I dont exactly get it, how would you like religion to be taught by these institutions? Learning it, has been compulsory, from the montessory to higher education. I mean we get a Islamiat subject here in the B.E. too. And personally, I have noted a firm commitment and much enthusiasm from the teachers in teaching the religion, so it is an integral part of the Pakistani curriculum, besides having its influence in other subjects too. The problem doesn't appear to be the lack of education of religion again and I have a strange feeling that what you want to be taught in schools, colleges and universities isn't possible or may be too much young students who aren't being sent here to become a "Mullah". And state cant possibly spoon-feed everything, expecting that is not rational, much will always be left to individual and society in general. However, what it can and should do, is regulate the religion, like the Arab countries.
In other words, Islam should be treated like just another subject in the education system, right? Not once I have felt that education system of Pakistan have taught me Islam
in proper. I have found these efforts lacking and so have my family members who have history of being part of the education system of this nation. I am left to understand Islam on my own.
Once again, Islam is not some subject; it is a cultural phenomenon, a religion representing a societal order in its entirety. Its principles should be taught to people since childhood and syllabus should cover entire Holy Quran with translation, collections of authenticated hadith of Holy Prophet (PBUH), and Islamic history. The entire syllabus shall be consistent for the entire education system and teaching process span to several classes due to amount of content involved. The purpose of teaching Islam to Pakistani people is to make them informed about its ground realities
in proper and culturally groom them to be good Muslims and citizens of the nation in the aftermath. At minimum, the aforementioned proposed effort would ensure consistency in understanding and knowledge about Islam on societal level and would minimize confusion.
The proposed effort isn't unrealistic, it is the best way to teach Islam and its principles to the masses with consistency in syllabus and without compromise on the time spent on teaching secular education.
It is the responsibility of an Islamic state to teach Islam to its citizens in fair and consistent manner via its education system and not leave such an important role in the hands of irresponsible, misguided and corrupt individuals.
Lack of proper education of religion is indeed part of the problem because people without valid credentials manage to become religious instructors in Pakistan and exploit the naïve for personal gains under the guise of religious instruction. The only method to counter religious extremism is to use education system to conduct this role in the manner proposed above. Also, people will not turn into Mullahs from comprehensive instruction about Islam; they would rather shape into informed Muslims and will be unlikely to be led astray by the misinformed.
Spoon-feeding people everything is not my point, I am simply pointing out the responsibilities of an Islamic state. The state cannot regulate the religion without culturally grooming the entire nation for the religion via its education system; it will fail otherwise, and enemies of Islam will take advantage of this shortcoming.
I have said it before and I will say it again that majority in Pakistan lack proper knowledge of Islam and are Muslims only in name or with limited knowledge. Religious instruction is really lacking in the education system and corrupt individuals continue to exploit this situation for personal gains.
Now, that isn't what I am advocating for and I am quite sure that those "some" principles were really "some" in number, universal popularity, hundred percent approval rate isn't possible in this world for anything and this is just one more example of that.
Islamic principles are not inconsistent; people however are inconsistent in their beliefs and understanding of these principles, thanks in part due to lack of consistency in instruction of religion since the end of reign of rightly guided caliphs.
And who gives a damn about the world? I am focused on the situation of Pakistan.
Yes exactly, you haven't missed out on anything. By hanging over rigidly to one interpretation of the religion (mostly sect based but today, mixed with extremism), restricting their choices in the world and providing no worldly education whatsoever unlike schools (there are a few which do, but they are exactly "few" in number) they produce a breed of young children who are both narrow minded and radicalized, offering the terror groups with ready made recruits. That is what I am talking about, but I am sure you knew all this. After all, that is where both the Afghan Taliban and TTP, got and still get the 99% of their recruits. Speak of the disastrous results of producing more children than you can raise and handing them over to Madarsas, as a result. Only to find him/her of no good to the society but to merely a group of organizations who would later use them for the most nefarious purposes.
This is why the state needs to take the responsibility for religious instruction and cultural grooming of the nation. State is responsible for governing all facets of the nation including education and culture. This is why
ministry of education and
ministry of culture exist.
Leaving religious instruction on the hands of some individuals is a big mistake, that too in a nation in which lot of developments remain unchecked and Ministries are ineffective and/or not performing. This is the situation of Pakistan.
In a nation where religious instruction is left to individuals and not regulated by the state, radicals can gain power by indoctrinating large number of people with their misinformed views and become untouchable in this manner. Maulana Fazl-ur-Rehman (Diesel) is an example, a well-known sympathizer of Taliban. Nobody will dare to arrest him due to fear of reprisals of such an act.
Parents do give a damn, that is why they spent thousands to hire that religious tuitor, who is just one more Madarsa student mostly, who cant find employment elsewhere and hence chooses to stick to what he's best in and teaches the holy book as he has taught through the years. Nothing surprising if one looks at it, from the beginning.
Oh, they give so much damn that they cannot make time for teaching Islam to their children themselves; they would rather waste resources on so-called religious instructors who also don’t have much time to teach Islam properly to the children either. DAMNED is the right word.
Nothing surprising indeed…
Any solution in mind?
Or willing to consider the fact that consistent nation-wide religions instruction is required and this role can only be fulfilled by the education system of the nation?
If Madrassah in Pakistan are lacking in quality, they shall be reformed and integrated into the main education system of this country by the state (Yes, this is the responsibility of the state, not individuals). Next step should be the solution that I mentioned above regarding consistency in the syllabus of Islamic studies (another task that only state can perform, not individuals).
Still not getting it? You will never perhaps.
They do, that isn't very true for Pakistan though, is it? Neither Zia nor Bhutto, both of the leaders responsible for messing up things in Afghanistan and as a consequence, at home, weren't secular.
And both were under influence of? The (SECULAR) USA
Pakistan had joined the Allied Camp during the COLD WAR much earlier than the rule of these two leaders, under the leadership of Mr. Liaquat Ali Khan. The Soviet-Afghan war was an internal affair of Afghanistan and was about struggle between Afghan communists and opposition, Pakistan should have stayed out of it and managed the refugees instead of transforming it into a front of COLD WAR.
Unfortunately, Pakistan, still reeling from defeat in the 1971 war and resultant split-up, wanted to restore its pride and perceived the Soviet-Afghan war as an opportunity to do so with funding from USA. The effort had been officially marketed by the Allied Camp as JIHAD against USSR and Pakistan bought to the propaganda, ironic.
Find the results surprising?
No, not under the facade- he believes in a determined manner, that only his version of religion is real and on the right path and everyone else needs to be brought to it, they know more about religion than you, just the wrong kind of it. Thats not a facade, there exist interpretation of the religion which gives rise to radicalism and extremism and which has been supported by the "great scholars" of Islam. They can recite more verses from the holy book than you can, know about religious history and the Prophets, even recite you the sayings and the prayers in better Arabic accents than you. What they lack is humanity and time seems to tell, it doesn't come merely from learning about religion day and night.
I won’t boast about my knowledge of Islam but I am educated and informed enough to understand it in proper manner. I don’t need to depend upon other individuals to understand most of its principles; I have ample content under my disposal to learn about Islam. The resources at my disposal can be freely accessed by every individual who is interested; he or she just needs motivation and right aptitude.
The extremist interpretations have been effectively countered by research of certified Islamic scholars globally and their findings are also accessible online or in published literature. Common sense is needed to address confusion and misunderstandings in the interpretation of Islam; unfortunately common sense is not very common or is it?
I would also point out that Taliban is not entirely wrong in its interpretation of Islam; it is however selective in its adherence to Islamic teachings, an issue which is common among Muslims globally actually. Taliban’s interpretation of Islam is based on mix-up of some religious principles and patriarchy-oriented local customs of Afghanistan. You can learn more about Taliban from the book of Mullah Zaeef titled
My Life with Taliban.
Now, the Taliban that people often refer to was the formerly organized religious and cultural movement that had roots in Southern Afghanistan, but this movement lost its stability during the recent US-Afghan war. Followers eventually became disillusioned during the course of this war. Taliban no longer exists as an organized religious and cultural movement like it once used to be, it have degraded into splinter groups vying for power and influence much in the same way like during the Soviet-Afghan war. Foreign sponsors of terrorism have successfully infiltrated many of these splinter groups which is not surprising since these sponsors had infiltrated Afghanistan much earlier than this war and they continue to operate and misguide the victims of the war for their nefarious agendas. It’s a mess.
You talk about humanity? Every individual would forget about humanity after suffering from several years in a war.
Humanity thrives under stable conditions only, not during conditions that facilitate instability and insanity.
Do you even understand what Islam teaches people? In shortest terms, it promotes principles of decency such as morality, ethics and goodness, and forbids evils such as murder, corruption, and immorality.
Islamic teachings can reform nations, entire world actually. However, people are too selfish to accept Islam because people are addicted to evils and global promotion of Islam is beyond the capabilities of ordinary individuals.
Islam makes it clear that every individual would be answerable to Allah Almighty (God) for personal deeds during the event known as Judgment (Qiyamah), therefore people should fear the God and adopt the right path. Much earlier in history, Allah Almighty destroyed several nations that became accustomed to evil practices but Prophet Noah (PBUH) requested Allah Almighty to adopt a different method to deal with corruption of humans and Allah Almighty planned Qiyamah in response.
To put it simply, this nation was moderate in its outlook towards the religion. Only when a certain ideology would be imported to pave way for the Afghan Jihad, would the country go this way. Pakistanis were a better nation than today, everything everytime in discussion related to this country, is always better in the past sadly.
Do you mind if I ask a better question? Who initiated the Afghan Jihad? The Americans needed it because of their beef with the Soviet Union, in the cold war. But what exact stake, did Pakistan have in it? Besides the need for the $$, that is most obvious. And please, dont give me the outdated myth of warm waters and skies falling if God forbid the Reds succeded in bringing stability back to the Afghan regime, despite them helping us economically since again the 60's and a reapproachment was always possible there. Training Jihadis on this soil with an extreme version of religion was always going to backfire and sure it did proving the planners were myopic, unable of thinking long term and to foresee the consequences of their actions. They should have considered a limited engagement instead of full blown participation. Why blame the secular West for taking care of its national interest when it was Islamic Pakistan which couldn't choose what was right for her. Zia-ul-Haq kept the nation hooked up on the opiate of the masses and people were happy to support a Muslim ruler finally- a Commander of the Faithful so to speak.
Yes! Pakistani people had better sense of Islam back then.
In addition, Islam doesn’t have versions like Moderate, Extreme, and vice versa. Islam represents a moralistic cultural order with a good blending of strictness and rights related matters, and is consistent in its principles.
No, I do not mind the question. I have provided some information above but will elaborate further.
In Afghanistan, communists and opposition struggled for power during the era of COLD WAR. The opposition was religiously motivated and perceived communism as a threat to Islamic culture of Afghanistan, though it was not united in its efforts at that time. This political struggle continued however until the communists felt that they were losing power and influence across the country so they sought help from USSR to restore their control over Afghanistan after losing lot of territory to multiple opponents during the clashes. USSR eventually agreed to help Afghan communists to gain control of Afghanistan and send its army into the Afghanistan for this purpose. As this war began, the opposition formed an alliance and came to be known as mujahedeen. The mujahedeen used Pakistani territory to escape annihilation in Afghanistan and to regroup and rearm to continue the war effort. The refugee shelters in Pakistan for displaced Afghans served as recruiting grounds for mujahedeen. Some Pakistani also found common ground with mujahedeen in this war effort and supported them. But the support eventually became national after Zia made the decision to join the war effort against USSR in Afghanistan. USA and some other countries also decided to take advantage of this political dynamic in Pakistan and funded the war effort. In addition to Pakistani, some foreigners also joined the war effort against USSR (Osama Bin Laden included). The mujahedeen significantly grew in power with such foreign support and eventually managed to foil the plans of communists in Afghanistan, forcing USSR to retreat. However, neither Pakistan and nor USA had planned an exit strategy for this war and left Afghanistan to its fate after it ended. The mujahedeen also ended their alliance and began to fight each other for power and influence in Afghanistan, starting a violent civil war. This instability paved way for the Taliban led religious and cultural movement in Afghanistan to restore order and stability to the war-torn nation. The war continued in the NORTH of Afghanistan however since Northern Alliance proved to be virtually impossible to eliminate due to funding from India, Iran and USSR. Taliban unfortunately permitted foreigners to remain in Afghanistan and expand their operations virtually unchecked; these foreigners became sponsors of terrorism and used extreme methods to target US interests in the Middle East (e.g. Al-Qaeda Network). In addition, wars in Afghanistan not just radicalized many Afghans but also many Pakistani, promoted gun culture in Pakistan, and also increased the power or some Pakistani religious leaders who supported the mujahedeen and Pakistan army in their struggle against USSR.
9/11 happened, thanks in part to unchecked growth of sponsors of terrorism in Afghanistan, and USA attacked Taliban and its allies in Afghanistan in retaliation, routing both forces during OEF phase of the so-called War on Terror. However, many followers of these forces fled to Pakistan to regroup and recruit more people to join the war effort against USA. This time, Pakistan army sided with USA again under leadership of Musharraf but unwittingly. However, Taliban and foreign sponsors of terrorism found ample support in the radicalized segments of the Pakistani populace and Afghan refugees in Pakistan nonetheless, and TTP also came in to existence to combat Pakistan army. Not surprisingly Afghan war expanded into Pakistan but Taliban movements on both sides (Afghanistan and Pakistan) degraded into smaller groups under the pressure of modern warfare techniques for survival and they have resorted to extreme methods to tackle their designated enemies. In addition to this mess, war in Iraq coupled with mistreatment of POWs in prisons by Americans and Pakistani authorities further destabilized the Islamic belt and motivated thousands more to join the war effort against both USA and Pakistan and these developments collectively strengthened sponsors of terrorism and the problem continues to the day.
I have presented an overview of developments that promoted radicalism and terrorism in Afghanistan and Pakistan and wars in these countries are responsible for this mess not surprisingly. Iraq represents another good example of how wars can mess-up stability of a modern nation. Other factors have also contributed to the menace of terrorism in these countries (and globally) which include socio-economic injustice, lack of consistency in the syllabus of Islamic education for the masses in Islamic nation, and political disasters (which are ample).
NOTE: I don’t believe in “warm waters” BS either, if USSR wanted to reach warm waters, it could do so via Iran as well. Pakistan was not a requirement for this objective. This theory was promoted by the Allied Camp to motivate Pakistani nation to mobilize against USSR, and Pakistani people foolishly bought into it.
And no, I dont workship the West, I just admire it for a variety of reasons. Why expect them to come to your rescue everytime? Learn to solve your own problems, yourself. This is defeatist mindset of expecting them to make everything right for you, when you keep making wrong decisions and committing blunders.
WEST isn’t a good model for Islamic nations, it have problems of its own and its cultural concepts are not compatible with Islamic values.
This paper presents the ugly side of the WEST:
Sexual Revolution, Multiculturalism & the Rise of Neo-Progressivism
Pakistan can solve its problems, but it needs sincere leadership for this purpose. Unfortunately, secular policies have introduced politics of division in Pakistan, preventing a cohesive political leadership platform to emerge and work effectively in Pakistan as a consequence. Politics of division unsurprisingly facilitated growth of corruption in Pakistan and both factors have collectively facilitated socio-economic injustices in the country that continue to plague Pakistan. Socio-economic injustice is one of the leading causes of terrorism FYI.
Seculars hate no religion in particular, they just hate the infusion of religion with politics, which is found disastrous everytime and no offence, but its not the seculars or liberals blowing up or fighting against the state or maybe found shoveling what they believe in, down everyone's throat. Pakistan had been founded on religious grounds but later its founding father didn't exactly want the religious law to be the part of system of governance. But thats another debate. And no, I am not anti-Islamic, speaking against religious overdoses and asking for moderation shouldn't get me classified as such.
Secularists do hate religions actually. They uprooted Christianity in the WEST and they want to uproot Islam in Islamic nations as well.
The first step to uproot a religious culture is to promote it as an individualistic matter. Islam is a societal order, not a strictly individualistic practice. However, secularists want to assert otherwise because they find Islam too restrictive for their personal life-styles and pursuit of power. This is why they promote BS that infusion of religion with politics is disastrous. Next step is to conduct politics of division; PPPP; PML(N); PML(Q); MQM; PTI; APML; Women Rights; Mafia Rights; Lawyer Rights; Minority Rights; and vice versa.
Prove that Quaid-e-Azam didn’t intended Pakistan to be an Islamic state. This is another nonsense invented by secularists to delude Pakistani people and continue to confuse them in regards to the founding principles of this nation. Mr. Jinnah intended Pakistan to be friendly to minorities but retain Islamic identity. Their was no other reason to create Pakistan and split the sub-continent. Mr. Jinnah even disowned his own daughter for marrying a Parsi, go figure.
I am not yet convinced that you are not Anti-Islamic. Sorry.