Political rights in China

[huzihaidao12]

Then there is the need to explain more complex. . . . . .

 

[conworldus]

why do so many Indian members care about the political rights in China. It is not your business.

 

[oceanx]

why do so many Indian members care about the political rights in China. It is not your business.

It's the business of whosoever interested - at least to ask questions and seek answers. Do Chinese in the PRC not care about the political winds blowing across Yankeeland?

You can, and should question their motivation, however.

There is nothing wrong with discourse.

 

[oceanx]

Buddy Rahul (no-Gandhi), I’ve answered you already. I totally agree with you on the three points. The only question is how to achieve that.

Indian type of democracy has definitely not able to achieve that. Repeat my answers:

...

If Indians wish for family dynasty, then go for it, but don’t laughably tell us India is democratic.

I’m not anti-India, as I repeated 1000 times. I’m anti foolishness and ignorance.

Family dynasty's merit and downside per se can still be subject to "辨证". Most would agree that its overall role in a nation's history should be transitory.

And it does depends on which family we are talking about. The Jiang dynasty in Taiwan brought prosperity (I am not going to argue with any 228ers), whereas the Kim dynasty in NK stagnation.

I also agree with (the sentiment from) a near-facetious argument that the best thing Americans did for China (aside from giving support during WWII) was the "providence"-guided incendiary bomb dropped on the Volunteers Headquarters in NK on Nov 25, 1950.

I am being somewhat facetious by the way.

 

[no_name]

Kim family are not under pressure like taiwan do. They can always count on china to bail them out. I personally think kim is spoiled. Old Chiang always dreamed of retaking china hence the difference.

 

[oceanx]

Kim family are not under pressure like taiwan do. They can always count on china to bail them out. I personally think kim is spoiled. Old Chiang always dreamed of retaking china hence the difference.

Perhaps you have a point I haven't considered.

 

[cera]

When you talk about political rights, you have to ask yourself does that really works for you? or it's just another way to fool yourself. For instance, yes, you have the rights, but does that give you the rights to stop many illegal wars launched by your presidents? The answer is NO. Think about it, would be nice to use that money for some most needed projects such as repaireing your out-dated highway system? Do you have the rights to stop the decision to delay your retirement age? The answer is also NO. Does that give you the rights to stop the increasing cost of living? You don't have these rights. You are just a bird in the cage. You can only play in the cage. That's what the policital rights and freedom you have in western countries.

On the other side, for those cummunist-haters, ask yourself, if there is a ruling party that lead your nation leap forward so much just in 30 years and greatly improved most of your people's living standard, and made them enjoy the life that they have never had before, would you vote for the party? If you're not biased, the answer is clear.

 

[ever4244]

Guys, I had this discussion a couple of days back with a friend and were comparing different forms of government - democratic, republic, authoritarian etc. The point where we got stuck was around political rights in non-democratic countries.

How do people exercise their political rights in China? By political rights I mean the right to complain against their government and if need be change it. In a democracy if the public ain't happy with one party they vote them out and bring somebody else in, for better or worse! But how do things work out in China? What options do the Chinese people have in case they aren't pleased with their government?
I am not going to bring in N. Korea as thats an extreme example. But China, being a capitalist (well, sort of) yet non-democratic country, I was curious to know about.

And I hope people don't take it the wrong way. Just wanted to know thats all. I could have Googled but I thought I should first hear it from the Chinese members in this forum who might have seen things first hand. So dccafe, conworldus, sinoindus, feifanke and the gang, what do you think?

P.S. If the Mods think this ain't the right forum for this topic, feel free to move it to the member's club. I wanted to get the attention of the Chinese members specifically, hence I posted it here.

Well, thats depends on conditions.

Condition1: If you feel certain discision taken by an admistration concerning yourself is inappropriate, you can file in an "administration litigation" against the aforementioned bureau. Since the nature of such case is against the administrative discision or administrative mismanagement, not against the bureaucrats themselves, the judgement will be conclude as the fate of desision or management itslef, along with reasonable compensation.

Condition2: If you discover certain public servants commit corruption, nonfeasance, dereliction of duty and crimes as such.You can anonymously file a letter to anti-corruption bureau under procuratorate of various level. The nature of such case is criminal offence, therefore the litigant is the procurator, the defendant is the accused official. The conclusion of such case is the guilt of certain official not the administration as a whole.

condition3: If you are not sure about the condition 1 and 2, you can file a letter to a certain bureau called"XinFangBan" senior to the administration you want to delate. This kind of bureau exist in many level of government and will generally accept virtually all kinds of of complaint against the junior administration within its domination. It can rectify the junior administrative desision by senior administrative injunction, it can also prosecute accused personal by transfer the case to procuratorate if crminal offences are concerned.

condition4: If you are unhappy with general policy or macroscopical decision of governments, your legal channel is to contact the "people's representative(congress men)" of the same or above level comparing with the aforesaided government. The representative will collect the complaint and bring up the interpellation in the congress. If the case is of wide public concern, the representatives may take a joint effort to push forward a bill recify the governmental policy within their domination.

Condition5: If you are a member of certain community, there are unions and partys you can turn to, like trader's union, worker's union, ect etc. They are significant political forces the Party has to reckon with and become more and more active in protecting the communal interests of their society in these days.

Condition6: Grey channels that too numerous to clearify.

 

[Brainwashed]

You are right on that in China, voting rights is lacking. However, you should understand this: no political system, democratic or not, can sustain without the support of the populous majority. If the system has lost the support of the majority, then it is a matter of time it will fall.

I can tell you this, the CCP still has the support of China's majority. In fact, last survey I remember showed 87% support. This is why the "political rights" is actually of very little importance in China. You can call it a tyranny, but it is the tyranny of the majority.

I don't know what kind of survey it is, but I'm pretty sure that's not "support". Chinese people are either afraid of getting themselves into trouble (that's our traditional "virtue") or know very little about what modern democracy is. Neither "fear" nor "ignorance" equals to "support".

There's an exception, though---Those who living in the system (which is many Chinese people's ultimate goal in life) truely support CCP. But it's hard to say if they should be categorized into "people" or "people's enemy", despite that they call themselves "people's servant".

 

[topjumper]

Guys, I had this discussion a couple of days back with a friend and were comparing different forms of government - democratic, republic, authoritarian etc. The point where we got stuck was around political rights in non-democratic countries.

How do people exercise their political rights in China? By political rights I mean the right to complain against their government and if need be change it. In a democracy if the public ain't happy with one party they vote them out and bring somebody else in, for better or worse! But how do things work out in China? What options do the Chinese people have in case they aren't pleased with their government?
I am not going to bring in N. Korea as thats an extreme example. But China, being a capitalist (well, sort of) yet non-democratic country, I was curious to know about.

And I hope people don't take it the wrong way. Just wanted to know thats all. I could have Googled but I thought I should first hear it from the Chinese members in this forum who might have seen things first hand. So dccafe, conworldus, sinoindus, feifanke and the gang, what do you think?

P.S. If the Mods think this ain't the right forum for this topic, feel free to move it to the member's club. I wanted to get the attention of the Chinese members specifically, hence I posted it here.

RobbieS: you have brought up a very interesting topic indeed! I highly recommend everyone to watch this UC Berkeley's interview with Mark Leonard, director of the think-tank: European Council on Foreign Relations,

He gave some very in-depth analysis of the chinese political system, the interesting part of the discussion starts at about 18mins into the video. In short he mentioned a very insightful observation -- rather than a simple dictatorship, the mechanics behind the chinese politburo is actually very complicated, many of its national strategic policies are not only set by the political elite but also heavily influenced by the top public think tanks and academics at elite universities in china, for example many strategic policies in china's five year development plans are put forward and reviewed by these public bodies, in Mark Leonard's words -- it's the intellectual elite class that sets china's strategies and policies, and inside this intellectual class there are plenty of open debates on which direction the country should be headed.

So the answer to your question is not simple and straight forward: no it is not a true democracy, but the intellectual elites of China can have a big influence in the government's key decisions. It should also be noted that this in a way has always been how china worked in its history: the intellectuals through stringent public examination system every year compete with each other at local and progressively national levels, those do well are awarded with high governmental posts, it's a very chinese way of doing things: "We'll listen to you if you can prove that you are smart". If you are nobody then your opinions are not really valued, sure it's not fair for everybody and very different from the western models and has lots of problems with it, but judging by its performance so far in a country with 1.3bln people, it has worked out ok with fingers crossed, how long that is going to continue is everyone's guess.