles that fought with Soviat Union gona like that ???
2. Is Pak ready to fight with all those^^^. It will be repeating something US did.
3. More over will China like Russian dominance in the region where she is doing every thing to become No1 ???
4. Russian entry in warm waters will be counter check to US. So is Pak prepared to mess with US in current political and economic conditions ??? Russia can't help Pak economically; China can but still now china has kept it to minimum.

The people who fought against Russians with overwhelming American support are now fighting the same Americans who were their friends earlier. Nothing remains the same forever.

Russia took its time to go over the defeat that it suffered in Afghanistan due to Pakistani and Afghan support. Yet, it has moved on and the emerging geopolitical and geo-strategic environment have forced her to. This has been a gradual shift but it was sure footed.

Russia is cooperating with China like it never did before. It didn't allow oil and gas pipelines from Russia into China earlier, now two have been laid and more are in the offing.

If the Russian and Chinese use of the strategic trade zone offered by Pakistan are not militarily intrusive to Americans, which probably wouldn't, Americans may not intrusively attempt to deny such usage.

Asia is the economic power house of the future and Pakistan sits on the interactive trade zone and cross roads to three of world's biggest powers. If Pakistani government is able to handle this appropriately, it would be good for all. If India needs to use this trade zone, either it goes through Iran, which the west and Americans don't want or India will have to improve her relationship with both Pakistan and China.

 

[Ticker]

Agree to disagree? I simply can't be bothered to keep banging my head against a brick wall. Somehow, against all logica and rationale, you have come to the conclusion that the richer and more prosperous India gets the weaker it will get despite no evidence to support this absurd claim. I'm sorry but this is the height of idiocy, if I say Pakistan will be a superpower in 2015 does that make it so? NO! But you can't seem to understand you need reason and FACTS to back up your hypothesis. I'm done.


I think $50 BN USD is something resembling leverage,no? And India can complain as much as they like about the VIKRAMDITYA-once again the Russians have failed to uphold their end of the bargin they can't be upset when someone points this out. And anyway Indian media has been slating the Viky deal for years why shoul th emost recent outbursts be any different?

Please understand that geo-economics as a leverage can only influence upto a particular stage.

Pakistan does not want to become a super power. It is not indeed working to become one. So this example is not the right one.

Would you sell Indian Occupied Kashmir to Pakistan for some hundred billion dollars. I am sure no would be the answer.

Money can buy some things but it can't buy everything. Not the national interests.

 

[帅的一匹]

India cant buy all the manufacturing output of Russia, business is business. The delay of visit tell India to shut up. Unless you could build up your own defense industry, you will kept frustrated. Money can't buy dignity.

Or maybe you should just shut up your wet dreams.

Do you THINK Russians are fools to run after a few millions, FORSAKING billions ?? Im pretty sure
we can get what we want outta them FOR AS LONG AS our own industry isn't capable of feeding
our war machine. And besides, we have FRANCE and USA as well ready to give us what we want.

So stop dreaming and start supplying quality firebricks instead.

Your industry will never able to feed your defense as long as you buy more and more. We will see.....
As to firebricks, whatever you happily to say.

 

[Sergi]

The people who fought against Russians with overwhelming American support are now fighting the same Americans who were their friends earlier. Nothing remains the same forever.

Russia took its time to go over the defeat that it suffered in Afghanistan due to Pakistani and Afghan support. Yet, it has moved on and the emerging geopolitical and geo-strategic environment have forced her to. This has been a gradual shift but it was sure footed.

Russia is cooperating with China like it never did before. It didn't allow oil and gas pipelines from Russia into China earlier, now two have been laid and more are in the offing.

If the Russian and Chinese use of the strategic trade zone offered by Pakistan are not militarily intrusive to Americans, which probably wouldn't, Americans may not intrusively attempt to deny such usage.

Asia is the economic power house of the future and Pakistan sits on the interactive trade zone and cross roads to three of world's biggest powers. If Pakistani government is able to handle this appropriately, it would be good for all. If India needs to use this trade zone, either it goes through Iran, which the west and Americans don't want or India will have to improve her relationship with both Pakistan and China.

1. Yes. They don't want USA/Russia/Pak there. They want all out

2. Ok. You keep the track of that. And tell us whenever it happen.

3. Russia is on the same page of China which say "No US" and after that you can see Russia clearly show dustbin to Chinese warnning in SCS. You call it cooperating ??? Russia is selling its anti-ship and anti air batteries in SCS surroundings. Is it cooperating ??? Mark my words Russia will return favour to china the moment it can. Russians will never forget fall of USSR.

4 Russia and china will be together only for US opposition in their area of interests. Nothing more. China will NOT like Russian influence in Pak at any cost.

5. Only valid sense in your argument is Pakistan's geographical location. But hey you know how US made the Loosing Party win in Afganistan. There are more than two separatist movement running in Pak. Closeness with Russia means direct enmity with US. And CIA has created good link and network inside Pak in last 10 years ( OBL hunt was outcome of that ) so it won't be too difficult to feed one of such separatist from Afgan territory. If geographical location of Pak can lead to balkanisation with efferts from external forces. And something like that happen then US will snap on your nukes saying the danger to humanity. It will take out your last line of defence against India. And if India regains the rest of JK , we got a road root to Afagan

Your industry will never able to feed your defense as long as you buy more and more. We will see.....
As to firebricks, whatever you happily to say.

Do you even know WHO BUY THE FIRE BRICKS ???

 

[帅的一匹]

I am reading this BS argument of yours that India is losing geopolitical strength since yesterday, i want to give u some points that will prove otherwise:

1. India got an NSG waiver in 2008 by the 45 member grouping to conduct civilian nuclear trade without signing NPT. There are around 200 countries in this world & this was the exception only made to India, & the country which was lobbying for India waiver was none other than only superpower of the world - US.

2. There is a grouping formed called G-4 (Germany, Japan, India, Brazil) which demands permanent seat in UNSC, India is the only country that have got 4 of the P-5 countries on it's side (US, UK, France, Russia) & even China will not veto if any vote to include India in UNSC comes. So it's not the question of "If" anymore but "When" will India be in UNSC (bad news for ur Kashmir cause ).

3. There is talk going on for including India in 4 groupings of nuclear non-proliferation (MTCR, NSG, Australia Group and Wassenaar Arrangement) & again the lobbying country is the US, so in some years u will see India in these top non-proliferation groupings, even without signing any conditional aggrements like NPT, etc. (do i have to reiterate that India will again be the only country to get it's way??).

4. How many country can get a top class SSN from an ex-superpower?? AGAIN INDIA IS THE ONLY ONE, just wait before we include another Akula sub in our fleet.

5. India is one of the few country's in this world that have good relations with both traditional competitors/rivals - Iran- Israel, Israel-Palestine, Russia-US, etc.

6. How many country's can buy top class weapons from nearly all top class weapons suppliers like Israel, US, UK, Russia, France, etc (before we were buying only from USSR). Again we don't have to get weapons at any conditions which many of our neighbors get

IS INDIA STILL LOSING GEO-POLITICAL, GEO-ECONOMIC OR ANY OTHER GEO U WANT TO SAY CLOUT???

no one could pay balance between top regimes, you are Playing fires. If India think UN permanent seat will secure your strategic advantage against Pakistan, you are not entitled at all.

I am reading this BS argument of yours that India is losing geopolitical strength since yesterday, i want to give u some points that will prove otherwise:

1. India got an NSG waiver in 2008 by the 45 member grouping to conduct civilian nuclear trade without signing NPT. There are around 200 countries in this world & this was the exception only made to India, & the country which was lobbying for India waiver was none other than only superpower of the world - US.

2. There is a grouping formed called G-4 (Germany, Japan, India, Brazil) which demands permanent seat in UNSC, India is the only country that have got 4 of the P-5 countries on it's side (US, UK, France, Russia) & even China will not veto if any vote to include India in UNSC comes. So it's not the question of "If" anymore but "When" will India be in UNSC (bad news for ur Kashmir cause ).

3. There is talk going on for including India in 4 groupings of nuclear non-proliferation (MTCR, NSG, Australia Group and Wassenaar Arrangement) & again the lobbying country is the US, so in some years u will see India in these top non-proliferation groupings, even without signing any conditional aggrements like NPT, etc. (do i have to reiterate that India will again be the only country to get it's way??).

4. How many country can get a top class SSN from an ex-superpower?? AGAIN INDIA IS THE ONLY ONE, just wait before we include another Akula sub in our fleet.

5. India is one of the few country's in this world that have good relations with both traditional competitors/rivals - Iran- Israel, Israel-Palestine, Russia-US, etc.

6. How many country's can buy top class weapons from nearly all top class weapons suppliers like Israel, US, UK, Russia, France, etc (before we were buying only from USSR). Again we don't have to get weapons at any conditions which many of our neighbors get

IS INDIA STILL LOSING GEO-POLITICAL, GEO-ECONOMIC OR ANY OTHER GEO U WANT TO SAY CLOUT???

no one could pay balance between top regimes, you are Playing fires. If India think UN permanent seat will secure your strategic advantage against Pakistan, you are not entitled at all.

 

[Ticker]

I am reading this BS argument of yours that India is losing geopolitical strength since yesterday, i want to give u some points that will prove otherwise:

1. India got an NSG waiver in 2008 by the 45 member grouping to conduct civilian nuclear trade without signing NPT. There are around 200 countries in this world & this was the exception only made to India, & the country which was lobbying for India waiver was none other than only superpower of the world - US.

Primarily due to US interest. Lets see how long does it last if you do not acquiesce to Americans concerns with regard to China. Can you do it on you own clout.

2. There is a grouping formed called G-4 (Germany, Japan, India, Brazil) which demands permanent seat in UNSC, India is the only country that have got 4 of the P-5 countries on it's side (US, UK, France, Russia) & even China will not veto if any vote to include India in UNSC comes. So it's not the question of "If" anymore but "When" will India be in UNSC (bad news for ur Kashmir cause ).

You trash UN resolutions and expect to become a member of UNSC. Lets see if it happens in the manner you desire it.

3. There is talk going on for including India in 4 groupings of nuclear non-proliferation (MTCR, NSG, Australia Group and Wassenaar Arrangement) & again the lobbying country is the US, so in some years u will see India in these top non-proliferation groupings, even without signing any conditional aggrements like NPT, etc. (do i have to reiterate that India will again be the only country to get it's way??).

Like I said before, it is US interest and not your capability. Deny the US what they are asking you with regard to China and see where you stand.

4. How many country can get a top class SSN from an ex-superpower?? AGAIN INDIA IS THE ONLY ONE, just wait before we include another Akula sub in our fleet.

No big deal. Pakistan may get it sooner than you may think. The what.

5. India is one of the few country's in this world that have good relations with both traditional competitors/rivals - Iran- Israel, Israel-Palestine, Russia-US, etc.

6. How many country's can buy top class weapons from nearly all top class weapons suppliers like Israel, US, UK, Russia, France, etc (before we were buying only from USSR). Again we don't have to get weapons at any conditions which many of our neighbors get

IS INDIA STILL LOSING GEO-POLITICAL, GEO-ECONOMIC OR ANY OTHER GEO U WANT TO SAY CLOUT???

Yes I still do feel that your geo-political prowess is weak. You are more likely to become a usable commodity for the US and west and you do not have any other place to go to.

 

[Windjammer]

India may be a big market for Russian armaments, but the Russian defence industry is not exactly selling through the roof.
OTOH, India may have good relations with the Arab/Muslim world, it's military doesn't enjoy the same interaction or influence as do the Pakistan armed forces. Albeit, an old story but back in the late 60s, the Pakistani order for Mirages did same to Marcel Dassault as what Bill Gates did to Microsoft as almost every Arab country ended up purchasing Mirage fighters. A lot of countries are feeling nervous with the Americans and as China is filling the vacuum, i am sure Russia also sees the potential and to get to the warm Arabian waters, it has to go through Pakistan.

 

[ajtr]

Anday footay nahi aur sab choozay ginana shuru kar dete hain..........

(People start counting chickens even before eggs are hatched)


Geopolitics aur realpolitics ka mila ke achar daal diya..................

 

[JayAtl]

Did anyone read the link from OP?

It's a novice guys blog

QUOTE: " The blog seeks to romanticise the forces. Far away from the jargon of defence, the blog would decode the big happenings in the field in layman's terms."

Now they took a news piece about Russia delaying the visit to finalize some concrete details about some military issues to - they did it because of Pakistan! you guys spent so many pages debating a blogger's fantasy

 

[illusion8]

I think Pakistan is over reaching itself and trying to have a say in a big boys club and the willingness to be played around like a pawn for titbits - the day they realize that will be the day they will forego of most of their troubles and start to rectify whatever's left of their country. The desperation to be aligned with a big power is what drives them into all the troubles. The constant jumping into camps and trying to group up with bigger powers to maintain some sort of parity with India will be unsuccessful now and also in the future. Pakistan has very little to offer as far as any geo political leverage is concerned.
Their only usefulness starts and ends with being a gateway to Afghanistan, Russia and China any day are more closer to Middle Eastern countries than what Pakistan can offer them.
I don't see much of a bright future and it would be fun watching the stupidity on play.

There is a sure shot conflict zone and that is when Pakistan supported Taliban carry out attacks against Russian interests inside Afghanistan. Russia will not look the other way as how the US has been doing for a while now.

 

[SamantK]

Primarily due to US interest. Lets see how long does it last if you do not acquiesce to Americans concerns with regard to China. Can you do it on you own clout.

Interest due to opportunity, opportunity helped by the economy of India. NSG waiver does not have **** to with China.

You trash UN resolutions and expect to become a member of UNSC. Lets see if it happens in the manner you desire it.

Which resolutions are you talking about? If it is regarding Kashmir, I think it is Pakistan which is the culprit, check threads on that topic.

Like I said before, it is US interest and not your capability. Deny the US what they are asking you with regard to China and see where you stand.

Read the first response.

No big deal. Pakistan may get it sooner than you may think. The what.

Focus on the bold letters as a response to India and a way for China to get back at India.. its not due to Pakistan's diplomacy unlike India.

Yes I still do feel that your geo-political prowess is weak. You are more likely to become a usable commodity for the US and west and you do not have any other place to go to.

Its just a feeling mate, dont mind but it does not amount to S**T