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Palestinian Statehood: The UNSC Vote Count

@ Gounder
Why are you acting more Israeli than Israelis themselves do? People like you portray such a pathetic picture of India and Indians.Suppose I'm any Malaysian or Singaporean guy reading all these posts of yours etc ..What would I think? I would be like
"Dude,these Indians are such a$$ lickers of Israel.Don't they have self-respect?

Hold your tongue..I dont need to care what a Malaysian or a Singaporean thinks of me or my country supporting a nation that stood by us during the most critical time and supplies us critical tech those Malaysians or Singaporeans can only dream of. I am only looking after my country's interests and Israel-Palestine dispute is none of my bloody concern.

I had to comment since you guys dragged Malaysia's name into it :lol:

First of all most Malaysians are very very very pro-Palestinian (Israel is considered state enemy, no diplomatic relations), so my views don't represent anyone but myself. Singapore meanwhile I think is pro-Israel, I believe they have diplomatic relations and conduct military training together.

About sucking up, well almost every other day, I see some Indians sucking up to US and Israel while some Pakistanis suck up to Arab and China, so no issue on that, we all have our favorite countries. As for me personally, I couldn't be bothered about Israel or Palestine.
 
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I had to comment since you guys dragged Malaysia's name into it :lol:

First of all most Malaysians are very very very pro-Palestinian (Israel is considered state enemy, no diplomatic relations), so my views don't represent anyone but myself. Singapore meanwhile I think is pro-Israel, I believe they have diplomatic relations and conduct military training together.

About sucking up, well almost every other day, I see some Indians sucking up to US and Israel while some Pakistanis suck up to Arab and China, so no issue on that, we all have our favorite countries. As for me personally, I couldn't be bothered about Israel or Palestine.

Its not about any favourite country..lol you make Israel sound like Deepika Padukone... but its about us discerning on which stocks the returns are good or betting on which horse will give you the money. Israel or Palestine ? I'll pick Israel anyday.

These people are just stuck up in the 1970s and 1980s when the Indian Govt supported Palestine at the cost of Israel with no tangible benefit and it seems they are not willing to move on from that.
 
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Its not about any favourite country..lol you make Israel sound like Deepika Padukone... but its about us discerning on which stocks the returns are good or betting on which horse will give you the money. Israel or Palestine ? I'll pick Israel anyday.

Just googled Deepika Padukone's name. Saw images. Wow :blink:

Obviously Israel will give you more goods than Palestine as they are more developed, but sometimes it's not all about business. We have to support the ones in the right rather than wrong. By your logic, every country would have supported German Nazi in WW2 over the Jews, because hey, Germans definately can give more to them than the Jews could at that time.
 
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Just googled Deepika Padukone's name. Saw images. Wow :blink:

Obviously Israel will give you more goods than Palestine as they are more developed, but sometimes it's not all about business. We have to support the ones in the right rather than wrong. By your logic, every country would have supported German Nazi in WW2 over the Jews, because hey, Germans definately can give more to them than the Jews could at that time.

We did go to Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy and Imperial Japan at that time.

Google Netaji Subash Chandra Bose.

p.s.:- I dont think right or wrong governs the interests of any nation. Its jungle raj out there with the only motto being "survival of the fittest". Everyone for his own.
 
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We did go to Nazi Germany at that time.

Google Netaji Subash Chandra Bose.


p.s.:- I dont think right or wrong governs the interests of any nation. Its jungle raj out there with the only motto being "survival of the fittest". Everyone for his own.

Equating Netaji taking help from Nazis to India supporting Nazi Germany/ideology is plain silly
 
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How about you stop your one-liners that make no sense and factually contradict anything I said ?



Not all Indians have supported this.



No no, please dont do that. We are all here to learn from one another.

Do explain how vociferously supporting Palestine and ignoring Israel helped our cause one bit before the 90s and how recognising Israel damaged our relations with the Arab countries another bit.

While doing so please cut down on the "historically we have supported,soo....., independent policy,so...., satyameva jayate,so..... bits" and just elaborate the benefits we have got in pure geo-political,technological and military terms. Did we get any military technology from them ? Did they support us during any of the wars with Pakistan ? Did we get an endorsement of our position on Kashmir from them ? Did they support us in any other cause in any other international fora etc.

I am willing to take back my words if refuted with facts.

one read history . i am not here to give you a lecture on it when all you need to do is read up , especially as you have been commenting on issues which have been a part of India mid east policy for 50 yrs.
second if Israel is not bothered with the way we vote . whats got you in such a twist?
do you really think that diplomacy works this way?
we consult the Israeli and inform them about the way we would vote . then we do it . its been discussed behind closed doors . or is that a concept you have never encountered before ?
try reading the following
India’s Foreign Policy available from oxford uni press india.
or
Challenge and Strategy: Rethinking India's Foreign Policy
Published by Sage Publication

these will give you an working knowledge into the actions of the MEA .

also there is just no substitute for books . the INTERNET can never be one . join a library if you are truly interested in knowing how things work , research, educate your self . if not continue posting like you have mate .
 
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Equating Netaji taking help from Nazis to India supporting Nazi Germany/ideology is plain silly

Exactly my friend.

No one is supporting Israeli idealogy here. Even I dont like the hawks like Liebermann over there. But then it is the Israelis who produce the Baraks and not the Palestinians..right ?

Just like Netaji went to Nazi Germany because it had the capability to help India attain independence and not ostracise it just because it was not good we should support Israel because it has the capability to help India in agriculture,science and most importantly military. Also the Jewish lobby in Capitol Hill is quite influential and we do need US in the coming years given the increasingly belligerent China..

Our policy regarding any country need not be static or rooted in history. It needs to be dynamic and constantly evolving with time.

---------- Post added at 12:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:57 PM ----------

one read history . i am not here to give you a lecture on it when all you need to do is read up , especially as you have been commenting on issues which have been a part of India mid east policy for 50 yrs.
second if Israel is not bothered with the way we vote . whats got you in such a twist?
do you really think that diplomacy works this way?
we consult the Israeli and inform them about the way we would vote . then we do it . its been discussed behind closed doors . or is that a concept you have never encountered before ?
try reading the following
India’s Foreign Policy available from oxford uni press india.
or
Challenge and Strategy: Rethinking India's Foreign Policy
Published by Sage Publication

these will give you an working knowledge into the actions of the MEA .

also there is just no substitute for books . the INTERNET can never be one . join a library if you are truly interested in knowing how things work , research, educate your self . if not continue posting like you have mate .

Just move on saying you don't have anything to refute my assertions.

I asked a simple question what has the half century of vociferous support to Palestine and ostracising of Israel got India ?

Surely there must be some incidents that made you people so madly in love with Palestine....I have got my reasons to like Israel purely from the perspective of what it has done for India...have you got any reasons ?
 
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Exactly my friend.

No one is supporting Israeli idealogy here. Even I dont like the hawks like Liebermann over there. But then it is the Israelis who produce the Baraks and not the Palestinians..right ?

Just like Netaji went to Nazi Germany because it had the capability to help India attain independence and not ostracise it just because it was not good we should support Israel because it has the capability to help India in agriculture,science and most importantly military. Also the Jewish lobby in Capitol Hill is quite influential and we do need US in the coming years given the increasingly belligerent China..

Our policy regarding any country need not be static or rooted in history. It needs to be dynamic and constantly evolving with time.

---------- Post added at 12:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:57 PM ----------



Just move on saying you don't have anything to refute my assertions.

I asked a simple question what has the half century of vociferous support to Palestine and ostracising of Israel got India ?

Surely there must be some incidents that made you people so madly in love with Palestine....I have got my reasons to like Israel purely from the perspective of what it has done for India...have you got any reasons ?

its like talking to a wall:rofl: good luck kid:rofl:
 
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The irony is that Palestinians go to UN because they want to avoid negotiations and statehood. If Palestinians really wanted a state they could get it long time ago.
 
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Obama Making Final Push to Blunt Palestinian BidPublished September 21, 2011
| Associated Press


NEW YORK – President Barack Obama will publicly push for the Palestinians to drop a statehood bid when he addresses the U.N. General Assembly as he scrambled to head off a diplomatic clash.

Obama will follow up his speech Wednesday with separate meetings with Israeli and Palestinian leaders as he seeks to coax both parties back to direct peace talks.

At the same time, U.S. officials are conceding that they probably cannot prevent Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas from moving forward with a request to the U.N. Security Council for full Palestinian membership.

Recognizing that Abbas seems intent to proceed, Obama is expected to privately ask the Palestinian leader to essentially drop the move for statehood recognition after Abbas delivers a formal letter of intent to the U.N. on Friday.

"The president will say, frankly, the same thing in private that he'll say in public, which is that we do not believe that this is the best course of action for achieving Palestinian aspirations," White House deputy national security adviser Ben Rhodes said.

Obama will also meet Wednesday with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

The Obama administration has pledged to veto any Palestinian statehood bid, arguing that only direct peace negotiations, not a U.N. vote, would allow the Palestinians to achieve the benefits of statehood.

With peace talks stalled, the U.S. and international partners have been negotiating intensely this week over the steps it would take to bring the two sides back to the negotiating table.

The new approach being considered would see the "quartet" of Mideast peace mediators -- the U.S., European Union, United Nations and Russia -- issue a statement addressing both Palestinian and Israeli concerns and setting a timetable for a return to the long-stalled peace talks, officials close to the diplomatic talks said.

Israel would have to accept its pre-1967 borders with land exchanges as the basis for a two-state solution, and the Palestinians would have to recognize Israel's Jewish character if they were to reach a deal quickly, officials close to the talks said. The officials spoke on condition of anonymity to discuss ongoing diplomacy.

The White House publicly appeared to hold out slight hope that enough progress could be made to stop Abbas from formally requesting statehood recognition.

"President Abbas has indicated his determination to go to the Security Council, so we take him at his word on that," Rhodes said.

The simmering situation is far from the scenario Obama envisioned when he spoke at the U.N. one year ago.

"We should reach for what's best within ourselves," Obama said last September in pushing for negotiated agreement on a sovereign Palestinian state. "If we do, when we come back here next year, we can have an agreement that will lead to a new member of the United Nations."

While the Palestinian statehood bid has overshadowed Obama's time at the U.N., he is also expected to use his speech to the international body to reflect on the sweeping changes in the world over the past year, most notably in the Arab world.

Rhodes said the president also would highlight significant foreign policy developments for the U.S., such as drawing down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, as well as the killing of al Qaeda terrorist leader Usama bin Laden.

Obama on Wednesday also planned to hold bilateral meetings on the sidelines of the U.N. General Assembly. He was to meet with leaders from Britain, France, Japan and South Sudan, the world's newest nation.
 
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What would this mean for Palestinian people? Hamas is not even on board and that's half of Palestine. UN is a toothless organization.
 
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We did go to Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy and Imperial Japan at that time.

Google Netaji Subash Chandra Bose.

p.s.:- I dont think right or wrong governs the interests of any nation. Its jungle raj out there with the only motto being "survival of the fittest". Everyone for his own.

What are you talking :confused: Looks like you have taken it to your ego to prove yourself right!!
 
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PS. Good to see that unlike Indian bloggers here the Indian govt. is likely to vote in favor of Pals.

India has always supported the Palestinian people - a part of India's NAM policy. Palestinians were welcome to study in Indian Universities. Arafat was a good friend of the Gandhis. FYI, India was against the creation of Israel and it was only after Arafat shook hands with Rabin that GoI finally developed overt diplomatic relations with Israel in 1992!

Although many Indians here support Israel for very obvious reasons (to a sane mind), Palestinians are also looked upon as friends, especially the PLA. India was, is and will always be against HAMAS.

---------- Post added at 03:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:38 PM ----------

But what a joke! The sole superpower, the emperor is so afraid of losing even the fig leaf of 'honest broker' that all kinds of bribes and arm-twisting is being employed to PREVENT even a vote!

What, in your mind, do you think is the reason for US to oppose the vote? Apart from the "lobby" (as you put it), that is.
 
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I asked a simple question what has the half century of vociferous support to Palestine and ostracising of Israel got India ?

Israel was never ostracized by India. Infact, India did have covert relations with Israel with the latter helping India during its previous conflicts.

Strange as it sounds, some international relations are altruistic in nature. Indian support for Palestinians is one such example.
 
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