Pakistan's 'secret' war in Baluchistan

[Awesome]

I am curious to know why this person Hamid Mir is allowed to write all these things if he is so wrong? If he is supporting a 'traitor' why is he not challenged by the GoP? or the security agencies or the Army?

Didn't you see the obvious anti-Musharraf stance? Musharraf's opponents are ready to sell their mothers to anti-Pakistani forces as long as it means throwing some dirt on him.

Hamid Mir has a big axe to grind against Musharraf.

 

[qsaark]

Didn't you see the obvious anti-Musharraf stance? Musharraf's opponents are ready to sell their mothers to anti-Pakistani forces as long as it means throwing some dirt on him.

Hamid Mir has a big axe to grind against Musharraf.

I am not talking about Musharraf's opponents. They are all traitors, I know that. I am only talking about the GoP, the security and intelligence agencies and the Army. Allowing people like Hamid Mir to write in favor of people like Bugti and get it published in National News Papers comes under 'assisting the crime and the criminal'. A person like him must be challenged in the courts of law or in the Army Courts for all his traitor-like activities. And if he is not challenged, than there will be a number of people who will have no choice to believe in his 'stories'.

 

[Awesome]

I am not talking about Musharraf's opponents. They are all traitors, I know that. I am only talking about the GoP, the security and intelligence agencies and the Army. Allowing people like Hamid Mir to write in favor of people like Bugti and get it published in National News Papers comes under 'assisting the crime and the criminal'. A person like him must be challenged in the courts of law or in the Army Courts for all his traitor-like activities. And if he is not challenged, than there will be a number of people who will have no choice to believe in his 'stories'.

The new government is banking on the infamous Pakistani public's amnesia and scoring points against Musharraf.

In the process they are making a hero out of the traitor, a symbol to give to the Baloch people to hate Pakistan... All because of his anti-Musharraf stance. The government wont care... He has their blessings.

The evidence is there, that he mentions Musharraf in his very first sentence.

Lets be real, the cases against Musharraf are nothing but the lynch mob - each trying to get back at him.

 

[qsaark]

The new government is banking on the infamous Pakistani public's amnesia and scoring points against Musharraf.

In the process they are making a hero out of the traitor, a symbol to give to the Baloch people to hate Pakistan... All because of his anti-Musharraf stance. The government wont care... He has their blessings.

The evidence is there, that he mentions Musharraf in his very first sentence.

Lets be real, the cases against Musharraf are nothing but the lynch mob - each trying to get back at him.

Well, Musharraf is an ex-CinC. Why Army is so quite if what Hamid Mir is writing is nothing more than the character assassination of their ex-CinC? In fact, if I remember correctly, Hamid Mir has been writing similar kind of ‘stories’ even during the time when Musharraf was in power. Even during those days he was never challenged in the courts for slander. I think the Army did not set a good precedence by allowing traitor-sympathizers to write whatever they pleased to write and misguide the masses. This is a simple case of slander, and Army and Army sympathizers must try to stop Hamid Mir and others like him. Where so many get abducted in the name of National Security by the agencies, why not one more who is causing so much damage to the country and the Army.

Unless of course, there is something ‘real’ about what he reports, Gosh, I don’t know. As it is said that "Rai hoti hey to rai ka pahar banta hey".

 

[qsaark]

Kzpla4zOnas[/media] - Baloch and Balochistan - the true story (50 minute - 16 august 2009)

 

[qsaark]

50 Minute – 19th September 2009 - Balochistan:

http://pkonweb.com/tag/50-minute-with-abdur-rauf-on-geo-aug-29-‘09/

 

[AAMIRKHAN]

Many ethics in balochistan and trying to create voilence and distrub the govt.and killing others peoples who speak other mothertounge.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Akbar Bugti’s killing: Niazi says Musharraf won’t be netted​

Thursday, October 08, 2009
By Mumtaz Alvi

ISLAMABAD: Former federal law minister Dr Sher Afgan Niazi on Wednesday said that he still hardly saw any chance of ex-military ruler General (retd) Pervez Musharraf being held accountable for the events, which led to the killing of Nawab Akbar Bugti.

“You must remember one thing that Musharraf is not like Bhutto, who was executed for launching Pakistan’s nuclear programme. Musharraf’s case is totally different, as he had taken action to quell the insurgency in Balochistan,” he said, when this correspondent sought his comment on the Balochistan High Court’s order for filing of an FIR against the former president.

The veteran politician from Mianwali emphasised that Musharraf in no way could be held accountable for his actions, which included the military operation against what he called insurgents in Balochistan.

Dr Niazi wondered had the people forgotten that how the state assets were being destroyed in a chain of subversive acts and missiles came down on PPL and Wapda assets, and even personnel of the paramilitary forces were attacked.

“When measures are taken to combat such activities, people are killed often. But this does not mean the ex-head of state, who also has been the chief of the Army staff, would be interrogated,” the former law and parliamentary affairs’ minister contended.

“I don’t think, the matter will move forward as being desired by anti-Musharraf camp,” he maintained. He added Musharraf himself had once said he was not alone in taking policy decisions.

Regarding the BHC’s order, he was of the view that the court was supposed to call for filing of a case against Musharraf and some of the key functionaries of that set-up. He declined to elaborate his observation.

Akbar Bugti’s killing

===========

Some good arguments by Niazi against the suggestion that 'Musharraf be tried for murdering Bugti'. Musharraf was the head of state, and as head of state he had to take action against an individual that was using violence against the state, its representatives and its infrastructure - that was Musharraf's job, and he was completely within his rights to take the course of action he did.

 

[All-Green]

Well, Musharraf is an ex-CinC. Why Army is so quite if what Hamid Mir is writing is nothing more than the character assassination of their ex-CinC? In fact, if I remember correctly, Hamid Mir has been writing similar kind of ‘stories’ even during the time when Musharraf was in power. Even during those days he was never challenged in the courts for slander. I think the Army did not set a good precedence by allowing traitor-sympathizers to write whatever they pleased to write and misguide the masses. This is a simple case of slander, and Army and Army sympathizers must try to stop Hamid Mir and others like him. Where so many get abducted in the name of National Security by the agencies, why not one more who is causing so much damage to the country and the Army.

Unless of course, there is something ‘real’ about what he reports, Gosh, I don’t know. As it is said that "Rai hoti hey to rai ka pahar banta hey".

Well he is quite a crooked crow and will always use the ambiguities to cast a negative or positive light on the character he wishes to discuss...

But it is true that most people have both merits and demerits and some people are pivotal leaders of a nation but in the end do more damage to it than the more traditional enemies...

Akbar Bugti was definitely someone who was not hesitant to do anything and everything against the state if his hold and grasp on his domain was threatened...he did nothing concrete to develop his area and educate his people...in that he is the run of mill Sardar who wants an army of thugs around him and is unwilling to give them a better life and lose his standing army...

The Rape case of Dr. Shazia is a highly mismanaged affair and no attacker was identified since the victim was blindfolded, do you honestly think that all this happened because of a rape?
Rape is a truly monstrous crime but happens all over the world, even in Baluchistan it has happened before, so did Bugti stand up for all the other victims?
To twist a rape case in which the victim did not even see her attacker and use it to perpetrate an armed rebellion is quite a strange thing in my opinion...it is a sham and it cannot be the real reason for Akbar Bugti's actions against the state...

I am all for punishing the attackers, hang them high regardless of who they are...but is armed rebellion the way to go and will it help the victim?
I am sure Bugti was, and all other sardars and politicians are still influential enough to help such victims in getting justice without resorting to an armed rebellion and shifting the focus somewhere else...this is exactly what the rebellion did so i have severe doubts about the link of Bugti's rebellion to the rape case...

The Army is quite strict with its own and does not let them off the hook when complaint is received but in this case i think it was PPL which mismanaged the affair, clearly the evidence needed to be gathered and a lot of investigation had to be carried out, this was not done and after so many days the case only became weaker in terms of identifying the criminals...the entire management of PPL shares the blame for this...i am sure if they had pushed for it there was no way that the case would not have progressed...

What Dr. Shazia alleges may or may not be true in its entirety, her version states that medical staff helped drug her and keep her unconscious for three days after the event...the thing to note is that she did not see any of her attackers...

The name of a certain captain popped up without any evidence whatsoever and certainly was just an excuse for Bugti to justify his actions...was the captain seen or heard...no...he was just suspected...i mean i sympathize with the Doctor if she was indeed raped and i give a damn about the captain if he was the actual attacker but the doubts have to be cleared first and then we can judge...

What prompted Bugti to jump the gun for a woman without clear evidence?
All know him to be a cold and calculated man...i am sure he was no hothead who suddenly developed a passion to rescue a damsel in distress...rescue could have been the tremendous political pressure but no the Bugti clan went for the jugular and tried to cripple the state by targeting the natural resources and the support structure...in this he became a traitor even if we suspect him to be genuinely upset over Dr. Shazia case...which is unlikely but still does not change the fact that what he perpetrated in the end was high treason against Pakistan...

This makes even the Rape almost a setup when judged from Bugti's entirely disproportionate reaction...however i would still say that i do not make a 100% confident statement that the rape was a setup...to do so without proof is folly, however to conclude otherwise without proof is also folly...

This is where a shark like Hamid Mir comes in who makes his solid conclusion based on a commentary on such vague motives and unresolved issues, motives which i think Allah only knows...

Giving the Bugti affair an ethnic flavor and making him sound like the victim is a very stupid and dangerous thing to do right now...when we have a group like TTP up against the state by claiming a holy cause we cannot be soft towards any rebel...
We cannot show double standards and embrace one rebel as a victim...this is not what a nation hoping to survive this storm can afford to do...
I truly am sad that this happened and Bugti did not instead become the Sardar who made a positive change even though he did not start out as anti Pakistan...however my laments do not change the fact that he chose to tread the path towards destruction...

Musharraf was not a total dictator like Zia, Musharraf was much more flexible and Bugti could have resorted to other means if his intent was truly to seek justice in the Dr. Shazia case...

 

[PAFAce]

It's incredible that debates surrounding Balochistan always ends with the same names, Bugti and Musharraf. Or, if not that, then it's about pre-Pakistan India and Bugti/Jinnah.

I am interested in knowing what the Balochi people want. It is of vital importance to know this, you can't solve this problem by pouring money into the provincial government, which seems to be the method of choice currently. Please, I request qsaark or anyone else with sufficient knowledge on the issue to enlighten me, what are the ground realities and what do average Balochis really want? Keep Bugti, Musharraf, Army, Jinnah etc. out of it is possible.

 

[qsaark]

Thank you very much for asking me to contribute. I am writing on the Balochistan issue for quite some time on this forum as well as on some others. However, I have reached to a conclusion that what I want to say is not what people (non-Baloch) want to hear and what the people (non-Baloch) want to hear is I can not say as it would not be the truth. All I can tell you is that matters are out of the hands of the Sardars, and into the hands of the masses. The time of lip-service is long gone and the GoP has to show something tangible that satisfies the inhabitants of Balochistan. Instead of labeling all the insurgents as traitors, the GoP has to negotiate with them, and not for passing the time but to make some real progress.

The GoP has to learn how to deal with the Balochs. And you know who could teach them how? The teachers of Colleges and the Universities… I have seen how beautifully my teachers have handled the situation in the Government Degree College and the Balochistan University and managed to keep the BSO (Baloch Student Organization) folks peaceful and cooperative.

The problem of the GoP is that they want to handle the situation with force and this has in the past and will always backfire. It is not that the Baloch are not at fault, they are and in many places. However, pushing them aside and label them with the word traitor will isolate them even further. The Balochistan problem will be solved the day they will start getting fair share in the NFC award, the justified royalty of Sui Gas and Sandak project as well as Gawder seaport etc. These are not big things and are doable, but who will do that? As the urdu proverb goes “billi key galey mein ghanti kaun bandhey” or in English “who will bell the cat?”

It is unfortunate that the folks sitting in Islamabad find it easier to spend millions of rupees in deploying forces to suppress the voice of the Balochs but not giving them what rightfully belongs to them. Until and unless this colonial mindset is not changed, don’t expect things to get normal in Balochistan.

Just look around yourself, how the country is being burnt. But did you see anything concrete coming out from the GoP to settle down the problems in Balochistan? What if the so-called Baloch nationalists start a revolt in Balochistan? These are grave times and we need unity. However, there is no shortage of people who still view things from a very different angle and keep living in denial, very conveniently putting all the blame on the Baloch sardars and labeling them as traitors and what not.

Take for example the Dr. Shazia case. Yes she was blind-folded, she might not have seen the face of the offender. But she might have recognized him through his voice or what ever. So if the Captain was blamed, what was the right thing to do? To let him prove his innocence in the court of law. That would simply solved the matter once for all. What happened instead? Musharraf came to rescue an ordinary Captain. Why? Who was Musharraf? God or what? How did he know that the Captain was not guilty? What the enquiry was not allowed to take place? Why all the evidence was destroyed by the officials as Sui Hospital? Whom they were protecting? Why they were not included in the inquiry for destroying the evidence? These are the questions that people ask, and they want the answers. It is possible that Captain was indeed innocent but the way the CinC got himself involved in a criminal matter only created doubts and fueled speculations. But when the so-called President of the country starts taking sides, things like this happen. The same thing happened when he supported the MQM terrorists on May 12, 2007 but that is another topic altogether.

Rahey naam Allah ka.

Note: I replied only because PAFace, a member I respect a lot, personally asked me to share my views. Otherwise, discussing this matter is a useless an exercise and waste of my time and of others. The folks who are making decisions will do what they think is right, what the Balochs think was never their concern is never going to be.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Most of development in these areas have been blocked or overlooked becasue the local gov bodies did not cooperate with Pakistani main gov ....

Local leaders , also entice the youth with flase story lines, just so that they can assume a power position with in society. Most youths are pretty much pawns.

99% of these tribal warlords had their own malitia and they routinely killed and kidnapped ppl , that is why this area has always stayed , underdeveloped

I ask you would you go to Balouchistan and open a Pizza Hut franchise, knowng that Karman Khan will come with militia and kill 2 customers and take a pizza with him to eat at home..

The same Balouch ppl that say they do not get any gas , on other blow up gas pipeline projects and also dirupt national programs for economic prosperity.

I mean Gwadar port its a great initiative to develop that region and help thing forward, but its up to blouchs to throw away the rifles and work with gov

Pakistani flag now flies over all the territories

Local groups have had weapons and militias to terrorize the local population and they insisted on dumb , punchiat or village courts etc ...

Pakistan army did great job hopefully Pakistani army can setup some strong outposts in region.

 

[qsaark]

Source: Jang Weekly Magazine - IQRA

 

[fatman17]

EDITORIAL: State of affairs in Balochistan

The Baloch Liberation United Front (BLUF) has killed the Balochistan Education Minister Shafiq Ahmed Khan outside his residence in Quetta. The slain minister was a member of the ruling PPP but was Punjabi by extraction. He is the second Balochistan minister to be killed in the last two months. The terrorist “liberators” of the province have killed scores of Punjabis mostly engaged in the education sector as “foreign” settlers to highlight their separatist ideology.

Promptly, someone has put the blame on India. Talking to Daily Times, Quetta’s Commerce College Principal Mirza Amanat Ali Baig said, “Since India has increased the number of consulates in Afghanistan, troubles have enormously increased for us, as terrorists are coming from Afghanistan and getting full support from there”. This may be a good way of explaining the activity of the Baloch insurgents based in Balochistan, but it hardly helps in analysing what is happening in Balochistan or saving Mr Baig from being killed.

A fringe Baloch nationalism has always wanted Balochistan to separate from Pakistan. The genuine grievance of Balochistan against the treatment it has received from the federation has never stopped lending strength to this fringe. But its dominance comes, not from its numbers, but from its ability to practise violence and intimidate. In this its power is no different from the terror practised by the Taliban in Swat. The outreach of BLUF and other extreme nationalists into the lives of the citizens is scary indeed.

It is a pity that at the very moment when violence has increased in Balochistan, the rest of Pakistan is completely in favour of meeting its demands and giving it a better economic deal. Gallup polls and opinion surveys show that the people of Pakistan side with the Baloch cause and wish to punish those who have used violence against the people of Balochistan. At the level of the political parties too there is a consensus over yielding to the demands of Balochistan. The current discussion in the National Finance Commission (NFC) has clearly signalled an unprecedented economic package to Balochistan.

But Balochistan is no longer under any cohesive administrative control to take advantage of the good times that are in store for it. No one otherwise convinced of the new popular attitude towards Balochistan is willing to stand up in Quetta and speak optimistically. Those who kill ensure that no one adopts a positive attitude towards the changing mood in the federation. Elected politicians complain of lax security but collectively demand a shrinking of the role of the police in the province.

The province is unique in having big tribal leaders among the Baloch who are enlightened and influential. Just three or four will swing the opinion of the province this way or that. Since the tragic death of Nawab Akbar Bugti, however, their attitude has stiffened and their demands may have gone beyond the demand for a fair economic deal including possession of the natural resources of the province. The moderate person in Balochistan who prefers the middle course is a very scared and muffled man.

One way Islamabad avoids handling the problem is to emphasise the “conspiracy” theory about Balochistan. It says Balochistan is fine but India is causing all the terrorism happening there. There is no dearth of the “conspiracy theory” among the Baloch too but they see their land being assailed by competing superpowers like America and China, and lesser regional powers like India, Iran and Russia. Islamabad says it has all the proof of India fishing in the troubled waters of Balochistan but will not show it “till it is appropriate to do so”. It keeps on claiming that Balochistan is clean of the Taliban but no one in Quetta believes it.

All kinds of terrorists have assembled in Balochistan partly because of the “strategic depth” policies of the past. There are Afghan refugee camps in the province serving as breeding grounds for jihad against whomever they see as their enemies, including the Shia Hazaras of Quetta. The Iranian Baloch too take shelter in the province and strike across the Iranian border; and there is Lashkar-e-Jhangvi from Punjab which is enslaved to Al Qaeda and its plans in Balochistan. Tragically, those who support separation have no idea of the kind of ethnic-linguistic inferno they are inviting on to themselves.

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

 

[PAFAce]

Thank you very much, qsaark, for your thoughtful reply. I wanted to reciprocate with an equally detailed response. I am very fortunate that I can communicate with a Professor from a Baloch background and get first-hand details.

You're not the only one who believes this government is dishonest in its services, not just towards Balochistan, but Pakistan in general. Also, the reason I asked you to contribute specifically is because I wanted to know about the ground realities, even if they are not pretty. I have read what you had written on the subject on other boards/threads. I must admit, I didn't like everything I read, but that is not your fault, it is mine for being to unaware of the ground realities.

Now, let's come to some specific issues you mentioned.

NFC Award: I was unsure how much share Balochistan really received, so I checked online. It says 3% on wikipedia, which seems extremely low. However, if you consider that the province is almost half the size of Pakistan but has less than 10% of the population, it puts the number into perspective. Of course, sincere efforts on the part of the federal government to increase development and investment in Balochistan would mean increasing this, however, it would also mean decreasing the Award to Sindh and Punjab, the two provinces that provide the maximum economic sustainment for Pakistan. As an outsider, I do not know the intricate details of the allocation system, however, I would fully support an increment in the NFC award if specific fields of development and projects are identified. That is all I can say on this subject without any detailed knowledge.

Justified Royalty of Sui Gas: Well, this is one of those issued that can be manipulated to no end by the politicians. What exactly is "justified"? We must decide whether natural gas, oil or coal reserves are a national resource of Pakistan, or just a provincial resource. If it is a national resource, then surely the federal government must decide what the distribution is like. It may seem to Balochis that Punjab gets an unfair amount of usage, but then look at the population and industry within Punjab. Now, I am not claiming that Balochis get treated fairly, I don't know whether they do, but don't you think that this is one of those issues that will always be used for political purposes inside Balochistan? Therefore, what is the solution?

Sandak and Gawader Projects: Once again, we must decide whether these are national or provincial resources. If national money is used in the development, then surely it is a national resource. This means that the federal government has the right to decide the usage. These projects will naturally improve the economic situation of Balochistan, it is a given. However, if my sources are correct, the "nationalists" in Balochistan are opposed to such development as they believe the primary beneficiaries will be Punjabis. This is another way the anti-Pakistan (or anti-Punjabi) elements will take advantage of this issue.

My point is this: there are undoubtedly anti-Pakistan elements inside Balochistan, and they are gaining popularity based on false propaganda against Punjabis and Sindhis. Even you won't deny this, I'm sure. To tackle with these elements, it is necessary to deploy at least some counter force to keep things in check. I agree 100% that this should be in tandem with strong measures to improve increase investment in key areas within Balochistan, such as Quetta.

Now, to address the serious issue of violence in Balochistan. This news regarding the Punjabi-origin Education Minister was saddening, but it was not shocking. That is becase, a few days before it happened, my dad related to me a story his friend, after a recent visit to Pakistan, told him. This friend is of Punjabi origina, but lived in Balochistan all his life. His older brother, a doctor, had received 3 death threats from unknown persons to leave Balochistan with his family or he will be killed. He would always reply with "this is my land, I am not leaving". Eventually, he was shot right in his home, for the simple crime of being of Punjabi origin. Now, take this story at face value, but these events seem to be common in Balochistan. It is a similar treatment those in East Pakistan received before the 1971 War. If this is commonplace, then I can't see why anybody would have a problem with force inside Balochistan. Not Army, not yet, but the police and the Frontier Corp must maintain a strong stance against any such BS.

Like you said, I don't believe this situation can be dealt with completely using a hammer. However, where and when needed, a hammer must be available.

Now, can you please let me know the names of any NGOs currently working in Balochistan on evelopmental projects? There is a group called "Engineers Without Borders" who regularly send student and professional engineers to countries where developmental projects are required. The Chapter at my university only sends students to African nations, however, I am sure if I try hard enough, I can convince the EWB to work with NGOs already inside Pakistan. I want to concentrate on Balochistan and NWFP, as I believe these two provinces are in need of some serious help. That is, until the much-awaited "Pakistani revolution" finally occurs.