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Pakistan's acquisition of the U-214

this thread is for discussion ony i am not saying that U deal will not go through

If geman by any chance dont sell us the U boats what are the best option for pakistan
I think instead of going to french once again we shuld go for chinese subs we have some expertise we buy two or three best availabe chinese subs and then work with them for improving the technological stuff

Well until Zadari doesnt do what he does best, there is no reason why we wont get the U-boats and if God for bid it does happen as news about possible bribes are being circulated over the internet, then perhaps we will see a French sub either Marlin or the Scorpion but in any case we will get a sub. Chinese subs have yet not reached the same standard as that of the German and the French so they are not an option. Lets hope for the best.
 
Now Navy should decide itself and Government shuould support. Mr. 10% is a bigger threat to this deal. U214 is best option. If Pakistan will show +ve response i think Germany will be ready to sell U214 technology. U214 is best at this moment, very silent, best AIP system with stealth technology.
 
U-214 deal updates

German submarines for Pakistan?

Germany has generally agreed to export three submarines to Pakistan, but the sale is being delayed because of the country's political instability.
For Germany, it's an economically promising but politically risky deal: the sale of three U-214 submarines built by German ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems to Pakistan for an estimated $2 billion.

In 2006 the German government gave its general approval after Pakistan and the company requested the sale. Berlin even granted federal export credit guarantees worth nearly $1.4 billion.

That was before Pakistan became infested with al-Qaida and Taliban insurgents who went on to destabilize the government and launch attacks into neighboring Afghanistan. Pakistan's political instability has caused Germany to delay the deal.

Contract negotiations have been dragging on for years. A delivery of the three subs to Pakistan would require the approval from Germany's national security council, and it has repeatedly postponed a decision on the deal. But that doesn't mean the sale is off the table: The Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung newspaper reports negotiations are still ongoing.

Pakistan's defense minister recently visited Berlin and a top Pakistani general will arrive in the German capital next week -- it's likely that the Siemens-engine-powered U-214 subs, which are able to run underwater at reduced speeds for up to three weeks, were and will be on the discussion agenda.

Observers say a final decision on the deal won't be made until shortly after the German federal elections in late September. The period in between two governments is often used to push through politically controversial deals.

Several German lawmakers oppose the sale, mainly because of Pakistan's instability and the region's overall volatility.

Berlin says it doesn't sell arms into politically unstable countries, but numbers prove otherwise.

German companies in 2007 sold weapons for $221 million to Pakistan, according to a government report.

Globally, Germany proves a successful export of high-tech weapons and weapons parts. According to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute, Germany exported conventional weapons -- such as submarines, tanks or helicopters -- worth some $12 billion between 2004 and 2008. (Small arms and weapons parts amount to roughly the same amount.)

Compared with 1999-2003, German arms exports increased by 70 percent, SIPRI says. The country is now No. 3 in the global market, trumped only by Russia and the United States, which leads the world in arms exports.
 
Bad news guys, as per daily Jang U 214 deal is off, Naval chief is being summoned by the NA for the in camera briefing to explain why they have decided to go for the French subs instead of German subs.
Dog Zardari did it again.
 
I read that and it was a big off for me. It will be hard that zardari will go for the German subs again. Germans will not be happy either. Israel's and America's influence has cost them big money this time.

Well which French sub we will be acquiring.
 
Bad news guys, as per daily Jang U 214 deal is off, Naval chief is being summoned by the NA for the in camera briefing to explain why they have decided to go for the French subs instead of German subs.
Dog Zardari did it again.

It seems to be part of the strategic partnership with France with the nuclear plants deal as well. The French have fed well to get the chance of selling Marlin submarines.
 
It seems to be part of the strategic partnership with France with the nuclear plants deal as well. The French have fed well to get the chance of selling Marlin submarines.

As far as my under standing zardari will be forced to back off if he has influenced the deal India nuclear Submarine alarms the bell for every pakistani and more and more people are interested on our response our opposition leader in the parliament is from highly respected military family with many generals and others he will not let it happen let hope and see. Its just one billion dollar we can purchase some thing else from French to make them happy, JF 17 stuff and more agostas France is not running on pakistani money its a develop country they have to market for it as many American and European countries are opening offices in india.U boat will be coming inshallah Unless French are offering some thing else with it.
 
i think we r still stuck between french and german decision yet to be taken what we can do to open a votings and signings in which govt will be forced from people of pakistan to go with germans we can do it as members im ready for it it is a national security issue its our security issue we have to come and force govt since indian nuke sub in water U 214 should be in pakistan side to defend our families im ready i hope some of our members who are genous should put some plan on this forum through votings and signature campaign we can do it if we like too i hope our members put some plans i will do what ever i asked and i just need a guidence
 

Why Pakistan went to Paris for submarine deal?


PML-Q Senator Sardar Mohammad Jamal Khan Leghari in a surprising revelation shocked the members of the Senate on July 30 by a claim that President Zardari had refused to approve the deal for purchase of German submarines and the file submitted to the Presidency recently had been rejected. He added that a team of Pakistani Naval officials had been receiving training on manning of sophisticated submarine in Germany for one and a half year.The Senator also claimed that the rejection of German submarine was aimed at paving the way for the purchase of French submarines and the one billion dollars were behind the latest defence deal with France.He elaborated that Pakistan already possessed the French submarine technology and needed diversified technology. He demanded that Pakistan Naval Chief should give an in-camera briefing to the legislators to clarify the position.The Senator’s criticism followed a report that Islamabad was tilting towards France rather than Germany which with much struggle had recently cleared the way for export of three submarines to Pakistan.According to defence experts, for Germany it was an economically promising but politically risky deal but despite backdoor work by Indian lobby the Germans had agreed to sell three U-214 submarines built by German ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems to Pakistan for an estimated $2 billion.Defence experts told Pakistan Observer that Germany was ready and was awaiting a formal order from the Ministry of Defence.
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A German team of Naval experts had visited Karachi to discuss technicalities and a Pakistan Naval team also visited Germany to make final inspection. According to reports the German government had even agreed to grant federal export credit guarantees worth nearly $1.4 billion.Sources confirm that as the deal was proceeding and 95% ready, President Asif Ali Zardari overruled his military’s preference for the German subs to take up a “better offer” from France. The change of heart was noted when President Zardari visited Paris in May and has long meeting with French President.To the surprise of many Pakistanis on the eve of President Zardari’s visit a French judge accused some “powerful Pakistanis” of having something to do with the murder of 11 French engineers in Karachi in May 2002 as a retaliation for the decision of France’s new government to cease bribe payments from the 1995 deal.Coincidentally, in 1995 too, the Pakistan People’s Party was in power when the government bought three French Agosta 90-B submarines. President Zardari was then Minister for Investment in the PPP Government while now French President Nicolas Sarkozy was a key aide to then French President Edouard Balladur. The two developed a close relationship since then.President Zardari’s decision to turn to Paris for the deal also coincided with reports that PPP Government had decided to appoint a civil servant from the District Management Group as the Ambassador of Pakistan to France. The most unusual appointment was resented by the veteran and serving diplomats at home abroad and Prime Minister had to intervene and cancel the appointment of Mohammed Jehanzeb Khan.
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Opposition members here claim that the delay in the issuing of the order for the German submarines that were almost finalized in December 2008 had “something to do with President Zardari’s meeting with President Sarkozy of France in May 2009? “ They also claim that the appointment of a junior civil servant as the envoy to Paris may also be related to this decision.Defence observers say that the Government managed to silence opposition to French deal by claiming that Paris had agreed to sign a peaceful nuclear cooperation deal while Germans were reluctant to deliver such an accord. Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi had claimed during President Zardari’s visit to Paris that France had agreed to extend cooperation in nuclear technology but French officials clarified that the cooperation would be limited to the safety and security of the nuclear plants.On July 2nd when French Admiral Edouard Guillaud, Advisor to President Sarkozy visited Pakistan he met with President Asif Ali Zardari, Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani and Army Chief General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani.Admiral Guillaud’s visit to Pakistan was considered as part of efforts aimed at further boosting the Pak-French relations in the wake of Zardari-Sarkozy meetings in May this year.PM proposed that the governments of Pakistan and France should chalk out a roadmap for pragmatic cooperation in the field of civil nuclear energy but there was no firm response from French side.
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Admiral Guillaud however, assured the prime minister that France would provide military equipment including Tiger Helicopters to Pakistan.Again on July 23 on the occasion of a visist by French Secretary of State for Foreign Trade, Anne Marie Idrac, Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani hoped that Pakistan would sign framework agreements with France on defence, security and energy this year and said that Pakistan wanted a long-term strategic partnership with France.Ms Idrac promised her country’s continued support to Pakistan in its efforts to overcome economic difficulties and win the war against terror. She said she would hold detailed discussions on economic and energy agreements. Ms Idrac made it clear that a proposed partnership between Pakistan and France on civilian nuclear energy would be limited to nuclear safety and security.What we propose is something very important, which is the possibility for technical people to discuss very precisely what can be done in terms of safety and security for the existing civil nuclear plants,’ she had clarified.

ASIAN DEFENCE: Why Pakistan went to Paris for submarine deal?
 
Aisa to hota ha is tara ka kaamon main, i wonder where is PM Gillani and his big talks about making history are? We are being robbed in bright day light and yet not a single voice is heard from any political circle within the country. I wonder why the issue of 3rd novemeber was raised at this particular moment, maybe to divert unnecessary attentions.
 
Is this the marlin sub we are talking about::lol:

MSubs | Home

It will for sure take care of the indian nuclear sub......z*****i style.
 
here is what PN should do...


1. Wait till zardari the G***O is defeated in midterm elections... hope the new leader ship listens to PN for Type-214 requirement.

2. PN original plan is to acquire 12 new subs in addition to agostas.. keep both german and french subs....

---------- Post added at 07:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:41 PM ----------

here is what PN should do...


1. Wait till zardari the G***O is defeated in midterm elections... hope the new leader ship listens to PN for Type-214 requirement.

2. PN original plan is to acquire 12 new subs in addition to agostas.. keep both new german (type-214) and french (merlin) subs....
 
here is what PN should do...


1. Wait till zardari the G***O is defeated in midterm elections... hope the new leader ship listens to PN for Type-214 requirement.

2. PN original plan is to acquire 12 new subs in addition to agostas.. keep both german and french subs....

---------- Post added at 07:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:41 PM ----------

here is what PN should do...


1. Wait till zardari the G***O is defeated in midterm elections... hope the new leader ship listens to PN for Type-214 requirement.

2. PN original plan is to acquire 12 new subs in addition to agostas.. keep both new german (type-214) and french (merlin) subs....


when MID TERM election is going to hold.
 

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