Lahori paa jee
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I think we have reached a point where we have to decide once n for all that army should be kept away from entering politics before they destroy our country for good
Pakistan's name should be changed to Army Welfare Centre
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Democrat-Pak
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Musharrif and the military are as much help to the pakistani public as an ashtray is on a motorbike.
Democrat-Pak
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Lets have a democratic goverment elected by the people a strong party to come forward and modernise pakistan creat jobs, boost the economy. Atrract foreign investment and shakeup the official offices to fit for pupose to lead pakistan in to 21st century. Someone with a vision to create industry and improve the infrastructure. Imrove living conditions, better education, healthcare.
What we crave for is end to corruption and brutality and seek a just state that enforces a just law regardless of status, wealth. colour and creed. Democracy is the way forwward for pakistan and the public should realise that, someone democratically elected to serve the people of pakistan and their interest rather then their own.
However i have been critical in most of my messages of the military, but truth be known that pakistani economy has propsered well under their leadership.
What we crave for is end to corruption and brutality and seek a just state that enforces a just law regardless of status, wealth. colour and creed. Democracy is the way forwward for pakistan and the public should realise that, someone democratically elected to serve the people of pakistan and their interest rather then their own.
However i have been critical in most of my messages of the military, but truth be known that pakistani economy has propsered well under their leadership.
Interceptor
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This is probably there final days after this, Pakistan will always use Article 6 on them, you just see those demonstrations by the Lawyers and how they are standing up against the government. They have prevailed.
Democrat-Pak
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whats article 6 dude?
Lahori paa jee
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Thanks Democrat-Pak and Interceptor. Now atleast we are a team of three. Hope sanity pevails and others join us in our struggle.
Democrat-Pak for you
Democrat-Pak for you
Interceptor
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Thats your constitution
.Freedom of expression is part of the constitution and violance lies in intent, and how the intent is found is juried by the Government of Pakistan namingly the police and Court, however, the need of a free Judiciary is required to the nesscery action against those who use violance, in this case lets look at the MQM the May 12 attack.
Democrat-Pak
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Well freedom of speech is not entirely possible, it may be in the institution but when you have police battering you, you soon changed your mind. You all may have seen the attack by the police on geo tv, reason because it was broadcasting police brutality. Police are suppose to be neutral and observe peace and enforce a law laid by the constitution. That attack on geo tv opened many peoples eyes to what pakistan is really about.
Banning protest in the capital is denying people their right of freedom to demonstrate against what they belive is an undemocratic leadership in pakistan, they are not far from wrong. It is in the hands of people of pakistan to speak and rasie their hand say we want democracy and real democracy not just by name but by nature .
Look at bhutto his era may have involved some scandals but it was time of prosperity and jobs and workers rights, not only that his style democracy had vision of taking pakistan in to the future as a modern self sufficent state.
Much dissapointed with the politics of his daughter who i feel has been a let down to great bhutoo and was a clueless lady with no vision to imrove pakistan.
Lets bring back bhutto type of democracy back where pakistan can stand with head high even in the international arena, a party that leads for people and has plans to industrialise and modernise pakistan.
Banning protest in the capital is denying people their right of freedom to demonstrate against what they belive is an undemocratic leadership in pakistan, they are not far from wrong. It is in the hands of people of pakistan to speak and rasie their hand say we want democracy and real democracy not just by name but by nature .
Look at bhutto his era may have involved some scandals but it was time of prosperity and jobs and workers rights, not only that his style democracy had vision of taking pakistan in to the future as a modern self sufficent state.
Much dissapointed with the politics of his daughter who i feel has been a let down to great bhutoo and was a clueless lady with no vision to imrove pakistan.
Lets bring back bhutto type of democracy back where pakistan can stand with head high even in the international arena, a party that leads for people and has plans to industrialise and modernise pakistan.
niaz
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Sorry to disappoint you but I was in Pakistan during ZAB era and I don't remember it like that. Are you forgetting that Bhutto nationalized nearlly every industry except Textile mills. Pakistan experienced negative growth and it took 30 years for the industrialization process to get back on track.
A.Rahman
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what are the pros & cons of nationalization? why did he do it? what were the consequences?
Lahori paa jee
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The result of that nationalization were devastating. Pakistan suffered major set back in that the industrialists lost confidence and shifted their businesses else where. Had he not done that Pakistan would have been very strong economically
Ex-armymen occupying top slots in govt depts
Ex-Military men take over key Bureaucratic/Civilian setups
Tuesday May 29, 2007
Large scale appointments, of retired armed forces officers, on key posts, on hefty pay-packages and lucrative perks and privileges in federal ministries, divisions and attached departments have once again left the civilian setup with the shorter end of the stick and the increasing âmilitary infiltrationâ slowly seems to eat away the roots of the bureaucracy and left over civil rule in the country.
A list of 225 retired armed forces officers, who have been appointed on key posts, has been tabled in the National Assembly by the Minister in Charge of the Establishment Division, Dr. Sher Afghan Niazi that shows that these officers have been re-employed on contract basis in Grade 17 to 22.
Though the Armed Forcesâ 10 per cent quota in civil service have been observed and 29 retired armed forces officers have been inducted in civil service on permanent as well as on contract basis but Prime Minister, Federal Ministers and Establishment Division attained the services of 225 retired army men on contract basis during the year 2005 to 2007.
On the question of peoples party MNA Beelum Husnain, the Minister In Charge Establishment Division told the Lower House in a written reply that the laid down procedure of re-employment after retirement is different for those armed forces officers who are appointed on contract basis or on secondment basis in the Ministries, Divisions and attach departments.
The list of these officers is only provided to the members but government tabled it in the library of National Assembly also for record. Weekly âPulseâ got the copy of this list that shows that during the last three years, the Prime Minister approved the re-employment of 96 retired army men on key posts, while the remaining 129 appointments were made by the Establishment Division, concerned head of the department or on the recommendations of ministers.
12 retired generals have been appointed in MP-1, MP-2, MP-3, and M-1 scales and they are drawing hefty salaries and other facilities, allowances, perks and privileges burdening the national kitty.
Majority of the officers were appointed on two year contract but they got extension after the expiry of contract period.
The extension example of the Rector, National University of Science and Technology (NUST) Lt. Gen. (retd) Syed Shujaat Hussain is really extraordinary. He was appointed as Rector NUST in February 1992 after his retirement from army, but he has been given continuous extensions by the past governments. Even the current setup last extended his appointment for the period of two years.
Evacuee Trust Property Board, Pakistan Automobile Corporation, Sindh Engineering Limited, Alternative Energy Development Board, Pakistan Steel Mills, National Institute of Health, Pakistan Environmental Planning and Architectural Consultants, Karachi Port Trust, Civil Aviation Authority, National Accountability Bureau, NUST, NIPA, CBR and other ministries and departments are being run by the retired army men or they are holding key influential positions in the setups.
The list of retired armed forces officers re-employed on contract or on secondment basis in the ministries, attached departments and divisions from 2005 to 2007 are as under:
http://www.paktribune.com/exclusive/table.shtml
http://www.paktribune.com/news/index.shtml?179554
Ex-Military men take over key Bureaucratic/Civilian setups
Tuesday May 29, 2007
Large scale appointments, of retired armed forces officers, on key posts, on hefty pay-packages and lucrative perks and privileges in federal ministries, divisions and attached departments have once again left the civilian setup with the shorter end of the stick and the increasing âmilitary infiltrationâ slowly seems to eat away the roots of the bureaucracy and left over civil rule in the country.
A list of 225 retired armed forces officers, who have been appointed on key posts, has been tabled in the National Assembly by the Minister in Charge of the Establishment Division, Dr. Sher Afghan Niazi that shows that these officers have been re-employed on contract basis in Grade 17 to 22.
Though the Armed Forcesâ 10 per cent quota in civil service have been observed and 29 retired armed forces officers have been inducted in civil service on permanent as well as on contract basis but Prime Minister, Federal Ministers and Establishment Division attained the services of 225 retired army men on contract basis during the year 2005 to 2007.
On the question of peoples party MNA Beelum Husnain, the Minister In Charge Establishment Division told the Lower House in a written reply that the laid down procedure of re-employment after retirement is different for those armed forces officers who are appointed on contract basis or on secondment basis in the Ministries, Divisions and attach departments.
The list of these officers is only provided to the members but government tabled it in the library of National Assembly also for record. Weekly âPulseâ got the copy of this list that shows that during the last three years, the Prime Minister approved the re-employment of 96 retired army men on key posts, while the remaining 129 appointments were made by the Establishment Division, concerned head of the department or on the recommendations of ministers.
12 retired generals have been appointed in MP-1, MP-2, MP-3, and M-1 scales and they are drawing hefty salaries and other facilities, allowances, perks and privileges burdening the national kitty.
Majority of the officers were appointed on two year contract but they got extension after the expiry of contract period.
The extension example of the Rector, National University of Science and Technology (NUST) Lt. Gen. (retd) Syed Shujaat Hussain is really extraordinary. He was appointed as Rector NUST in February 1992 after his retirement from army, but he has been given continuous extensions by the past governments. Even the current setup last extended his appointment for the period of two years.
Evacuee Trust Property Board, Pakistan Automobile Corporation, Sindh Engineering Limited, Alternative Energy Development Board, Pakistan Steel Mills, National Institute of Health, Pakistan Environmental Planning and Architectural Consultants, Karachi Port Trust, Civil Aviation Authority, National Accountability Bureau, NUST, NIPA, CBR and other ministries and departments are being run by the retired army men or they are holding key influential positions in the setups.
The list of retired armed forces officers re-employed on contract or on secondment basis in the ministries, attached departments and divisions from 2005 to 2007 are as under:
http://www.paktribune.com/exclusive/table.shtml
http://www.paktribune.com/news/index.shtml?179554
Interceptor
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I can recall that too after all, my family had assets that were nationalised. You forget that these investors that were so corrupt they use to infringe them selfs of non-tax and tax corruption and made the average poor man that worked for them more poor. The employees would for example work for 5 ruppees after Bhutto made these industries national which he did by buying them off the investor, he made the average poor man worth 50 ruppees i.e. increased there wage 10 times. He was the inventor of the trade union gave the the poor peasants of Pakistan a tongue to oppose the harsh criminals that were later let loose by Zia. I can recall that long time ago we opposed Bhutto because he made our business less profitable we supported Zia because he came in power to restore the currupt system of making the poor slaves again.
Later I opposed them. Bhutto though did make the industries nationalised but later most of it was returned for various reasons of which one is that Bhutto was murdered so his Idea of nationalised industry could not be carried on. The economy during that age was slow but was growing.
Niaz, Bhutto was created for the poor people of Pakistan and he fought for them with both hands, he had bountiful of land he was a landlord. He had so much land that when a train would pass through it, it would take a few hours before it could leave the strech of land, he was a very wealthy rich and upper class Pakistani. He gave his land to the Poor peasants of Pakistan so that they may live of it, unfortunelatly the creatures Zia created and that were let loose are now more powerful then ever before.
The Land lords and Investors hated him, trust me I know this personally they opposed his Idea, the investors use to monopolize over industries and poor people so that they earn more profits, to stop this he nationalized. I opposed him but later when I matured I read I saw and dicovered he was the right man for Pakistan, he was upright, his character not the one that could be defeated.
niaz
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Dear Interceptor,
You are young and I dont want to disillusion you, just to say that in this case I have first hand knowledge.
I have travelled thru Garhi Khuda Bakhs Bhutto, Rate Dero, Navo Dero and Larkana, even driven in front of Al Murtaza. I have also met his wife Nusrat Bhutto who was owner/dealer of ESSO Petrol Station in Rate Dero.
ZAB was no doubt a large landlord but not in his own right. The land you speak of belongs to Bhutto Clan ( curent head being Mumtaz Bhutto). There are many other landlords in that area such as the Khuroos whoes family owned a lot more.
Thru his land reforms act, he divided the lands of his opponents, lands of his cronies didnt even get touched. His inner circle didnot have a single poor man, all Sindhi landlords. He was no doubt a charismatic leader and one of the most clever polticians but he was 'Fox' and certainly very vindictive. In the nationalization process he destroyed the so called 22 families but didnot touch Hayee Sons, who were his supporters. His domestic policies destroyed Pakistan's economy. Of course, die hard socialists such Dr Mubashar Hassan carry a substantial blame for this as well.
ZAB was for poor man is a joke. He only used 'Roti Kapra aur Makaan' as a political slogan and nothing else. Truly socialist leaders such as Meraj Mohammad Khan were ostracized by ZAB. There is no doubt that ZAB managed to fool a lot of people and to this day his legacy is a major political force. Besides, it is a disgrace for a country to hang their Prime Minister, no matter what his crime and his was based on circumstantial evidence only. ( It is an irony that BB is these days allied with NS, who used to go on Zia's grave every year to vow the continuation of Zia's policies and it was Zia who hanged ZAB).
ZAB is now long dead and no use beating a dead horse. You are welcome to keep him as your hero and I will maintain what I think of him.
You are young and I dont want to disillusion you, just to say that in this case I have first hand knowledge.
I have travelled thru Garhi Khuda Bakhs Bhutto, Rate Dero, Navo Dero and Larkana, even driven in front of Al Murtaza. I have also met his wife Nusrat Bhutto who was owner/dealer of ESSO Petrol Station in Rate Dero.
ZAB was no doubt a large landlord but not in his own right. The land you speak of belongs to Bhutto Clan ( curent head being Mumtaz Bhutto). There are many other landlords in that area such as the Khuroos whoes family owned a lot more.
Thru his land reforms act, he divided the lands of his opponents, lands of his cronies didnt even get touched. His inner circle didnot have a single poor man, all Sindhi landlords. He was no doubt a charismatic leader and one of the most clever polticians but he was 'Fox' and certainly very vindictive. In the nationalization process he destroyed the so called 22 families but didnot touch Hayee Sons, who were his supporters. His domestic policies destroyed Pakistan's economy. Of course, die hard socialists such Dr Mubashar Hassan carry a substantial blame for this as well.
ZAB was for poor man is a joke. He only used 'Roti Kapra aur Makaan' as a political slogan and nothing else. Truly socialist leaders such as Meraj Mohammad Khan were ostracized by ZAB. There is no doubt that ZAB managed to fool a lot of people and to this day his legacy is a major political force. Besides, it is a disgrace for a country to hang their Prime Minister, no matter what his crime and his was based on circumstantial evidence only. ( It is an irony that BB is these days allied with NS, who used to go on Zia's grave every year to vow the continuation of Zia's policies and it was Zia who hanged ZAB).
ZAB is now long dead and no use beating a dead horse. You are welcome to keep him as your hero and I will maintain what I think of him.
