Proud LAHORI at home in BOMBAY

[Awesome]

Although, in principle, I don't want to agree with Halaku but sometimes comments like above do make me feel that perhaps it is acceptable that India tries to find out if a Pakistani seeking to enter Indian soil, or is already earning his/her bread and butter in India, is a closet jihadi/terrorist, who secretly wishes and is overjoyed by death of Indian citizens in uniform.

The likes of Asim make the likes of Siv Sena look like angels. And that is sad.

Excuse me, why the assumption that anyone - especially me - is overjoyed by the deaths of Indian soldiers? It's reality, they are occupying Kashmir illegally. We want it. If we go there, they'll kill us. So we should kill them instead.

There is no joy in war and conflict, it just has to be done by the people who have the legitimate right to do so.

On the flip side, your Shiv Sena has no right to conduct violence against anybody. If combat is required you have your army.

 

[paritosh]

Perhaps my good time consists of waging Ghazwa. I'm afraid you live in a very fragile bubble.

calm down...how many people on this forum talk of waging ghazwa-e-hind?
and this is a pakistani defence forum...one of the most likely place of the whole ghazwa talk...
my fragile bubble has prevented a lot of wars.

 

[Halaku Khan]

cheeky..very cheeky but let me tell you of my brother...who recently got the Sena medal for single-handedly killing two terrorists in barahmulla in Kashmir...while risking his life...
he's had shrapnel wounds...has had colleagues being kidnapped...has seen shiitt...so we have our guy risking it all..

a lot of people believe that it would have been more convenient if could have discarded the whole democratic process itself....

One has to salute your brother's contribution. But how does democracy come into the picture? I haven't said anything undemocratic.

 

[Naradmuni]

On the flip side, your Shiv Sena has no right to conduct violence against anybody. If combat is required you have your army.

Shiv Sena is a just a big Mouth and that is it. At the max it can do a Mumbai-Band. You are giving it too much importance than it deserves.

It is not a parallel so called "non-state" actor like the LET.

 

[paritosh]

But how does democracy come into the picture? I haven't said anything undemocratic.

freedom speech and expression is one b1ttch of an individual right...
it empowers guys like thackrey...the sri ram senas...and bhindrewales to infuriate people....but it is required...democracy is solely run on this right apart from the right to vote and the right to information...and some other rights I don't remember...

 

[Halaku Khan]

freedom speech and expression is one b1ttch of an individual right...
it empowers guys like thackrey...the sri ram senas...and bhindrewales to infuriate people....but it is required...democracy is solely run on this right apart from the right to vote and the right to information...and some other rights I don't remember...

I totally support freedom of expression ... but it is also the duty of a state to not allow entry to terrorist sympathizers.

 

[toxic_pus]

Excuse me, why the assumption that anyone - especially me - is overjoyed by the deaths of Indian soldiers? It's reality, they are occupying Kashmir illegally. We want it. If we go there, they'll kill us. So we should kill them instead.

There is no joy in war and conflict, it just has to be done by the people who have the legitimate right to do so.

On the flip side, your Shiv Sena has no right to conduct violence against anybody. If combat is required you have your army.

Whether or not you are overjoyed is besides the fact that you openly advocate, condone and justify killing of Indian citizens on the basis of your own understanding of the legality of the issue. That is the mindset of a closet terrorist, who would typically redefine 'reality' to suite his own agenda.

Your agenda is that of irredentism and to that end you have simply redefined and spun the Kashmir issue. For example, you have convinced yourself that the 'reality' is that Pakistan is entitled to possess Kashmir and hence you don't see no wrong in going into Kashmir to take possession of it, or the resultant loss of life in chasing this chimera.

I am not apologetic of Siv Sena and its goons. But if killing Indian citizens is 'fair' to achieve your perverse goals, then the State of India is entitled to defend itself from terrorist apologists, and do it with a vengeance.

You are basically justifying Halaku.

 

[Developereo]

Whether or not you are overjoyed is besides the fact that you openly advocate, condone and justify killing of Indian citizens on the basis of your own understanding of the legality of the issue. That is the mindset of a closet terrorist, who would typically redefine 'reality' to suite his own agenda.

Your agenda is that of irredentism and to that end you have simply redefined and spun the Kashmir issue. For example, you have convinced yourself that the 'reality' is that Pakistan is entitled to possess Kashmir and hence you don't see no wrong in going into Kashmir to take possession of it, or the resultant loss of life in chasing this chimera.

I am not apologetic of Siv Sena and its goons. But if killing Indian citizens is 'fair' to achieve your perverse goals, then the State of India is entitled to defend itself from terrorist apologists, and do it with a vengeance.

You are basically justifying Halaku.

Your post illustrates the problem.

Strictly speaking, the term 'terrorism' means the deliberate targetting of civilians.

However, it has been abused over the years to include any attack by your opponent. Hence the USS Cole attack on a military ship was termed terrorism by the American media. The Israelis routinely abuse the term to include any attack even on their soldiers. And you justr used that word to describe a resistance movement by freedom fighters against military personnel whom they consider an occupying force.

The murders in Mumbai and Pune were terrorism; killing innocent Kashmiri civilans would be terrorism; fighting the Indian Army in Kashmir is not terrorism.

If anything, it is the Indian Army's harassment, rape and murder of innocent Kashmiri civilians that can properly be termed as state-sponsored terrorism.

 

[Spitfighter]

Excuse me, why the assumption that anyone - especially me - is overjoyed by the deaths of Indian soldiers? It's reality, they are occupying Kashmir illegally. We want it. If we go there, they'll kill us. So we should kill them instead.

There is no joy in war and conflict, it just has to be done by the people who have the legitimate right to do so.

On the flip side, your Shiv Sena has no right to conduct violence against anybody. If combat is required you have your army.

Simply put, you condone terrorism as we define it and so you shouldn't visit the country.

 

[Awesome]

Whether or not you are overjoyed is besides the fact that you openly advocate, condone and justify killing of Indian citizens on the basis of your own understanding of the legality of the issue. That is the mindset of a closet terrorist, who would typically redefine 'reality' to suite his own agenda.

Excuse me once again, no where have I condoned the killing of Indian citizens - by assumption Indian civilians.

Indian army is a combatant directly violating Pakistani demands of Kashmiri liberation. It is OKAY to kill people in conflict with Pakistani demands.

Your agenda is that of irredentism and to that end you have simply redefined and spun the Kashmir issue. For example, you have convinced yourself that the 'reality' is that Pakistan is entitled to possess Kashmir and hence you don't see no wrong in going into Kashmir to take possession of it, or the resultant loss of life in chasing this chimera.

We're ready for the debate of the right and wrongs as well, in fact also prefer it. But all venues are kept on the table. From our point of view Pakistan reserves the right to liberate Kashmir.

I am not apologetic of Siv Sena and its goons. But if killing Indian citizens is 'fair' to achieve your perverse goals, then the State of India is entitled to defend itself from terrorist apologists, and do it with a vengeance.

When your vengeance expands from combatants to non-combatants thats where the problem emerges and you're calling for an all out war. If you have any issues combat the PA in Kashmir, your vengeance expands to aiding suicide bombers of FATA who blow up schools of children, that's not legitimate.

You are basically justifying Halaku.

No I'm not, you haven't understood what I'm saying.

 

[Awesome]

Simply put, you condone terrorism as we define it and so you shouldn't visit the country.

Killing Indian soldiers engaged in conflict with Pakistani soldiers is not terrorism.

 

[Spitfighter]

Killing Indian soldiers engaged in conflict with Pakistani soldiers is not terrorism.

You (and developereo) have no problem with terrorists killing Indian soldiers in Kashmir either, which is why Pakistanis such as yourself pose a security risk.

 

[Awesome]

You (and developereo) have no problem with terrorists killing Indian soldiers in Kashmir either, which is why Pakistanis such as yourself pose a security risk.

Actually I've qualified it further that PA or legitimate Kashmiri separatists should only kill Indian soldiers in Kashmir

1. PA or Kashmiri separatists should only do the Fighting
2. The Fighting must be against Indian Soldiers
3. The Indian soldiers must be stationed in Kashmir.

Why would I care if a German Bakery Dhaba is attacked. Its an unnecessary loss of life.

 

[blueoval79]

Actually I've qualified it further that PA or legitimate Kashmiri separatists should only kill Indian soldiers in Kashmir

1. PA or Kashmiri separatists should only do the Fighting
2. The Fighting must be against Indian Soldiers
3. The Indian soldiers must be stationed in Kashmir.

Why would I care if a German Bakery Dhaba is attacked. Its an unnecessary loss of life.

Going by your logic.... Indian Army has all the right to kill the separatists.....so there would be no so called human rights abuse claim from Pakistan Side if the so called Separatists Get Killed ....

 

[Awesome]

I am also a non-combatant, there should be no issues with a visa being granted to me - my support is merely moral as per the official stance of the government of Pakistan.