Questions!

[Elmo]

This is really getting weird. Omar, yes people are different from district to district. not just here, it happens all across the word. its nurture and nature mixed.

You are saying 'pakistanis' are different, hey what is pakistan? its also a mix of different people like india. it was religion that was the supposed differentiator in 1947 and looks like after 1971 its the 'looks'

genetically atleast 75% pakistani population if of indic stock, the rest iranic and turkic.

are we different in terms of customs, food, dressing etc, yes that changes every few hundred kilometers, so yes we are. its what u r looking at. we are different and we are similar, what do u want to look at depends on your political stand.

Probably 15 years back pakistan had the issue of an independent image. after 9/11 however pakistan has managed to create a firm image in world's eyes. so no need to work on 'how we are different' so fervently, nobody's taking you for indians.

I think Omar is trying to prove he isn't like the Indies. Denial doesn't work Omar

What Fateh said should be the final word for this thread

 

[Omar1984]

I noticed that MANY Indians try to tell themselves that Pakistanis and Indians are the same people when its far from the truth. Pakistanis have their own identity, we dont want to be Indians. Indians have their own identity. Theres nothing wrong with being Indian, but that is not our identity. As for ethnic groups of Pakistan....Punjabis, Sindhis, Balochis, Pashtuns, they are major ethnic groups of Pakistan. I never researched on the ethnic groups of India I know theres way more ethnic groups in India, Punjabi is just one of it and they are a very small minority in India who dont share any religious similarities with the Punjabis of Pakistan and religion always played a major role in South Asia.

Only Indians want to associate themselves with Pakistanis but we Pakistanis always been trying to get away from you all. I dont know what obsession Indians have with Pakistanis. Even look at this forum theres as many Indian members as there are Pakistani members. Get over your obsession. Pakistan is its own sovereign nation and Pakistanis are not Indians.

 

[Nemesis]

Inter-mingling happened 1000 years but doesn't affect the population now, WHAT???? Are you joking? So let me get this straight, people who live in Pakistan were of mixed descent 1000 years ago, but somehow in the modern era they became a "pure race"?? Okay then......

 

[Omar1984]

I think Omar is trying to prove he isn't like the Indies. Denial doesn't work Omar

What Fateh said should be the final word for this thread

"Indies" what is that? Undies? Never heard of that before in my life.

I'm Pakistani. I'm very proud of being Pakistani. Maybe you are an Indie

 

[Omar1984]

Inter-mingling happened 1000 years but doesn't affect the population now, WHAT???? Are you joking? So let me get this straight, people who live in Pakistan were of mixed descent 1000 years ago, but somehow in the modern era they became a "pure race"?? Okay then......

How did a person living in Faisalabad in 500 A.D. intermingle with a person living in Mumbai and then return back to Faisalabad?

There was no airplanes or even cars back then. I already said some Punjabis maybe similar to some Punjabis of India, but it doesnt make sense for Punjabis of Pakistan to be related to the rest of Indians. Do you suggest all the ancestors of Pakistanis intermingled with the ancestors of Indians 1000 years ago?

 

[Omar1984]

This is really getting weird. Omar, yes people are different from district to district. not just here, it happens all across the word. its nurture and nature mixed.

You are saying 'pakistanis' are different, hey what is pakistan? its also a mix of different people like india. it was religion that was the supposed differentiator in 1947 and looks like after 1971 its the 'looks'

genetically atleast 75% pakistani population if of indic stock, the rest iranic and turkic.

are we different in terms of customs, food, dressing etc, yes that changes every few hundred kilometers, so yes we are. its what u r looking at. we are different and we are similar, what do u want to look at depends on your political stand.

Probably 15 years back pakistan had the issue of an independent image. after 9/11 however pakistan has managed to create a firm image in world's eyes. so no need to work on 'how we are different' so fervently, nobody's taking you for indians.

What is indic? Haven't you guys distorted the name of Indus river more than enough. First this river that flows through Pakistan, gave the name for your country, your religion, and now you term a race for it. Indus is the name of a river. India, Hinduism are British created words. Indic is also a distorted word. The Indic race doesnt exist. Indus is a river and it flows through Kashmir, Punjab, and Sindh not Bharat.

The nile river flows through Egypt. We dont see people calling themselves of the Nilic stock.

 

[toxic_pus]

Not really. Pashtuns, Baloch, and Kalash share no similarities with Indians. Some Sindhis might be similar to the Hindu Sindhis who migrated to India after partition but they make less than 1% of India's population. Some Punjabis maybe similar to some Punjabis of India but they make less than 3% of India's population.

Pakistanis are their own people. I think Indians are more similar to Bangladeshis than Pakistanis.

Strange. You have almost entirely disregarded the post and just concentrated on a single line, which, btw, should have been read in the light of the entire post.

Why are you avoiding the question of genetics, particularly Y Haplogroup L, which is so common among the Indians and Pakistanis. Haplogroup 28 is found at a frequency of 14% in Pakistan, while it appears at a frequency of 30% in India. It starts diminishing as one goes further away from this region and virtually disappears in Europe. The only ethnic group that stands out in Pakistan is the Hazara.

 

[Omar1984]

^ Show me the article of this study, and if the study was not done in Pakistan or if its a study done by Indians I dont want to see it.

14% of Pakistanis is not a large number by the way. What about the 86% of Pakistanis who dont have this Haplogroup 28?

 

[toxic_pus]

How did a person living in Faisalabad in 500 A.D. intermingle with a person living in Mumbai and then return back to Faisalabad?

There was no airplanes or even cars back then.

You certainly do not understand the concept of back migration. Here's one example of back migration (not related to the topic of discussion though)
A Back Migration from Asia to Sub-Saharan Africa Is Supported by High-Resolution Analysis of Human Y-Chromosome Haplotypes

 

[toxic_pus]

^ Show me the article of this study, and if the study was not done in Pakistan or if its a study done by Indians I dont want to see it.

14% of Pakistanis is not a large number by the way. What about the 86% of Pakistanis who dont have this Haplogroup 28?

Ask and ye shall receive
Y-Chromosomal DNA Variation in Pakistan

The fifth haplogroup that is common in Pakistan, haplogroup 28, differs from all the others in its distribution. Within Pakistan, it made up 14% of our sample and was present in all but two populations (both of which had very small sample sizes), so it is both common and widespread. Outside Pakistan and the nearby countries, however, it is rare. It has been reported in India (30%; present in 3/3 populations), Tajikistan (10%; present in 5/6 populations), and Uzbekistan (3%; present in 10/13 populations), but it is rare in Russia (0.4%; present in 1/6 populations) and the Caucasus (1.4%; present in 1/6 populations (Wells et al. 2001) and has not been found at all in China or Mongolia (unpublished observations).

 

[Elmo]

^ Show me the article of this study, and if the study was not done in Pakistan or if its a study done by Indians I dont want to see it.

14% of Pakistanis is not a large number by the way. What about the 86% of Pakistanis who dont have this Haplogroup 28?

Omar ab aap Kashmir pohanch gaye hain

Indians is what I meant. Yara, quit it, you are different from the rest of us, buss ab khush

 

[Omar1984]

Ask and ye shall receive
Y-Chromosomal DNA Variation in Pakistan

^ So 14% of Pakistan's population are similar to 30% of India's population, 10% of Tajikistan's population, and 3% of Uzbekistan's population.

Yipee, so what about the rest of Pakistan's population and the rest of India's population.

 

[toxic_pus]

From the same article:

When these conditions are not met, the presence of distinct Y lineages can still be informative. The origins of the Parsis are well-documented (Nanavutty 1997) and thus provide a useful test case. They are followers of the Iranian prophet Zoroaster, who migrated to India after the collapse of the Sassanian empire in the 7th century a.d. They settled in 900 a.d. in Gujarat, India, where they were called the “Parsi” (meaning “from Iran&#8221. Eventually they moved to Mumbai in India and Karachi in Pakistan, from where the present population was sampled (fig. 7). Their frequencies for haplogroups 3 (8&#37 and 9 (39%) do indeed resemble those in Iran more than those of their current neighbors in Pakistan. They show the lowest frequency for haplogroup 3 in Pakistan (apart from the Hazaras; fig. 1C). The mean for eight Iranian populations was 14% (n=401) (Quintana-Murci et al. 2001), whereas that for Pakistan, excluding the Parsis, was 36%. The corresponding figures for haplogroup 9 were 39% in the Parsis, 40% in Iran, and 15% in Pakistan excluding the Parsis. These figures lead to an admixture estimate of 100% from Iran (table 3). Given the small effective population size of the Parsis, the closeness of their match to the Iranian data may be fortuitous, and the presence of haplogroup 28 chromosomes at 18% (4% in Iran; Wells et al. 2001) suggests some gene flow from the surrounding populations. The TMRCA for the Parsi-specific cluster in the haplogroup 28 networks was 1,800 (600–4,500) years (table 8), consistent with the migration of a small number of lineages from Iran. Overall, these results demonstrate a close match between the historical records and the Y data, and thus suggest that the Y data will be useful when less historical information is available.

A tiny example of a partial back migration.

 

[Omar1984]

Omar ab aap Kashmir pohanch gaye hain

Indians is what I meant. Yara, quit it, you are different from the rest of us, buss ab khush

Nai ji. Main Pakistani hoon main hindustani nai hoon.

 

[toxic_pus]

Yipee, so what about the rest of Pakistan's population and the rest of India's population.

They are from Mars of course.

While you are mapping the martian genome, get acquainted with the rules of statistics and sampling methods.

And one more thing. Although the research paper is too long for someone with an attention span of a bug, or too technical, do give it a complete read. It is actually pretty interesting.