PTI-JI remove ‘objectionable’ material from textbooks ..Very revolutionary, indeed."

[Zarvan]

That is a very narrow or rather "scared" worldview right there; from a person(or grouped mindset) that feels that it is no longer relevant and hence must come up with various reasons to keep its grip on a more rebellious(if not strictly well informed) society stronger lest they be thrown out into the scrum of history.

What exactly does teaching a girl about Dupatta somehow prepare her for doing so at a later stage? Will that prevent her from engaging in pre-martial affairs and sending nudes over the cellphone to a guy? NO.

Those choices are entirely hers to make and hers alone. Whether she keeps a Dupatta or not depends upon her household and the upbringing there. Nor does the presence or absence of a Dupatta tell the girl what she is destined for later on.

As for the bolded part, do you not see the absolute hypocrisy in your statement?
If she is to be judged by Allah then it is HIS prerogative to judge her. You are no Prophet to pass authoritative ideals on the former or to speak for his judgement which has YET to happen.

In Islamic society if some one is breaking Islamic rules he or she will be told that what wrong he or she is doing and will be discouraged from doing that. And which fool thought Nia Pakistan would have no Islamic education or part in ouy curriculum Imran never said that so stop coming up with your own assumptions off what Imran thinks or has idea off nia Pakistan

 

[Jungibaaz]

That is your opinion, you may or may not be correct but how can you make that statement without going through the proposed changes in detail?

Can you kindly provide link to that curriculum and its details, I am sure a country such as UK would have a universal education system and that would readily be available online. I would really like to take you home on this.

The way it works here is that there are several exam boards, the chosen board varies from school to school. The focus on which religions are taught alongside the main, depend upon the area, demographics of the area, the school and choices made by the school departments. That is for KS3, students 12-14, GCSE (O level) is different, it depends on the exam board, student's own options and the school.

I really don't have time to discuss this in detail with you, nor am I teacher who's read the syllabus outline for staff, but here you go:

http://webarchive.nationalarchives....ublications/eOrderingDownload/QCA-04-1374.pdf

Here's a part from page 129:

''Religions and beliefs
a Christianity
b at least two other principal religions
c a religious community with a significant local presence, where appropriate
d a secular world view, where appropriate.''​

And should just two be a problem for some parents, oftent imes the schools themselves can teach more than two, aide from the syllabus, all one needs to do is have the head of that subject in the school asked by anyone from pupils to other staff members to parents and their represented school chairs.

And here:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...ECONDARY_national_curriculum_FINAL_140714.pdf

Page 4 section 2.3 outlines that it is compulsory to have religious education taught to those ages.

And here again for the content on page 268:

http://webarchive.nationalarchives.....uk/uploads/QCA-07-3350-p_RE_KS3_tcm8-411.pdf

And the two other world religions means that is what the school teaches for that YEAR ALONE. Many schools are reuired to have a rotating syllabus. So the first year of KS3, they'd be taught Christianity, religion 1 and religion 2. Next year they'd be taught Christianity, religion 3 and religion 4. and then the next year, religion 5 and 6. That means at least a term of teaching per year is provided to each specific major world religion depending on the school.

Also a side note:

''A religious community of local significance: This may be included to give
a local focus to the study of how religion and belief impact on individuals,
families and the community.''​

^From that same page, like I said, schools and department heads can take the local community, demographics of the school and community into consideration.

 

[syedali73]

Honestly, some of you just cease to amaze me every so often. It's because of your brilliantly illogical logic. Answers in the same paragraph pattern:

There is nothing wrong with 'Good Morning' if it is taught after 'Assalaam-o-Elikum' because these children need to learn our culture and our religion before they ever get to use the former. And, the bridging that you seem to have conjured is a 2-way street.......Is the other side also teaching all their children 'Subh Bakhair'??

In a textbook, a girl without 'dupatta', I believe, may not be wrong to you but so may not be many many grown up girls and women who not only wander out without dupatta, they do so without sleeves and with generous necklines and skin fitting pajamas/kurti's or shirts etc., but to many of us it is the precise opposite of Islam and any Muslim society. Also, it is easier to teach a child the good, albeit hard at time, practices and guidelines of Islam rather then at a later age. The child in the textbook is to be idealized by the students, education after all is the first building block of a better human and better society. I wonder how the Prophet would react to our society today and to your posts.

Respecting other religions and the right of religious freedom of others is a teaching of Islam and not of Caliph Hazrat Omer (R.A.) alone. However, I seriously fail to understand where PTI has encouraged razing of churches, temples or any other places of worship. Even more importantly, what has this got anything to do with the curriculum changes that were under discussion?

Finally, to learn, understand and educate ourselves and our future generations about our religion is not equal to alienation. Infact, Islam teaches and encourages us to spread Islam through our deeds and actions and only by honest education and a firm root level commitment to religion and education can we do that.

So, the next time you feel the urge to jump into arguments needlessly, especially religious arguments, you may want to remember that you are going to die one day and that you will have to defend your words and actions infront of Allah on the day of judgement.

Your zeal for the religion is commendable however, I think we should not leave just about everything on the Schools. I remember, by the age of 10, I had already gone through major religious books thanks to my Mother. She even made me to read her Moulana Ashraf Ali Thanvi's 'Beheshti Zewar', a book that used to be given to every newly wed girl as an essential part of the dowry (in Sunni Deobandi Muslims). I can vouch that my training as an acceptable (I would never say good) Muslim came from my parents and not from the School, though I got my school education from a Jamaat-e-Islami-run public School in which Arabic and Quran classes were must. However back then for us as students, they were just subjects, and were taught as such.

What I am trying to say is, objecting on a minor with no dupatta is kind of pushing things unnecessarily. Same goes for things like saying good morning and not Assalamo-Alikum, or why cross and not crescent on the ambulance etc. These things can easily be educated at home and much more effectively than in the School. Actually our so-called political religious parties have earned such a bad reputation (and correctly so) over the period of time that even if they say right things, people hesitate to accept.

 

[Jungibaaz]

That is a very narrow or rather "scared" worldview right there; from a person(or grouped mindset) that feels that it is no longer relevant and hence must come up with various reasons to keep its grip on a more rebellious(if not strictly well informed) society stronger lest they be thrown out into the scrum of history.

What exactly does teaching a girl about Dupatta somehow prepare her for doing so at a later stage? Will that prevent her from engaging in pre-martial affairs and sending nudes over the cellphone to a guy? NO.

Those choices are entirely hers to make and hers alone. Whether she keeps a Dupatta or not depends upon her household and the upbringing there. Nor does the presence or absence of a Dupatta tell the girl what she is destined for later on.

As for the bolded part, do you not see the absolute hypocrisy in your statement?
If she is to be judged by Allah then it is HIS prerogative to judge her. You are no Prophet to pass authoritative ideals on the former or to speak for his judgement which has YET to happen.

Very well said.

That's exactly my view, especially the part in bold.

 

[WAJsal]

uhh, listening to what?

killing mullahs but how people think they are doing them a favour

 

[Hyperion]

I think not. What you meant to say was, from your "sects" perspective, which in all probability is either Salfi/Wahabi or Deobandi!

Muslims.

I like the way you think/process info!

That is a very narrow or rather "scared" worldview right there; from a person(or grouped mindset) that feels that it is no longer relevant and hence must come up with various reasons to keep its grip on a more rebellious(if not strictly well informed) society stronger lest they be thrown out into the scrum of history.

What exactly does teaching a girl about Dupatta somehow prepare her for doing so at a later stage? Will that prevent her from engaging in pre-martial affairs and sending nudes over the cellphone to a guy? NO.

Those choices are entirely hers to make and hers alone. Whether she keeps a Dupatta or not depends upon her household and the upbringing there. Nor does the presence or absence of a Dupatta tell the girl what she is destined for later on.

As for the bolded part, do you not see the absolute hypocrisy in your statement?
If she is to be judged by Allah then it is HIS prerogative to judge her. You are no Prophet to pass authoritative ideals on the former or to speak for his judgement which has YET to happen.

 

[Armstrong]

Very well said.

That's exactly my view, especially the part in bold.

Don't trust @Oscar hes like the Emperor Palpatine of PDF !

Except that hes got a fetish for Ewoks !

 

[VCheng]

That is a very narrow or rather "scared" worldview right there; from a person(or grouped mindset) that feels that it is no longer relevant and hence must come up with various reasons to keep its grip on a more rebellious(if not strictly well informed) society stronger lest they be thrown out into the scrum of history.

What exactly does teaching a girl about Dupatta somehow prepare her for doing so at a later stage? Will that prevent her from engaging in pre-martial affairs and sending nudes over the cellphone to a guy? NO.

Those choices are entirely hers to make and hers alone. Whether she keeps a Dupatta or not depends upon her household and the upbringing there. Nor does the presence or absence of a Dupatta tell the girl what she is destined for later on.

As for the bolded part, do you not see the absolute hypocrisy in your statement?
If she is to be judged by Allah then it is HIS prerogative to judge her. You are no Prophet to pass authoritative ideals on the former or to speak for his judgement which has YET to happen.

I think the solution is to insist on a proper hijab, since a dupatta is clearly not enough for moral protection.

 

[Jf Thunder]

killing mullahs but how people think they are doing them a favour

who is doing who a favor?

 

[Dubious]

There is nothing wrong with 'Good Morning' if it is taught after 'Assalaam-o-Elikum' because these children need to learn our culture and our religion before they ever get to use the former. And, the bridging that you seem to have conjured is a 2-way street.......Is the other side also teaching all their children 'Subh Bakhair'??

1stly,

I learnt Assalamualaikum from my parents...And mind you parents too have a duty to teach "culture and religion" not leave it on someone else to poison their minds


2ndly, Why would they teach Subh khair? Is Arabic/ Urdu/ Persian on international level?

Had these people not been busy poisoning people´s mind (Sunni vs Shia; Deobandi vs Brailvi; Wahabbi vs whatnot) for their own benefits Muslims would have been more advanced than being labelled ISIS or Taliban!

In a textbook, a girl without 'dupatta', I believe, may not be wrong to you but so may not be many many grown up girls and women who not only wander out without dupatta, they do so without sleeves and with generous necklines and skin fitting pajamas/kurti's or shirts etc., but to many of us it is the precise opposite of Islam and any Muslim society. Also, it is easier to teach a child the good, albeit hard at time, practices and guidelines of Islam rather then at a later age. The child in the textbook is to be idealized by the students, education after all is the first building block of a better human and better society. I wonder how the Prophet would react to our society today and to your posts.

1stly, the girl without the dupatta is also part of our society (Hindu / Christian) ....Duppatta is only cultural which some Pakistani Hindu may wear coz they are Pakistani and following its culture!

Prophet never forced the non believers to be shunned or covered up! The command was ONLY for believing women...Spain is an excellent example where Jews and Muslims as well as Christians lived in harmony for some 100s of year!

As for the women walking without sleeves....thats their problem...When will these Mullahs learn to take the order before that TELL THE BELIEVING MEN TO LOWER THEIR GAZE AND GUARD THEIR MODESTY! This order came before that for the women! So lets put that in order first!

Respecting other religions and the right of religious freedom of others is a teaching of Islam and not of Caliph Hazrat Omer (R.A.) alone. However, I seriously fail to understand where PTI has encouraged razing of churches, temples or any other places of worship. Even more importantly, what has this got anything to do with the curriculum changes that were under discussion?

It was an example of the extreme mindset being cultivated in Pakistan thanks to the intolerance of diversity ...even something as small as a "girl" (who may not have hit puberty) in a book (basically a picture) without a dupatta!

Finally, to learn, understand and educate ourselves and our future generations about our religion is not equal to alienation. Infact, Islam teaches and encourages us to spread Islam through our deeds and actions and only by honest education and a firm root level commitment to religion and education can we do that.

There is a saying men are scared of what they dont understand!

Now if all their lives they are closed up with women who are "covered up" and not a drop of diversity exists...when some difference happens their 1st reaction would be ALLAH HU AKHBAR and killing! or raping!

Islam teaches us to spread Islam by actions not ignorance nor Jahalat of alienating/ locking ourselves in our culture without contact of outside world!

So, the next time you feel the urge to jump into arguments needlessly, especially religious arguments, you may want to remember that you are going to die one day and that you will have to defend your words and actions infront of Allah on the day of judgement.

Next time you present rubbish in the name of Islam can you also remember ALLAH´s words dont sell your religion for a meager price! and Jahalat (ignorance) has been opposed soo many times all over the Quran!

 

[SQ8]

I think the solution is to insist on a proper hijab, since a dupatta is clearly not enough for moral protection.

Please, My first carnal encounter involved a girl in what was supposedly a "Hijab" outfit. So I have serious reservations against its sanctity in the current social scenario.

 

[Dubious]

Is the west teaching Islam to their students??

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/07/w...in-islam-to-better-blend-its-melting-pot.html

Why German public schools now teach Islam - CSMonitor.com

Islam to be Added to German Public School Curriculum in North Rhine-Westphalia | AICGS

As for Muslim schools there are plenty in UK but some are getting negative review thanks to mindsets similar to JI

British government to make Muslim schools teach children about Christianity? | Christian News on Christian Today

Police raid unlicensed Islamic school in east London | UK news | The Guardian

 

[VCheng]

Please, My first carnal encounter involved a girl in what was supposedly a "Hijab" outfit. So I have serious reservations against its sanctity in the current social scenario.

If the hijab don't work, we need to ensure armor plated burkas. That will be enough. If not, we must come up with new barriers. And keep improving them. Surely, we all can solve this problem with strict guidance such as this.

(Or not. )

 

[Porus]

Mullahs have also put forward a recommendation for the inclusion of an extensive chapter about pederasty embellished with colourful pictures of innocent looking young lads.

 

[Jungibaaz]

If the hijab don't work, we need to ensure armor plated burkas. That will be enough. If not, we must come up with new barriers. And keep improving them. Surely, we all can solve this problem with strict guidance such as this.

(Or not. )

How about a 50 tonne tank with no hatch? Painted pure black so that there is no confusion.