Russia can't find a better ally than Pakistan in the region.

[illusion8]

Russians will be keen to have a look in to Afghanistan post NATO withdrawal, the current imbroglio in Ukraine will fuel that even further.

One needs to wait and see how the Russians approach Pakistan and the taliban on one end and the present Afghan regime, Iran, India on the other.

 

[Chak Bamu]

Very smart. My post was removed and the thread moved to Seniors cafe.

Never mind. The Russian members read my post and Russians are already aware of Pakistani support to Chechen terror groups. My question was whether it could affect the relations or not.

So you are saying that you deliberately made a post to ensure that Russian readers think of Chechnya while a discussion of ways and means to improve ties between Pakistan and Russia is going on?

If any Russian members are dumb enough to take such a bait, then let them follow your lead.

Indian Don Quixote, you are on a fairly dumb crusade. When will you realize that you are charging at windmills for no good reason?

 

[Gandhi G in da house]

So you are saying that you deliberately made a post to ensure that Russian readers think of Chechnya while a discussion of ways and means to improve ties between Pakistan and Russia is going on?

If any Russian members are dumb enough to take such a bait, then let them follow your lead.

Indian Don Quixote, you are on a fairly dumb crusade. When will you realize that you are charging at windmills for no good reason?

So you want the debate to go in a particular fairy tale direction that you wish to see it go ? There are issues in the Pak-Russia relationship which I mentioned and only wanted to know from the Russian members as to how much they could be a hindrance. Irfan Baloch too mentioned the Chechnya angle in his post.

Only because I am an Indian who mentioned the Chechnya angle my post was deleted. That's wrong and you know it. One Russian member thanked my post. The person who deleted my post did not have the patience or inclination to know what the Russians thought about it. It wasn't off-topic or against forum rules. There was no reason to delete it. Anyway, your forum your ways.

 

[Chak Bamu]

So you want the debate to go in a particular fairy tale direction that you wish to see it go ? There are issues in the Pak-Russia relationship which I mentioned and only wanted to know from the Russian members as to how much they could be a hindrance. Irfan Baloch too mentioned the Chechnya angle in his post.

Only because I am an Indian who mentioned the Chechnya angle my post was deleted. That's wrong and you know it. One Russian member thanked my post. The person who deleted my post did not have the patience or inclination to know what the Russians thought about it. It wasn't off-topic or against forum rules. There was no reason to delete it. Anyway, your forum your ways.

Don Quixote is not a fairy tale. It is a tale of hopelessly outdated idea running amok in an idealist's mind. The parallel with you is obvious. Your idea is hopelessly outdated. You thrive on enmity. Geostrategic movements have gone past your mind-set.

Do you not realize that any positive interaction between Russia and Pakistan is bound to benefit India, since there is a certain degree of convergence in Russian and Indian views? Do you not realize that there is positive momentum in relations between India and Pakistan and that people with views like yours are gradually loosing relevance? I doubt you see things that way, and hence a very appropriate epithet of Don Quixote for you.

@Irfan Baloch can say whatever he wants. That has no bearing upon my views. He wrote as though Syria is full to bursting with Chechens. That is of course not the case.

Chechnya was independent for a while and in those days no one could be certain if Russian federation could survive. I recall very well Berzinsky (spelling?) saying in 1996 that with Chechen success, Russia would be finished. This article noted the importance and impact of that temporary success of Chechens and how Russians took care to neutralize it. I do not know to what extent was there ever any support for Chechen cause from GOP. But now, after so many years it would be madness to think that GOP would have any interest in supporting a lost cause, especailly since Chechnya has a degree of autonomy and the current Governor is well in control and loyal to Russian federation.

Anyone who deliberately trolls in Senior section by setting bait should have their post deleted. I see no problem with that. As far as I am concerned, you, @acid rain and others of your mind-set can go and cry a river about your failed efforts at trolling.

 

[Gandhi G in da house]

Don Quixote is not a fairy tale. It is a tale of hopelessly outdated idea running amok in an idealist's mind. The parallel with you is obvious. Your idea is hopelessly outdated. You thrive on enmity. Geostrategic movements have gone past your mind-set.

Do you not realize that any positive interaction between Russia and Pakistan is bound to benefit India, since there is a certain degree of convergence in Russian and Indian views? Do you not realize that there is positive momentum in relations between India and Pakistan and that people with views like yours are gradually loosing relevance? I doubt you see things that way, and hence a very appropriate epithet of Don Quixote for you.

@Irfan Baloch can say whatever he wants. That has no bearing upon my views. He wrote as though Syria is full to bursting with Chechens. That is of course not the case.

Chechnya was independent for a while and in those days no one could be certain if Russian federation could survive. I recall very well Berzinsky (spelling?) saying in 1996 that with Chechen success, Russia would be finished. This article noted the importance and impact of that temporary success of Chechens and how Russians took care to neutralize it. I do not know to what extent was there ever any support for Chechen cause from GOP. But now, after so many years it would be madness to think that GOP would have any interest in supporting a lost cause, especailly since Chechnya has a degree of autonomy and the current Governor is well in control and loyal to Russian federation.

Anyone who deliberately trolls in Senior section by setting bait should have their post deleted. I see no problem with that. As far as I am concerned, you, @acid rain and others of your mind-set can go and cry a river about your failed efforts at trolling.

My post was directed to two Russian members whose views I wanted to know on the issue of alleged Pakistan support to Chechen terror groups. One of them thanked my post and may be the other saw it as well. I wanted to elicit their response. They may have stated that it's somehting that Russia and Pakistan can work around ? They may have stated that it doesn't matter ? Why so scared when somebody brings in the Chechen angle ? Russians may have given a favourable response.

You have failed to prove yet again how that post was meant for trolling because you can't. Calling everybody who you don't agree with a troll is not going to help at all.

Anyway, I rest my case. It's your forum, you have every right to steer the discussion in any direction that you wish to.

 

[Chak Bamu]

roads, pipelines and other trade is too far fetched and can only happen once there is stability in Pakistan and a government that doesnt look up to KSA or USA to make its next move. with PMLn such initiate is out of question which has in quick succession not only put a spanner into Gawader progress but also cancelled gas agreement with Iran and decided to follow the directive of KSA to arm and support the FSA terrorists in Syria.

Speculations. We will see how it turns out. I would suggest that you tone down your rhetoric a little bit. Your anti-democratic feelings are too evident. I see no spanner in Gawadar progress (It necessarily will be slower than we would like), IP will be built when the price is right, and we will see how GoP and our army would succeed in supporting FSA if they try at all.

with the kind of taliban appeasers and supporter parties in government, any such alliance or cooperation with Russia is impossible and what Putin can do is send a very clear message to the Taliban friendly government of Pakistan that if it follows the directive of Saudis to arm the Chechen rebels that it will have to face the direct response from Russian forces.

There are no Taliban appeasers in government. This is another figment of your imagination and a clue to your dislike for GoP as it is today. Before you begin to type a response here, please have some figures handy as to how many Chechens are supporting Syrian rebels, particularly FSA. Then we may discuss relevance to this thread.

I am not really keen on exchanging scholars and clerics because Pakistani Islam is infested with radicalised & violent version of Taqfiri Wahabism and it will only cause problems for Russia and instead of helping it will degrade our relations.

Yes there are Takfiri groups in Pakistan, but how relevant are they? Can you tell anything about numbers and percentages? While you are at it, you may wish to consider the fact that majority of Pakistanis Muslims are more aligned with Sufism and not with fringe Takfiri groups. When you use words like 'infested' you really are deliberately sending a misleading signal. Do you think that the writer lives in space and not Pakistan? Do you think that he would make a suggestion in jest? You do presume to know more than him. Why?

Why would any Government level contacts have anything to do with fringe Takfiri groups? If ever, can the government not send Brelvi ulema who would be better able to interact with Russian Muslims because of shared Sufi background? Where is Takfir in that? What would be its relevance? Why would anyone in their right minds engage Takfiris for building trust?

Clearly you have certain set views and wish to bulldoze them over important distinctions and nuances.

on the other hand, if by any chance or luck a pro Pakistan government comes to power in the near future which levels the terrorist breeding grounds like Lal Masjid and executes the mass killers, controls the talibanized media and judiciary .. then there is a chance that Pakistan can contribute positively.

The present government is an elected government that came into being after valid and constitutional process. You may criticize it all you want, but better go easy on the 'pro-Pakistan' bit. The last 'pro-Pakistan' government that you liked very much left us a bloody (literally), corrupt, dispensation with help of NRO. If ever again such a 'pro-Pakistan' government came again, Pakistan might not survive it.

 

[sancho]

Am I the only one that things that the article is rather poor and one sided? The author is trying to create joints by linking Pakistan and the Russian muslims, only based on the religion as a common factor. But neither are the Russian muslims in power, nor would have the need to deepen ties to Pakistan only because of the religion. Russia has good ties to other muslim countries and India not to forget has one of the biggest muslim population in the world, so for Russian muslims it would be far more logical to deepen ties with these countries, rather than creating new ties with Pakistan. Be it in economic, strategic or defence interests, these countries offer far more prospect for Russia, even when it comes to intel against terrorists.
And no offence, but making Pakistan to a key to stability in the region is rather strange if we are honest isn't it? I wouldn't mind if Russia can help to increase stability in Pakistan, or between Pakistan and India, but don't see how Pakistan would be a big advantage for Russia. Infact with the recent incedents and Pakistan being a NATO ally, it is more likely that Russia will cautious to deal with NATO partners and stick to more (from Russian point of view) trustable partners like China, Iran and India of course.

 

[VCheng]

What is quite interesting, and indeed telling, in threads and news stories of this sort is the commonality of Pakistani sources trying to make their pitch to country A, B or C that improving co-operation in Sector X, Y, or Z would be mutually beneficial on a grand scale, but such overtures are almost never matched by any action from the other side, except a few diplomatic words and statements, or may be an MoU or two.

Big deal? Nope.

 

[Sergi]

Russian cant find a better ally than Pakistan in the region ???
Isn't it other way around

Relations today are driven by Economics and Strategic interests.

So why would Russians need Pakistan ???
- Old theory access to hot water thorough Afgan -Pak .
- new theory Islamic country with A-Bomb to pursue other Islamic nations to camp Russia. Point being which Islamic country is currently against Russia ??? Turks n Saudis anybody-else worth mentioning ???

So why would Russians would not need Pakistan as Ally ???
- Potentially unstable country.
- No business opportunities
- Chances of losing Indian business and market.
- Potentially pushing a ally like India away for a country which remained a US proxy for decades ......
- to enter muslim world Russia didn't need Pakistan. Recent Russian firm stand on Syria has shown countries that Russia will stand by you in Problems wether it suits them or not.
- I personally think Pakistan is thinking a lot too much of itself. If any country worth making friendship right now to counter US is not China or not Pakistan. Its Iran. And they already have good relations.
- Any country Muslim or not will welcome Russian help if they are not in good terms with USA. You don't need a Pakistani liaison for that.
- Apparently Afgan-Iran is also a way to hot waters.


So its more of a Pakistani need than a Russian one. I don't see why would Putin invest in that.

 

[Screambowl]

I think, Russia has already found an ally, which is Iran. The presence of CIA is much more in Pakistan than in Iran. To have a top strategic relations with Pakistan, it will take Russia more than a decade if you start today. Russia would not take this risk.

 

[airmarshal]

Pakistan has to have stability inside and some economic growth to attract new alliances. Its geographical location will else be used by any power of its time with interests in the region and its location. This has been happening to our country for the last 65 years.

Pakistan must at the same time proactively engage with Russia. Its a major power of the region and in fact the world.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

Russia and pakistan would be a very difficult marriage----next to impossible. And the u s won't let go off that easy if common sense in the u s prevails---but more often the americans act stupid when it comes to relationship with pakistan---retaliate now and then try to mend fences if need be. this is how americans are---.

 

[Asian.Century]

Published in Pakistan Army's magazine 'HILAL'.​

Indeed, great article...Pakistan by its location and its Military strength, indeed Russia cannot find a better ally than Pakistan.