Pakistan's Service Rifle (G-3, Type-56) Replacement Competition 2016.

[Zarvan]

Hi,

For pakistan---scar should be for special forces---and not for regular troops---. This rifle is too expensive.

The serbian rifle is good---and the price around $500 for a large order would be the way to go. It is in the 5.56 caliber with an AK type mechanism---.

Remember---the higher the price of the rifle---the higher the bakhsheesh in the deal.

Sir we are testing FN SCAR for infantry and company is more than willing to give with TOT. Most probably 50000 will be bought from company and rest will be produced at POF. As for affordability well we are testing this because we can afford it.

 

[MastanKhan]

Mastan Sahab. Please do a little research before posting. The Seribian M-21 is being tested with 7.62x51 ammo. 556 is not on the cards.

We can afford Scar for our regulars if it comes out on the top.

Hi,

I re-checked---it is the Zastava M77 in .308----I am very familiar with the rifle---I used to own one---made by Valmet / Finland---many a years ago----. It was the Valmet M76

I could hit bulls eye at 100 yards without a scope---when my eyes were sharp.

This one for the .308 and the AK for the smaller bore are the best buy for the regular troops----. AK would be under 500 dollars a copy---this one under 600 a copy.

The Scar is too expensive for the military----it is fine with the special forces---but the M77 is a workhorse----.

Both the scar and and the M77 can hit a man at 300 yards---the M77 is much much cheaper to operate---basically an AK design---but much refined.

There is another benefot with going with the Zastava---the serbs have a whole defence industry and that would be a big asset for joint ventures---.

I would like to own another M77.

Sir we are testing FN SCAR for infantry and company is more than willing to give with TOT. Most probably 50000 will be bought from company and rest will be produced at POF. As for affordability well we are testing this because we can afford it.

Son,

You need to stop talking and start listening----. Just because you have a few dollars jumping around in your pocket does not mean that you need to spend it.

The minimum cost of the scar is going to be 2500---2750 a copy---.

The minimum cost of the M77 could be around 800 dollars. There is nothing that an M77 cannot do what the scar does for regular troops.

Just because it is 3.25 times more expensive---it does not give a 3.25 times better org-asm---.

You kids need to get out of this mind set of SHOW & POMP---you need to understand what reality is---.

If the M77 passes the test---then that is the absolutely the best deal---. It is an absolute workhorse---.

I am going to check if I can find one here in the U S.

 

[Mutakalim]

Hi,

I re-checked---it is the Zastava M77 in .308----I am very familiar with the rifle---I used to own one---made by Valmet / Finland---many a years ago----. It was the Valmet M76

I could hit bulls eye at 100 yards without a scope---when my eyes were sharp.

This one for the .308 and the AK for the smaller bore are the best buy for the regular troops----. AK would be under 500 dollars a copy---this one under 600 a copy.

The Scar is too expensive for the military----it is fine with the special forces---but the M77 is a workhorse----.

Both the scar and and the M77 can hit a man at 300 yards---the M77 is much much cheaper to operate---basically an AK design---but much refined.

There is another benefot with going with the Zastava---the serbs have a whole defence industry and that would be a big asset for joint ventures---.

I would like to own another M77.



Son,

You need to stop talking and start listening----. Just because you have a few dollars jumping around in your pocket does not mean that you need to spend it.

The minimum cost of the scar is going to be 2500---2750 a copy---.

The minimum cost of the M77 could be around 800 dollars. There is nothing that an M77 cannot do what the scar does for regular troops.

Just because it is 3.25 times more expensive---it does not give a 3.25 times better org-asm---.

You kids need to get out of this mind set of SHOW & POMP---you need to understand what reality is---.

If the M77 passes the test---then that is the absolutely the best deal---. It is an absolute workhorse---.

I am going to check if I can find one here in the U S.

Another thing which amuses me is their level of confidence without using any of the above mentioned rifles.

 

[Zarvan]

Hi,

I re-checked---it is the Zastava M77 in .308----I am very familiar with the rifle---I used to own one---made by Valmet / Finland---many a years ago----. It was the Valmet M76

I could hit bulls eye at 100 yards without a scope---when my eyes were sharp.

This one for the .308 and the AK for the smaller bore are the best buy for the regular troops----. AK would be under 500 dollars a copy---this one under 600 a copy.

The Scar is too expensive for the military----it is fine with the special forces---but the M77 is a workhorse----.

Both the scar and and the M77 can hit a man at 300 yards---the M77 is much much cheaper to operate---basically an AK design---but much refined.

There is another benefot with going with the Zastava---the serbs have a whole defence industry and that would be a big asset for joint ventures---.

I would like to own another M77.



Son,

You need to stop talking and start listening----. Just because you have a few dollars jumping around in your pocket does not mean that you need to spend it.

The minimum cost of the scar is going to be 2500---2750 a copy---.

The minimum cost of the M77 could be around 800 dollars. There is nothing that an M77 cannot do what the scar does for regular troops.

Just because it is 3.25 times more expensive---it does not give a 3.25 times better org-asm---.

You kids need to get out of this mind set of SHOW & POMP---you need to understand what reality is---.

If the M77 passes the test---then that is the absolutely the best deal---. It is an absolute workhorse---.

I am going to check if I can find one here in the U S.

Sir you need to calm down and listen. If we would have been interested in cheaper option than we would have went for MPT-76 or Chinese QZB-03 or even look at new Indonesian Rifle SSX. Testing Guns like FN SCAR and Berreta ARX 200 shows we are not looking to go for cheaper stuff. We want the BEST for our BEST.
@DESERT FIGHTER @kaonalpha @Horus @Khafee

 

[kaonalpha]

We are a very rich army as compared to our eastern neighbors but it's internal politics that prevents us from doing what is right. That and they're is an obsession with launching DHA in every nook and cranny of the country. The amountof taxes we draw from residents is enoughto raise 3 new armoured strike corps and that's a fact.This time the chief knows that

"Hond mine Koch nahi kya to bakyo NE kha pi ke moj orani heh"

Sir you need to calm down and listen. If we would have been interested in cheaper option than we would have went for MPT-76 or Chinese QZB-03 or even look at new Indonesian Rifle SSX. Testing Guns like FN SCAR and Berreta ARX 200 shows we are not looking to go for cheaper stuff. We want the BEST for our BEST.
@DESERT FIGHTER @kaonalpha @Horus @Khafee

 

[Zarvan]

We are a very rich army as compared to our eastern neighbors but it's internal politics that prevents us from doing what is right. That I they're is an obsession with launching DNA in every nook and crazy of the country. The amountof taxes we draw from residents is enoughto raise 3 new armoured strike corps and that's a fact.

Sir I know this tell this to other members who think we would not got for FN SCAR because it's two expensive. By the way I started a thread on Indian Defence Forum and they are way to funny.

 

[kaonalpha]

Sir I know this tell this to other members who think we would not got for FN SCAR because it's two expensive. By the way I started a thread on Indian Defence Forum and they are way to funny.

Look Zarvan the other members have a justifiable reason. FN scar might not be picked if there are strings attached. There are 101 reasons that have to be throughly gone over again and again.Specially when we are capable of blowing 9 billion on useless Chinese trucks

 

[Zarvan]

Look Zarvan the other members have a justifiable reason. FN scar might not be picked if there are strings attached. There are 101 reasons that have to be throughly gone over again and again.Specially when we are capable of blowing 9 billion on useless Chinese trucks

Well yes they can have reasons but at least company policy on website states they are ready to share it with TOT. Still first step is to pass the tests and I hope to see the results in next 5 to 6 months

 

[Quwa]

We are a very rich army as compared to our eastern neighbors but it's internal politics that prevents us from doing what is right. That and they're is an obsession with launching DHA in every nook and cranny of the country. The amountof taxes we draw from residents is enoughto raise 3 new armoured strike corps and that's a fact.This time the chief knows that

"Hond mine Koch nahi kya to bakyo NE kha pi ke moj orani heh"

Sir when the country itself can generate some $15 *billion USD* for debt servicing within a *single year*, it is evident that the economy has the foundations to fund development and defence. It's like seeing a C-grade kid do his math homework, he gets the answers by just looking at the questions, but when exam time comes, well ...

 

[Amaa'n]

Sir you need to calm down and listen. If we would have been interested in cheaper option than we would have went for MPT-76 or Chinese QZB-03 or even look at new Indonesian Rifle SSX. Testing Guns like FN SCAR and Berreta ARX 200 shows we are not looking to go for cheaper stuff. We want the BEST for our BEST.
@DESERT FIGHTER @kaonalpha @Horus @Khafee

did you consider the possibility of SCAR - H being there in the trails for just being the benchmark?? after all it is said to be the best of the best - as claimed by many --- so if i was the one on team, would have selected one rifle to set the benchmark and rest for the trails --- that how others are going to compete against this ------ this factor is going to rise up even if SCAR - H wins the trail that what is the Cost - benefit ratio ---- it has to Cost- benefit analysis will be conducted to justify the Recommendation of SCAR - H against others ---- if i have million ruppee in my pocket doesn't really mean i go out and buy myself 300k 1911 .45 when clearly a Taurus 1911 for 130k can give me approx same results ----

 

[Zarvan]

did you consider the possibility of SCAR - H being there in the trails for just being the benchmark?? after all it is said to be the best of the best - as claimed by many --- so if i was the one on team, would have selected one rifle to set the benchmark and rest for the trails --- that how others are going to compete against this ------ this factor is going to rise up even if SCAR - H wins the trail that what is the Cost - benefit ratio ---- it has to Cost- benefit analysis will be conducted to justify the Recommendation of SCAR - H against others ---- if i have million ruppee in my pocket doesn't really mean i go out and buy myself 300k 1911 .45 when clearly a Taurus 1911 for 130k can give me approx same results ----

Sir 14 companies wanted to come we invited these 5. Sir I know Army Guys they made calculations before starting trials. If cost would have been that much consideration they would have tested MPT-76 and Chinese Gun. I am pretty sure FN SCAR is not their just as a showpiece or benchmark. It's their because we are interested in making this our standard rifle.

 

[MastanKhan]

Sir you need to calm down and listen. If we would have been interested in cheaper option than we would have went for MPT-76 or Chinese QZB-03 or even look at new Indonesian Rifle SSX. Testing Guns like FN SCAR and Berreta ARX 200 shows we are not looking to go for cheaper stuff. We want the BEST for our BEST.
@DESERT FIGHTER @kaonalpha @Horus @Khafee

Hi,

Learn--not to mix INEXPENSIVE with CHEAP---. Inexpensive does not mean that it is not a quality product.

You need to understand that for the SCAR you are paying NOT FOR THE RIFLE but for the lifestyle of BELGIUM---.

You are paying for the high hourly wage and the social welfare cost of that nation.

For the Zastava---you are paying for a lower cost of living of the serbians.

GDP per capita for Belgium is around $43,000 / year

GDP per capita for Serbia is around $14,000 / year

What you are talking about is the same thing the British aristocracy never understood for a long time that why the american aristocracy were happy with their Remington---Savage and Winchester hunting rifles rather than the expensive Churchill or the Purdeys or other likewise---.

 

[Amaa'n]

Hi,

Learn--not to mix INEXPENSIVE with CHEAP---. Inexpensive does not mean that it is not a quality product.

You need to understand that for the SCAR you are paying NOT FOR THE RIFLE but for the lifestyle of BELGIUM---.

You are paying for the high hourly wage and the social welfare cost of that nation.

For the Zastava---you are paying for a lower cost of living of the serbians.

GDP per capita for Belgium is around $43,000 / year

GDP per capita for Serbia is around $14,000 / year

What you are talking about is the same thing the British aristocracy never understood for a long time that why the american aristocracy were happy with their Remington---Savage and Winchester hunting rifles rather than the expensive Churchill or the Purdeys or other likewise---.

Sir, let it go, no point arguing over here --- my fight over here was actually not about which rifle is the best but about the thinking that ' since XYZ item is expensive, then somehow it is the best aswell & we MUST buy it, and rest of the weapons here, that are being used by the Armies around world is cheap and not worthy "----

 

[Zarvan]

Sir, let it go, no point arguing over here --- my fight over here was actually not about which rifle is the best but about the thinking that ' since XYZ item is expensive, then somehow it is the best aswell & we MUST buy it, and rest of the weapons here, that are being used by the Armies around world is cheap and not worthy "----

Sir question is not about Which Gun !!!! I would be happy if Berreta ARX-200 or CZR 806 are selected. I have issues with AK-103 M21, but my point is if we were looking for cheaper alternatives none of this Gun would have been on the list. Cheaper alternatives would have meant testing MPT-76 or Chinese or Indonesian Gun or some other one . I also know something's in Army they would have calculated everything before started testing. They know the price so what ever Gun passes tests than hardly any more negotiations will take place, and soon deal would be signed. So question is which gun will pass tests ? @MastanKhan

 

[proka89]

I have issues with AK-103 M21

Would you be kind to share those issues with us?