Pakistan's foreign minister Bilawal Zardari humiliated himself in US

[Joe Shearer]

Not a big factor. Public schooling and public university educated in New York. Home culture surely played a part but that can be provided in poor, immigrant households also.

Yes, of course, but immigrants get access that they might never have got in their home countries. You do understand that I am speaking influenced by Indian circumstances.

 

[Norwegian]

We can always say we should only be representing Pakistan's interests but our interests have to be aligned to the power-centers of the world. That is because unfortunately the leverage is not with us.

That's exactly where Americans broke off with ex PM Imran Khan. He said no to support American interests in Pakistan and in the region. Hence US backed regime change operation in Pakistan happened and a puppet govt with a puppet pro US FM was installed.

 

[Joe Shearer]

You should have seen how your India's foreign minister responded Americans when questioned about their growing oil imports from Russia. That's how foreign minister of a sovereign nation responds. Not like that slave Bilawal

That's true, and it was one of his better moments. He does have this debaters' capacity for wriggling out of difficult positions with a construction that is difficult to refute. His core representation, however, is flawed. He is trying to gloss over genuine problems, with a defensive attitude and a position that pushes national sovereignty forward whenever cornered.

I would rather comment about Jaishankar than about your foreign minister, or about your comments about your foreign minister.

 

[WotTen]

Yes, of course, but immigrants get access that they might never have got in their home countries. You do understand that I am speaking influenced by Indian circumstances.

That is one of the big draws of Western countries that opportunities are available to poor households. This may be true of East Asian countries also but they don't take as many immigrants.

Pakistan is a disaster in this respect (by design of the oligarchs) but India does much better. I was talking to an Indian guy just the other day and he was telling me how India is churning out I.T. workers by the millions, even from poor villages, and they are all finding well paying jobs. He was joking about villagers who barely speak their non-native languages or know how to dress business casual but make over USD 60-70K a year in India.

 

[Joe Shearer]

That is one of the big draws of Western countries that opportunities are available to poor households. This may be true of East Asian countries also but they don't take as many immigrants.

Pakistan is a disaster in this respect (by design of the oligarchs) but India does much better. I was talking to an Indian guy just the other day and he was telling me how India is churning out I.T. workers by the millions, even from poor villages, and they are all finding well paying jobs. He was joking about villagers who barely speak their non-native languages or know how to dress business casual but make over USD 60-70K a year in India.

I wish I could agree. Having taught these same students, it is difficult for me to explain what results without deep pain. Open a new thread and I will explain in detail, both from the view of the teacher and from the point of view of a recruiter who has engaged perhaps a total of 5,000 IT engineers over 36 years - nothing impressive, but sufficient to make a deep and lasting impression.

Oh, btw, current opening salaries for IT engineers with no previous experience hovers between INR 15,000 to 20,000, that's $200 to 270 a month, or $24K to 32 K a year. About 1 in 3 get jobs in the first six months of their finishing their degree, and the number is dropping. It is a different matter for trained engineers with 4 to 5 years of experience.

 

[WotTen]

I wish I could agree. Having taught these same students, it is difficult for me to explain what results without deep pain. Open a new thread and I will explain in detail, both from the view of the teacher and from the point of view of a recruiter who has engaged perhaps a total of 5,000 IT engineers over 36 years - nothing impressive, but sufficient to make a deep and lasting impression.

Oh, btw, current opening salaries for IT engineers with no previous experience hovers between INR 15,000 to 20,000, that's $200 to 270 a month, or $24K to 32 K a year. About 1 in 3 get jobs in the first six months of their finishing their degree, and the number is dropping. It is a different matter for trained engineers with 4 to 5 years of experience.

Well, I am only relaying what this guy told me. He moved to Australia 30 years ago and keeps visiting India every few years. His last visit was only last month.

He told me the country has changed completely over the years. Modern metros in most cities with 19th century street vendors selling traditional food in 21st century metro stations.

He said there is plenty of trickle down prosperity and I.T. has opened middle class prosperity to a lot of people from the poorest villages.

He could have been embellishing things, especially to a Pakistani, but he seems like a fairly honest, down to earth guy.

 

[Olympus81]

Go easy on Bilawal.

You guys have to understand Blinken and his team who’re masters in psychology and diplomacy craft would have run circles around Pakistan’s new FM prior to the press conference. Hence, this body language.

The government should have known not to select an inexperienced FM and that too his first trip to the US.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Well, I am only relaying what this guy told me. He moved to Australia 30 years ago and keeps visiting India every few years. His last visit was only last month.

He told me the country has changed completely over the years. Modern metros in most cities with 19th century street vendors selling traditional food in 21st century metro stations.

He said there is plenty of trickle down prosperity and I.T. has opened middle class prosperity to a lot of people from the poorest villages.

He could have been embellishing things, especially to a Pakistani, but he seems like a fairly honest, down to earth guy.

<sigh>
He is just another of those who has bought into saffron propaganda, like some of my compatriots on PDF. He probably doesn't mean harm, or mean to be deceiving you deliberately. For experienced people, salaries are zooming, there is a shortage of candidates and jobs are going abegging. For freshers, life is bleak. IT is doing well, a handful of sectors is doing well; the economy has shrunk, employment has shrunk, and some millions have slipped back under the poverty line. New ventures, some utterly preposterous, are getting venture capital in sackfuls; if you ask a feel-good citizen, he will give you statistics about how well the economy is doing, based on how many unicorns were created in the last six months.

The best achievement - planned, and not accidental, planned and not failed - is digitisation (that is what we boomers called it, but the current term, the fashionable neologism, may apparently be digitalisation). There, too, only time will tell if what is happening is a good thing or a bad thing. On the one hand, I can pay for a single kachori of 10 rupees digitally, using a payment gateway, or pay for my medicines for a month at a time the same way. Autorickshaws take payment the same way (very often; there are hold-outs who demand cash), and almost everyone, including your mithaiwala, will take a digital payment. There are still those who appear, as I bite into my single kachori sitting on the shop's concrete steps, and gorge themselves, and then pull out a few soiled notes and pay for it. It is not for the poor, for the daily-wage worker.

I don't know where this long winter will end.

 

[Paitoo]

Honestly, I have no sympathy for dynasts. He had no 'majboori' to become FM, he is not doing an 'ehsaan' on anyone by being FM. In India too people try to develop soft corner for Rahul Gandhi when he goes through some social media bashing, but he deserves every bit of it. By being totally ineligible for the posts they occupy simply due to a surname, they deny a capable person a chance and that is not pardonable. It is the exact opposite of what a democracy should be.

These people can use all their money to do some business, buy expensive education and get into another field, I don't have a problem. Running a country is not a privilege to be inherited.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Well, I am only relaying what this guy told me. He moved to Australia 30 years ago and keeps visiting India every few years. His last visit was only last month.

He told me the country has changed completely over the years. Modern metros in most cities with 19th century street vendors selling traditional food in 21st century metro stations.

He said there is plenty of trickle down prosperity and I.T. has opened middle class prosperity to a lot of people from the poorest villages.

He could have been embellishing things, especially to a Pakistani, but he seems like a fairly honest, down to earth guy.

Yes, there is a lot in what he says.

Most big cities now have metros, making a huge impact (nowhere at the level of New Delhi's extravagant and splashy display, but we are quite content in Hyderabad, especially after the third line got to the awkward to reach parts of the Old City).

No, he isn't lying, but he desperately wants to believe the old country is doing well under the bozo.

Honestly, I have no sympathy for dynasts. He had no 'majboori' to become FM, he is not doing an 'ehsaan' on anyone by being FM. In India too people try to develop soft corner for Rahul Gandhi when he goes through some social media bashing, but he deserves every bit of it. By being totally ineligible for the posts they occupy simply due to a surname, they deny a capable person a chance and that is not pardonable. It is the exact opposite of what a democracy should be.

We really need to get rid of that baggage. RaGa sounds like a pleasant enough buffer as an individual, but he is such a huge burden on politics.

Honestly, I have no sympathy for dynasts. He had no 'majboori' to become FM, he is not doing an 'ehsaan' on anyone by being FM. In India too people try to develop soft corner for Rahul Gandhi when he goes through some social media bashing, but he deserves every bit of it. By being totally ineligible for the posts they occupy simply due to a surname, they deny a capable person a chance and that is not pardonable. It is the exact opposite of what a democracy should be.

These people can use all their money to do some business, buy expensive education and get into another field, I don't have a problem. Running a country is not a privilege to be inherited.

I blame their mother.

 

[jamahir]

Reading your posts (silently from afar since I first knew you)... you have not changed one bit you remain solid as rock on your core stands hehe.

I call you and @Joe Shearer as "PDF institutions" here:

Policy watch: What factors helped Bangladesh overtake India in per capita income?

You have very little knowledge on FDI that’s evident from your post. Please don’t post things for which you have no idea. Definitely RMG and remittance has helped Bangladesh but back in 1970s and 1980s that was the only viable way to make money. In Bangladesh has brought woman into work force...

defence.pk

Keep your unique spark always and take care.

Thank you for your trust and good wishes here and in that post. I just make simple points and what I see as rational and natural. It is just so frustrating that many people call themselves educated but have a mental blockage to see obvious wrongs and rights. But there are people on PDF like you and others who do. Thanks.

 

[SIPRA]

He says Pakistan must not be punished because his country's former PM visited Russia!!! What kind of freaking defense is this?! What has Pakistan or ex PM done wrong by visiting Russia that it deserved a punishment from US? Is this how foreign minister of a sovereign nation talks?
And yes Bilawal did oppose ex PM Imran Khan's foreign policy while he was opposition leader. He threatened to bolt his historic OIC meeting as well

Bilawal Bhutto threatens to stop OIC Conference

PPP leader Bilawal Bhutto has threatened to stop the upcoming OIC Conference in Islamabad if the government fails to call the National Assem

www.globalvillagespace.com

Unfortunate, that we are forced to discuss a joker, clown, charlatan, thug and characterless scoundrel like "Billo Rani", for 9 pages of PDF.

 

[Gripen9]

Why he is pointing himself, any explanation.....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1527422251515142146

 

[Catalystic]

Bilawal can’t be 33……that is a middle-age face, not a young man. Look at receding hairlines

More like around 40-ish…..and still no signs of any woman/girl in his life……
Either mental/nervous/psychological issues or physical ? He shoukd get treatment before a nervous breakdown in front of non-slave people….that can be disastrous for the “bhutto” dynasty

A FM needs to be ruthless and a real man who stands up for his country no matter what. Ghairat aur Bahaduri k sath

None of these cowardice or apologetic shit…..Pakistan deserves a lion as a FM nit sime donkey

 

[Mahabahu kaunteya]

I have nothing to say about him , but just that he should improve his urdu speaking skills .
Hearing to a grown up man , using wrong nouns ( can correct me here, If iam wrong but you fellas get my gist ) like using " karti hu " instead of " karta hu " seems bad to be honest.