Replacement of Pakistan Army's G-3 Rifles.

[Gazzi]

It all depends on how much one intends to spend...........

5.56 rounds are good in that it can change a battlefield status quo as in the LOC between India and Pakistan whereby the philosophy of killing a soldier is not necessary but wounding him only to die later will cause one injury but two soldiers to get him medical aid and help taking three people off the front line.......this is a must flor Pakistan's Army when faced with a big army, however as a turn, PA can also then use the military strategy of Kargil using much heavy calibre weaponry to keep enemy afar.........

This is where the 7.62 round comes to effect. It keeps the effectective enemy range at about 700 metres and harrassing fire range at about 900 metres with most rifles....... This keeps the enemy a good distance away allowing your snipers using 50 cal rounds to hit the command and communications disrupting enemy co-ordination......however, 7.62 rounds cost more and when you take into account that a rifle can fire upto 700 rounds a minute, a 30 round magazine will be gone in 3-4 seconds, especially when in sectional defence like the LOC......

Pakistan will however require to change its entire thinking about how and what to deploy. there are two scenarios, LOC (india) and terrorists in KP.......

 

[Gazzi]

I still remember that documentary part in which the army personnel using G-3 was not happy with its performance and the main issues according to him were

It is very heavy
It gets stuck/jammed so often ,after firing few rounds

That jamming problem is on board all main weapns..........the British SA80, despite being revolutionised by H&K to prevent jamming change alot of the internal parts, the damn thing still jams often, especially the LSW design.......I recall having upto 17 jams when I fired close to 300 rounds from it.........despite the weapon being well cleaned and maintained..........However when you read the weapon description by teh manufacturer, its a very advanced weapon which hardly ever jams..........B0llucks, I wouldn't read too much into the descriptions given but ask the people who use them.

 

[Mani2020]

That jamming problem is on board all main weapns..........the British SA80, despite being revolutionised by H&K to prevent jamming change alot of the internal parts, the damn thing still jams often, especially the LSW design.......I recall having upto 17 jams when I fired close to 300 rounds from it.........despite the weapon being well cleaned and maintained..........However when you read the weapon description by teh manufacturer, its a very advanced weapon which hardly ever jams..........B0llucks, I wouldn't read too much into the descriptions given but ask the people who use them.

Thats where the AK series was revolutionary specially the Ak-47 which set the trend and is the most produced one .i think Pakistan should look for new variants of Ak series from Russia ,there is a high probability that we would get refused but another option would be China .Through China we can buy them and then China either can produce there own variant based upon that or licence production in China will result us acquiring those in some numbers

 

[imiakhtar]

That jamming problem is on board all main weapns..........the British SA80, despite being revolutionised by H&K to prevent jamming change alot of the internal parts, the damn thing still jams often, especially the LSW design.......I recall having upto 17 jams when I fired close to 300 rounds from it.........despite the weapon being well cleaned and maintained..........However when you read the weapon description by teh manufacturer, its a very advanced weapon which hardly ever jams..........B0llucks, I wouldn't read too much into the descriptions given but ask the people who use them.

Utter hogwash. I've put 1000s of rounds through the SA80 and can count on one hand the occasions on which it has jammed. Of those jams, 4 were magazine related. In it's current form, a very reliable system, albeit a slightly heavy one compared to it's contemporaries.

 

[ahmed_naj]

interesting conflicting views ... generally the view ive got about the L85A2 is very positive. I personally have no experience with the platform.

 

[Thomas]

if you don't mind it being Israeli made the 7.62mm Galil is a great alternative, It uses a Kalishnikov action.

Or there is the Galil Ace Model 32

 

[Mani2020]

if you don't mind it being Israeli made the 7.62mm Galil is a great alternative, It uses a Kalishnikov action.

Or there is the Galil Ace Model 32

the problem not only is that whether we mind or not but also whether they allow us the sales or not .i don't see any transactions b/w two countries atleast for a century

 

[Thomas]

the problem not only is that whether we mind or not but also whether they allow us the sales or not .i don't see any transactions b/w two countries atleast for a century

In the past Israel has given liscense to other countries to manufacture their rifles. Italy and South Africa being just a few. Then you wouldn't be buying them from Israel per say. And based on past sales Isreali military industries is more interested in money then who.

 

[Mani2020]

In the past Israel has given liscense to other countries to manufacture their rifles. Italy and South Africa being just a few. Then you wouldn't be buying them from Israel per say. And based on past sales Isreali military industries is more interested in money then who.

But Pakistan is a different case then Italy and South Africa and you know why .

Secondly you must be well aware of India-Israel defence ties.even if Israel agrees to provide these machines to Pakistan i don't think it will serve india's purpose and Israel as you mentioned striving just for money will never want to loose the customer like indian with whom she is having multiple deals of billions worth .

Also Pakistan will never be interested in purchasing anything from Israel. i remember when Elta offered their radar for Fc-1 and it was rejected directly without even evaluation

 

[rockstarIN]

But Pakistan is a different case then Italy and South Africa and you know why .

Secondly you must be well aware of India-Israel defence ties.even if Israel agrees to provide these machines to Pakistan i don't think it will serve india's purpose and Israel as you mentioned striving just for money will never want to loose the customer like indian with whom she is having multiple deals of billions worth .

Also Pakistan will never be interested in purchasing anything from Israel. i remember when Elta offered their radar for Fc-1 and it was rejected directly without even evaluation

Really? they offered to China?

 

[Mani2020]

Really? they offered to China?

Yup , i think it was a kind of indirect sales through China.i don't remember the exact type as this news is years old and there was a lot of discussion on that , i remember an indian member argued about the news but then he was provided with many articles from various sources .

you should try to google it and may be you would come up with those articles

 

[Gazzi]

Utter hogwash. I've put 1000s of rounds through the SA80 and can count on one hand the occasions on which it has jammed. Of those jams, 4 were magazine related. In it's current form, a very reliable system, albeit a slightly heavy one compared to it's contemporaries.

Putting 1000s of rounds through the weapon on deifferent days oir on the range isn't where the weapon is tested.

I have put hundreds of rounds down sectional defence where the working parts gave out smoke and weapon becane more and more prone to jammings. This was in 2002 when being trained for mobilisation for Iraq.

I know how the weapon worked and every single person in my batallion was of the same view, it is not a weapon that lives up to its mechanical expectations.

On the other hand, it is very accurate for a 5.56 round with the SA80 being pretty good upto 600 metres and the LSW at more then 800 metres.

 

[milvipes]

Civilian market prices do not necessarily reflect cost of manufacture. Check out some of the sources that cater specifically to government agencies. HK416 is considrably cheaper than SCAR-L, so the same should be true for HK417 WRT SCAR-H.

 

[monitor]

 

[monitor]

Information about the development of a dual-caliber air-burst weapon by South Korea was available since about 2006 and K11 was first revealed to public in 2009, in DSEI military expo . This is developed by the Agency for Defense Development and S&T Daewoo.K11 is similar to the ill-fated American XM-29 OICW (Objective Individual Combat Weapon. Weapon is believed to be in service with South Korean army.Last year, it was reported that some of the South Korean troops deploying to Afghanistan will be armed with the Daewoo K11 dual-caliber airburst weapon.K11 dual-caliber air-burst weapon is proposed for infantry squad support role, multiplying soldiers capabilities to engage enemy personnel in defilade and soft-skinned vehicles and equipment, using 20mm air-burst grenades with pre-programmed fuse and 5.56mm ammunition for short- to medium range direct fire. K11’s 20mm grenade launcher weapon carries a 5-round magazine. K11’s 20mm round can track its target and explode three to four meters above it by using a self-detonation system.

K11 dual-caliber air-burst weapon consists of three major units, linked into one weapon.


20mm multi-shot grenade launcher which is a manually operated and is fed from detachable box magazines. It is built in bullpup layout. K167 HE air-burst grenade and K168 TP target practice grenade can be fired from the grenade launcher.

5.56mm automatic rifle component is similar to US-made M16 or Korean-made K2 rifles which allows it to use NATO-standard 5.56mm ammunition.

Eelectronic fire control unit includes laser rangefinder, environmental sensors, ballistic computer, and day (optical) and night (IR) sighting channels.

Caliber: 5.56x45mm NATO + 20 mm
Action: Gas operated, rotating bolt for 5.56mm and manually operated for 20mm
Overall length: 860 mm
Barrel length: 310 mm (5.56mm); 405 mm (20mm)
Weight: 6.1 kg (with optics and battery but less magazines)
Magazine capacity: 30 rounds of 5.56mm and 5 rounds of 20mm