RAW Is The Real Terrorist!

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Salman, while genocide did not take place atrocities certainly did, and by both sides. In addition we do know that a large section of the Bangladeshi people felt disenfranchised by Pakistan.

So Vinod's argument is that despite being Muslims, we had all of that take place, and Islam was no uniting bond at the time - rather it was ethnicity and culture.

 

[Vinod2070]

Bangladeshis approval of the facts are enough, there is no need to prove it in front of the world it’s a matter b/w us and we know the facts.

And where is the "Bangladeshi approval"? Have they expunged it from their text books, from their history?

And you are wrong that you don't need to prove to the world. What facts to do you know that the rest of the world doesn't and how did you get that proprietary knowledge?

Its just about wanting to believe something because the truth is not palatable.

 

[was]

 

[doobie86]

Did you really see 1 actually? Just qurious by the way.



Looks who talking. Some one who cant even quote a proper example. 50 beers. Dude do you even know what is the meaning of having 50 beers or that even is it possible to have 50 beers. Eventhough you were quoting an example terminology you like to call it, still 50 lol, i dont need to say anything more on this issue atleast.




Dude let me get it straight to you since before that i thought you might have got some brains to do a simple calculation but it seems i am wasting time. But before i go there let me tell you to keep your debate of my family, you dont know nothing about me or my family so before you even get started on what i watch or my family does, i'll suggest you to remain on what the topic is and not on what my family watches. On a side note your movies are pathetic and really not me and not any one in my family wastes time in such crap, what ever the name of the show you mentioned above. Believe me when i say so, we do have better things to do in life then watching some cheap bollywood hero saving a pakistani girl.

Ok with that done let me get back to your post:



Your bad did i read it correct, what happened couldnt back that up so that turns to your bad. Ok now tell me how in the hell is my laptop (by the way) is working because of them, just because its HP? But anyways i still bought it from China and its made in China. Now for the break fast, i dont know where are you going with this but enlighten me on this one. Not to mention gas ahh right? dude seriously get a hold of yourself because what ever you are saying, none makes sense. How is gas related to them, are you out of damn freaking mind, are you telling me that gas comes from the US? If it was up to them(US) pakistan would have been blacked out long ago, dont believe me, well take indo/US nuclear accord for example, is Pakistan not suffering from electricity shortage, then why does India gets exempted and treated as if India is from heaven and not Pakistan and then when we tell them ok, get lost we will get it from some place else(China) they start whining. DO you have any clue at all or you just like to rant. What ever you said above, do you have anything to back it up, if yes let me know otherwise dont even bother wasting my time.




You dont care because you know nothing about warefare, nothing at all. Let me suggest you something, go read something about strategic locations and their implications before even coming out with such nonsense. 71 was a loss and no sane Pakistani can deny that and that is the point, this whole debate thing started, you actually in your hypothesis think that after 71 Pakistan would actually like to join India and the US and show a middle finger to China, you couldnt be more wrong. 65 well no one lost, yeah rigth that is why India was running towards the UN for a cease fire. Ohh i forgot almost didnt your generals made plans to have a drink at PC in Lahore

And yes we would have done the same thing If it was India instead of us and believe me, ask any military personal, you would have suffered the same specially when all odds were against you.




Yeah right like the part where you quoted having 50 beers. Right.

wow, you actually got thanked for that post?

to address your 'quriosity'

have I seen panties, LOL, have you seen panties? and I don't mean in a store or on tv, and yes, I have seen panties, as a matter of fact, if it works out the way I'd like I might get to see some again tonight, you know how college rolls, gotta love booze man.

I'm starting to think your comprehension of the english language isn't as good as I first thought it to be. with regard to my example of '50 beers', I was obviously exaggerating to prove a point, which was simply that you cannot get high off of alcohol, you just don't know what high means.

ok no need to go all emotional on me, I wasn't trying to insult you or anyone in your family, I'll keep your family out of it from here on in. Ah yes, you say our movies are pathetic and then you say you don't waste your time watching crap, but how would you know if you've never seen one? Unless of course you have seen one, were absolutely repulsed by it, and never bothered watching one again. but we make so many in a year, there's something for everyone. you know what, let me suggest a movie, try rock on or tare zameen par.

I am done discussing panties, drugs, alcohol and hindi movies, I am frankly not interested in what you have to say about the same. I don't even know how all this started in the first place. so keep your comments to yourself in this regard.

getting back to the subject.

yeah, it was my bad, I have no qualms whatsoever about admitting my mistakes, I shouldn't have said you don't need them at all, because obviously you do and obviously I know you do. I think you understood what I was trying to imply, you're just nit-picking at my posts. I'll tell you how your laptop and breakfast and everything else depends on the international community, and pay attention, are you paying attention?

They have propped up your economy, plain and simple. The US has come to Pakistan's aid in the past, now its China, but not really, more like the IMF, didn't they approve a loan like yesterday or day before, I forget how much, but go google it and you'll see how your economy depends on injections of cash from the intl' community, the same one that needs you more than you need them, unless of course you aren't cool with the idea of becoming a south asian somalia.

I'm the one that's ranting? dude go read your posts, when did I say gas comes from the US? I said the money for gas has come from the US and the Saudis in the past and this time its the IMF. And the same logic applies to food, any idea what the inflation rate in your country is? any idea what happened to the price of food recently? not that it hasn't happened anywhere else on the planet but its not nearly as bad as in Pakistan and a few other places.

you're right, I know nothing about 'warefare' .

You were the one who said Pakistan can whoop India's as* any given day of the week, its called a 'universal' statement if you know anything about logic, I just countered it with an 'Existential' statement saying that if what you said was true, BD wouldn't be BD. and yeah, I know the odds were against you in '71. Even today, conventionally speaking its the same story really, just the nuclear angle makes war a lot riskier. So if anything wars will be fought on a limited scale, my point ?, Pakistan cannot outright whoop India's ***.

We really should start talking about RAW, any fun news about 'em recently?

 

[was]

to address your 'quriosity'

have I seen panties, LOL, have you seen panties? and I don't mean in a store or on tv, and yes, I have seen panties, as a matter of fact, if it works out the way I'd like I might get to see some again tonight, you know how college rolls, gotta love booze man.

yeah in your dreams

 

[Contrarian]

Nothing is perfect and Muslims are also not perfect but surely Islam is perfect!

Nothing-including Islam is perfect. We all try to be perfect in our own views and make things perfect.

 

[DarkStar]

Everyone judges his country/religion by its highest ideals and others by their actions (often picking the worst ones).

More plaguarism.

It would have been noble of you to actually give credit to the person whose words you quoted.

Seems like you read Rajmohan Gandhi's (grandson of M.K. Gandhi a.k.a. mahatma) book, Understanding the Musilm Mind.

 

[Vinod2070]

More plaguarism.

It would have been noble of you to actually give credit to the person whose words you quoted.

Seems like you read Rajmohan Gandhi's (grandson of M.K. Gandhi a.k.a. mahatma) book, Understanding the Musilm Mind.

I think you meant "plagiarism".

I have learned each word that I speak from someone or the other.

If we stand tall today, it is because we stand on the shoulders of the giants. (I don't remember who said that)

I didn't read his book but you are right that the words are his.

See, some quotes you like so much that over a period they become a part of you and you even forget where you read it from.

So I didn't plagiarize it and claim it as my own as you are suggesting here.

 

[DarkStar]

I think you meant "plagiarism".

I have learned each word that I speak from someone or the other.

If we stand tall today, it is because we stand on the shoulders of the giants. (I don't remember who said that)

I didn't read his book but you are right that the words are his.

See, some quotes you like so much that over a period they become a part of you and you even forget where you read it from.

So I didn't plagiarize it and claim it as my own as you are suggesting here.

What a flimsy excuse to cover up what you have done.

If you haven't read that book, I suggest you read it. Everyone interested in India/Pakistan and HIndu/Muslim dialogue should read this book of M.K.Gandhi's grandson. It is an absolute master piece.

 

[DarkStar]

Salman, while genocide did not take place atrocities certainly did, and by both sides. In addition we do know that a large section of the Bangladeshi people felt disenfranchised by Pakistan.

So Vinod's argument is that despite being Muslims, we had all of that take place, and Islam was no uniting bond at the time - rather it was ethnicity and culture.

One thing that must be remembered, that just before partition there were riots in Bengal, between muslims and hindus. M.K. Gandhi immediately went there to quell the anger and discontent, and along with some other leaders of different communities managed to bring a sort of peace to the region. This act of his led to many Hindus feeling pacified, and deciding to stay on in East Pakistan, and carry on with their lives rather than risk becoming refugees with uncertain futures in Bhaarat.

However, when the same thing happened in Punjab, M.K. Gandhi undertook no such yatra, and Bharati/Pakistani punjab was cleared of it's minority muslim/hindu/sikh populations.

This was a strategic masterstroke by Gandhi, as it cleared teh way to rid places like Gurdaspur of its muslim population, in order to gain a safe route to Kashmir.

On the other hand, most of the teachers, intellectuals, civil servants in what then became East Pakistan were Hindus. Since many of them did not migrate, they had a cultural influence upon East Pakistanis which was disproportionate to their numbers.

I still remember anecdotal accounts from old people who had studied in schools and colleges of East Pakistan, about how Hindu teachers influenced the views of the Bengali students, and telling them how big a mistake it was to make Pakistan, and how much life would have been better under secular India.

In West Pakistan, most people revered the Quaid, while in EAst Pakistan issues such as the Quaid's "controversial" marriage to Rutti Jinnah, his being of a minority religious sect, and allegations regarding his non-kosher eating and drinking habits were common knowledge among students, and subseuquently shaped the paradigm through which they understood the two-nation theory. All this was thanks to the disproportionate percentage of teachers who were HIndus.

These teachers, intellectuals constituted what could be a called a fifth column in East Pakistani society, and their infulence was an important factor in the machinations which led to the Independance of Bengladesh.

 

[salman nedian]

Nothing-including Islam is perfect. We all try to be perfect in our own views and make things perfect.

It’s all about believes and according to our belief Islam is the religion of Allah. Surely Allah cannot commit mistakes only humans can make mistakes. You can say it for your religion since you believe in it.

 

[salman nedian]

And where is the "Bangladeshi approval"? Have they expunged it from their text books, from their history?

And you are wrong that you don't need to prove to the world. What facts to do you know that the rest of the world doesn't and how did you get that proprietary knowledge?

Its just about wanting to believe something because the truth is not palatable.

We don’t want world to approve this, when world cannot stop a super power to attack smaller nations and capturing them than such useless world is good for nothing. A common Bangladeshi believes this and that’s enough for us. It’s a matter between Bangladeshis and us so others better take care of their countries.

Agno,
I agree that atrocities were committed and if you ask me, Pakistan and BD should apologize to each other but huge propaganda in this regard is not acceptable specially by those who are involved in killings of their countrymen.

 

[Vinod2070]

What a flimsy excuse to cover up what you have done.

 

[Vinod2070]

One thing that must be remembered, that just before partition there were riots in Bengal, between muslims and hindus. M.K. Gandhi immediately went there to quell the anger and discontent, and along with some other leaders of different communities managed to bring a sort of peace to the region. This act of his led to many Hindus feeling pacified, and deciding to stay on in East Pakistan, and carry on with their lives rather than risk becoming refugees with uncertain futures in Bhaarat.

However, when the same thing happened in Punjab, M.K. Gandhi undertook no such yatra, and Bharati/Pakistani punjab was cleared of it's minority muslim/hindu/sikh populations.

This was a strategic masterstroke by Gandhi, as it cleared teh way to rid places like Gurdaspur of its muslim population, in order to gain a safe route to Kashmir.

On the other hand, most of the teachers, intellectuals, civil servants in what then became East Pakistan were Hindus. Since many of them did not migrate, they had a cultural influence upon East Pakistanis which was disproportionate to their numbers.

I still remember anecdotal accounts from old people who had studied in schools and colleges of East Pakistan, about how Hindu teachers influenced the views of the Bengali students, and telling them how big a mistake it was to make Pakistan, and how much life would have been better under secular India.

In West Pakistan, most people revered the Quaid, while in EAst Pakistan issues such as the Quaid's "controversial" marriage to Rutti Jinnah, his being of a minority religious sect, and allegations regarding his non-kosher eating and drinking habits were common knowledge among students, and subseuquently shaped the paradigm through which they understood the two-nation theory. All this was thanks to the disproportionate percentage of teachers who were HIndus.

These teachers, intellectuals constituted what could be a called a fifth column in East Pakistani society, and their infulence was an important factor in the machinations which led to the Independance of Bengladesh.

The paranoia of some knows no bounds and so does their capacity to lie or indulge in delusions.

Even the extreme danger that Gandhi took on his life when he went alone in places like Noakhali where people were being butchered and cow meat was being stuffed by the "peaceful and tolerant" people in their mouths seems to such people as "master stroke". And that visit and the pacification prevented a reverse orgy of violence in Bihar and West Bengal.

Why was there no master-stroke by your leaders to prevent the ethnic cleansing that took place in West Pakistan? Why were the Muslim League's guards allowed to run amok on hapless minorities and almost totally wipe them out?

If you know so much, you should be knowing about people like Suhrawardy who promoted massive massacre on the "Direct Action" day but when the inevitable blow back came, went running to Gandhi to save his people from the blow back.

And you talk about blaming victims for being victims? This is the perfect example. You murdered millions of them, a disproportionate number of them being Hindus and then you blame the victims for being intellectuals in a disproportionate number!

Try to have some measure of honesty. It won't bite, I can assure you, though it may leave what you have held precious for so long totally shattered, the untruths and the fables!

However, when the same thing happened in Punjab, M.K. Gandhi undertook no such yatra, and Bharati/Pakistani punjab was cleared of it's minority muslim/hindu/sikh populations.

Especially liked this part. So it was Gandhi's responsibility to save minorities in Pakistan after it been formed!

Same as it is the responsibility of the fabled "international community" to prevent you from imploding or exploding just because of the sheer nuisance value!

 

[Logic note]

One thing that must be remembered, that just before partition there were riots in Bengal, between muslims and hindus. M.K. Gandhi immediately went there to quell the anger and discontent, and along with some other leaders of different communities managed to bring a sort of peace to the region. This act of his led to many Hindus feeling pacified, and deciding to stay on in East Pakistan, and carry on with their lives rather than risk becoming refugees with uncertain futures in Bhaarat.

However, when the same thing happened in Punjab, M.K. Gandhi undertook no such yatra, and Bharati/Pakistani punjab was cleared of it's minority muslim/hindu/sikh populations.

This was a strategic masterstroke by Gandhi, as it cleared teh way to rid places like Gurdaspur of its muslim population, in order to gain a safe route to Kashmir.

.

Migration of ethinic Population was based on religious lines in punjab , and population moved as per redcliff line, chasing there dreams of Pakistan . it has nothing to do with Gandhi questioning his intention based on your obsession of Kashmir is ridiculous ..

http://faculty.washington.edu/brass/Partition.pdf