Rule of Law Index 2014: Sri Lanka top in South Asia

[Echo_419]

But they have legendary third world politicians and majority of third world nincompoops that vote those politicians in to nullify what ever advantages you have mentioned, That is sadly the truth



Mate being best of the worst lot aint that great..

But still,Now that we also have a capable leader expect our performance to go up too

 

[Gibbs]

But still,Now that we also have a capable leader expect our performance to go up too

Yep there is a lot of enthusiasm not just in India but the whole region.. But a word of caution, Though it's difficult try and keep expectations low, That way disappointments will have less impact, This is vital in sub continental politics

 

[Echo_419]

Yep there is a lot of enthusiasm not just in India but the whole region.. But a word of caution, Though it's difficult try and keep expectations low, That way disappointments will have less impact, This is vital in sub continental politics

Expectations were very high before & that's one of the reason why people are disappointed that current govt has not able to bring in any MAJOR reform,people need to give this new govt time & wait till next budget for the real reforms to take place.They seem to be heading in to the right direction & have already taken many good steps [labor reforms,cutting red tape & Corruption,etc] but due to the high expectations people are not able to see that.

 

[DarkSeid]

But still,Now that we also have a capable leader expect our performance to go up too

It's good then. Wish for the best.
Oh, you have changed the avatar to that evil smile.

 

[Echo_419]

It's good then. Wish for the best.
Oh, you have changed the avatar to that evil smile.

Avoid looking at it for too long

 

[Saradiel]

What is the solution you suggest?

what do u think the solution is? apply the rules! punish the wrong doers no matter what sort of position he helds and change governments every two or even one term.

And most importantly stop whitewashing politicians from every crime they do even if you like him.

Politicians in SL will abuse rule of law and even corruption as long as people in SL treat it serious!

 

[HeinzG]

what do u think the solution is? apply the rules! punish the wrong doers no matter what sort of position he helds and change governments every two or even one term.

In order to punish the guilty despite his position we need to get rid of our voting system and presidency. What we need is a strong parliament which is accountable to the judiciary and the mix electoral system.

Without implementing the things I have said above we will not be able to punish who ever in power.

And most importantly stop whitewashing politicians from every crime they do even if you like him.

I just don't whitewash them. I just pity them and I understand their troubles in upholding justice in our political system. It is the people like you who simply brand the politicians as the bad guys and tend to forget every thing else that made the politicians bad.

 

[Saradiel]

In order to punish the guilty despite his position we need to get rid of our voting system and presidency. What we need is a strong parliament which is accountable to the judiciary and the mix electoral system.

Without implementing the things I have said above we will not be able to punish who ever in power.

i didn't ask you to punish who ever in power , i told any one who did wrong needs to be punished according to the law irrespective of the position he/she holds. So you mean to punish PS members for rape, murder, arson we must first change the voting system and presidency? what about not voting for rapists and murderers as a whole? what about not giving the murderers and rapists candidature?
so you mean countries who act according to law are countries that hjave 100% perfect voting systems and judiciary?
Sri Lankan constitution is enough and strong to punish wrong doers. It is not a tribal constitution though politicians have made it into such. I am person who needs huge changes in constitution but saying we cant punish wrong doers in this constitution is a lie.
How can a parliament be accountable to a judiciary when the judiciary is weaker than the parliament? It is weakened.

Electoral system, presidency are different subjects. And if anyone says we cant punish rapists, murderers and robbers of public's wealth using existing constitution he is a mega idiot. Go and see a court in SL how wrong doers are punished in SL who are do not have political power.

The only reason you come with this is you feel the criticism is relevant to you and you re right. You are another ultra idiot, racist, stupid sri Lankan who will bear every rapist, murderer, robber as long as he is from your voting party!

I just don't whitewash them. I just pity them and I understand their troubles in upholding justice in our political system. It is the people like you who simply brand the politicians as the bad guys and tend to forget every thing else that made the politicians bad.

The bolded parts is one of the most ridiculous sentences i have ever seen in PDF. I didnt even point at a certian politician but i pointed at rapists and murderers in SL politics and the passion with which you come to defend such politicians shows why SL is such a despicabale place when it comes to law and order where thugs rule. As i said before lack or rule of law and corruption will exist forever in this country taking this country down and down as long as there are citizens like you. It is for Sri Lanka's unfortune we have people like you.

I dont simply brand politicians as bad guys, i brand politcians who rape, murder, rob and do every unimaginable horrid thing as bad guy. And i dont blame the politicians, I blame the citizens who are whitewashing these murderers and rapists because they like the party they represent. Politicians are not the only bad guy. Citizens who tolerate these kinds of things and worse white wash them is the worst guy! because they sustain that system! Hope you know who i am talking about!

 

[HeinzG]

i didn't ask you to punish who ever in power , i told any one who did wrong needs to be punished according to the law irrespective of the position he/she holds. So you mean to punish PS members for rape, murder, arson we must first change the voting system and presidency?

Yes it is necessary. If it was not necessary then we wouldn't see anything like what we see today in Sri Lanka. The misuse of law and order by politicians has been done since 1978 by every party who got to the helm of the power.

what about not voting for rapists and murderers as a whole? what about not giving the murderers and rapists candidature?

Voting for a candidate is up to the voters. You or me cannot question that. However regarding the issue of permitting murderers and rapists candidature, it is a matter of the vote base of a candidate. Sometimes personnel preferences are taking place also. We cannot help that. However if certain candidate has a strong vote base he will be contested by any one. If he is not given permission by one party he will contest from the other party or he will contest as an independent candidate.

The image of the politicians is very subjective when it comes to voting, so it is highly inappropriate to take into account here.

so you mean countries who act according to law are countries that hjave 100% perfect voting systems and judiciary?

I do not say "countries who act according to law are countries that have 100% perfect voting systems and judiciary". What I'm saying is that the woes of our political system is created by JRJ in 1978 by creating presidential system and proportional voting system. I think even you agree that before 1978 our political system was much better than today.


Sri Lankan constitution is enough and strong to punish wrong doers. It is not a tribal constitution though politicians have made it into such. I am person who needs huge changes in constitution but saying we cant punish wrong doers in this constitution is a lie.
How can a parliament be accountable to a judiciary when the judiciary is weaker than the parliament? It is weakened.

Electoral system, presidency are different subjects.

No you are wrong. Electoral system and presidency are two intervening subjects. With out strong presidency like ours. Our weak Parliament cannot function effectively. The weak Parliament is created by the proportionate voting system.

And if anyone says we cant punish rapists, murderers and robbers of public's wealth using existing constitution he is a mega idiot. Go and see a court in SL how wrong doers are punished in SL who are do not have political power.

Theoretical our existing constitution has ample power to punish any wrong doer but practically it is not.

The bolded parts is one of the most ridiculous sentences i have ever seen in PDF. I didnt even point at a certian politician but i pointed at rapists and murderers in SL politics and the passion with which you come to defend such politicians shows why SL is such a despicabale place when it comes to law and order where thugs rule. As i said before lack or rule of law and corruption will exist forever in this country taking this country down and down as long as there are citizens like you. It is for Sri Lanka's unfortune we have people like you.

Well you might have viewed your comment is a more specific angle. I viewed it in a more general angle. I didn't take account only of rapists and murderers. What I pointed out was why our politicians cannot punish the rapists and murderers.

I dont simply brand politicians as bad guys, i brand politcians who rape, murder, rob and do every unimaginable horrid thing as bad guy. And i dont blame the politicians, I blame the citizens who are whitewashing these murderers and rapists because they like the party they represent. Politicians are not the only bad guy. Citizens who tolerate these kinds of things and worse white wash them is the worst guy! because they sustain that system! Hope you know who i am talking about!

I don't whitewash those politicians or criticize them for nothing. I see why we are unable to punish the politicians who are bad and I have suggested to what we have to do. Unlike me you are just blabbing about the politicians and your only solace is changing the government. But as we have seen before it is like chaining one devil to another.

 

[Saradiel]

Yes it is necessary. If it was not necessary then we wouldn't see anything like what we see today in Sri Lanka. The misuse of law and order by politicians has been done since 1978 by every party who got to the helm of the power.

If you think we want to change voting system and presidency in SL to punish a PS member who rapes and murders, I can only hope for your mental recovery (though I am not sure of the word recovery) . There is a constitution, a law in this country that punishes the rapists and murderers no matter whether they are from government side. The question is why this law does not take place….Take kurraim Sheikh murder and his GF rape, now the rapists are punished. What changed it? I didn’t see any change in voting system and presidency. What made them punished?
The real reason the rapists and murderers are not punished is because politicians are protected by the politicians at higher level. The same protection given to Duminda De Silva, Mervyn Silva, Atha kota, and the protection kurraim sheikh murderers until recently. The politicians including MR protect them. They protect them because they think they are useful for them. And this has given an atmosphere for thugs in gove side to do any horrible act because they know they can go scot free.
The misuse of law and order has been in SL before 1978 but in a lesser horrid way. Yes no one rejects JR time after 78 was a nasty period with mis use of law. DO you know what protected the UNP thugs at that time from punishments for such crimes like UPFA thugs are receiving protection now?, the people in this country who whitewash them. There were people in UNP time who whitewashed every crime including murder and rape by UNP goons just like there are now people who white wash UPFA thuggery and MR’s misuse of law. Actually the bad guy is not JR or MR rather people like you who whitewash them and feel the necessity to give excuses on behalf of criminals. It is not MR and JR but people like you are the ones born for the misfortune of the country.

Voting for a candidate is up to the voters. You or me cannot question that. However regarding the issue of permitting murderers and rapists candidature, it is a matter of the vote base of a candidate. Sometimes personnel preferences are taking place also. We cannot help that. However if certain candidate has a strong vote base he will be contested by any one. If he is not given permission by one party he will contest from the other party or he will contest as an independent candidate.

That is what I am saying from the beginning that the biggest wrong doer is people. But one cannot absolve the politicians from the responsibility of giving a murderer a candidature. If a party feels like they want to give candidature to a criminal because they think he can win, it shows that particular party has no regard for the future of the country or any regard to people in it. More reasons not to vote for that party. And that shows people in that country do not care what happens to fellow citizens as long as his/her own benefits are maintained. And if people still vote for that criminal and the party that has him as a candidate that shows party in question has no doubts that people in this country do not give two hoots about break down of rule of law. Which in turn give immunity to the criminals in the political party!
This again comes to my initial point where I said, abuse of rule of law will go ahead as long as people in this country ignore and whitewash the abuse of rule of law.

The image of the politicians is very subjective when it comes to voting, so it is highly inappropriate to take into account here.

Yes of course that is subjective. In a society where rape, murder and abuse of law and no respect for law and order are prevalent and common citizens in it ignore them they will get rapists and murderers to rule over them. That is not hard to understand. That is exactly the direction SL is going. That does not mean it is correct.

I do not say "countries who act according to law are countries that have 100% perfect voting systems and judiciary". What I'm saying is that the woes of our political system is created by JRJ in 1978 by creating presidential system and proportional voting system. I think even you agree that before 1978 our political system was much better than today.

I can’t be sure had it been much better. As I said earlier the problem is not a voting system or presidential system. It is the people. When people whitewash every crime their favorite politicians do the wrongs will continue. If you need to arrest a situation and solve problems you first need to understand and acknowledge the problem. When that acknowledgement part never comes, you will not see a solution.
Yes presidential system is not good to maintain rule of law. That is why we should bring independent commissions like police commission, judiciary commission and election commission. And we do need to reduce power in the executive presidency and remove 18th amendment. You having no problem with 18th A but talking ill about executive presidency has no meaning but hilarious. Anyway it is common knowledge Sinhala racists are idiots.

No you are wrong. Electoral system and presidency are two intervening subjects. With out strong presidency like ours. Our weak Parliament cannot function effectively. The weak Parliament is created by the proportionate voting system.

I think you are misunderstanding the difference between a weak parliament and an unstable parliament. A weak parliament is a one with its power (constitutional powers) limited by a higher power like executive (the classic case in SL). Electoral systems create an unstable parliament. That is why even I am also NOT for abolishing executive power. It is good if we can change the electoral system but you will see high resistance to it. And I don’t see people questioning electoral system as much as they talk about executive presidency. If we go for a parliamentary sys with this electoral system it would be a disaster. Even with any other electoral systems I do not approve parliamentary system to SL.
Many people disregard the very reason JR brought executive presidency over parliamentary sys. That is in 77 elections TULF became the main opposition. A party that calls for a separate eelam became the main opposition in a parliamentary system. That created a lot of problems. With SL’s issues not really solved yet, going for a parliamentary system is extremely risky.
But we cannot let our rule of law to go down. What we need is a presidential system a kin to American one, a strong parliament (not like what we have today) and bringing the independent commissions that I said before.
And you can’t go to parliamentary system easily you need a new constitution. The moment a new constitution is talked about demands for federalism will pop up. So it is a risky business that too in a fragile time. It will be like ‘debareta gal gahuwa’.

Theoretical our existing constitution has ample power to punish any wrong doer but practically it is not.

The ‘theoretical’ powers that became practical in Kurrahm sheikh’s case after Britain pressurized SL gover. There are many theoretical powers in constitution like president being able to let a person go free no matter the sentence he is given by court. But the powers that are advantageous to politicians are very much practical and active while the powers that are disadvantageous to politicians are impractical and inactive?

Well you might have viewed your comment is a more specific angle. I viewed it in a more general angle. I didn't take account only of rapists and murderers. What I pointed out was why our politicians cannot punish the rapists and murderers.

What I say is politicians need not punish rapists and murderers. SL is not a kingdom. There is a law and order to punish the wrong doers and politicians just have to not to poke their nose in it by pressurizing police and judges. That is why we need independent police and judiciary commission.

I don't whitewash those politicians or criticize them for nothing. I see why we are unable to punish the politicians who are bad and I have suggested to what we have to do. Unlike me you are just blabbing about the politicians and your only solace is changing the government. But as we have seen before it is like chaining one devil to another.

I didn’t suggest changing the government for lack of order alone. The disaster in economy management, no vision for country, disaster in foreign policies, nepotism, racism and of course making a mess of North and East issue. These are the real reasons I want a gover change, law and order is just a one reason.
Anyone can see whether you are whitewashing rapists and murderers. Actually giving the excuses on behalf of them for not being punished is a way of whitewashing. And no what you suggest won’t change anything rather than make a further mess of the prevailing mess.
And as a person responsible for one mess (S-M issues) it is funny you are worried about the situation SL faces.

 

[HeinzG]

There is a constitution, a law in this country that punishes the rapists and murderers no matter whether they are from government side. The question is why this law does not take place….Take kurraim Sheikh murder and his GF rape, now the rapists are punished. What changed it? I didn’t see any change in voting system and presidency. What made them punished?
The real reason the rapists and murderers are not punished is because politicians are protected by the politicians at higher level. The same protection given to Duminda De Silva, Mervyn Silva, Atha kota, and the protection kurraim sheikh murderers until recently. The politicians including MR protect them. They protect them because they think they are useful for them. And this has given an atmosphere for thugs in gove side to do any horrible act because they know they can go scot free.

Indeed you are right. However what we need to identify is why thugs and goons are necessary for the political parties. The reason is that in order to compete in preferential voting system you need to have thuggery and other criminal acts. The person who does not succumb to this will eventually fail. Our election system requires thugs not gentlemen.

The misuse of law and order has been in SL before 1978 but in a lesser horrid way. Yes no one rejects JR time after 78 was a nasty period with mis use of law. DO you know what protected the UNP thugs at that time from punishments for such crimes like UPFA thugs are receiving protection now?, the people in this country who whitewash them. There were people in UNP time who whitewashed every crime including murder and rape by UNP goons just like there are now people who white wash UPFA thuggery and MR’s misuse of law. Actually the bad guy is not JR or MR rather people like you who whitewash them and feel the necessity to give excuses on behalf of criminals. It is not MR and JR but people like you are the ones born for the misfortune of the country.

People are responsible for the downward spiral of our political system in partially. You cannot put the whole blame on them. As everyone can see the quality of our politicians dropped from 1978 which was the year that the proportionate voting system and executive presidency came into being.

This again comes to my initial point where I said, abuse of rule of law will go ahead as long as people in this country ignore and whitewash the abuse of rule of law.

So what do you suggest people should do elect UNP or JVP ? Or go on a general rampage ?

Yes presidential system is not good to maintain rule of law. That is why we should bring independent commissions like police commission, judiciary commission and election commission. And we do need to reduce power in the executive presidency and remove 18th amendment. You having no problem with 18th A but talking ill about executive presidency has no meaning but hilarious. Anyway it is common knowledge Sinhala racists are idiots.

Independent commissions? It is really nice to say independent commissions should prevail. But are those independent commissions really independent? Can any one guarantee it's independence? What if some foreign power install their puppets into one of this commissions? Will it work for the betterment of the country then?

About the 18th amendment. If our opposition leader can contest for presidency for the 4th time. Why can't MR contest it for the 3rd time. Besides president do not choose himself for the 3rd time, it is the people that elect him if he contested. It is the democracy.

BTW in other countries where executive presidency is practiced opposition leaders do not cling in for become presidency even after they loose 20th time. So it has to be amended according to our local conditions.

I think you are misunderstanding the difference between a weak parliament and an unstable parliament. A weak parliament is a one with its power (constitutional powers) limited by a higher power like executive (the classic case in SL). Electoral systems create an unstable parliament. That is why even I am also NOT for abolishing executive power. It is good if we can change the electoral system but you will see high resistance to it.

Yes what I meant is unstable parliament. No one gives hoot about electoral system change. Even today many MPs are agreed to abolish it for good and some head way is achieved in the process. I hope in near future we will see the fruits of these efforts.

And I don’t see people questioning electoral system as much as they talk about executive presidency. If we go for a parliamentary sys with this electoral system it would be a disaster. Even with any other electoral systems I do not approve parliamentary system to SL.

The reason many do not questioning electoral system is that many do not know about the implications of the proportionate voting system. They are much familiar with the implications of executive presidency because many idiotic opposition parties only talk about it while completely disregarding implications of the proportionate voting system.

Many people disregard the very reason JR brought executive presidency over parliamentary sys. That is in 77 elections TULF became the main opposition. A party that calls for a separate eelam became the main opposition in a parliamentary system. That created a lot of problems. With SL’s issues not really solved yet, going for a parliamentary system is extremely risky.

In 1977 JR had a 2/3 majority parliament with strong premiership. The reason he changed our constitution is not that TULF became the major opposition party in parliament (TULF had close to 20 seats while UNP had more than 125). That is to create a all powerful executive that no other country has ever seen before and to keep his party in power virtually forever.

But we cannot let our rule of law to go down. What we need is a presidential system a kin to American one, a strong parliament (not like what we have today) and bringing the independent commissions that I said before.
And you can’t go to parliamentary system easily you need a new constitution. The moment a new constitution is talked about demands for federalism will pop up. So it is a risky business that too in a fragile time. It will be like ‘debareta gal gahuwa’.

No sane government will yield to federalism in Sri Lanka. So there is not any threat from that theater. We shouldn't be worried about "Goni Billas" as such.

But the powers that are advantageous to politicians are very much practical and active while the powers that are disadvantageous to politicians are impractical and inactive?

That is the reality of politics. Even in US the situation is like this.

What I say is politicians need not punish rapists and murderers. SL is not a kingdom. There is a law and order to punish the wrong doers and politicians just have to not to poke their nose in it by pressurizing police and judges. That is why we need independent police and judiciary commission.

Yes politicians need not punish rapists and murderers. But they can create a process that can punish the rapists and murderers disregarding their position in the society.

I didn’t suggest changing the government for lack of order alone. The disaster in economy management, no vision for country, disaster in foreign policies, nepotism, racism and of course making a mess of North and East issue. These are the real reasons I want a gover change, law and order is just a one reason.

So you suggest UNP or JVP?

 

[Saradiel]

Indeed you are right. However what we need to identify is why thugs and goons are necessary for the political parties. The reason is that in order to compete in preferential voting system you need to have thuggery and other criminal acts. The person who does not succumb to this will eventually fail. Our election system requires thugs not gentlemen.

This election system needs changed. No one doubts that. But it is not the election system that sustains thuggery. The biggest problem you ignore is it is difficult to change the election system; there will be a lot of resistance. And more than that no one has any idea to change the electoral system. Do you see any even a slight attempt to change the electoral system? Does your MR try to change the electoral system? MR will never change the electoral system as this electoral system is advantageous to MR.
So according to your logic we should not care rule of law and bear all the murder, rape, thuggery, robberies of gover politicians and total degradation of SL until when someone changes the electoral system in some future date (of which we see no sign even in the next decade). If you wait that much time SL won’t even exist.
Now look at why thugs are needed to win in preferential systems. Whenever a murder is done or rape is in news the thugs KNOW they will NOT be punished. The parties and party leaders KNOW people still vote them IRRESPECTIVE of what their politicians do. It is this assurance that whatever wrongs the politicians do they know still people vote for them. That sustains this system.
And when politicians do murder and rape politicians need not punish them. Even if MR did not poke his nose, the police and judiciary have enough power to arrest the culprit and punish him in a due process. But it does not happen. Why? Judiciary and police are not independent!
And MR (or any other higher politician) uses his power to STOP the due process.
Even without an electoral system, abuse of law will continue as long as police and judiciary are not independent and as long as people ignore abuse of rule of law.
If we can change electoral system it is good, but it is not going to solve the problem of abuse of law and politicians doing murder going scot free as long as we do not have an independent judiciary and police. And as long as we have people who ignore politicians’ bad acts!

People are responsible for the downward spiral of our political system in partially. You cannot put the whole blame on them. As everyone can see the quality of our politicians dropped from 1978 which was the year that the proportionate voting system and executive presidency came into being.

The politicians come from a society. The society as a whole is degrading. Societies which don’t care or even condone murder or rape produce murderers and rapists as politicians. We have had bad politicians even before 1978. The first major break down of rule of law and mega scale violation of human rights happened in 1971. That is before 1978. No one was punished for the crimes in 1971.
There were race riots in 58 and 65 where people killed people, burned vehicles with live people in it. SL has not been a wonderful place before 1978 either. It is wrong to assume every wrong started in 78. The degradation of SL politicians had started from 48 itself. The continuous degradation, break down of rule of law and politicians abusing state resources have increased with time. Take a look at how Siramavo nationalized Lake House to stifle independent media, changed constitution and brought anti-democratic practices. Each time in every decade the degradation came to a new height. The only reason people like you point at 78 are because you want to give excuses and whitewash the crimes of the politicians of the present government. Had you were a UNP supporter of 1978 you will be whitewashing UNP gover’s crime. And there were people like you and that sustained the system.
The problem is not with any system (may be the system creates an environment conducive to thug politicians) but real problem lies because people in the country approve or ignore even whitewash the crimes of politicians.

So what do you suggest people should do elect UNP or JVP ? Or go on a general rampage ?

It does not matter the party, people should not elect people who have done such frauds, murders and rapes.
Form a civil movement and pressurize a govern to stop protecting criminals and protect law and order of the country. Yes and if the present gove destroys law and order elect a different government.
And more than that bring independent commissions to protect law and order! Stand for independent media who bring out the fraudsters to public. And yes stop voting MR if he continues to protect wrong doers.

Independent commissions? It is really nice to say independent commissions should prevail. But are those independent commissions really independent? Can any one guarantee it's independence? What if some foreign power install their puppets into one of this commissions? Will it work for the betterment of the country then?

You ask this because you have no idea how independent commissions work. No foreign power can install their puppets in commissions. Why should foreign powers need puppets in commissions when MR gove itself is making the situation ideal for foreign powers to exploit. Foreign gover had no supporter than MR gov itself. MR gover is the best puppet so called foreign gover ever had!
The reason judiciary and even police are not independent are because higher posts like chiefs of police, AG dept head, and PSC heads, COPE heads, human rights commission head, bribery commission head are appointed by the executive aka MR. So these people act with allegiance to MR and gover politicians. When high positions in parliament and judiciary commissions and police are filled by gover politicians they act according to the gov politicians. That is why AG is silent on every crime done by gov politicians.
In independent commissions’s head or officials are appointed by a panel of officials and these appointments can be questioned by judiciary. The problem is it cannot be questioned when MR appoints them.
Independent means they are independent from the executive and responsible for all executive, judiciary and parliament equally. After 18th amendment the power of executive to appoint the heads of commissions were strengthened. That is why independence (whatever was remaining) is no more.
And you did not answer how murderers of Kurram Sheikh were punished? Did electoral system or constitution change?

About the 18th amendment. If our opposition leader can contest for presidency for the 4th time. Why can't MR contest it for the 3rd time. Besides president do not choose himself for the 3rd time, it is the people that elect him if he contested. It is the democracy.

This is why I call you an anti SL government supporter. You are ready to bear all the damage MR and his goons do to this country because you are blind supporter of MR. Remember this very well. If you allow MR like this, there won’t be an SL (for you to even damage) if MR is let to continue.
Ranil can contest as long as he likes because there is no constitutional limit for him as he has never held a presidential post. And your qn why cant MR contest for 3rd time if people like is equivalent to asking why cant a rapist be elected as chairman if the ppl vote for him?
If you are concerned about constitution and its powers HONESTLY you cannot justify 18th A. If JR fucked the system bringing totalitarian executive MR fucked it further by bringing 18A. So you cant point at **** number 1 by justifying **** no 2. It is that simple.

BTW in other countries where executive presidency is practiced opposition leaders do not cling in for become presidency even after they loose 20th time. So it has to be amended according to our local conditions.

How many times Ranil contest the election it has had no impact on rule of law in this country or the democracy in SL. I think we were talking about rule of law in SL and government politicians abusing the rule of law and blind anti SL gover supporters forever whitewashing their crimes. How many times Ranil contests it does not have any impact on rule of law or democracy in SL.
You having to talk about Ranil contesting for presidency itself shows how poor you are even when in arguments to whitewash the abuse of rule of law by this government. According to you, what matters most is Ranil fucking his wife/boyfriend but you are perfectly ok with MR raping your mother.

Yes what I meant is unstable parliament. No one gives hoot about electoral system change. Even today many MPs are agreed to abolish it for good and some head way is achieved in the process. I hope in near future we will see the fruits of these efforts.

So then why talk about a changing an electoral system if no one gives a hoot about it? According to you the mother of all evil in SL is electoral system. But no one is going to change it. So we will wait like a century when somebody feels like changing it.

The reason many do not questioning electoral system is that many do not know about the implications of the proportionate voting system. They are much familiar with the implications of executive presidency because many idiotic opposition parties only talk about it while completely disregarding implications of the proportionate voting system.

What is doing the biggest harm to this country is not an electoral system but an executive with very high powers. So yes executive is the one that needs to be changed. The reason is you are stupider than the idiotic political parties.

In 1977 JR had a 2/3 majority parliament with strong premiership. The reason he changed our constitution is not that TULF became the major opposition party in parliament (TULF had close to 20 seats while UNP had more than 125). That is to create a all powerful executive that no other country has ever seen before and to keep his party in power virtually forever.

JR wanted to change the constitution for multiple reasons and strengthening his grip on power was one among them. But the biggest reason was the TULF being the opposition. SL had do go for a executive system in the given circumstances but it needn’t be an authoritative one like JR did. That is what I am saying we need an executive system but with its powers limited.

No sane government will yield to federalism in Sri Lanka. So there is not any threat from that theater. We shouldn't be worried about "Goni Billas" as such.

I did not say gover will be giving federalism, but demands for federalism well strengthen. At the moment demand for federalism is not strong. Federalism can come up even replacing mild 13 A. With the global opposition against MR gover mainly from US coming up any demand for federalism can become stronger. They have aces in their hands. MR has given them aces. The whole request for war crime investigations 2 years back MR rejected, but now MR is having internal investigations he is now inviting an indian into the panel.
In this forum itself you said gove will not have elections in north and will not implement 13A. You said you ppl will not allow gov to implement 13 A. but what happened? Gover is not in a position to counter the global threat. Gov cannot sustain the force coming from US, Europe. And if you add india to it, Gov cannot. So in an environment where global powers are against SLG and partial to sepertaist forces you should not let federalism demand to come up. That is common sense not any goni billa. But I completely understand common sense is not a strength of you.

That is the reality of politics. Even in US the situation is like this.

No. That is not. Politicians are like that, but prevailing system in the country does not allow it. In US or even in India there are strong civil movements. Politicians in these countries are scared of the people, media and law. In SL that is not so. In SL people, law and media are scared of gov politicians.
Had a duminda like politician with his open links to drug trade and murdering a person in broad day light happened in US that party would have seen the door? People will rise against the party and politicians who do the cover up. The judiciary and police act against them.
I am not saying politicians in US (or any other country) are better, it is just that law works against them if they do any crime, in SL it does not.

Yes politicians need not punish rapists and murderers. But they can create a process that can punish the rapists and murderers disregarding their position in the society.

Politicians need not create processes. There are due processes already in constitution. That is why a normal civilian who does rape and murder can be punished. It is just that the due processes are not working when it comes to gover politicians or the processes are stopped from acting against that.
Example: 1. Chandana Kathriarachchi was sentenced by court for murder in 2004. MR after he became president pardoned him and released him. And even gave a chairman position in a gover organization.
In a different country such acts would be headlines and MR would have to resign. But in SL their every crime is tolerated which keeps the culture of abuse.
2. Micheal Perera’s (gov minister) wife killed his girl friend and her servant by burning alive. Court gave the woman death sentence. CBK then president pardoned her and set her free using her executive power.
So the problem is not law or due processes not taking place but rather politicians in higher positions stop the due processes from taking place.

So you suggest UNP or JVP?

If the question is in regard of stopping abuse of power and lack of rule of law, it won’t still get solved by changing the gover. It can be changed only by bringing independent commissions and making the judiciary and police independent. But still not enough, people in this country need to inculcate a culture where criminals in politics are removed from politics by voting them out.
But considering other problems in SL economic mismanagement, crisis in foreign relations, total mess in N and E and rising racism and of course the anti-democratic practices and MR’s protection of criminals, yes we need a government change.
It is big ZERO in MR’s report card.

And you did nt answer my question. If we need electoral change and changing the constitution to punish a mere rapist and a murder from gover party why did Kuram Sheikh’s murderer and his Gf’s rapist got punished? What made them punished?

 

[HeinzG]

This election system needs changed. No one doubts that. But it is not the election system that sustains thuggery. The biggest problem you ignore is it is difficult to change the election system; there will be a lot of resistance. And more than that no one has any idea to change the electoral system. Do you see any even a slight attempt to change the electoral system? Does your MR try to change the electoral system? MR will never change the electoral system as this electoral system is advantageous to MR.

It is not difficult to change the election system. The mix system is legalized for small scale elections to test how it performs so that it will use in national level. There is also a parliament committee for this. No one has oppose it.

“No political party has refused this mixed electoral system. Some political parties have expressed their views and made their submissions on some basic features of this system. Therefore all political parties have agreed to this concept,’ Minister told a media briefing held at Parliament complex yesterday.

Sri Lanka Political News | Online edition of Daily News - Lakehouse Newspapers

So according to your logic we should not care rule of law and bear all the murder, rape, thuggery, robberies of gover politicians and total degradation of SL until when someone changes the electoral system in some future date (of which we see no sign even in the next decade). If you wait that much time SL won’t even exist.

No; until then we have a solution. That is our vote. We can change the governments till it is done.

Now look at why thugs are needed to win in preferential systems. Whenever a murder is done or rape is in news the thugs KNOW they will NOT be punished. The parties and party leaders KNOW people still vote them IRRESPECTIVE of what their politicians do. It is this assurance that whatever wrongs the politicians do they know still people vote for them. That sustains this system.

No sane politicians at least in national level do not want to be branded as goon or bad guys because that will tarnish there image. However Most of the politicians you have specifically quoted as rapist and murderous are local politicians who have a local vote base in rural areas. They are different from the mainstream politicians. As I mentioned above mainstream politicians mostly acts as godfathers of mafias where the dirty works of politicians are done by thugs and goons so that the politician can be seen as the innocent guy. Therefore your argument on politicians do crime because they believe people still vote for them has no real base. The real reason for politicians to use thugs is that thugs are necessary for the politicians' election campaign. That kind of environment has been created by the proportionate voting system.

However I won't say that even after changing the election system, politicians will stop using thugs for their dirty works. But changing the election system will surely end the necessity for politicians' depends on thugs and business people.

The first major break down of rule of law and mega scale violation of human rights happened in 1971. That is before 1978. No one was punished for the crimes in 1971.

Bullshit. Many were punished including police officers specially for the "Manamperi case". Read some history.

There were race riots in 58 and 65 where people killed people, burned vehicles with live people in it. SL has not been a wonderful place before 1978 either. It is wrong to assume every wrong started in 78. The degradation of SL politicians had started from 48 itself. The continuous degradation, break down of rule of law and politicians abusing state resources have increased with time.

I do not say that only UNP government was bad. There were problems in our socio-political system before 1978. But after 1978 the whole thing changed in to completely new dimension which we have not experienced before. What we currently facing is chaos made because of the greed of one man in particular.

Form a civil movement and pressurize a govern to stop protecting criminals and protect law and order of the country. Yes and if the present gove destroys law and order elect a different government.

Yeah right. Civil movement. Would it be look like the Arab spring? And about the government change. It is like changing the pillow for the headache. We need to look into the root cause of the problem not at the mere topping of the problem.

You ask this because you have no idea how independent commissions work. No foreign power can install their puppets in commissions. Why should foreign powers need puppets in commissions when MR gove itself is making the situation ideal for foreign powers to exploit. Foreign gover had no supporter than MR gov itself. MR gover is the best puppet so called foreign gover ever had!

There is a very real possibility of that happening. How can you deny that even when we can clearly see the US embassy is meddling with our local affairs.

The reason judiciary and even police are not independent are because higher posts like chiefs of police, AG dept head, and PSC heads, COPE heads, human rights commission head, bribery commission head are appointed by the executive aka MR. So these people act with allegiance to MR and gover politicians. When high positions in parliament and judiciary commissions and police are filled by gover politicians they act according to the gov politicians. That is why AG is silent on every crime done by gov politicians.

Even is US. The president makes the necessary appointments he desires. The logic behind is that the president requires people who understand the president's policies and ready to execute them as soon as possible. That is how president can have a hold of the governance of the country.

The president is the head of the executive branch of the federal government and is constitutionally obligated to "take care that the laws be faithfully executed."[30] The executive branch has over four million employees, including members of the military.[31]

Presidents make numerous executive branch appointments: an incoming president may make up to 6,000 before he takes office and 8,000 more during his term. Ambassadors, members of the Cabinet, and other federal officers, are all appointed by a president with the "advice and consent" of a majority of the Senate.

The president also has the power to nominate federal judges, including members of the United States courts of appeals and the Supreme Court of the United States. However, these nominations do require Senate confirmation. Securing Senate approval can provide a major obstacle for presidents who wish to orient the federal judiciary toward a particular ideological stance. When nominating judges to U.S. district courts, presidents often respect the long-standing tradition of Senatorial courtesy. Presidents may also grant pardons and reprieves, as is often done just before the end of a presidential term, not without controversy.

President of the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

If president or parliament cannot appoint people they wish then there will be a true banana republic where the public nominated representatives are powerless even to make any change to sensitive government agencies and they will be ruled over by "independent commissars" who do not need public approval to be elected to the sensitive government agencies.

In independent commissions’s head or officials are appointed by a panel of officials and these appointments can be questioned by judiciary. The problem is it cannot be questioned when MR appoints them.

This can be easily remedied by modifying the constitution so that president's actions are questioned in court procedures. No one need independent commissions just because our constitution says presidents actions cannot be judged.

Ranil can contest as long as he likes because there is no constitutional limit for him as he has never held a presidential post. And your qn why cant MR contest for 3rd time if people like is equivalent to asking why cant a rapist be elected as chairman if the ppl vote for him?

There is no constitutional limit for the repeated contest because the writers of the constitution believed in ethics. They would not have thought that unethical person like RW will contest for 20th time disregarding even his party's life. There is a simple question. If unpopular character like RW can contest for 4th time for presidency. Why can't a popular MR contest 3rd time for presidency?

How many times Ranil contest the election it has had no impact on rule of law in this country or the democracy in SL.

Yes it does. It is because RW that UNP has weakened so badly. It is because of him that there is no powerful / energetic opposition. That is why Freedom Alliance run wild in political arena. RW should have handed over UNP to someone else long time ago.

What is doing the biggest harm to this country is not an electoral system but an executive with very high powers. So yes executive is the one that needs to be changed. The reason is you are stupider than the idiotic political parties.

Executive is bad and electoral system is as equally bad.

Politicians need not create processes. There are due processes already in constitution. That is why a normal civilian who does rape and murder can be punished. It is just that the due processes are not working when it comes to gover politicians or the processes are stopped from acting against that.

Constitution is created by the politicians.

And you did nt answer my question. If we need electoral change and changing the constitution to punish a mere rapist and a murder from gover party why did Kuram Sheikh’s murderer and his Gf’s rapist got punished? What made them punished?

That is because British government forced SL government to making sure justice is done. We cannot have a powerful foreign government forcing our own local government to deliver justice every time for every case. We need a proper, practical and long lasting system that will make sure justice is delivered to who ever in need regardless of his position of the society. That can be done through changing the executive and electoral system. But not by merely changing governments.