Pakistan must change its tactics to kill non state actors with non state fighters

[Maula Jatt]

Dana pani ka ehsas sirf woh karsakta hai jissey Rizq ki kadar karna aati ho, aur woh log Imaan walay hotay hain. Tum kya jaantay ho Imaan kya hota hai?

ghareeb bukhe bachon ko imaan khilla kar sulla do raat ke khaane ke liye

give me practical reasoning sir, we have a nation to run

 

[Pakistansdefender]

Pakistan has to change its tactics which miserable failing for last 40 yrs

We can't fight direct war with non state actors because if we kill them with state name on that weapon they get more stronger and use the common public emotions against our state


USA RUSSIA doing it very well with no direct conflict but removing state actors silently

Direct war in Afghanistan is a guaranteed chaos in oakistan


We should hire mercenaries to kill enemies of state by infiltrating inside their operational machenism either poison them sniper kill etc


These type of kills will bring chaos inside BLA and TTP because they might think some one inside them is doing it so they fight against each other for leadership

Silence is the name of the game against such state actors this will keep them busy fighting each other for leadership role etc

Russia using poison very well to take down such elements

My opinion best way to hire a gun which won't be much of a cost than firing huge missiles and bombs and bring coletral damage in our account

@Zarvan @Imran Khan

We should not get into direct conflicts Yemen Syria Ukraine are best lesson act from behind of the curtain

Build a secret nercanary force specialized handling hitman missions

We need a hitman

These are more deadly than thunder or drone strikes and hit where it hurts the most

These are more deadly than thunder or drone strikes and hit where it hurts the most

@WinterFangs

Pakistan has to make peace with india because Pakistan army cannot fight with Pakistan. Let me again say Pakistani people can, Pakistani army cannot. Lost half the country,lost huge territories of gilgit baltistan and azad kashmir. Loat siachen.
Come on. Yeah to hiqmat hai nhn lar sakta to agreement ker lo.
Aur mulk main aik government ko chalna do. Aur aisa experiment jo ap army ker rahi hai na kera.khuda ka wasta apna kaam kerain aur politics se door ho jain.
Politicians ko ap judge nhn ker skata. Wo jo kuch kerain ga us ka result awam 5 saal bad vote main da ga. Ghq ka general faisala nhn kera ga.
Ab to samaj jain.
120 foji 3 months main mara hain and life is going on. Yeah kaisa behis mashara hai. Khuda ka wasta ac main baittha hua generals kuch dekahin. Bus ker do bus

 

[Super Falcon]

What about changing the chief ?

Yes he is making too many mistakes at same time

 

[SaadH]

Such groups can get out of hand you can look at Afghanistan as a prime example.

Yeah especially if you start attacking them at the behest of amreeka bahadur...

 

[The Accountant]

Yes he is making too many mistakes at same time

His ego has become higher then Pakistan

 

[Chak Bamu]

And on what basis have you composed this post of yours? Let me guess, you are a "valiant defender" of Pakist ... sorry, PML-N? So speak up then, lets see what rationale, if any, could you possibly use to defend your post. Go on, I am waiting for your response.

So, you are answering my question by an irrelevant question?

Why do you think that you are somebody who has a right to interrogate & harangue others about matters of faith. Do you think you are more Muslim than others?

BTW, in case you do not know, discussion of religion is actively discouraged on this forum, otherwise this forum would become a flame-bait magnet. So please stop bringing religion into your discussions. Some of us have been on the internet since the early 90s, way before you were born, & we know how discussions go once religion is allowed to be the central topic.

 

[Jango]

Imaan ka waise koi entry test hota hai jo clear karte hain aur phir aap certification detay hain jiss mein likha hota hai ke iss ko rizq ki qadar bhi hai?

Waise tu Imaan sirf Allah ki zaat janti hai ya apne nabion ko ilm deti hai. Kya aap nabowat ka dawa bhi rakhte hain?


Same goes for Hizb ut Tahrir but the problem is still of the attractiveness of such narratives.
Until you provide the people of Baluchistan a better life the narrative will stand. Historical injustices can still be used but they are much less effective when you and those around you are making good money, and have economic and physical security.

I don’t want to derail this but why do I keep citing that Kashmir was technically lost in 2012 because the Kashmir youth was engaged in the Indian system, invested in businesses outside of Kashmir and thinking more along the lines of more economic and social control than independence (Pakistan wasn’t even on the list). If anything, India walked back some of those gains from then in an attempt to kill the disputed idea but that is a different discussion.

If today Balochistan had great infrastructure, education and opportunities for the entire strata matching northern punjab or otherwise you would not have an insurgency as such.
Yes, separatism would remain(Catalan is a great example) but would eventually die out as you integrated them more and more.

Finally, language is a great binder… how much has Urdu taught and spoken from top to bottom? It isn’t about diminishing Balochi but rather giving a common platform that all could understand and speak to communicate with and enable growth.

Copying my comment from another thread, as it seemed fit for continuing the discussion from your post.
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Can't really disagree with this TBH.

But in this whole scenario, only one actionable is to be done by the military, the rest is by the civilian government (reference to a tweet by senator Mushahidullah on some items he listed down to resolve this situation).

We all know how indifferent the civilian setup is to the Baloch people. Baloch representatives spend more time in Islamabad than in their own constituencies. They want an iron grip on their clans, and whenever something is done to disrupt this, in comes the excuse of 'age old Baloch traditions'.

These people do not want their people to get developed.

As for the development, you cannot deny that it has been done in the past few years at an unprecedented rate. Just take the example of the bomber, she was educated in AIOU Kech campus! So was her husband.

Just look at the following thread:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1519188919786561536

Her whole family was employed by the state, and they were pretty well off comparatively.

The inculcation by BSO Azad during the student definitely had an effect and keep that seed of rebellion in the mind. In a later stage of life, you just need to grow that seed and give it a trigger in the form of propaganda.

As a follow on to a previous post of mine, the porous Iran border is also creating problems. The FC knows very well each smuggling route, and even takes commission off of it. The government can easily close it off (as it did a while back if I am not mistaken), but then every MNA and woke brigade comes on twitter and labels it as an attack on the livelihood of the people, since this is their business.

Now you tell me, yeh fauj ki zimmedari hai us ilaqay main development karna, thori activity generate karna so that those people move away from smuggling and do something else? This is where the civilian government needs to step in, but again baat wohi hai, the Baloch sardars that get elected to PA or NA are more busy showing off their sports car than doing something for Balochistan.

 

[mhosein]

Pahle to, janab, aap hame yeh samjhaiye aap hain kaun , imaan ki baatein par aage ayenge.

Sawal to lajawab hai, magar poochnay wala nahein. Main Musalmaan hoon.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Sawal to lajawab hai, magar poochnay wala nahein. Main Musalmaan hoon.

Aap khush naseeb hain. Jeete rahiye. Khush rahiye.

 

[mhosein]

ghareeb bukhe bachon ko imaan khilla kar sulla do raat ke khaane ke liye

give me practical reasoning sir, we have a nation to run

What was the PRACTICAL REASONING of Muslims that were being persecuted, slaughtered by the Quraish in Makkah? They migrated to Madinah and established an Islamic State. Then returned to liberate Makkah once they had established themselves in Faith, in Society, in Trade, in Policies as Muslims.

Feed the hungry? Prophet Muhammad Alaihi Salaat-u-Wassalam tied stones to His stomach and went days without eating!! For whom did He (Alaihi Salaat-u-Wassalam) pray all night in front of the Kaabah, weeping for Allah's mercy?

You ask for practicality? It starts with FAITH, because without establishing faith, it doesn't matter whether you eat, sleep, have a roof over your head.

I have been homeless, I have been hungry for days in my life and it is a horrifying experience. What I learnt is it is only Allah, it is only Allah, it is only Allah Subhnahu Wata'aalah whom I can turn to and it is only Imaan in Allah that will save me. RAZIQ is ALLAH, MALIK is ALLAH, AL-AKBAR is ALLAH.

That practical enough for you, dear brother?

 

[El Sidd]

ghareeb bukhe bachon ko imaan khilla kar sulla do raat ke khaane ke liye

give me practical reasoning sir, we have a nation to run

Kabhi khushbu laga ke jao na master race areas where women and children toil away in the fields and blue eyed aryan sit in the shade and do hukkah.

jao na zara enlightened moderation leke when animal instincts overpower human instincts and where ritual lynching of women take place as some sort.

these people have to break their own tribal imposed shakles. jo pathar eenth uthao uske nechay to quota shumar milenge, konsi marginalisation hai? karachi ka domicile hota to ye sab phatt chuke hote ab tak

 

[Joe Shearer]

Nope .... mein kushnaseeb agar hota (if I were that fortunate and blessed) I would not be here trying to convince MY OWN countrymen about Islam and how the policies and behavior of our leaders is kufr.

Thik hai, tab aap bad naseeb rahiye, aur apne humwataniyon ko samjhate rahiye. Hamara to aur koi len-den nahin hai isme, hum bas yeh koshish dekhte rahenge............

 

[Leviza]

Only option is to find out which countries are behind these organisations and make them bleed as well

When the cost abd stakes get higher for them as well then they will either come on table or stop funding these organisations

It’s more of a strategic move to combat these elements

 

[LeGenD]

Food for thought from me.

1. Fascism is NOT the way forward but EXPOSING TACTIC and EDUCATION.

The fundamental problem is brainwashing of people to hate other people for having different perspectives. This problem extends to hating entire countries in fact. -----[1]

For example, the so-called Balochistan Liberation Army (BLA) is of the view that China is exploiting natural resources of Balochistan for its gains and depriving Balochi people in the process. This perception does not helps.

Balochistan Liberation Army | Mapping Militants Project

cisac.fsi.stanford.edu

Efforts should be made to identify those individuals who brainwash Balochi youth on such lines and a SYSTEM should be adopted to deal with them. The SYSTEM should involve following steps:

- - - - LOOP - - - -

1st step = EDUCATE individuals.

Pakistan Army should create SPECIAL EDUCATION CAMPS in Balochistan and use them to spread awareness about CPEC, socio-economic challenges of the region, and to cultivate sense of goodwill between Pakistani armed forces and Balochi youth in the province. Make it compulsory for Balochi youth to attend these EDUCATION CAMPS for a period of time.

If this fails then;

2nd Step = adopt LEGAL route to penalize individuals and/or put them behind bars for a long time. Broadcast these legal proceedings in courts to expose these individuals to the greater Public (i.e., Exposing Tactic).

If this step fails then;

3rd step = Eliminate individuals who cannot be reformed and are hellbent on separatism.

Do NOT resort to 3rd step on the fly. This approach fuels hatred and calls for revenge.

- - - - LOOP - - - -

For the sake of argument, let us call this "Balochistan Reformation LOOP SYSTEM." The loop must continue for indefinite period.

It would be helpful to COACH Local Politicians on these lines first and foremost. Appropriate political framework must be in place for the SYSTEM to work.

On the flip side:

- GOP (in concert with Pakistan Army) should make sure that CPEC will meet its socio-economic objectives in Balochistan and elsewhere.

2. The (Pakistan Army - Academia) Collaboration Scheme to identify and address causes of terrorism.

While Pakistan Army (and ISI) have their methods to conduct COIN operations, Pakistan Army can request Pakistani Academics to get to the bottom of causes of terrorism in our region and provide meaningful perspectives in relation. Academic research can be used to inform ongoing COIN strategy and devise a NATIONAL PLAN to address causes of terrorism in our region.

Academic Research can be very instructive. -----[2]

3. Coherent narrative for Pakistan's role and legacy in connection to US-led War On Terror in view of 9/11.

Pakistan does NOT have a coherent narrative about Pakistan's decision to join US-led War On Terror in view of 9/11 as noted by General Tariq Khan and myself.

The narrative should have been this: dismantle Al-Qaeda Network in the region. Pakistan should respect efforts of then COAS Pervez Musharraf in this regard. Following book provides excellent information in relation:

Amazon.com

Pakistani politicians do NOT pay heed to this theme unfortunately. Even Imran Khan (former Prime Minister) is a CRITIC of Musharraf in this regard - this is NOT helpful. By criticizing Musharraf's decision in this regard, Pakistani politicians fuel DISCONNECT between Pakistan Army and the Public in regards to steps taken to address one of the greatest sources of terrorism in the world - a move that was in the best interests of Pakistan. Pakistan Army have considerable history of fighting and/or nabbing Al-Qaeda terrorists and their affiliates through the years as noted in the memoir of Musharraf but these efforts do not receive much-needed respect and recognition in Pakistani politics and discourses. This is SHAMEFUL.

- Coherent narrative helps address misconceptions and mitigate counterproductive propaganda effects.

Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) was founded in Waziristan by Baitullah Mehsud in 2007 due to following reason:

Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) is an umbrella organization of various religious militant groups located along the Pak-Afghan border area with a strong presence in the former tribal areas of Pakistan. It was founded in 2007 in North Waziristan of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa province, Pakistan, under the leadership of Baitullah Mehsud, in response to Pakistan’s military operation against Al-Qaeda (AQ) militants in tribal areas. It draws its ideological guidance from AQ and maintains ties with Iraq and Syria (ISIS) and AQ, sharing money, explosives, and bomb squad personnel. John Brennan, President Obama’s chief counterterrorism adviser, said: “It’s a group that is closely allied with al-Qaeda. They train together, they plan together, they plot together. They are almost indistinguishable.”

TTP, AQ, ISIS Nexus and Its Impact on Regional Security – Probyn Security Advisors

probynsecurityadvisors.com

Related:

Baitullah Mehsud: Who is he?

Baitullah Mehsud during a press conferences where he insists his face remains hidden. - Reuters Baitullah Mehsud, ...

www.dawn.com

TTP shifted its base of operations to Afghanistan in the face of Operation Zarb-e-Azb (2014 - 2016). Mufti Nur Wali Mehsud have managed to reorganize TTP in Afghanistan and revisit its strategy and propaganda efforts since 2018.

The Pakistani Taliban’s radical rebranding: Is there more than meets the eye?

In a statement released on Feb. 12, the Tehreek-e Taliban Pakistan (TTP) distanced itself from international terrorism, declaring that its violence was singularly focused on Pakistan. While the TTP’s recent comments on America are unprecedented, they do fit into its broader rebranding effort...

www.mei.edu

Are Afghan Taliban sincere with Pakistan? - BOL News

Islamabad’s concern must have increased manifold due to growing incidents of attacks by the Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) from across the border, causing casualties to Pakistani soldiers. During the past two weeks, over two dozen soldiers have been killed. In retaliation, Pakistan has used its...

www.bolnews.com

TTP aims to regain control of Waziristan in Pakistan.

4. How to defeat TTP in Afghanistan? Take cues from "Operation Inherent Resolve."

Afghan Taliban have courted both Al-Qaeda Network and TTP respectively.

Afghan Taliban did NOT stop TTP from attacking Pakistani security forces and abandon its pursuit of Waziristan. IF this trend continues then Pakistan will have to defeat TTP in Afghanistan.

Pakistan tested the waters not long ago:

Deadly border attacks test Pakistani gov’t relations with Taliban

Alleged Pakistani raids in Afghanistan in response to killing of its soldiers have raised tensions between two nations.

www.aljazeera.com

Afghan Taliban oppose strikes inside Afghanistan.

Their sovereignty concerns are understandable but what to do about Afghanistan being a cesspool of terrorism? Besides TTP, there is danger of the resurgence of ISKP and Al-Qaeda Network in Afghanistan. There are reports of emergence of independent pockets of resistance to Afghan Taliban as well. I am NOT sure about how Afghanistan can be developed and normalized under these circumstances or anytime soon.

4.1. Fencing of Durand Line is one of the most sensible decisions Pakistan have made in regards to Afghanistan. If there are gaps left in some areas, these should be plugged ASAP. If fencing is not possible in some areas then UAVs should be deployed to patrol and monitor these gaps on regular basis.

4.3. Pakistan must PROFILE every Afghan who lives in Pakistan and every Afghan who visits Pakistan for trade and other activities. Create and maintain a separate database of Afghans in our country.

IF Afghan Taliban cannot control Afghanistan (and TTP in particular) then Pakistan will have to make a decision at some point. The last resort path and option (PLAN B).

4.3. American MODEL of COIN for defeating ISIL in the Middle East (i.e., Operation Inherent Resolve), is instructive in regards to defeating TTP in Afghanistan. This entail use of Pakisan Air Force (PAF) in consert with "suitable forces" on the ground to identify, chase and help engage TTP cadre across Afghanistan.

ISI can be directed to find and recruit Afghans who would be willing to join "suitable forces" for the right price.

On the flip side:

- Port "Balochistan Reformation LOOP SYSTEM" to Waziristan.

As noted above, it would be helpful to COACH Local Politicians on these lines first and foremost. Appropriate political framework must be in place for the SYSTEM to work.

Refer back to [1] above to address the issue of Pashtun Tahafuz Movement (PTM) in Waziristan. Demonizing the likes of Mohsin Dawar and Mansoor Pashteen have not worked (and might not work). Listen to these people, and COACH them.

- GOP (in concert with Pakistan Army) should make sure that CPEC will meet its socio-economic objectives in Waziristan and elsewhere.

 

[denel]

Real terrorists are here, on this forum, writing posts like your's, spitting venom without a thought. You think you are the only Momin & Muslim here & that the rest are kafirs?

You have been swindled & brainwashed by your bubble. You are misled by your own biases.


Another gem.

You think these attacks are being done by disillusioned & bitter youthias? That is the only way your post could be even remotely relevant.

Well put my friend. You captured prior responses perfect