Phalanx Close-In Weapons Systems (CIWSs) -

[Penguin]

So,
what is the ending point.
are we getting this stuff or not?

Have you checked out any images of the F22Ps lately? Look around the hangar area: you will see a "Type 730B" CIWS set-up.

 

[nightcrawler]

How the viewers rate Phalanx system against supersonic antiship Brahmos??

Because I think its useless against the mentioned threat

 

[SnIPeR Xr]

How the viewers rate Phalanx system against supersonic antiship Brahmos??

Because I think its useless against the mentioned threat

Ya man it it is useless because you are a big Fan of soviet SS Ashms.Nothing can shot down your Ideal.

 

[Jigs]

Phalanx are generally good for SSM but when your talking about stuff like ballistic missiles or hypersonic cruise missiles good luck. There was something the naval institute came out with i was reading that said that carriers are pretty much scrap metal when it comes to defending against ballistic missiles. Since they have zero defense against them.

 

[nightcrawler]

Ya man it it is useless because you are a big Fan of soviet SS Ashms.Nothing can shot down your Ideal.

hehehe

Being fan is something different from being realistic.
ok let me calculate & show you why its useless
Phalanx effective range=1.5km=1500m
Brahmos speed= 8oom/s
Max ideal engagement time= ~2s
Max rate of fire Phalanx= 4500roundsperminute=75roundspersecond
Max ideal bullets towads approaching threat=~150

so I think you are shooting less than 150 bullets upon an object the size of your desktop screen ain't good at all
I think that is why US updated to SeaRam systems

 

[SnIPeR Xr]

hehehe

Being fan is something different from being realistic.
ok let me calculate & show you why its useless
Phalanx effective range=1.5km=1500m
Brahmos speed= 8oom/s
Max ideal engagement time= ~2s
Max rate of fire Phalanx= 4500roundsperminute=75roundspersecond
Max ideal bullets towads approaching threat=~150

so I think you are shooting less than 150 bullets upon an object the size of your desktop screen ain't good at all
I think that is why US updated to SeaRam systems

Did I said some thing about CIWS???

Look man in another thread you done the same thing of bringing Brahmos and the thread was about JF-17's Antiship capabilities which has nothing to do with Brahmos & obviously because of this the thread got derailed.Now you have started the same thing here.

Please for god sake leave this **** brahmos only for India defence section.
Let the members discuss something about Pakistan's acquition of CIWS & Pakistan's defence developments not.......

And by the way CIWS has nothing to do with Brahmos it is for Sea skimming & low flying targets.

No member mentioned Brahmos because it is not related to it but you are again doing the same thing of derailing this thread by bringing it.

By the way you always fulfill the post of Indian trollers or thread derailers In Pakistan defence Sections.

 

[nightcrawler]

Liked your attitude.............
but this time I ain't d-railing; just questioning the effectiveness of said weapon against known threats to Pakistan

No member mentioned Brahmos because it is not related to it but you are again doing the same thing of derailing this thread by bringing it.

According to the anti-ship missiles features dictated in the pamphlet I asked this question
Raytheon Company: Phalanx

 

[Penguin]

hehehe

Being fan is something different from being realistic.
ok let me calculate & show you why its useless
Phalanx effective range=1.5km=1500m
Brahmos speed= 8oom/s
Max ideal engagement time= ~2s
Max rate of fire Phalanx= 4500roundsperminute=75roundspersecond
Max ideal bullets towads approaching threat=~150

so I think you are shooting less than 150 bullets upon an object the size of your desktop screen ain't good at all
I think that is why US updated to SeaRam systems

Phalanx is cued by by radar and other means and can start firing at max effective range of 1500m. It then theoretically has max 2 second to detonate the missile (effectively more like 1 second, because closer in would be hazardous to the ship). Detonation kills the missile warhead but missile wreckage may still hit and damage the ship (e.g. missile debris and burning missile fuel). So I'ld say 75-100 rounds. These are no explosive rounds (i.e. no proximity fusing) but solid kinetic kill rounds.

Of course, the gun max range is not 1500m but 5500m (at a 45 degree angle). It should therefore be possible to start shooting somewhat earlier on, to improve chances of a hit. In fact: " In automatic control, the gun will prioritize the first six threats it sees at about 10,000 yards (9,100 m) and engage at 4,000 yards (3,600 m)." See: USA 20 mm Phalanx Close-in Weapon System (CIWS) That's more than twice the 1500m effective ranged used above and so more than doubles the number of rounds that can in theory be fired in the available time.

As for the target size, while Brahmos missile body diameter is about 60cm, Phalanx CIWS typically is placed high up on a ship's hull and would likely be firing at an increasingly steeper angle down onto the 8.4m long missile body rather than trying to catch it head on. And then add the fact that there are wing(lets) which mak the overal span 1.7m. Any way you cut it, the actual target area is far larger than 'your desktop screen' and increasing as the missile gets closer.

But clearly, given that latest Burke destroyers are not receiving Phalanx mounts at all (and also no [Sea]RAM launchers) but just ESSM and Standard missiles, the USN has adopted a missile-based pproach to deal with the threat of supersonic missiles.

 

[Penguin]

And by the way CIWS has nothing to do with Brahmos it is for Sea skimming & low flying targets.

CIWS deals with sea skimmers as well as high divers.

Brahmos is relevant in the sense that any supersonic missile poses a threat that smaller caliber gunbased CIWS will have greater difficulty dealing with. Hence, movement to larger caliber solutions (35mm Millennium gun) or guided projectiles (Strales: 76mm Oto Melara gun + Davide Munition) or missiles (SeaRam, Ram, ESSM)

 

[nightcrawler]

@Penguin

As for the target size, while Brahmos missile body diameter is about 60cm, Phalanx CIWS typically is placed high up on a ship's hull and would likely be firing at an increasingly steeper angle down onto the 8.4m long missile body rather than trying to catch it head on. And then add the fact that there are wing(lets) which mak the overal span 1.7m. Any way you cut it, the actual target area is far larger than 'your desktop screen' and increasing as the missile gets closer.

Extremely helpful posts; I have a questions about the max ceiling Phalanx is able to detect/counter the approaching missile in this case supersonic

 

[Jigs]

@Penguin

Extremely helpful posts; I have a questions about the max ceiling Phalanx is able to detect/counter the approaching missile in this case supersonic

I don't know about the ceiling but the max effective range is 3,600 m (11,800 ft) i would guess that would count in all directions.

 

[softtec]

Actually if u think Phalanx can engage mach 3 missile effectively, what will happen to 2-3 times slower missiles!! Here speed does matter a lot.

 

[SnIPeR Xr]

CIWS deals with sea skimmers as well as high divers.

Brahmos is relevant in the sense that any supersonic missile poses a threat that smaller caliber gunbased CIWS will have greater difficulty dealing with. Hence, movement to larger caliber solutions (35mm Millennium gun) or guided projectiles (Strales: 76mm Oto Melara gun + Davide Munition) or missiles (SeaRam, Ram, ESSM)

Obviously it can deal with.

But dont you think its better to limit CIWS only for seas skimmers.Especially when they starts their seaskimming phase.

I think its better to give the job of engaging threats like aircrafts or high speed,high altitude targets to the long range primary sam systems of the ship.
Two diferent systems performing two different functions is better or one system performing two different functions is better.

CIWS will help while engaging projectiles but a maneouvring target like brahmos whose primary job is to not let the ship to break its lock should be engaged with a LR high altitude sam.

But in certain cases you can also use CIWS in that role.

 

[Penguin]

Obviously it can deal with.

But dont you think its better to limit CIWS only for seas skimmers.Especially when they starts their seaskimming phase.

I think its better to give the job of engaging threats like aircrafts or high speed,high altitude targets to the long range primary sam systems of the ship.
Two diferent systems performing two different functions is better or one system performing two different functions is better.

CIWS will help while engaging projectiles but a maneouvring target like brahmos whose primary job is to not let the ship to break its lock should be engaged with a LR high altitude sam.

But in certain cases you can also use CIWS in that role.

As a commanding officer, I would use any and all means at my disposal to stop incoming AShM, irrespective of whether it is super- or subsonic.

 

[wangrong]