Performance Report Aug18-Aug19 Shows More than 212 Million USD defence exports

[Sulman Badshah]

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

IIRC PAC's orders are coming from Boeing (offset from the 777 deal) and co-production from JF-17.

No excuse as to how or why HIT and POF dropped so, so rapidly. I mean, with POF, not even lucrative ammunition and Mk-8x GPB sales? It is really bad. Had HIT and POF performed up to capacity, we'd match India dollar-for-dollar in arms exports.

 

[Sulman Badshah]

IIRC PAC's orders are coming from Boeing (offset from the 777 deal) and co-production from JF-17.

No excuse as to how or why HIT and POF dropped so, so rapidly. I mean, with POF, not even lucrative ammunition and Mk-8x GPB sales? It is really bad. Had HIT and POF performed up to capacity, we'd match India dollar-for-dollar in arms exports.

yes
Numbers speak for PAC and newly formed pvt sector ..

HIT and POF should modernize themselves

 

[Philip the Arab]

yes
Numbers speak for PAC and newly formed pvt sector ..

HIT and POF should modernize themselves

I agree, POF especially should offer LGBs, and PGMs and a lot more even if developed with Chinese help.

 

[Tipu7]

IIRC PAC's orders are coming from Boeing (offset from the 777 deal) and co-production from JF-17.

No excuse as to how or why HIT and POF dropped so, so rapidly. I mean, with POF, not even lucrative ammunition and Mk-8x GPB sales? It is really bad. Had HIT and POF performed up to capacity, we'd match India dollar-for-dollar in arms exports.

Infact several PAC projects which were meant to introduce weapon platforms nascent in South Asia were capped due to reasonings like lack of requisite funds, disapprovals from higher commands etc etc.

While in case of HIT (not aware of POF) several old 'Baba Gs' did jugaars in tank production which compromised the fighting capability of an entire batch. I don't know action was taken or shortcomings were fixed or not. But it proves a significant capability difference between PAC and HIT, POF work force & management.

 

[HRK]

Had HIT and POF performed up to capacity, we'd match India dollar-for-dollar in arms exports.

This must be realised amount in last one year, as It was mention in last IDEAS exhibition that PAC alone have $600 million confirm orders for export

 

[Ark_Angel]

IIRC PAC's orders are coming from Boeing (offset from the 777 deal) and co-production from JF-17.

No excuse as to how or why HIT and POF dropped so, so rapidly. I mean, with POF, not even lucrative ammunition and Mk-8x GPB sales? It is really bad. Had HIT and POF performed up to capacity, we'd match India dollar-for-dollar in arms exports.

This was deemed to happen when you start treating SOEs as a Last Post Benefit slot for an outgoing 3 Star instead of running it professionally. Such a Large infrastructure just laying useless. We need to privatise them or restructure them on a commercial outlook. We can’t keep on importing new systems, weapons. It’s simply unrealistic for an underperforming economy to sustain such acquisitions.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

This was deemed to happen when you start treating SOEs as a Last Post Benefit slot for an outgoing 3 Star instead of running it professionally. Such a Large infrastructure just laying useless. We need to privatise them or restructure them on a commercial outlook. We can’t keep on importing new systems, weapons. It’s simply unrealistic for an underperforming economy to sustain such acquisitions.

It's really weird bro. I, for one, am OK with the armed forces being 100% shareholders in POF, HIT, etc, but why do generals have to run the day-to-day? Why not hire actual professionals (you can find Pakistani pros all over the world)? We can grow profits to hundreds of millions, or even billions, and they'll benefit from it via dividends. I mean, be unfair and all, but at least be competent Lol.

Infact several PAC projects which were meant to introduce weapon platforms nascent in South Asia were capped due to reasonings like lack of requisite funds, disapprovals from higher commands etc etc.

While in case of HIT (not aware of POF) several old 'Baba Gs' did jugaars in tank production which compromised the fighting capability of an entire batch. I don't know action was taken or shortcomings were fixed or not. But it proves a significant capability difference between PAC and HIT, POF work force & management.

PAC is moving to the Turkish model. It seems, medium-to-long-term anyways, the officers will sit back and leave the day-to-day to the right people. We'll see if they get there.

 

[The Ronin]

According to the Pakistan Ministry of Defence Production’s (MoDP) “First Year Performance Report,” the country had registered $212.6 million US in defence exports from August 2018 to August 2019.

Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) booked the highest value at $184.38 million US, which was followed by Pakistan Ordnance Factories (POF) at $7.13 million US and Heavy Industries Taxila (HIT) at $1.3 million US. In addition, private sector firms booked $19.36 million US in sales.

No additional breakdowns were provided by the MoDP.

It is likely that PAC’s exports were fueled by co-production work for FC-1/JF-17 sales to Myanmar and/or Nigeria. Though an agreement was signed with Turkey for the sale of 52 Super Mushshak basic trainers, it is unclear if PAC has started manufacturing these aircraft.

It is also unclear if PAC is registering the sale of Boeing 777 and 737 as ‘defence exports,’ which it has been manufacturing under an offset agreement with the US aerospace and defence giant since 2006.

POF had suffered a sharp collapse from its exports between 2017-2018 and 2018-2019.

According to the MoDP’s yearbook for 2017-2018, POF had registered sales of $58.15 million US (including a contract with Turkey for the sale of 1,000 PK-83 general purpose bombs). In 2016-2017, POF registered sales worth $67.8 million US, and in 2015-2016, it exported $93.68 million US in defence goods.

No explanation was provided as to why POF only achieved 12.3% of its export figures from the previous year, or, more alarmingly, the cause for the downward trend in exports since 2015-2016.

HIT’s exports likely comprised of the six ‘Interceptor’ light armoured vehicles it supplied to Bahrain.

The MoDP did not record export figures were recorded for Karachi Shipyard & Engineering Works (KSEW) or the National Radio Telecommunication Corporation (NRTC).

Notes & Comments:

Relative to capacity, Pakistan’s defence suppliers categorically underperformed. In fact, Bulgaria exported $844.3 million US in goods in 2018, while India booked $621 million US in sales for 2019-2020.

Though plagued with many constraints and challenges, the root cause of Pakistan’s lack of defence exports could be traced to a lack of institutional interest. This is apparent in the quality of the marketing, outreach, and lack of coherent product development and prioritization.

Be it deflating the efforts of the private sector or binding the modernization of defence production assets, such as POF’s small arms manufacturing, to armed forces requirements, Pakistani defence manufacturers will find it increasingly difficult to compete against more agile competitors.

Moreover, the armed forces’ general lack of interest in research and development (R&D), and alarmingly, joint R&D ventures with South Africa, Ukraine, and/or Turkey, will prevent the domestic industry from at any point offering its own competitive solutions.

The solution will ultimately have to start with changing the business leadership and management of these organizations to individuals with genuine product design, development, marketing and sales experience.

Under the current – yet slow and rigid – administration, change is not tenable, nor will Pakistan’s defence exports climb to figures that better suit the country’s heavy investment in the infrastructure.

https://quwa.org/2019/10/24/pakista...meiyO83IvqLSwIly-061Kb16NsLpYHc0UPN8dS3yPmAHY

 

[gangsta_rap]

!repost

 

[GHALIB]

very good for the economy of pakistan .

 

[TNT]

Need to work on defense exports. They are crucial not only for foreign income n jobs but also increase expertise in high end technology, it also helps alot in foreign policy. Need to increase defense export to muslim countries and others.

 

[JamD]

PAC is moving to the Turkish model. It seems, medium-to-long-term anyways, the officers will sit back and leave the day-to-day to the right people. We'll see if they get there.

PAC has/is hiring a LOT of PhDs, which is interesting considering sarkari idaras prefer bachelors levels people that can be molded into sarkari types easily. If they know what they are doing then they are doing exactly what you suggested: leaving the day-to-day to the right people (because PhDs are older people with stronger opinions and less tendencies to be career sarkari afsars). On the other hand, if PAC does not know what they are doing they will end up frustrating all these PhDs and force them to leave wasting everybody's time and money. Let's hope it's the former.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

PAC has/is hiring a LOT of PhDs, which is interesting considering sarkari idaras prefer bachelors levels people that can be molded into sarkari types easily. If they know what they are doing then they are doing exactly what you suggested: leaving the day-to-day to the right people (because PhDs are older people with stronger opinions and less tendencies to be career sarkari afsars). On the other hand, if PAC does not know what they are doing they will end up frustrating all these PhDs and force them to leave wasting everybody's time and money. Let's hope it's the former.

I heard about the PAC shifts from an ex-DGDP person at IDEAS 2018. What they told me was that at some point we asked the Turks 'what worked for them,' and they, basically, gave the equivalent of a tax audit, and not a very nice audit.

It was high level (as we didn't let them know much, but they guessed fairly well), and the PAF and PN took what they said to heart. So, when I say "reform," I basically mean copying the Turks: let experts run the day-to-day, and the armed forces will benefit from the profit and dividends.

Based on what they were saying at IDEAS, the PN is being the most aggressive on the reform front, e.g., inviting the private sector to invest in Gwadar Shipyards. It's slow due to the fact that literally no one had done this before in Pakistan, but CSIC, Damen Shipyards, and (purportedly) Daewoo are interested at various layers (the more Sino you get, the more military the application, and the more ROK/Japan, the more civil).

The PAF is being the most aggressive on the product design front, with a moderate -- but as you said, noticeable -- move on the reform front. Though Turkish Aerospace, Aselsan, et. al want in on PAC shares, they won't get any.

However, the 'crown jewels' of all this, so to speak, are HIT and POF. It's guaranteed production work, it's much simpler in scope (armored vehicles vs. planes/ships), and it's easier to shift turn-key production in those areas.

I literally heard it from a Turkish company, word-for-word, 'we will manufacture every component in Pakistan and source everything that can be sourced in Pakistan, with Pakistani labour, and re-invest in Pakistan, but only if we own the facilities.' So, for armoured vehicles at least, it's all or nothing for the Turks.

 

[Philip the Arab]

IMO this is ok for the size of the country. Jordan made at least 60 million USD(Probably double this with exports in Libya) this year and it is a much smaller country than Pakistan. Pakistan of course has a huge amount of tech more than Jordan will have in the near future.