Featured Project Azm: Pakistan's Ambitious Quest to Develop 5th Generation Military Technologies.

[Abid123]

Why does Pakistan need a twin engine fighter jet?

 

[Iron Shrappenel]

Would love to hear more. I have the following data points:
1. There's a huge disconnect in the "planned" infrastructure, and what has been constructed so far:

2. Some money was demanded for construction in 2021 budget:
View attachment 776450
3. Jobs were posted through brightspyre (29 jobs):

Jobs in Pakistan - BrightSpyre.com

Start your job search with BrightSpyre. Apply for hundreds of open jobs in Pakistan. Find part time, full time, contratual jobs in government, semi government and private sectors. BrightSpyre has more than 1.6 million active users and each month on average 10,000 new users sign up. This makes...

nastp.brightspyre.com

View attachment 776452Looking at the jobs they are either very low-tech or administrative.



So in my opinion this looks like a grand plan struggling to get off the ground because there is little planning, just grand visions. But I would love to hear your opinion since you seem to know something that I probably don't.

In simple words they jammed an axe into their foot because if lack of long term vision...
The request for funds is understandable as the prices for land acquisition have spiraled from 10s of thousand to millions...
At first they were using middle men in the premise that the land acquisition is for a factory for building helis. this is during the time the T-129 talks were in full swing and acquisition seemed to be in good numbers... So people were ready to give away land at marginally higher prices and the middle man ofcourse made his commission....
Someone in the higher ups decided that they should eliminate the middle man altogether. This went really badly for them. Now they are holding large chunks of land to this day in between the acquired area. This makes it almost impossible for making a functioning part of the project...
Subsequently prices have spiraled to a new high... ( 50k per kanal to as high as 12-45 lac )..... The project cost excluding inflation has sky rocketed.. People are holding there land for better prices and land acquisition is now at a sluggish pace... As of 3 month back they had acquired almost 6k to 8k kanals while if my memory serves me right the whole project is of 25k kanals.. so you can see the disparity...
You have stated that there is a lack of R&D related jobs and the reason you have stated yourself.... Only buildings raised in the newly acquired area is the university and adjacent hostel....
The head of land acquisition isn't that in touch with the locals either.
All in All I don't see the project completing in the next 10 years if the govt doesn't use section 4.
( Corruption, bribes and other arm bending tactics have been left out )

 

[JamD]

In simple words they jammed an axe into their foot because if lack of long term vision...
The request for funds is understandable as the prices for land acquisition have spiraled from 10s of thousand to millions...
At first they were using middle men in the premise that the land acquisition is for a factory for building helis. this is during the time the T-129 talks were in full swing and acquisition seemed to be in good numbers... So people were ready to give away land at marginally higher prices and the middle man ofcourse made his commission....
Someone in the higher ups decided that they should eliminate the middle man altogether. This went really badly for them. Now they are holding large chunks of land to this day in between the acquired area. This makes it almost impossible for making a functioning part of the project...
Subsequently prices have spiraled to a new high... ( 50k per kanal to as high as 12-45 lac )..... The project cost excluding inflation has sky rocketed.. People are holding there land for better prices and land acquisition is now at a sluggish pace... As of 3 month back they had acquired almost 6k to 8k kanals while if my memory serves me right the whole project is of 25k kanals.. so you can see the disparity...
You have stated that there is a lack of R&D related jobs and the reason you have stated yourself.... Only buildings raised in the newly acquired area is the university and adjacent hostel....
The head of land acquisition isn't that in touch with the locals either.
All in All I don't see the project completing in the next 10 years if the govt doesn't use section 4.
( Corruption, bribes and other arm bending tactics have been left out )

So the "usual" lol

 

[M.AsfandYar]

Would love to hear more. I have the following data points:
1. There's a huge disconnect in the "planned" infrastructure, and what has been constructed so far:

2. Some money was demanded for construction in 2021 budget:
View attachment 776450
3. Jobs were posted through brightspyre (29 jobs):

Jobs in Pakistan - BrightSpyre.com

Start your job search with BrightSpyre. Apply for hundreds of open jobs in Pakistan. Find part time, full time, contratual jobs in government, semi government and private sectors. BrightSpyre has more than 1.6 million active users and each month on average 10,000 new users sign up. This makes...

nastp.brightspyre.com

View attachment 776452Looking at the jobs they are either very low-tech or administrative.



So in my opinion this looks like a grand plan struggling to get off the ground because there is little planning, just grand visions. But I would love to hear your opinion since you seem to know something that I probably don't.

Go that Brightspyre email 10 hours ago from university . And a message 3 4 days ago saying send your CVs regardless of posts, you will be considered in future. (Might be) this is the first or second such hiring (i think). Dont know anybody who is applying there atm.

In simple words they jammed an axe into their foot because if lack of long term vision...
The request for funds is understandable as the prices for land acquisition have spiraled from 10s of thousand to millions...
At first they were using middle men in the premise that the land acquisition is for a factory for building helis. this is during the time the T-129 talks were in full swing and acquisition seemed to be in good numbers... So people were ready to give away land at marginally higher prices and the middle man ofcourse made his commission....
Someone in the higher ups decided that they should eliminate the middle man altogether. This went really badly for them. Now they are holding large chunks of land to this day in between the acquired area. This makes it almost impossible for making a functioning part of the project...
Subsequently prices have spiraled to a new high... ( 50k per kanal to as high as 12-45 lac )..... The project cost excluding inflation has sky rocketed.. People are holding there land for better prices and land acquisition is now at a sluggish pace... As of 3 month back they had acquired almost 6k to 8k kanals while if my memory serves me right the whole project is of 25k kanals.. so you can see the disparity...
You have stated that there is a lack of R&D related jobs and the reason you have stated yourself.... Only buildings raised in the newly acquired area is the university and adjacent hostel....
The head of land acquisition isn't that in touch with the locals either.
All in All I don't see the project completing in the next 10 years if the govt doesn't use section 4.
( Corruption, bribes and other arm bending tactics have been left out )

So they never learn. They did the exact shit in building Naval Anchorage and pissed of the villagers in doing so. Cutting the middle man. Villagers sold their lands cheaper to Jinnah and Gulberg greens with conditions never to sell to Navy.

 

[Iron Shrappenel]

So the "usual" lol

No, even Army now has a system of acquisition and secrecy with these kind of things.... They have a serving wing commander running the sight office, sigh if anyone of you is actually connected high up please try to make them understand that this is a very social job and a person who has to run something like this needs only 2,4 years to make necessary relations with Tehsildars, Patwaris and the locals... Most of these lands when they were starting the project were held by families and acquisition was easy before... Now there are investors..
Only way forward seems to me is the shutting down of one of the older Mirage or F-7 factories.... This also helps in understanding why J-10s are ordered ( retirement of one of the two ).

 

[JamD]

Go that Brightspyre email 10 hours ago from university . And a message 3 4 days ago saying send your CVs regardless of posts, you will be considered in future. (Might be) this is the first or second such hiring (i think)

Yes, I've heard from a few people about getting emails. But look at the jobs. Lots of administrative jobs. All of the technical jobs are low-level jobs (once you read the job descriptions). The technical jobs are either about CAD, FPGA, hardware operation, or vague things like ML and RF designer. All jobs have Bachelor's requirements - not even Masters. Looks like an attempt to fill an empty building rather than a well-thought out establishment of a research center.

 

[Blacklight]

No, even Army now has a system of acquisition and secrecy with these kind of things.... They have a serving wing commander running the sight office, sigh if anyone of you is actually connected high up please try to make them understand that this is a very social job and a person who has to run something like this needs only 2,4 years to make necessary relations with Tehsildars, Patwaris and the locals... Most of these lands when they were starting the project were held by families and acquisition was easy before... Now there are investors..
Only way forward seems to me is the shutting down of one of the older Mirage or F-7 factories.... This also helps in understanding why J-10s are ordered ( retirement of one of the two ).

"Army has a serving Wing Commander" is a contradictory statement.

Btw it is "Site Office" not "Sight Office"

 

[M.AsfandYar]

Yes, I've heard from a few people about getting emails. But look at the jobs. Lots of administrative jobs. All of the technical jobs are low-level jobs (once you read the job descriptions). The technical jobs are either about CAD, FPGA, hardware operation, or vague things like ML and RF designer. All jobs have Bachelor's requirements - not even Masters. Looks like an attempt to fill an empty building rather than a well-thought out establishment of a research center.

That CAD Job is grade 12 LOL. Its a joke.
Had a look at them. Those Design Engineers are at max FYP level jobs. CAD + FEM/CFD

 

[Blacklight]

Why does Pakistan need a twin engine fighter jet?

Long range & increased CAP's.

 

[JamD]

"Army has a serving Wing Commander" is a contradictory statement.

Btw it is "Site Office" not "Sight Office"

I believe @Iron Shrappenel meant that:
1. Army has a system for this sort of thing.
2. For Aviation City PAF has a Wg Cdr running the site office.

 

[DJ_Viper]

Why does Pakistan need a twin engine fighter jet?

I can list a number of reasons. Armament carrying capacity is one, more "up" time is second, with Pakistan's EEZ out to 400 KM's, it needs to ensure constant CAP in the extended zone. To target naval assets and fight the IN, you'd be much better off having a heavier punch. Your Mirages are almost outdated and the JFT can't take such long hikes, the ocean is where that platform's weakness shows up, despite the block III being an extremely capable platform technology wise.

 

[Blacklight]

Go that Brightspyre email 10 hours ago from university . And a message 3 4 days ago saying send your CVs regardless of posts, you will be considered in future. (Might be) this is the first or second such hiring (i think). Dont know anybody who is applying there atm.

If I were you, I would send my CV, and see how it goes. It could actually give be a career boost, in the long run.

I believe @Iron Shrappenel meant that:
1. Army has a system for this sort of thing.
2. For Aviation City PAF has a Wg Cdr running the site office.

Ah ok! Got it!

Well if its a Wg Cmdr who has been tasked with running site offices, then I wonder what he did to deserve it, and no wonder he is so bad at it

 

[Iron Shrappenel]

"Army has a serving Wing Commander" is a contradictory statement.

Btw it is "Site Office" not "Sight Office"

I meant the Aviation city building is run by a serving wing commander.... site or sight.... The first building left when coming from Islamabad next to the private hospital.... I apologize if the revelation hurt you... By your posts I thought you visit PAC and might have known....

If I were you, I would send my CV, and see how it goes. It could actually give be a career boost, in the long run.

Ah ok! Got it!

Well if its a Wg Cmdr who has been tasked with running site offices, then I wonder what he did to deserve it, and no wonder he is so bad at it

The previous one was good at his job.. a family guy who understood how to deal people ( respect ).... Current one not so much....

 

[Blacklight]

That CAD Job is grade 12 LOL. Its a joke.
Had a look at them. Those Design Engineers are at max FYP level jobs. CAD + FEM/CFD

Well there goes your dream of pulling out your id card and pulling rank on traffic cops. Oh well....


*just kidding*

I meant the Aviation city building is run by a serving wing commander.... site or sight.... The first building left when coming from Islamabad next to the private hospital.... I apologize if the revelation hurt you... By your posts I thought you visit PAC and might have known....

The previous one was good at his job.. a family guy who understood how to deal people ( respect ).... Current one not so much....

Not hurt at all my friend ! I'm used to such stupidity, we have too many Einsteins who even know the number of black holes in our galaxy, but cant see the elephant in front of them.

Anyways, it's a good thing that our younger gen has morals & principles, and I hope they stick by them, by the time they retire.

 

[SQ8]

Yes, I've heard from a few people about getting emails. But look at the jobs. Lots of administrative jobs. All of the technical jobs are low-level jobs (once you read the job descriptions). The technical jobs are either about CAD, FPGA, hardware operation, or vague things like ML and RF designer. All jobs have Bachelor's requirements - not even Masters. Looks like an attempt to fill an empty building rather than a well-thought out establishment of a research center.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Want to bet this eventually ends up as Faziya Housing Society at some point?

All of this is lack of having qualified people at the project head - the JF worked because of the Chinese guiding hand, in this case they look to be fumbling around without actual SMEs and Project management. Why? Because they want military and not civilians in charge who may be able to guide this better.