Pakistan's Growing Tax Base: Impact on my family's Textile Business.

[nahtanbob]

Traders are the biggest thieves. We need to get their transactions documented and bring them in tax net.
I commend you for doing the right thing even it will cost you - but believe me if all do it similarly then the benefits of a prosperous Pakistan will be for everyone.
For example: what is use of saving on tax which bankrupts the govt and then has to devalue currency which then is a loss for you as well? What is the use of saving on tax when rest of the people are poor and creates law and order - the people with money are then in fear and spend more money on security.

the thieves are the ones who run the government and live off the government dole
Traders are not thieves. they are making a living

 

[Code_Geass]

Thief or not they earn huge sum of money that needs to be taxed and their transactions also needs to be traceable..

the thieves are the ones who run the government and live off the government dole
Traders are not thieves. they are making a living

 

[nahtanbob]

Thief or not they earn huge sum of money that needs to be taxed and their transactions also needs to be traceable..

this is from Ayn Rand retweeted by your Prime minister:

"When you see that trading is done, not by consent, but by compulsion—when you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing—when you see that money is flowing to those who deal, not in good, but in favors—when you see that men get richer by graft and by pull than by work, and your laws don't protect you against them, but protect them against you—when you see corruption being rewarded and honesty becoming a self-sacrifice—you may know that your society is doomed."

 

[Meengla]

this is from Ayn Rand retweeted by your Prime minister:

I don't care if Imran Khan retweeted Ayn Rand or not. But the quote you have mentioned, if applied, will make all those govt officials who make policies and perform other roles irrelevant. I know a little bit about Ayn. Her theory is not accepted or at least not applied even in the very capitalistic American society.
Traders do contribute. But should pay fair tax too.

 

[nahtanbob]

I don't care if Imran Khan retweeted Ayn Rand or not. But the quote you have mentioned, if applied, will make all those govt officials who make policies and perform other roles irrelevant. I know a little bit about Ayn. Her theory is not accepted or at least not applied even in the very capitalistic American society.
Traders do contribute. But should pay fair tax too.

Traders and textile mill owners do contribute to society.
the textile mill owners earn half of pakistan exports

 

[Meengla]

Traders and textile mill owners do contribute to society.
the textile mill owners earn half of pakistan exports

Of course they contribute. But your Ayn Rand quote implied the govt officials don't. Ayn Rand is just as discredited as the Libertarian in American politics.

 

[nahtanbob]

Of course they contribute. But your Ayn Rand quote implied the govt officials don't. Ayn Rand is just as discredited as the Libertarian in American politics.

no thanks ... i will pass
the federal government has a bloated military, bloated healthcare system

 

[jamal18]

In all businesses now 'cash' is a dirty word. Nothing happens with cash, the accountants and Tax officials see this is a massive red flag.

 

[Meengla]

no thanks ... i will pass
the federal government has a bloated military, bloated healthcare system

So you would vote for Ayn Rand Paul then!

 

[TheDarkKnight]

the thieves are the ones who run the government and live off the government dole
Traders are not thieves. they are making a living

The ones in govt definitely are corrupt but the issue is also prevalent in these Traders as well. Making a living is fine but they need to share their load as everyone else does. All their strikes and protests are againsy the govt enforcement of tax collection and documentation - they are not protesting against the bribes they pay to corrupt officers ... why? As obvious any bribes they pay is many times less than the taxes they owe.

Traders and textile mill owners do contribute to society.
the textile mill owners earn half of pakistan exports

Taxes are being asked for domestic sales. Exports are already tax exempt. There is no excuse for not obeying the law and paying your taxes. Everything else needs to be sorted out but you need to pay taxes. For example will any court in USA let my income be tax exempt if I give a similar argument that the govt is corrupt or I don't agree with the spending done on military and wars etc. No matter what issues are prevalent - there is no justification for tax evasion and not documenting economic activities.

 

[nahtanbob]

The ones in govt definitely are corrupt but the issue is also prevalent in these Traders as well. Making a living is fine but they need to share their load as everyone else does. All their strikes and protests are for the govt enforcement of tax collection and documentation - they are not protesting about the bribes they pay to corrupt officers ... why? As obvious any bribe they pay is many times less than the taxes owed.


Taxes are being asked for domestic sales. Exports are already tax exempt. There is no excuse for not obeying the law and paying your taxes. Everything else needs to be sorted out but you need to pay taxes. For example will any court in USA let my income be tax exempt if I give a similar argument that the govt is corrupt or I don't agree with the spending done on military and wars etc. No matter what issues are prevalent - there is no justification for tax evasion and not documenting economic activities.

for what it is worth "government" in USA has more credibility than their counterparts in pakistan

it is impossible to win the war against the traders because you are trying to legislate against "culture"
the same culture of tax evasion exists in Italy, Greece and Spain

 

[Meengla]

it is impossible to win the war against the traders because you are trying to legislate against "culture"
the same culture of tax evasion exists in Italy, Greece and Spain

Don't say 'impossible'. If 'traders' include MY family textile mill then, surely they are grudgingly going to be paying more; I have no doubt about that. The cash-way to transact is going away. Italy, Greece, and Spain maybe in trouble but they are far richer than Pakistan; Pakistan simply can't afford to be on its knees anymore than already is given the geopolitical environment. Who is attacking the 'PIGS' countries of Europe?!

 

[nahtanbob]

Don't say 'impossible'. If 'traders' include MY family textile mill then, surely they are grudgingly going to be paying more; I have no doubt about that. The cash-way to transact is going away. Italy, Greece, and Spain maybe in trouble but they are far richer than Pakistan; Pakistan simply can't afford to be on its knees anymore than already is given the geopolitical environment. Who is attacking the 'PIGS' countries of Europe?!

No one does "cash". it is about having two sets of ledgers - one for you and one for the tax collector

no amount of tax collection solves fundamental economic issues - lack of exports/too much imports, poor human resource base, poor physical infrastructure

 

[TheDarkKnight]

for what it is worth "government" in USA has more credibility than their counterparts in pakistan

it is impossible to win the war against the traders because you are trying to legislate against "culture"
the same culture of tax evasion exists in Italy, Greece and Spain

Of course compared to US and other developed countries the credibility is questionable at best. But we can't set out on a 'winning hearts and mind' campaign for these traders first and, then beg them to come into tax net. Taxes should be paid on income - period. Traders can the protest and call strikes on all issues such as corruption, incompetence etc. Depending on political affiliation, at-least half of of US population currently thinks that the current govt doesn’t have any credibility, but IRS still continues to collect taxes.

About culture - its human nature to save money and earn more. I hate taxes too and don't want to pay them - but I know I cant run away from it and not paying them is the worst idea. No one will voluntarily pay taxes in US as well and unless laws were enforced. Don't you see how big companies find loopholes and try to save on taxes?

For Pakistan there is no other choice - no freebies or aid is coming to coverup for all the inefficiencies as it used to in past.

 

[Code_Geass]

No one does "cash". it is about having two sets of ledgers - one for you and one for the tax collector

no amount of tax collection solves fundamental economic issues - lack of exports/too much imports, poor human resource base, poor physical infrastructure

i think eliminating two set of ledgers will help alot in tax collection and condition of CNIC helps a bit in this regard,

with increased tax collection we can spend more on human and infrastructure development