Qaher F313 l News & Discussion

[gambit]

before any judgement about F-313 we should know the main mission of this jet.

Let us see if the thing can fly first. If the first test flight have its altitude above GEV level, everything you guys posted are pointless.

 

[Oldman1]

The key point is that what is mission of F-313.
I strongly believe we shouldn't play in American ground and base on Normal military tactics.
Sadam tried that and he lost b/c US is superior in any field.
Iran should be creative and bring his enemy to whee she like to fight Iran determine the ground and rules of war.
before any judgement about F-313 we should know the main mission of this jet.
my guess is that bigger F-313 can be part of complex tactic of attack to Diego Garcia Island in Indian ocean.

Doubt the F-313 is designed to be a tactical long range bomber to reach Diego Garcia. You have a better chance of reaching the U.S. carrier in the region than the island.

 

[randomradio]

Airframe design for ground effects is what the forum Iranians are saying the F-313 is supposed to be, which in my opinion, is nonsensical for a 'stealth' combat aircraft.

We here think it's not going to be any different from a stealth-enhanced advanced trainer.

Like a Combat Hawk or Textron Scorpion, but with a much lower RCS + Possibly a small internal bay.

Considering they make a version that can fly.

@any professional Iranians here:
HAL is working on a turbofan engine, HTFE-35/40, 35-40/53-68KN. You can give it a thought. There's even a 25KN version available.

 

[SubWater]

Doubt the F-313 is designed to be a tactical long range bomber to reach Diego Garcia. You have a better chance of reaching the U.S. carrier in the region than the island.

reaching US carrier is old now. In the case of total naval war Indian ocean would be front line, not Persian golf or sea of Makran.
I didn't say that F-313 is tactical long range bomber and Iran does not have enough money to support such that project ,also that mean playing in American ground, where Americans are superior.
In my opinion, bigger F-313 could be long hand of Iran in Indian ocean.

 

[AmirPatriot]

@any professional Iranians here:
HAL is working on a turbofan engine, HTFE-35/40, 35-40/53-68KN. You can give it a thought. There's even a 25KN version available.

Iran is working on its own turbofan engines.

 

[PeeD]

If ground effect flight is tactically useful, there would have been more combat aircraft using it. What I see in this discussion is people desperate to make the F-313 justifiable in any way.

No.
Iran could be the first country to make use of a GE specialized aircraft.
Russians and even Chinese play the game that Americans and Russians set. The whole layout of a fighter aircraft is the evolution of eastern and western aerospace industry and more importantly thinking.

Its due to engine technology as the single greatest bottleneck, Iran can't enter a competition like PAK-FA vs. F-35/-22.

So the solution is to go for a different approach and that's easy for Iran because there is no established aerospace industry circle with their own doctrine. There is no US, British, French, Russian or Chinese fighter that ever used GE, but this does not mean that a GE specialized fighter is not competitive to their designs.

You are apparently someone from the "establishment", a bomber pilot of a aerospace leading country. I don't expect from you a sober engineering approach to judge about a GE specialized fighter. The Qaher may or may not be such a novel fighter, we don't know.

 

[Habibollah500]

at the end it never made it out of the shahed like rc toy that was shown in 2013.

 

[Deino]

nice CGI

Nice ... ??? IMO plain stupid ! Two tandem weapons bays on the belly and two side bays ? !! that's impossible and even more plain stupid. Ohhh these fan-boys.

 

[PeeD]

Nice ... ??? IMO plain stupid ! Two tandem weapons bays on the belly and two side bays ? !! that's impossible and even more plain stupid. Ohhh these fan-boys.

Someone has not realized that the unusual intake size and top arrangement of this design has the side effect that the lower fuselage can be more effectively used for weaponbays.

I don't say this CGI is anything close the reality but it seems you got your eyes on FC-31 and J-20 for too long.

 

[Deino]

Someone has not realized that the unusual intake size and top arrangement of this design has the side effect that the lower fuselage can be more effectively used for weaponbays.

I don't say this CGI is anything close the reality but it seems you got your eyes on FC-31 and J-20 for too long.

Could be but that does not make these CGs more realistic, that type a decent combat aircraft nor even flyable !??

How should this model get the air for its engines esp. in aerial combat and hard manoeuvring ??

Sorry, but if anyone with a slightest sense of reality looks at these CGs then not only the weapon bays (by the way, where is fuel ?) but also that AAM (looks like a PL-12 or similar) is way too small (about the size of the pilot ?) ... but You really seem to take this "concept" for granted ????

Deino

 

[SOHEIL]

Could be but that does not make these CGs more realistic, that type a decent combat aircraft nor even flyable !??

How should this model get the air for its engines esp. in aerial combat and hard manoeuvring ??

Sorry, but if anyone with a slightest sense of reality looks at these CGs then not only the weapon bays (by the way, where is fuel ?) but also that AAM (looks like a PL-12 or similar) is way too small (about the size of the pilot ?) ... but You really seem to take this "concept" for granted ????

Deino

Yeah ... Those CGs are fanboy art !

 

[PeeD]

@Deino

No, I don't take it for granted. The lateral SRAAM bays are nonsense but the center bay or bays are possible. The whole intake and landing gear arrangement should be mainly for the purpose of center bays.

We have discussed the intakes and they make sense if hard maneuvering is not part of the operation regime.
There would be plenty of space for fuel, especially due to the unusual thick main wings and the thick fuselage.

The Qaher is either designed by a genius and highly unconventional or a fake project, there is more or less nothing in between.

A nice coincidence:

@VEVAK said last week that if GE would be useful, the US would have produced GE cruise missiles.

Just a few days ago a photo of a Chinese GE missile/drone was released:

Its performance stats speak for themselves and about the kinematic and effectively propulsive effectiveness of GE. This beast would likely fly more than 1000km out into the sea at very low level and even have time to loiter the target region for the target that has moved since launch (if no mid-course update is used).

Interestingly the Chinese weapon is flying over ground, well possible that Chinese plan to use it over ground too.

@Penguin also said that downward chanting wings have no effect on a GE aircraft. The Chinese weapon has a top intake (to avoid FOD?), hence the structure below it is not some sort of large intake, but downward chanted edges to better contain the cushion effect.

 

[Arminkh]

@Deino

No, I don't take it for granted. The lateral SRAAM bays are nonsense but the center bay or bays are possible. The whole intake and landing gear arrangement should be mainly for the purpose of center bays.

We have discussed the intakes and they make sense if hard maneuvering is not part of the operation regime.
There would be plenty of space for fuel, especially due to the unusual thick main wings and the thick fuselage.

The Qaher is either designed by a genius and highly unconventional or a fake project, there is more or less nothing in between.

A nice coincidence:

@VEVAK said last week that if GE would be useful, the US would have produced GE cruise missiles.

Just a few days ago a photo of a Chinese GE missile/drone was released:

Its performance stats speak for themselves and about the kinematic and effectively propulsive effectiveness of GE. This beast would likely fly more than 1000km out into the sea at very low level and even have time to loiter the target region for the target that has moved since launch (if no mid-course update is used).

Interestingly the Chinese weapon is flying over ground, well possible that Chinese plan to use it over ground too.

@Penguin also said that downward chanting wings have no effect on a GE aircraft. The Chinese weapon has a top intake (to avoid FOD?), hence the structure below it is not some sort of large intake, but downward chanted edges to better contain the cushion effect.

And with this new information, the GE concept will all of a sudden become the theme of the day. Shahed az gheib resid!

 

[mohsen]

Could be but that does not make these CGs more realistic, that type a decent combat aircraft nor even flyable !??

How should this model get the air for its engines esp. in aerial combat and hard manoeuvring ??

Sorry, but if anyone with a slightest sense of reality looks at these CGs then not only the weapon bays (by the way, where is fuel ?) but also that AAM (looks like a PL-12 or similar) is way too small (about the size of the pilot ?) ... but You really seem to take this "concept" for granted ????

Deino

weapons and fuel:

 

[AmirPatriot]

@Deino

No, I don't take it for granted. The lateral SRAAM bays are nonsense but the center bay or bays are possible. The whole intake and landing gear arrangement should be mainly for the purpose of center bays.

We have discussed the intakes and they make sense if hard maneuvering is not part of the operation regime.
There would be plenty of space for fuel, especially due to the unusual thick main wings and the thick fuselage.

The Qaher is either designed by a genius and highly unconventional or a fake project, there is more or less nothing in between.

A nice coincidence:

@VEVAK said last week that if GE would be useful, the US would have produced GE cruise missiles.

Just a few days ago a photo of a Chinese GE missile/drone was released:

Its performance stats speak for themselves and about the kinematic and effectively propulsive effectiveness of GE. This beast would likely fly more than 1000km out into the sea at very low level and even have time to loiter the target region for the target that has moved since launch (if no mid-course update is used).

Interestingly the Chinese weapon is flying over ground, well possible that Chinese plan to use it over ground too.

@Penguin also said that downward chanting wings have no effect on a GE aircraft. The Chinese weapon has a top intake (to avoid FOD?), hence the structure below it is not some sort of large intake, but downward chanted edges to better contain the cushion effect.

Oh damn. I knew about ground effect and I obviously knew about cruise missiles. Cruise missiles are designed to fly low and fast. Ground effect makes low level flight very efficient and fast.

Why has no-one connected the dots even though both of these technologies have been available and known for 30 years?