Pakistan, the Next Software Hub?

[Echo_419]

No for banking. Last I checked, PayPal was willing to launch its service in Pakistan but State Bank wanted its share from Paypal so its still stuck there. Banking system is cr@p, my last foreign ramittence got stuck in the bank just because the old bank manager was changed and new one turned out to be a d!ck head. He just refused to credit the payment in my account just because the sender was some gora and the payment was above 100k. He had a gut feeling that this money was came due to some online betting or gambling. Even after giving him all the documented proofs about the source of that payment, knocking doors of the bank for 5 months I couldn't get my payment released.

Finally, I had to use my banking sources via my uncle who's high up in a bank, bad to bribe the manager and then got the payment cleared within few hours. In short, 5 - 6 month's time and energy was wasted for nothing.

 

[Areesh]

Competing with India !

India is the world's largest sourcing destination for the information technology (IT) industry, accounting for approximately 52 per cent of the US$ 124-130 billion market. The industry employs about 10 million Indians

India, the fourth largest base for young businesses in the world and home to 3,000 tech start-ups, is set to increase its base to 11,500 tech start-ups by 2020

IT Industry in India, Indian Information Technology, ITeS Sector, Services

And here comes the Shining India syndrome patient.

 

[Viny]

from 2010, ( Saraswat: DRDO working on India's own computer operating system - The Hindu )... what became of this project??

Do you think they are building a gui system for you?

Well not only DRDO, there are many other organization which build there on OS, these days most are based out linux base with custom flavors.

So why are you so obsessed about it. Its just that these OS are not made for public, they are being used in various internal systems.

Sooner or later OS market for computers is going to die off from business model, it would be more service oriented. So it doesnt make sense to make product out of it from mass consumers.

 

[Asian.Century]

Lahore city is the main hub of everything software, hardware related IT , internet stuff, and can supply in millions to meet worldwide demand.

 

[jamahir]

Do you think they are building a gui system for you?

i didn't understand.

Well not only DRDO, there are many other organization which build there on OS, these days most are based out linux base with custom flavors.

linux cannot be reliably used in any non-pc non-server, which necessiates use or design of os that are called by academics/industry as "real time"... os like qnx or the os from bae systems ( forgot name ) used in its avionics products and services.

linux base plus general custom flavors will still be linux.

but if linux is highly customized, then it will be linux just in name... i think vxworks fits this category... i think spacex is using this method.

So why are you so obsessed about it. Its just that these OS are not made for public, they are being used in various internal systems.

design of a reliable os says that a particular country is matured to a large extent in computing... india is not, and neither will pakistan be unless it designs a reliable os.

Sooner or later OS market for computers is going to die off from business model, it would be more service oriented. So it doesnt make sense to make product out of it from mass consumers.

there is a real world outside of capitalist companies and their dependence on server farms or "the cloud" ( most irritating term !! )... this real world includes military needs, outdoors scientific research, manufacturing, medical and other such machine-dependent things.

( QNX operating systems, development tools, and professional services for connected embedded systems ) is still existent, despite "the cloud".

 

[Viny]

i didn't understand.

GUI stands for Graphic User Interface.

linux cannot be reliably used in any non-pc non-server, which necessiates use or design of os that are called by academics/industry as "real time"... os like qnx or the os from bae systems ( forgot name ) used in its avionics products and services.



linux base plus general custom flavors will still be linux.

but if linux is highly customized, then it will be linux just in name... i think vxworks fits this category... i think spacex is using this method.

Beauty of open source system is you are open to make things out of it
Traditionally, Linux was designed to be a GPOS. However, many projects have been started to convert the Linux operating system into an RTOS: RTLinux (Wind River), Xenomai, RTAI, RT Preemption Patch, etc

The most common approach is building a sub kernel or co kernel

design of a reliable os says that a particular country is matured to a large extent in computing... india is not, and neither will pakistan be unless it designs a reliable os.

Thats most foolish way of looking into.
Maturity is better measured by how well a country is using the computing power to bring benefits to mass and world at large.

there is a real world outside of capitalist companies and their dependence on server farms or "the cloud" ( most irritating term !! )... this real world includes military needs, outdoors scientific research, manufacturing, medical and other such machine-dependent things.

( QNX operating systems, development tools, and professional services for connected embedded systems ) is still existent, despite "the cloud".

If a device can connect to get electricity it can connect to internet thats how it started and in future it would be if a device can get started it will be connected to internet (or say network) thats where future is moving.

Cloud is just one phenomena build upon internet (network) this much more than this

 

[Trisonics]

The Pakistani programmer market is ranked 3 but they earn only 2.8billion, says it all doesn't it? Just doesn't add up..either a lot of companies are being floated around to get to a higher ranking, or the quality of work is not up to the mark. The beauty of freelancing in software development is it doesn't matter if you are sitting in a war zone as long as you can come up with solutions and deliver. Pak may have potential on paper, but its no where close to even making a small noise in the market. Truth hurts but a Pakistani author publishing her opinion in NYT will not change much.

When I was in college and call centers in India were making big news all over the world, I had read a similar article in a Pakistani paper which claimed Pakistanis can speak better english than Indians so its only a matter of time before Pak overtakes India. The tone suggested it will happen like day after the news article went online but we never saw that date of triumph for Pakistan.

It's important to have dreams but its much more important to know your capacity as a nation and the nature of the deliverables. Pakistan as a nation was/is never known for its engineering or science capabilities. It may have one univ that is well ranked at the most, the few bright spots leave the nation in a hurry.

Sorry to play spoil sport but coming from a nation not too dissimilar that worked its way only because its citizens wanted to, is a big lesson to be learnt for any body. Sure most pictures in International media of India will always show a cow on the street or a poor beggar with little clothes on but the world also knows that this poor nation's children are most wanted in IT, have reached the moon and mars, can manufacture automobiles and its engines, has a population known to be good in math and so on. Stop the feel good news articles and get yourself and your children inspired!

 

[jamahir]

Beauty of open source system is you are open to make things out of it
Traditionally, Linux was designed to be a GPOS. However, many projects have been started to convert the Linux operating system into an RTOS: RTLinux (Wind River), Xenomai, RTAI, RT Preemption Patch, etc

The most common approach is building a sub kernel or co kernel

simpler and more reliable than building a sub-kernel or co-kernel would be designing a new os, even a new computing architecture ( which has been my approach ).

Thats most foolish way of looking into.
Maturity is better measured by how well a country is using the computing power to bring benefits to mass and world at large.

so what the 2.5+ million "computer science" graduates that have flooded out of indian colleges/universities in the last 15 years are just glorified users... isn't it shameful ( or wonderous ) that that big a number of people have spent three to seven years in "educational" institutes and not come up with a single operating system or microprocessor??

If a device can connect to get electricity it can connect to internet thats how it started and in future it would be if a device can get started it will be connected to internet (or say network) thats where future is moving.

Cloud is just one phenomena build upon internet (network) this much more than this

there is a project for "space internet" too where communication cannot be as instant as on earth but android os version 47 or windows 10 are simply unnecessarily complicated to be used if you land on the moons of mars some day.

as i said, there is a real world outside of whatever capitalist sources "the cloud" gets its inputs from.

 

[Viny]

simpler and more reliable than building a sub-kernel or co-kernel would be designing a new os, even a new computing architecture ( which has been my approach ).

It sounds like why are you using same round wheel of different sizes and colors to move ahead and why not make a something thats not wheel but does job of wheel.

Can you let me know the issues that you have current computing architecture, and how your new computing architecture will solve the problems of common man as well as some distant remote user.

so what the 2.5+ million "computer science" graduates that have flooded out of indian colleges/universities in the last 15 years are just glorified users... isn't it shameful ( or wonderous ) that that big a number of people have spent three to seven years in "educational" institutes and not come up with a single operating system or microprocessor??

As you said "Computer science", its a science and its the implementation of science which is more important. So majority of this wonderful team with knowledge of "Computer Science" has ensured the power of computing reaches the mass in there day to day usage without bothering about what an OS or microprocessor does.

If all of these would have just thought of making one good OS or microprocessor, then probably you might had a computer that starts up on worlds best OS, but after that you would have had nothing else to do on that machine.

there is a project for "space internet" too where communication cannot be as instant as on earth but android os version 47 or windows 10 are simply unnecessarily complicated to be used if you land on the moons of mars some day.
as i said, there is a real world outside of whatever capitalist sources "the cloud" gets its inputs from.

How many people do you think live on moon who will be interested in our OS like Android.
And just for your knowledge, MuLinux comes in size of floppy drive and is capable of running a system.
And who said world is just "the cloud", as already said "cloud" is just one phenomena on internet. IOT is whats coming in various forms.

 

[Faiez]

there is a real world outside of capitalist companies and their dependence on server farms or "the cloud" ( most irritating term !! )... this real world includes military needs, outdoors scientific research, manufacturing, medical and other such machine-dependent things.

when the applications are really really real time, forget an os, you go all the way down to hardcore assembly....

so what is your point again ? A country that can produce a real time os is mature ?

 

[punit]

from 2010, ( Saraswat: DRDO working on India's own computer operating system - The Hindu )... what became of this project??

its DRDO. end of Story.

 

[mr.robot]

IMO, freelancing shouldn't be the measurement of becoming "Software Hub". And by no means we are going to compete with INDIA in IT. They had invested in higher education and sending people abroad long before us. Quality of their higher education institutions is much better than us. Current C.E.O of Microsoft is an Indian. Higher ups in many other prominent companies are Indians. Then size of Indian customer base matter a lot as well for Startups. For example, just one startup UBER plans to invest 1 Billion dollars in India. Snapdeal, their home grown startup is expecting to be valued at 5 Billions USD. Their earlier funding round valued them at 1 Billion USD. Still,

Edit:
And moments after I posted this, Google announced Sundar Pichai to be new CEO.
Official Google Blog: G is for Google

 

[Gauss]

Nah... Pakistan cant really cut it in software on a large scale because of its educational system. Contrary to popular opinion software or coding is not something a creep masters all by himself locked up in his basement room. Mastery in this area is closely related to good pedagogy. Pakistanis dont really have an aptitude for this thing because they are badly brought up, in schools and in society. Pedagogical reforms will open up a lot of tech areas for Pakistan including this one.

 

[jamahir]

its DRDO. end of Story.

nevertheless, it doesn't describe why others couldn't do it... something is being done the wrong way, yes??

when the applications are really really real time, forget an os, you go all the way down to hardcore assembly....

so what is your point again ? A country that can produce a real time os is mature ?

operating systems i believe were created to provide a simplified way to run newer programs without reprogramming the entire computer or parts of it... plus, assembly programming becomes tedious after a while... can you tell me how many instructions does a sun sparc or intel x386 have??

It sounds like why are you using same round wheel of different sizes and colors to move ahead and why not make a something thats not wheel but does job of wheel.

again, i didn't understand.

Can you let me know the issues that you have current computing architecture, and how your new computing architecture will solve the problems of common man as well as some distant remote user.

it is a political project as much technological.

except for network data i/o, all external i/o is through visual means... i mean visual and not just optic... so all current i/o standards, right from rs-232c to the latest usb need not be used... translate that to making obsolete the capitalist factory lines producing interfaces for those standards, imagine the reassignment of people in those factories, imagine how many useless programmers will go out of jobs.

the os design has a new internet architecture too, simpler than the existing and based on peer-to-peer but will have bridge facility to connect to current one.

just two of the things to simplify computing.

As you said "Computer science", its a science and its the implementation of science which is more important. So majority of this wonderful team with knowledge of "Computer Science" has ensured the power of computing reaches the mass in there day to day usage without bothering about what an OS or microprocessor does.

sure, and that must be the intent... but what the capitalist industry has done is mostly kept churning the same old complicated way of computing, not daring to radically innovate, giving people unnecessary usages ( specifically vid games and cell phones ) so that they can keep using the obsolete way of computing but with more "advanced" os and microprocessor... example, intel i9 or whichever is their latest processor... people spend their energies and money needlessly buying useless stuff.

however, one fine and real advance is this ( the return of the vacuum tube computer ).

If all of these would have just thought of making one good OS or microprocessor, then probably you might had a computer that starts up on worlds best OS, but after that you would have had nothing else to do on that machine.

why?? won't application programs and newer application areas have come with a new os??

How many people do you think live on moon who will be interested in our OS like Android.

i was talking of future human explorations of space, specifically the two moons of mars, and whether linux ( however much "real time" ) can be relied upon to keep humans safe... presently, as far as i know, life-critical medical instruments don't run linux in whichever form.

And just for your knowledge, MuLinux comes in size of floppy drive and is capable of running a system.

around year 2000 was a earlier version of qnx os 6 which could off a floppy drive and had all basic facilities, and it was so much more responsive and reliable than linux can ever be even now.

i got a qnx cd from pcquest magazine.

And who said world is just "the cloud", as already said "cloud" is just one phenomena on internet. IOT is whats coming in various forms.

i must say, iot is a bad idea... hackers doing a ddos attack on your fridge ( even with qnx os installed ) will totally defeat the purpose of iot.

 

[Force-India]

nevertheless, it doesn't describe why others couldn't do it... something is being done the wrong way, yes??



operating systems i believe were created to provide a simplified way to run newer programs without reprogramming the entire computer or parts of it... plus, assembly programming becomes tedious after a while... can you tell me how many instructions does a sun sparc or intel x386 have??



again, i didn't understand.



it is a political project as much technological.

except for network data i/o, all external i/o is through visual means... i mean visual and not just optic... so all current i/o standards, right from rs-232c to the latest usb need not be used... translate that to making obsolete the capitalist factory lines producing interfaces for those standards, imagine the reassignment of people in those factories, imagine how many useless programmers will go out of jobs.

the os design has a new internet architecture too, simpler than the existing and based on peer-to-peer but will have bridge facility to connect to current one.

just two of the things to simplify computing.



sure, and that must be the intent... but what the capitalist industry has done is mostly kept churning the same old complicated way of computing, not daring to radically innovate, giving people unnecessary usages ( specifically vid games and cell phones ) so that they can keep using the obsolete way of computing but with more "advanced" os and microprocessor... example, intel i9 or whichever is their latest processor... people spend their energies and money needlessly buying useless stuff.

however, one fine and real advance is this ( the return of the vacuum tube computer ).



why?? won't application programs and newer application areas have come with a new os??



i was talking of future human explorations of space, specifically the two moons of mars, and whether linux ( however much "real time" ) can be relied upon to keep humans safe... presently, as far as i know, life-critical medical instruments don't run linux in whichever form.



around year 2000 was a earlier version of qnx os 6 which could off a floppy drive and had all basic facilities, and it was so much more responsive and reliable than linux can ever be even now.

i got a qnx cd from pcquest magazine.



i must say, iot is a bad idea... hackers doing a ddos attack on your fridge ( even with qnx os installed ) will totally defeat the purpose of iot.

I am not a computer programmer but i agree with you that making an OS needs a different level of programming. And OS plays a very big role in information warfare. And don't understand what stops us from making it.