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Russia blocks sale of engines for Sino-Pak fighter jets

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Even Putin hasen't said the Pak-Fa is equal to F22 yet. The Pak-fa has some 5th gen technology but it has a long way to go in avionics and producing new 5th gen engines to really be considered in the same league as the f-22.

As for the LCA well the clue is in the name (light combat aircraft) which is single engine and a replacement for the mig21's.
omg... we have been missing you! where have you been hiding all the time? enjoy your staty.
Though i can support my statement with links but forget it, if you were interested you would have tried it once reconfirming it over google.
 
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strangly 2 indian guys are dragging chinese and their "planes" in this thread for some unknown reason maybe on retard therapy.
I'm not dragging in chinese planes. I'm stating any assumptions that JF 17 will seriously dent russian standing in the fighter business is too premature. The ruskies are way too strong in this field.
 
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omg... we have been missing you! where have you been hiding all the time? enjoy your staty.
Though i can support my statement with links but forget it, if you were interested you would have tried it once reconfirming it over google.


I dont understand what u mean your english is poor, u want me to provide u evidence that putin said Pak-fa is not 5th gen yet?

if thats wt u want just ask me ill be happy to post
 
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Off topic i just joined this forum now i like the way its been designed i checked out bharat raksha (indian equil) too but i liked the layout of this site, so hats off to the web design crew.
 
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Russia, China to design, build heavy-lift helicopter | Defense | RIA Novosti

"(Russian Dept. Industry&Trade Minister) MANTUROV ALSO SAID RUSSIA AND CHINA WOULD COOPERATE IN MANUFACTURING AIRCRAFT ENGINES."

Isn't this an interesting development. I really am sick and tired of all the indians and their propaganda on this forum - if you read through this thread, look at their demeanor in the earlier pages. It's getting really tiresome because this happens every single time, everytime anything from "very reliable" UNNAMEDsources talk about denying french avionics or anything that could possibly be construed and twisted to be shown REMOTELY undermining the JFT project or anything else in Pakistan's favor, they jump all over it like monkeys going into heat.

So it looks like the engine deal is still on. They don't mention the RD-93 engine by name, but since that is the engine the Chinese and Russians were having this tussle over in these recent weeks, it's a reasonable assumption. Or perhaps their mentioning aircraft engine development assistance in general, means they'll be helping China on both of it's major announced turbofan projects(WS-10&WS-13). Russian help on anything beyond that(Chinese J-XX engine) seems unlikely at the moment. It's interesting that the aircraft engine manufacturing deal got negotiated in conjunction with their joint heli manufacturing deal, makes it seem like these things might be linked. RU would have more to loose if it decides to schitzophrenically torpedo the engine deal again.

It's also interesting that, rather than an announcement telling us that the engine deal for which they'd been negotiating was coming through and RU had gotten the contract to sell the Chinese more engines, it says that the RU would *assist* China develop the engines. Perhaps this would help develop the improved variants of both WS-10A and WS-13.

Either way, this is good news. Our birds Inshallah shall keep flying in the coming years and decades.
 
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I fail to see how China and Russia linking up for a JV on a Helicopter has anything to do with Russia blocking engines for JF17.
 
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http://en.rian.ru/mlitary_news/20100713/159799118.html


Russia and China will cooperate in jointly developing and manufacturing a heavy-lift helicopter, a Russian deputy industry and trade minister said on Tuesday.

Denis Manturov said the new helicopter could be based on the Russian Mi-26 and that the two sides were currently discussing the new machine's specifications taking into account China's domestic needs.

"This machine will be oriented toward the Chinese market and the project will be commercial," he said.

The Mi-26 Halo, a heavy transport helicopter with civilian and military applications, is the largest and most powerful helicopter ever to have gone into production.

Manturov also said Russia and China would cooperate in manufacturing aircraft engines.

SHANGHAI, July 13 (RIA Novosti)
 
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Russian Fears

The Russians are worried about China's burgeoning defense aerospace industry, which is targeting markets once dominated by Soviet and Russian products.

In another demonstration of Russia's concern over competition with China, the administration issued a July 7 tender on the state procurement website for a study on the strategy and tactics of Chinese exporters of arms and military equipment, their success and competitive advantages.

The Kremlin offers $6,500 for a research paper that will be used to prepare a report for President Dmitry Medvedev. The authors will be expected to study Russian-Chinese military and technical cooperation, including the state regulatory mechanisms, to identify factors that give Chinese exporters competitive advantages. Separately, authors of the paper should study how Chinese exporters operate in the markets that Russia traditionally considers its own.

Moreover, Russian officials say, China is doing it by intellectual theft.

At the 2009 Dubai Airshow, an official from Rosoboronexport, Russia's state arms export agency, accused China of stealing the designs for the Su-27 (J-11B) and called China's L-15 trainer jet a cheap copy of Russia's Yak-130.

"Everyone in the defense industry should be concerned about the Chinese push into the market," he said.

In China, said Dean Cheng of the Washington-based Heritage Foundation, "R&D does not stand for 'research and development,' but rather 'receive and duplicate.'"

Some Chinese officials appear unconcerned over Russian complaints that China is stealing its customers.

"I hope that is the reason," said Maj. Gen. Zhu Chenghu, director­general of the Strategic Studies Department of the Chinese Army's National Defense University.

Russia has a lot to protect. In 2009, MiG exports reached $325 million and its order portfolio now exceeds $3 billion.

Last year, the MiG-29 beat out China's FC-1 and J-10 for a 20-fighter order from Myanmar. This year, the MiG-29 is competing against the JF-17/FC-1 for an Egyptian tender of 32 fighters. The FSMTC has already approved the re-export of RD-93 engines if China wins the Egyptian tender.

Dmitry Vasilyev, an arms export analyst with Moscow's Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies, said the JF-17's relatively small pricetag makes it more attractive.

"Two engines needed to equip one fighter costs about $5 million, and engines usually make up about one-quarter of the total price of a fighter," Vasilyev said.

In fact, he said, it looks as if the Chinese government is offering the fighter for less than its production cost - "dumping" them on the world's arms market.

Russia and China have already clashed in the international market over air defense missile system exports. The Russian S-300 anti-aircraft system is competing with the Chinese HQ-9 system for a three-year-old Turkish tender.





Pakistani Concern

Pakistan is watching the engine dispute with concern. One observer gave even odds that Pogosyan would succeed in his efforts to block the engines.

"Russian military-industrial oligarchies are powerful and have immense say in the Russian governmental structures," said retired Pakistan Air Force Air Commodore Kaiser Tufail.

That would hurt Pakistan's domestic fighter program, Tufail said. Waiting for the Chinese WS-13 engine would require a whole range of test trials in different configurations and could lead to a two-year delay.

It does not help, Tufail said, that "China is not going whole hog with the JF-17 for reasons of their own."

China is not building the fighter for its own air service; that role will be filled by the more capable J-10 aircraft.



Russia Fears Competition From Chinese Fighter Jets - Defense News
 
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I fail to see how China and Russia linking up for a JV on a Helicopter has anything to do with Russia blocking engines for JF17.

Your failure has to do with your not reading about Russia and China agreeing to cooperate in the manufacturing of aircraft engines. That's the part I'd bolded out and capitalized, in the beginning of my post.

China's been working on it's WS-10 and WS-13 engines for a while now, along with perhaps other as of yet unannounced fighter aircraft engine projects. Russia's got some expertise in this field and according to the Russian Minister, they're going to cooperate with the Chinese in this area.

The DefenseNews article is a few days old, the Russian statement was apparently released today.
 
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Your failure has to do with your not reading about Russia and China agreeing to cooperate in the manufacturing of aircraft engines. That's the part I'd bolded out and capitalized, in the beginning of my post.

China's been working on it's WS-10 and WS-13 engines for a while now, along with perhaps other as of yet unannounced fighter aircraft engine projects. Russia's got some expertise in this field and according to the Russian Minister, they're going to cooperate with the Chinese in this area.

The DefenseNews article is a few days old, the Russian statement was apparently released today.


Yes but a JV with China in producing a helicopter doesen't mean nothing in regards to blocking engines for JF17 does it?

The whole point why engines was blocked is due to sour taste when China copied the SU27 fighter from Russia breaking copyright laws.
Russia wants to protect its defence industry and future export sales.
 
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